xboxscene.org forums

Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6

Author Topic: Stolen Honor  (Read 399 times)

feflicker

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1692
Stolen Honor
« Reply #60 on: October 20, 2004, 10:21:00 AM »

tongue.gif

The bottom line is that this crapumentary wouldn't even be an issue if there wasn't a Bush Vs. Kerry, so of course the topic is going to have its moments when the focus is shifted to the candidates...

Anyway... That being said, this thread turned out nicely. A lot of intelligent, thought-out, informative, responses  beerchug.gif
Logged

Baner

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 662
Stolen Honor
« Reply #61 on: October 20, 2004, 11:14:00 AM »

QUOTE
1. The war in Iraq was not neccessary. There were no WMD's or an 'emenent threat' like Bush told us. They lied to the UN and gave bogus information showing setallite photos saying they knew 'exactly' where these WMD sites are only to come up empty handed. There was no eminent threat to the U.S. and no need to engage in this war to begin with but not only that, we barely have any help. Don't even go on about the 30 nations that are a 'coalition of the willing', compared with the number of troops that we have over there, their support, while appreciated, isn't that much and we could have used more troops and greater cooperation from 'other' nations.

Wasn't it the CIA that told Bush that information? We all believed Clinton when he was told there were WMDs in Iraq the first time, and we believed it again. "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me again, shame on me."

QUOTE
2. Bush lied and flip-flopped about medical marijuana. He said he thought the states were compenent enough to take care of the issue on their own, same with gay marriage. Yet now he is sending the DEA and FBI to bust people who use it medicinally and who have APPROVED the measure to do so in their own state. I guess when he said he thought the states could handle it on their own he meant 'they can handle it on their own if they agree with me' (then gives retarded look).

1. Source please?
2. I doubt he'd use the FBI into a home with someone using medicinal Mary Jane, considering the low amount of herb they're actually given.

QUOTE
3. I'm not saying I like or even understand Kerry's tax plan but under Bush, I didn't get crap.

I'm sorry to hear that. sad.gif I don't think blindly going with the other canidate is a good choice either tho.

QUOTE
4. I don't know where you are reading your news BJ, but from every Canadian I have spoken to, Canada's health care system is something to be admired and I haven't read a damn thing about it being a bad thing for Canada or trying to change it too drastically. It's good because everyone is covered. I am not saying we should use that exact same approach here (you'd never get it with the pharm companies hands in the politicians pockets), but it's a novel approach and I think we should move in that direction. I don't know about anyone else but Health care is crazy expensive and I for one am one of the people who lost health coverage under bush's presidency.

I've noticed that Americans aren't ones to allow themselves to be taxed more, even if it benifits them a little. You get a canidate that openly says he's going to tax people more, and you won't see him as president. Not saying the Canadian health care plan is bad, just saying it won't happen in America.

QUOTE
5. I'm sorry again BJ, but I don't know how in the hell you can say that Bush seems more competent than Kerry like "he's a guy that would know what to do if there is a possum dead in his driveway". Whatever! Just watching him in the first debate, all he could say was flip flopper to Kerry. Bush seems like the kind of guy to me who is controlled and not in control. He wasn't prepared or could even find the words to use against Kerry in that debate and that to me shows a man who knows no more than what someone else has written or told him to say.

The bold words implies that it's an opinion, and your's differs from his.
I might be wrong, but I don't remember Bush calling Kerry a Flip Flopper during the debate. I know Bush got his ass handed to him in the first debate (yet to see the other two), but it is harder to debate as the current president against a master debater (hehe), then as the "attacker".

QUOTE
6. He can't even pronounce Nuclear for christ's sake! It's not nucular you friggin moron!

Sucks that you don't like his accent, maybe we all don't\can't pronunciate as well as you do.

QUOTE
7. He damaged relations with other country's over a war that shouldn't have been. Again, remember there were no WMD's and there was no immediate threat.

Who's relations did he damage? I'm pretty sure France, Russia, Germany, Iraq, and Iran weren't on our good side to begin with.

QUOTE
8. To the country's that decided not to help the US in the war in Iraq, Bush sent a big middle finger their way by telling them they are not able to bid for contracts to help rebuild Iraq. WTF was that?! For a president to turn away help was retarded. Seems like a tit for tat thing to me. Again, showing his child like actions.

I don't see why a nation should beable to profit form a reformed country, that they didn't help reform.

QUOTE
9. No real stratedgy going into Iraq and getting out of Iraq. Two more things that could have been accomplished much better if he wouldn't have been so impatient.
10. Complete and total secrecy for things that should have been made open to the public.

Hmm... those fit together pretty well, except for the part about being made open to the public. I would rather not have our enemey know our every plan.
As for keeping things secret, what about Kerry not releasing his military papers, much like Bush did.

QUOTE
11. Since he couldn't get a judge on the bench through the conventional way like going through the house and congress, he decided to wait till recess and then appoint him that way. I sure do like judges who think homosexuality is akin to beastiality and rape.

To the victor goes the spoils, aka Spoils system, look it up.

Sorry for the long ass post, but it was calling out my name tongue.gif
Logged

feflicker

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1692
Stolen Honor
« Reply #62 on: October 20, 2004, 12:10:00 PM »

cool.gif
Logged

The unProfessional

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 679
Stolen Honor
« Reply #63 on: October 20, 2004, 12:10:00 PM »

I have a new goal in life.  Go to medical school, win the lottery, and turn my house into a hospital.  That way, I can provide health care to family and friends since whether they live in Canada or the US, they're @*#ked.
Logged

pug_ster

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 804
Stolen Honor
« Reply #64 on: October 20, 2004, 01:14:00 PM »

Even Canada's health care system sounds bad, US's health care system is much much worse.  If you are affected with a medical problem which is going to cost you, and you don't have insurance, you're basically screwed of your money.  To make it worse, for the people who has no insurance and cannot pay for the bill, the hospital can't recover the money from them, so they have to pass along the cost to people who can pay.
Logged

gainpresence

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 940
Stolen Honor
« Reply #65 on: October 20, 2004, 01:36:00 PM »

I know this thread has gone far from the topic.. But it's not Stolen Honor that's airing on Sinclair Networks, it's a news report called 'A POW Story' that addresses issues brought up in Stolen Honor. Sinclair says it will be fair to both sides, and that John Kerry was even invited on for the whole 90 minutes to respond. Who knows how it will turn out.

The funny thing is, Democrats are already threatening Sinclair before anyone's even seen the report (from what I hear, it hasn't even been made yet).
Logged

feflicker

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1692
Stolen Honor
« Reply #66 on: October 20, 2004, 02:40:00 PM »

QUOTE
The funny thing is, Democrats are already threatening Sinclair before anyone's even seen the report (from what I hear, it hasn't even been made yet).


gainpresence, the doc was actually made, you can view it online and it is downloadable in the newsgroups.

Sinclair just shifted yesterday toward this "POW Story" thing as opposed to airing the documentary in its entirety.  wink.gif

So yeah, no one can complain now, we don't know what this report will be, we just hope it is fair.

And about Kerry going on the program... Would you expect Bush to go on the panel if this was about Fahrenheit 911? I wouldn't...
Logged

brandogg

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1668
Stolen Honor
« Reply #67 on: October 20, 2004, 07:18:00 PM »

I've always heard that it was a story that featured parts and possibly all of Stolen Honor, from teh first day this was announced. A hotel near me showed it yesterday, and apparently everyone who saw it now hates John Kerry. I didn't see it, but I'm gonna try to find it somewhere.
Logged

pug_ster

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 804
Stolen Honor
« Reply #68 on: October 23, 2004, 11:22:00 PM »

I finally had some time to watch it.  All the former POW's in this so called 'documentry' blamed on Kerry for why they remain a POW for so long.  They don't have any solid proof of why Kerry and other peace activists remained as a POW.  

The only people who can negotiate for the POW's release is by the Vietnamese and US govt, not Kerry and their peace activists.  I feel sorry for these former POW's but they just blamed on Kerry for nothing.
Logged

feflicker

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1692
Stolen Honor
« Reply #69 on: October 24, 2004, 01:44:00 AM »

QUOTE
I feel sorry for these former POW's but they just blamed on Kerry for nothing.


I agree.

The whole notion that the Vets who returned and voiced their outrage at the way the troops were behaving (and were being ordered to behave) in Vietnam somehow adversely affected the troops is ridiculous to me.

What are we going to do? Track down everyone who said anything at the time that could have negatively impacted the troops? Well, if we are talking about Vietnam we better get some pencils and paper because if I am not mistaken, that war was heavily protested against by the U.S. and other nations!

I say "bravo" to Kerry and the other troops that returned and reported the problems over there. Remember, the President at the time wouldn't listen to anybody about how bad things were going, somebody had to step in front of Congress and say something, sound familiar?  dry.gif
Logged

pug_ster

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 804
Stolen Honor
« Reply #70 on: October 24, 2004, 09:33:00 AM »

QUOTE
“I would like to talk, representing all those veterans, and say that several months ago in Detroit, we had an investigation at which over 150 honorably discharged and many very highly decorated veterans testified to war crimes committed in Southeast Asia, not isolated incidents but crimes committed on a day-to-day basis with the full awareness of officers at all levels of command..." – John Kerry [Senate Foreign Relations Committee Testimony, 4/22/71]


QUOTE
“The historical record shows that atrocities did occur in Vietnam, as in the My Lai massacre or the so-called Tiger Force activities that were recently uncovered.” [Newsday, 2/22/04]


QUOTE
“Stanley Karnow, author of ‘Vietnam: A History,’ said there is no question that atrocities occurred on both sides in the Vietnam War. [Boston Globe, 5/13/04]


QUOTE
Gen. Tommy Franks: Certain That Atrocities in Vietnam Did Take Place. “I think we had a lot of problems in Vietnam. One was the lack of leadership of young people like in - - in John Kerry's position. He was a young officer over there, and I'm not sure that -- that activities like that didn't take place. In fact, quite the contrary. I'm sure that they did. ...I wouldn't say that the things that Senator Kerry said are undeniable about activities in Vietnam. I think that things didn't go right in Vietnam.” [Hannity and Colmes, 8/3/04]


It is probably similar to the things happening today at Abu Ghraib.  I'm pretty sure that their superiors ordered the soldiers to do this kind of stuff.

While an estimated 55k US soldiers died and 300k us soldiers injured, there were about an estimated 3 million Vietnamese people died.  Do you think all of these 3 million Vietnamese are soldiers or perhaps there are a good number of them are women and children?
Logged

Ween311

  • Archived User
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 286
Stolen Honor
« Reply #71 on: October 24, 2004, 10:34:00 AM »

If that's true, then should somebody who admitted to taking part of those atrocities be allowed to be President?
Logged

pug_ster

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 804
Stolen Honor
« Reply #72 on: October 24, 2004, 10:43:00 AM »

QUOTE (Ween311 @ Oct 24 2004, 06:37 PM)
If that's true, then should somebody who admitted to taking part of those atrocities be allowed to be President?

And you have some proof that he took part of those atrocities.

And heres a link of what he said in the senate hearings was true...

http://www.villagevo.../0438/turse.php
Logged

Ween311

  • Archived User
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 286
Stolen Honor
« Reply #73 on: October 24, 2004, 11:38:00 AM »

QUOTE
(Audiotape, April 18, 1971):

MR. CROSBY NOYES (Washington Evening Star): Mr. Kerry, you said at one time or another that you think our policies in Vietnam are tantamount to genocide and that the responsibility lies at all chains of command over there. Do you consider that you personally as a Naval officer committed atrocities in Vietnam or crimes punishable by law in this country?

SEN. KERRY: There are all kinds of atrocities, and I would have to say that, yes, yes, I committed the same kind of atrocities as thousands of other soldiers have committed in that I took part in shootings in free fire zones. I conducted harassment and interdiction fire. I used 50 calibre machine guns, which we were granted and ordered to use, which were our only weapon against people. I took part in search and destroy missions, in the burning of villages. All of this is contrary to the laws of warfare, all of this is contrary to the Geneva Conventions and all of this is ordered as a matter of written established policy by the government of the United States from the top down. And I believe that the men who designed these, the men who designed the free fire zone, the men who ordered us, the men who signed off the air raid strike areas, I think these men, by the letter of the law, the same letter of the law that tried Lieutenant Calley, are war criminals.

(End audiotape)



So he admitted it, its true.  He should not be allowed to be President?
Logged

pug_ster

  • Archived User
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 804
Stolen Honor
« Reply #74 on: October 24, 2004, 03:34:00 PM »

This is his response on a show on Meet the press a few years back.

http://hnn.us/articles/3552.html

I think the commanders are responsible for this because they are ordered to do it.  But he didn't do any indecent things like genocide.  

Besides Bush wasn't exactly an Saint either when he was young.  Should we allow a president elected when he was arrested before?
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6