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[dfairch]

I have a modded xbox and burn dvds only for it.  The dvd backups play just fine on the modded box, but I get an "Incompatible media error" when trying to play them on an unmodded xbox.  Why is that?  I was always under the assumption that backups of the original game could be played on any xbox.  Not so??

[yourwishismine]

QUOTE (dfairch @ Dec 31 2003, 04:00 PM)

I have a modded xbox and burn dvds only for it.  The dvd backups play just fine on the modded box, but I get an "Incompatible media error" when trying to play them on an unmodded xbox.  Why is that?  I was always under the assumption that backups of the original game could be played on any xbox.  Not so??

 This has got to do with the original xbox bios recognizing the media in the drive as recordable media and then it will not work with the original xbox bios.   That is why a MOD chip, or soft MOD that 'overwrites' the original bios is required to play backups.

[recon66]

OK, I follow your explanation, but, is there a way to reconstruct the original DVD so it can be used on an unmodded xbox?

[brahm2]

QUOTE (recon66 @ Feb 14 2004, 05:42 PM)

OK, I follow your explanation, but, is there a way to reconstruct the original DVD so it can be used on an unmodded xbox?

 Original DVDs should be playable on ALL Xboxes.

If you are talking about putting all the files from an original onto a DVD-/+R (creating a backup), it will NOT play unless you have a modchip, or have preformed a TSOP flash, or one of the various exploits.

aka backups don't play on unmodded boxes.

[recon66]

I still don't follow: what is on a DVD is data. Is it not possible to copy the original bit by bit onto a DVD? In other words, just clone the original. What am I missing?

[Helpfull]

Here's the deal: DVD(meaning commercial applications), DVD-R, and DVD+R are actually 3 different media types. Check out this site: DVDRHELP

[eebeejay]

QUOTE (recon66 @ Feb 15 2004, 01:34 AM)

I still don't follow: what is on a DVD is data. Is it not possible to copy the original bit by bit onto a DVD? In other words, just clone the original. What am I missing?

 Sure, you can copy all of the files from the original data DVD, but in theory, the disc is not "completely" cloned because the media is different. Face it, a DVD is a different media than DVD+/-R/RW.

The Xbox knows recordable media, and wasn't meant to accept it, which is why you NEED a modchip to "trick" the Xbox into thinking that the media is original, thus letting it play.

No mod, no recordable media.

[drako]

no thats always been a problem with video games.  it has something to do with the way the beginning of the disk is written i think... dont quote me im not positive.

[G-FORCE420]

I think the system checks for some signed coding in the beginning and last parts of the disc and if they are different it won't take the game, thats what im under the impression of. regardless, it cant play without a chip.

[Yox]

With PC rips they normally remove music and video and high res textures etc. Is this what is done with X-Box rips? So if I was to get a rip of GTA3 would I not get the radio stations or a rip of KOTOR and lose the cut scenes?

[jedi6]

My burner allows me to change the bitsetting of a dvd+r to dvd-rom. This is using a hacked firmware on a nec 2500a. Has anyone had any experience trying this and seeing if that makes a difference playing backed up games on an unmodded xb? This would at least take care of the argument about the different types of dvds I would think.

[thebigj706]

EVERYONE the reason you need a modchip to play backups is because all retail games are signed with an RSA code at the beginning of the DVD. The modchip isnt tricking the console into thinking its a different media,i believe dvd-/+r doesnt matter to a dvd-rom drive, it is just the RSA key that is being bypassed. Thats why theres all those projects to find the RSA key, so they can boot their own progs and stuff wtihout a modchip.

[geniusalz]

True, the RSA key needs to be correct.  If it were just the media type, mass "factory" produced dvd's from China would work on an unmodded Xbox, but they don't.

[Kthulu]

actually, xbe's do have media flags embedded in them so that they will only run from certain media and if the region flag in the xbe matches the region of the xbox.  it is documented in the xdk that there are separate media flags for hard-drive, dvdrom, xboxdisc, and others, but there is no documented discernment between dvd+r and dvd-r.

ultimately, it IS the RSA key that prevents backups from running on an unmodified xbox.  if you edit the xbe's to change their media flags, RSA key no longer matches the hash of the xbe.  i've read seemingly ambiguous information regarding whether or not the actual disc is signed, so i'll take someone else's word on that.  the bottomline that everyone should accept tho is that a backup will never run on an unmodified xbox.  unless someone gets REALLY lucky, it will take YEARS to crack the MS RSA encryption key.

no information such as music or cut-scenes are lost when backing-up an xbox game..unless you purposely leave it out to save space.

a modchip is not necessary to modify an xbox.  you can flash the tsop (onboard bios chip in xbox) or you can use an audio or font exploit.  the UDE exploit is really living up to it's name.  if i were just starting out, that is the route i would take,  but tsop flashing isn't very hard either and it makes lots of things easier and less complicated...but i digress...

[Xeero]

It's a combination of things, actually: media type and signature.

If you could copy all the files (without touching them) and press them onto a DVD, theoretically it would work fine.  The Xbox would see the signature was valid, and it would also see it was an "original" DVD in a manner of speaking, because it was pressed and not burned.

However, since pressing DVDs isn't an option, we can do the following:
-Leave the signature intact and burn the files onto a DVD-R, at which point the media check will trigger (because it's a DVD-R) and kick you out
or
-Change the media type to accept all discs and burn the files onto a DVD-R, at which point the Xbox will notice the altered signature and kick you out.

There is no way around this by changing bitsettings of your burner.  It really IS that simple.  As I said, you could press it, but come on...

A modchip/soft mod remedies each of these situations...so why look any further than that?