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[lordvader129]

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Yeah, so I was reading over that Iraqi soldier thread and saw that you actually got her banned...

he got himself banned, i didnt even do anything

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You may not argee with someone, but people should feel free to post their opinions in this forum as long as they are somewhat civil about.

that somewhat civil part was xmedia problem, and why he got banned

1: there ARE laws to prevent sale of guns to minors, however, if bubba's gunshop sells a shotgun to a 10 year old, bubba is the one held responsible, xmedia wants winchester (the company that makes the gun) to be held responsible, probably because they have more money

2: tax breaks and subsidies are 2 different things, if you want to start discussion subsidies to oil companies i agree with you, they shouldnt be given tax money outright

3:yeah, and its been going on forever, not a unique bush-ism like many people make it out to be

4:wars have always been about money, its like the governments business, lol, like saying bill gates has no money profitting from MS since he had a hand in making it

5:my uncle fought in the first gulf war, he witnessed firsthand saddams use of biological weapons against both his own people and american troops, in the meantime he has had ample time to destroy or hide them (not hard to do in half a million sq km of desert) my point is he is still accountable for past crimes

as for korea, yeah, they are a threat too, but they havent acted directly against america, besides, iraq was the easier target, and thats how things have always worked


but your right, this stuff is nothign new, its part of america, i wouldnt go so far as to say we are slaves, if we were you wouldnt be free to leave the country if you didnt liek it

[PhatIrishBastard]

QUOTE(hartwickhaloer @ Jan 8 2006, 11:03 AM)

Yeah, so I was reading over that Iraqi soldier thread and saw that you actually got her banned...
You may not argee with someone, but people should feel free to post their opinions in this forum as long as they are somewhat civil about. But yeah, so I stumbled into here and see the 3 of you fighting...
On this point I think that she is correct and you guys are wrong. In fact, your attempt to rip apart her 5 points only made her points stronger.

1. I agree with her and gunmakers/sellers should be forced to attempt to limit access to minors. In fact, I think there needs to be an intelligence test before someone can buy a gun, but that's an entirely different point. My justification is if the Tobacco Industry has to do it, why shouldn't the Gun Industry do it as well? Tobacco kills people a lot slower and less definite than guns (i.e. Someone could smoke 2 packs a day for their entire life and get lucky and not die or get sick, however if someone gets shot with a gun, damage is always going to be caused).

2. So the only reason we gave tax breaks to the Oil Industry was to save money for the consumers? That's is so far away from the truth that one couldn't even see the truth. I'm currently a Junior, pursuing a major in Business Management and minors in Economics and Finance so I think I might have a better grasp on it than you would (that is unless you could post some evidence of what makes you qualified). Let's look at the situation... The US government is giving taxpayer money to the Oil Industry in order to save us more money at the pump? If that was their intentions wouldn't it be smarter for them to just put the money back in our pockets through a tax break, or even elminating federal taxes on gasoline? Obviously there were alterior motives and I would have to agree that lobbying as well as campaign contributions are a huge factor in it.

3. I don't really pay attention to fraud that much since it is a lot more difficult for us to correct that since it's pretty easy for the government to cover it's cronies.

4. It's not illegal to make money, and it probably isn't illegal for what Cheney is doing with his (dont think he is that involved with it, besides collecting profits) company otherwise he would be indictated. However, there is a difference between what is illegal and what is ethical or unethical for that matter. Haliburton received uncontested contracts to re-build Iraq as well as many other goverment projects. These projects are usually open to bid (that's where the government states what it needs and then contractors give them a cost, the lowest cost wins), these ones weren't. Without bidding out contracts, Haliburton pretty much had a monopoly in some respects as they had no competition, thus no need to lower their fees which would have diminished their profits. The bottom line is, it is wrong for Cheney to profit off of a war that he played a big role in creating.

5. This is probably one of the most important points. I strongly disagree with what you said but it isn't a surprise, nearly every Iraqi War supporter has said it in one way or another. Oh no, Sadaam was a horrible horrible person, look what he did to the people in his country, etc... I hate to break it to you, but what Sadaam did in Iraq is most likely nothing compared to other dictators or even compared to past ones. Did the United States go in and stop Stalin during the great purge, or when he systemically slaughtered citizens of satelite countries who would not conform? One of the big reasons we went to war was Weapons of Mass Destruction. Before the war, very few people believe that Iraq housed any of these, or even had the capability to produce them. Hell, to this date, not a single WMD has been found in Iraq. How did Bush respond?... "Whoops, I didn't know he didn't have them, I guess someone in my staff lied to me" and then nobody even questioned it. As far as Kim Jhong, he is by far a greater threat. Hundreds of thousands of people are being starved to death in North Korea. Why's that you may ask? Because Kim Jhong has decided to use all of the resources of the country to attempt to build a nuclear bomb and completely neglect his own citizens.

In conclusion, you two are completely wrong... But that's besides the point because none of this shit really matters anyhow. We don't live in a democracy, we have little to no power as far as politics are concerned in our country. We're left with two choices... Either suck it up and live as a slave (which is more or less the reality), or leave the country.

QUOTE

Yeah, so I was reading over that Iraqi soldier thread and saw that you actually got her banned...
You may not argee with someone, but people should feel free to post their opinions in this forum as long as they are somewhat civil about. But yeah, so I stumbled into here and see the 3 of you fighting...
On this point I think that she is correct and you guys are wrong. In fact, your attempt to rip apart her 5 points only made her points stronger.

Actually he (xmedia) is working in  iraq and kuwait at the moment. But he did get himself banned, he was bored and was shipping out. The money he is raking up tax free has me jealous.

But I sort of agree with you on the slavery issue. This country was built on slavery and for the most part western culture.  Having served in wartime, and working in military complex the hypocrisy is even more glaring.

Fuck it, Blame it Springer, Jesse Jackson, or Michael Moore I guess. Accountability is taboo.