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[Be Absentminded]

QUOTE

Why is it cloned? It's popular.. and a security issue made it easier than the competition at the moment

Thank you.  That is all I wanted to know.  I know that there have been previous "clones" I just found it odd that the Xenium had been "cloned" and the SmartXX had not eventhough they were released only about a month apart from eachother.

-Jameson

[marksu]

QUOTE

if you look at what time the two topics got started you will notice that I got mine up first although we were probably typing them at the same time

You are right about the date, but I did not tell you this to be mean.

QUOTE

so it's no big deal to me if you don't feel that it you need to talk with the other guy about this

Do not know why you think I don't like to tak to you. Just ment that it it easier to have the coversarion in one thread.

QUOTE

...but I do understand and I will try to adhere to your request.

Thanks  

[Exobex]

QUOTE (eXOBeX (ozXodus forums) @  Apr 07, 2004 11:03 am)

I think ozXodus are making a mistake by highlighting all the differences between the fakes and the originals, in one go. It gives the cloners a chance to fix all their mistakes quickly. Better to do it in stages. For example:- 1 ) ozXodus report the "capital X" and "different LED" mistakes 2 ) cloners fix this, missing all the other bits they screwed up on 3 ) ozXodus now point out "different switch" and "white dots on board" 4 ) cloners need to rework boards again, fixing these changes 5 ) ozXodus point out "grid differences near LPC" 6 ) cloners yet again have to rework and manufacture new boards 7 ) ozXodus point out "font differences" and "three dots near transistor" 8 ) more boards scrapped, more rework, more manufacturing 9 ) ozXodus point out "grid differences near edge bus" and "top solder pads" 10) cloners bin yet another lot of boards, fix and manufacture a new batch 11) to be continued...  The above method gives people plenty of things to look out for as each clone revision is released, without letting the cloners fix everything in one go. They're forever fixing mistakes, binning perfectly good (but not identical) PCBs and getting new ones designed and manufactured, all of which takes time, costs money and reduces the profitability of cloning the Xenium. One other suggestion though - how about a list (a locked topic on these forums would be an ideal location) of manufacturer date-codes used on genuine Xeniums (and maybe the fakes as well, so we can keep an eye out). For example, my Xenium batch (genuine, from Divineo) have a date code of 0323 on the flash. There's probably one on the CPLD as well, but there's a whole load of stuff printed there that means nothing to me!

[Master-Chief]

QUOTE (Cavalierz24 @ Apr 7 2004, 06:27 AM)

Thank you...that's exactly what I am trying to say and I got flamed and called dumb and all I was trying to say is that it isn't good for business to help out the guys that are trying to undermine your business.

You just don't understand do you...?

When you browse through these forums, people are all saying my Xenium doesn't work and blah blah. Then the FIRST question to come to mind is, "Do I have a fake"? How are they supposed to know if they have a fake if they don't have the resources/guides to find out? Is this starting to make sense to you or am I going a little too fast?  

Also, do you see this 10 PAGE THREAD?

http://forums.xbox-s...howtopic=189861

These people saw the guides to see if they have a FAKE XENIUM and they CAN get their money back due to Internet FRAUD! If those diagrams/guides weren't out so you could determine whether you have a fake Xenium or not, people would have gotten ripped off and had a FAKE XENIUM that doesn't even work for a mere $45.  

[Exobex]

QUOTE (Master-Chief @ Apr 7 2004, 12:35 PM)

You just don't understand do you...? When you browse through these forums, people are all saying my Xenium doesn't work and blah blah. Then the FIRST question to come to mind is, "Do I have a fake"? How are they supposed to know if they have a fake if they don't have the resources/guides to find out? Is this starting to make sense to you or am I going a little too fast?  Also, do you see this 10 PAGE THREAD? http://forums.xbox-s...howtopic=189861 These people saw the guides to see if they have a FAKE XENIUM and they CAN get their money back due to Internet FRAUD! If those diagrams/guides weren't out so you could determine whether you have a fake Xenium or not, people would have gotten ripped off and had a FAKE XENIUM that doesn't even work for a mere $45.

But they didn't need to post it all at once though, did they?  Pointing out six differences when two obvious ones would suffice means the cloners can fix them all in one hit.  Announcing only two means the cloners only fix two differences.  Once the new boards hit the streets you point out another two differences, which means the cloners have to scrap and remanufacture again.  Then another two, then another two, and so on.
So far around a dozen differences have been pointed out in just two releases. The next Xenium clone (version 3) will be much harder to spot.  Giving out the differences bit by bit would have meant they'd be up to version 7 or 8 by now.  And getting really pissed off about it, too!

[Master-Chief]

QUOTE (Exobex @ Apr 7 2004, 08:56 AM)

But they didn't need to post it all at once though, did they?  Pointing out six differences when two obvious ones would suffice means the cloners can fix them all in one hit.  Announcing only two means the cloners only fix two differences.  Once the new boards hit the streets you point out another two differences, which means the cloners have to scrap and remanufacture again.  Then another two, then another two, and so on. So far around a dozen differences have been pointed out in just two releases. The next Xenium clone (version 3) will be much harder to spot.  Giving out the differences bit by bit would have meant they'd be up to version 7 or 8 by now.  And getting really pissed off about it, too!

Good point, but the fact of NOT having diagram comparisons at all like Cavalierz stated, is a BAD idea!  

[marksu]

Heh that is ment as a joke! lol  

Clone makers might not have thought they would have got such large negative publicity of their clone. Might have thought ppl dont care that mutch that is is not 100% same looking as long it is working. Well as it happened the clone is not working wery well, therefore they try to make is look more as a exact copy of original xenium to confuse customers.

I think it is Ozxodus way of saying this is not a clone cause of the many detailed differences (and also the bad quality aspect). That is why I presume Ozxodus wanted intensionally to publish many deatiled differences between clone and the original Xenium.

To come to the point when clone is to similar to original to detect it to be clone might be still far away. There is pretty mutch allways some differences that Ozxodus can point out how to detect a clone.

As I preious stated:
If clones still would reach the point to be to similar Ozxodus could make new changes to the outlook and cloners would need to start from the beginning.

[seedyrom2003]

Trying to get back on topic.. I Just bought a batch of clones from ********. I took a risk buying them knowing they were.. At $29 a piece they dont cost me $60 each .. people locally dont care they are clones.. and as long as they work.. AND LIKE MOST AMERICANS ... THEY WANT IT CHEAP!!! not saying for how long.. then whats the big deal? You get what you pay for.. but sellers FAKING off clones as originals is wrong.. Im not going all PRO on clones since I do own 3 originals myself but..  whats the big deal.. the only one getting taken is OzXodus because they are loosing business in the market. All the rumors got people scared.. Especially if the seller of the chip has a good reputation. I hand it to ******* cause he states that he does sell clones up front.. and until i see a failure in one of the clones as you should all do first hand ... then complain and bitch about how they are ruining the scene.. thats my 2 cents.

PLZ DON'T LIST THE SELLER IN A PRO-CLONE POST.

[marksu]

There is a nice thread at Ozxodus forum of a succestion on how to make Ozxodus mod easily detected to be clone or original.

Now your turn to reply   .

[marksu]

QUOTE (seedyrom2003 @ Apr 8 2004, 08:49 AM)

Trying to get back on topic.. I Just bought a batch of clones from robotpig. I took a risk buying them knowing they were.. At $29 a piece they dont cost me $60 each .. people locally dont care they are clones.. and as long as they work.. AND LIKE MOST AMERICANS ... THEY WANT IT CHEAP!!! not saying for how long.. then whats the big deal? You get what you pay for.. but sellers FAKING off clones as originals is wrong.. Im not going all PRO on clones since I do own 3 originals myself but..  whats the big deal.. the only one getting taken is OzXodus because they are loosing business in the market. All the rumors got people scared.. Especially if the seller of the chip has a good reputation. I hand it to robotpig cause he states that he does sell clones up front.. and until i see a failure in one of the clones as you should all do first hand ... then complain and bitch about how they are ruining the scene.. thats my 2 cents.

Well I think you are not entitled to any Xenium support on xbox scene after that comment!

I don't care if you have 3 original xenium or not, but buying intensionaly clones and seling them is not supporting xbox scene.

This kind of clone promotion is not needed in this forum!  

Hopefully HSDEMONZ gives his comment on this one!

[seedyrom2003]

If you remember though.. I do support OzXodus, their competition on the scene is appreciated.. I dont mean to help the clones but money always runs the business factor. I didnt mean any harm. What I'd like to see is how much the chip makers are really making on the technology..(If someone can put up numbers on this that would be great)  the fact still remains is that most people do not use the chip for its intentional LEGAL use. I personally have worked for a fiber optic company for over 5 years and have seen many attemps to steal a product thats patented, I know it pisses me off when I get returned items that I have to fix cause some moron got a transciever fixed somewhere else and it broke when he would have saved time just bringing it to us in the first place. If the undermining companies such as whoevers making the clones ...why doesnt someone take action?? pointing out that clones are bad cause they hurt the company that originally made them thats one thing.. but not opposing any sort of action against it except what they are doing wrong... oh wait we cant sue any one since we are already putting money into the hands of people that are ripping off a much bigger company.. one that provides us with a kick ass gaming system. And just because talking about unintentional use is banned from the forums.. doesnt mean its banned from real life. And please.. if you are going to reply to this post check your grammar to make sure people understand your point. I feel there are a lot of unclear points about this topic that DO go unseen. Its your loss if you go ahead and void the warranty on a product .. just remember that, and remember who the victim is in the long run.

[HSDEMONZ]

Removed alot of PRO-CLONE Propoganda posts.

As of now.. The clone talk ends.  People who needs help in determining if their chip is a fake.. should read the pinned topics.

I know the mods tire of this nonsense.. as do I.

Discuss the fakes.. and your opinions on it and if it hurts the consumer.. helps/hurts the scene elsewhere.

We've already taken the standpoint.. that CLONES hurt the scene over-all.  Other sites and devs in the scene have taken a similar standpoint.. including Maxconsole.com.