Topic: Abbass And His Policies (Read 162 times)

damam · « **on:** February 07, 2005, 01:29:00 PM »

A while back, I posted a post which stated reasons why I did not believe Yasser truly wanted peace with Israel. I stated things that i thought he should have done, and also listed stuff he had done that was contrary to a position of Peace.

Now Abbass - who has not even been in office a year, is closer to peace than yasser ever was. Here is a list of the stuff that he has done (and with far less funding I might add):

1) Taken on Hamas and Hezbollah: he has started an active campeign to marginalize militant jihadists effects and influence on the palestenians. You can argue with his level of success with this, but he has done it.

2) Stopped praising suicide bombers and other attacks on Israel done by militant jihadists: Schools and Media outlets are no longer aloud to praise suicide bombings or other attacks, only report the fact that they occured in an objective manner. Its a matter of symantecs. Rather than calling them martyrs, they call them bombings, etc. It does make a difference, because one encourages attacks, the other merely reports them. It is a start in the slow process of turning a culture of hate around.

3) He openly acknowledges that the carrying out the intifada against Israeli citizens was a mistake. This goes a long ways toward mending the fence with Israel.

4) Assigned Palestinian security forces to block attacks on Israeli troops: While many have said that Yasser could not control Militant Jihadists if he had wanted too, Abbas in just days has had a dramtic effect by taking such actions.

As time goes on, and he knocks down the obstacles of peace (which bush outlined), it is going to put more and more pressure on Sharon to give Palestenians a state. We will have to see what happens, but if things continue as they do, i believe we could see a Palestenian state in Bushes last term.

The one thing I have seen him do which I wish he hadnt was this. If you recall Norhan Deeb (a 10 year old girl) was shot last week. Sharon wanted to do a joint investigation with Abbas to find out what happened. Abbas turned down Sharon's offer. Consequently this has turned into a mess with both sides accusing the other of doing it. If their would have been a joint investigation, something official could have been released from both sides. And, it would have forced Sharon hand if it had turned out to be an Israeli.

Tony42077 · « **Reply #1 on:** February 07, 2005, 02:23:00 PM »

I completely agree, it's quite obvious that Arafat never truly wanted peace with Israel. If he did, he would have taken greater steps to discourage the suicide bombings, not encourage them the way that a lot of the groups affiliated with him did, ie Fattah.

Let's hope that this peace process continues unabated by those who would look to destroy it.

gronne · « **Reply #2 on:** February 07, 2005, 02:49:00 PM »

The problem we had with Arafat was that the situation was more or less impossible to solve. I don't believe for a second he didn't want peace, but because of his long history the situation got nailed down on both sides. I would never wish he had died, but the situation is much easier to deal with now, and EVERY step from both sides now must be very carefully dealt with as we are walking on a thin rope that can burst at any second. If only Abbas and Sharon can put a great effort in eachothers sides we may actually have that impossible peace no one hardly dared to think of half a year ago.

Not some classic anti-americanism, but I honestly think USA should keep out of this, COMPLETELY. Not that USA can't do anything good, but if the palestinian side will seriously try and make peace, they will NOT like the american interest. That could finally break the possible peace, by terrorists who refuse to accept USA tries to take honour for the peace. Take that into consideration.

Tony42077 · « **Reply #3 on:** February 07, 2005, 04:14:00 PM »

QUOTE(gronne @ Feb 7 2005, 09:55 PM)

Not some classic anti-americanism, but I honestly think USA should keep out of this, COMPLETELY. Not that USA can't do anything good, but if the palestinian side will seriously try and make peace, they will NOT like the american interest. That could finally break the possible peace, by terrorists who refuse to accept USA tries to take honour for the peace. Take that into consideration.

damam · « **Reply #4 on:** February 07, 2005, 04:45:00 PM »

Colonel32-
I think it could make for a stronger state if they could agree to become one state. And in the long run it would probably be better for the citizens. I just think their is too much to overcome for that to occur.
Israel wants this to end, it is an enormous drain on their resources. A palestenian state would mean that they could apply pressure on Abbas to stop the attacks, rather than having to do it themselves.

Gronne- As for the US staying out of it -
First, bush has already stated that he believes sharon and abbas need to meet free of any foreign presence for the peace talks. Keeping that in mind . . .
Abbas has already requested that we do a few things. My bet is that he is hoping we will do a lot more. It was Abbas taking the US/Bush at face value that led to the platform under which the Palestenian people elected him. Abbas is counting on the US to intervene at some point if Sharon does not decide to enter peace talks and he has successfully done everything we asked. Are you saying that even though Abbas is entering a good faith agreement with the US we should turn our backs on him? I seriously hope thats not what your implying, because I feel that it would be reprehensible for America to go back on our word to the Palestenians at this point. Especially since Abbas is making clear stides to do everything the US said he had to before we would support another peace talk.

However, I do agree that we should stay out of it until our presence is requested. And it would probably be better for everyone if they could handle this themselves.

pepsik · « **Reply #5 on:** February 07, 2005, 05:43:00 PM »

Things will probably move better if the Israeli's dump Sharon. The US should stay out of this, but Sharon won't deal, so eventually the US will have to force his hand.

The only real peace in the region will come if they remove the israeli gov't and forget about a palestinian gov't, and setup a coalition of nations to run the region, with no interest in race or religion. Call it the International Peace Zone. I mean if so many people hold this piece of land to be holy, they wouldn't be opposed to a unified peaceful solution that does not favor or exlude anyone.

^delusional solution, go ahead and flame.

The unProfessional · « **Reply #6 on:** February 07, 2005, 06:08:00 PM »

The problem is it's in our nature to see an exclusion/favor whether or not it's there. It gives us a reason to complain - a reason to fight.

Race and religion tend to magnify that concept 100 fold. Fact of the matter is, people aren't happy unless they're miserable.

My_Brain_is_on_Fire · « **Reply #7 on:** February 07, 2005, 07:15:00 PM »

QUOTE(The unProfessional @ Feb 8 2005, 01:14 AM)

Fact of the matter is, people aren't happy unless they're miserable.

gronne · « **Reply #8 on:** February 08, 2005, 03:21:00 AM »

QUOTE(damam @ Feb 7 2005, 11:51 PM)

Gronne- As for the US staying out of it -

damam · « **Reply #9 on:** February 08, 2005, 10:35:00 AM »

QUOTE(gronne @ Feb 7 2005, 10:27 PM)

Well since I don't know what he's requested USA to do it's a bit hard to say.

He's asked for some funding (if you'll recall yasser embezzled over a billion dollars that his widow is now living pretty nicely off of in france), and we announced yesterday that we would give them 40 Million in the next 90 days to help him meet the US criteria. The money is extremely important because it will allow the PA to build independent schools and medical facilities, right now Hamas controls most of the schools and medical facilities.

Hes asked for some consultation on how best to do some of the things, the US deployed General Ward to monitor and give advice.

He's asked that we pressure syria and iran to stop funding hezbollah and hamas. Although I dont know what we can really do their.

I believe he also asked for neutral ground to meet on - although he may not actually need it now that egypt has offered to provide neutral ground.

The unProfessional · « **Reply #10 on:** February 08, 2005, 12:21:00 PM »

Does anyone else get bad chills when thinking about the repercussions of hamas and hezbollah losing control of social services and getting their funding cut? Desperate times call for desperate measures, and when you're a terrorist, that means death.

damam · « **Reply #11 on:** February 08, 2005, 01:01:00 PM »

QUOTE(The unProfessional @ Feb 8 2005, 07:27 AM)

Does anyone else get bad chills when thinking about the repercussions of hamas and hezbollah losing control of social services and getting their funding cut? Desperate times call for desperate measures, and when you're a terrorist, that means death.

Ive thought about that - its going to get rough, but it has to be done. The PA will never have true authority until it happens.

Hamas and hezbollah really dont like Abbas to much . . .

QUOTE(Intifada website)

"Known universally for his "flexibility" with Israel... Abu Mazen (Abbas) is thought of generally as colourless, moderately corrupt, and without any clear ideas of his own, except that he wants to please the white man."

Tony42077 · « **Reply #12 on:** February 08, 2005, 05:57:00 PM »

It looks like they have agreed on a cease-fire agreement at their summit in Egypt, as reported by CNN.com. The deal hinged on Israel handing over control of 5 cities in the West Bank, and the release of over 500 Palestinian prisoners. I hope that Hammas will at least hold off their attacks until after the proposed time frames. Once again, it comes down to what the terrorists end up doing.

The article over at MSNBC also stated that the German Foreign Minister Joshka Fischer said in Berlin that the renewed U.S. engagement is of central significance. So I guess that not everyone thinks that the US is the barrier to peace.

Shoue · « **Reply #13 on:** February 08, 2005, 10:11:00 PM »

QUOTE

It looks like they have agreed on a cease-fire agreement at their summit in Egypt, as reported by CNN.com. The deal hinged on Israel handing over control of 5 cities in the West Bank, and the release of over 500 Palestinian prisoners. I hope that Hammas will at least hold off their attacks until after the proposed time frames. Once again, it comes down to what the terrorists end up doing.

terrorists don't believe in diplomacy.. especially when the future of their organization depends on it.

there will be attacks and they will be big

jbp20717 · « **Reply #14 on:** February 09, 2005, 06:27:00 AM »

Exactly, Abbas doesn't control Hamas or any of the other Palestinian militant groups any more than Sinn Fein controls the IRA. These groups, somewhat understandibly, will want the Israelis to withdraw from both the Gaza Strip and the West Bank, which just isn't going to happen. A lot has been said about Abbas finally being able to bring peace to the region, but until Isreal withdraw to the UN borders, I don't think they will be any concrete improvements in the situation.

Author Topic: Abbass And His Policies (Read 162 times)