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[Deftech]

QUOTE(Mr Invader @ May 15 2006, 10:12 PM)

Every week i see more things that persuade me to not even touch a PS3

All the games (graphics) are very disappointing considering that last year Sony made fun of every other console for not being as "good" as they were. Now look at E306, very dissappointing in my opinion. The graphics are no where near what they said they were going to be, the price is way to high, and it seems that everything that Sony does is copying either the Nintendo Wii or the Xbox 360.

Piss on Sony and there "wonderful" PS3

Ive been doing that for 6 months, look at my sig  

[Deftech]

QUOTE(bpsmx001 @ May 16 2006, 09:33 PM)

I have been a long time Sony supporter, but realistically there is NOOOO WAY that I can support them here and still respect myself as a gamer.  They showed ABSOLUTELY NOTHING that was better in gameplay on the Wii or graphics on the 360.  Also, I don't remember the last E3 that the developers, analysts, manufacturers, press, and gamers all unanimously proclaimed that a company dropped the ball like Sony did.  I don't see how anyone with any common sense can say that Sony had a good show.  It wasn't that they were bad.  They just weren't nearly as good as their competition this time. They seem to not realize that they are not going up against SEGA, a company that at the time of the PS2 launch had alienated 90% of its fanbase and 75% of its 3rd party support by coming out with a system every 6 months. For this not even the likes of greedy EA would support them, and they support everybody(MONEY)!!!

This failure actually started with the PS2.  If you remember everyone complained about the price of the machine and the games, developers complained about it's difficult developement environment, Sony realeased it late according to their timetable and they flat out lied about the PS2s capabilities(Supercomputer my A$$).  BUT, THERE WAS NO REAL COMPETITION AND EVERYONE WAS FORCED TO BUY SONY'S HARDWARE. Not so? OK, TELL ME WHAT WAS THE OTHER CONSOLE CHOICE TO BUY INSTEAD OF THE PS2?!!! I give you one guess because anymore would be overkill.

SONY NEEDS TO REALIZE WHETHER THEY LIKE IT OR NOT, THEY ARE FACING REAL COMPETITION THIS TIME, NOT VAPORWARE OR COMPANIES ON THE VERGE OF BANKRUPTCY.THEY NEEDED TO SHOW EVERYONE SOMETHING AT LEAST VAGUELY RESEMBLING WHAT THEY SHOWED AT E3 '05, BUT THEY DID NOT AND THEREFORE LOST PLENTY OF MINDSHARE BECAUSE THEY WERE SIMPLY NOT PREPARED FOR NINTENDO AND MS TO SHOW A SOLID, IF VERY GOOD LINE-UP OF SOFTWARE AND PRODUCTS.

I liken this round to the classic SNES VS. Genesis battle. Nintendo was riding high with close to 90% marketshare and thought they could not be beaten.  Of course SEGA launches the Genesis early because they had been whipped in the 8-bit wars(Sound Familiar?). Then SEGA proceeds to out-cool and outmanuver Nintendo to the point were even Nintendo's most loyal developer began making games for SEGA. Until just about every 3rd party exclusive franchise Nintendo ever had was now also on the Genesis as well as the SNES.  Nintendo still won overall, but they lost a HUGE chunk of market share. I think it was 56/44 Nintendo by that time.  But, the point is that Nintendo thought they could arrive late to the party, show up drunk and nobody would care because after all they were Nintendo, and everybody LOVED Nintendo...RIGHT?!!  You know... It's ironic that Peter Moore was the at the helm of Sega when he acomplished what nobody at that time thought was possible...It seems as though he is poised to do it again with MS.

The bottom line is that outside of fanboy loyalty there is no REAL compeling reason to be an early adopter of the PS3. Most of its best games have no concrete release dates, and have not demonstrated a leap in technology as promised...mabye next year...mabye not.  With developer forced to make more titles available cross-platform due to market conditions...I just don't think that SONY will have the software advatage they enjoyed in the past.  Just like the past allegences WILL shift and market share will be much more evenly distributed in this round.  In this senario...the advantage goes to the company who can reach "critical mass" first and best distance themselves from the competition with their 1st party line-up.  The advantage would go to MS.  

This will either be Sony greatest comeback or the one of the biggest corporate downfalls in history...The public will ultimately decide.  But, it doesn't look good for Sony.

Indeed, to all of it.

every roundtable held by every website has said the same thing during/since E3...

"Thinking sony will automatically win is foolish" or something along those lines.

I mention *websites* only because in the past they all seemed biased towards sony in 1 way or another and would slander anything else. That has changed. Hell, even G4 is singing a different tune. I cant believe it, but the media themselves has finally seen the light. It took longer than I expected, but the tides are changing.

If you disagree, put yourself in the "Foolish" category.

Only a diehard sony fanboy/zombie would sit here and say that sony will win and the competition doesnt have a chance.

Sad thing is...such people are in great abundance, blindly following the Shepherd and making asses of themselves every step of the way.

Buy whatever console you want I say. Buy them all. Love them all. The consumer wins in the end(well maybe not @ $600.00)

[ikecomp]

 I'm buying a PS3 for evey day I've lived because I know some over anxious consumer will be willing to pay an absorbent amout money to get their hands on one

Move over santa, theres a new distributor in town  

[Deftech]

QUOTE(ikecomp @ May 17 2006, 10:47 AM)

 I'm buying a PS3 for evey day I've lived because I know some over anxious consumer will be willing to pay an absorbent amout money to get their hands on one

Move over santa, theres a new distributor in town  

hahahaha

[KAGE360]

great post bpsmx001, i also refer to this coming generation as a genesis vs. snes remake.  however i think there is something that is inaccurate in your post, i thought i remember reading many times that in the peak of the 16-bit era (very weird using the term "bit" again) that sega enjoyed a 55% market shair.  nothing huge but still a success and an accomplishment for sure.  will that happen again?  its too early to tell but not likely unfortunatly.  there are still far too many people who will shun MS and nintendo for a sony console IMHO.  if MS plays its cards right and prices the 360 at the right amounts it could go the other way.  

I dont mind sony being in the market as competition benefits us gamers, but i do get confused how a company with so many issues can remain the dominent figure in the industry.  with being the market leader they should act like one and they did not this E3.  MS and nintendo acted like industry leaders and gave us what we wanted, games.  maybe when/if sony is knocked off of its thrown, they will put more thought to whats best for the consumers and not their own hype, pockets, and brand name.

[Liquid Smoke]

i got the cash, just not sure if i wanna spend $500 though. i will probably wait like 5-6 months and hopefully theres a price drop. i'll probably have to wait that long anyway cuz i wont be sleeping in front of best buy to get one and im not buying one off ebay for twice the price.

[Deftech]

itll be a hell of a lot longer than 5 or 6 months b4 sony does a price drop. they MUST keep it high for as long as possible to recoup some money. Id say it'll be atleast a year. For your sake, I hope Im wrong.

[twistedsymphony]

QUOTE(Deftech @ May 22 2006, 10:45 PM)

itll be a hell of a lot longer than 5 or 6 months b4 sony does a price drop. they MUST keep it high for as long as possible to recoup some money. Id say it'll be atleast a year. For your sake, I hope Im wrong.

Or it will be like the PSP where launch day sales tank because of the high price... then they drop the price 27% just to move the things and shaft the only people who actually supported them on day 1.

[Deftech]

QUOTE(twistedsymphony @ May 23 2006, 09:33 AM)

Or it will be like the PSP where launch day sales tank because of the high price... then they drop the price 27% just to move the things and shaft the only people who actually supported them on day 1.

didnt know they did that, you have a point.

[Johnny Johnson]

Would only get one if the price drops by $200, which won't happen for a few years.

[Deftech]

QUOTE(calderra @ May 28 2006, 01:09 PM)

Let me first start out with two points:

-Incredible topic here. Great debate, great points.

-Do we need any more proof that Xbox enthusiasts are the "best" fanboys? I always felt that when I bought my system and it's always been confirmed when I've been working in game stores. Xbox enthusiasts probably own more than one console, and they probably have a great deal of respect for all of them, unless there's just some incredible BS they can't stand (which unfortunately tends to come from Sony). Just take a jog over to the Wii60 forums- Nintendo and Xbox fans (and newcomers) all living in perfect harmony. Everyone just cares about the games and the experience- making fun of Sony just becomes a focusing point. It seems like people who give the Xbox brand its due credit are people who are (generally) less biased, more informed, and more inquisitive. They want to know about all the consoles, and if they're not buying the competition, they at least want to understand them. All in my own personal experience, anyway.

Now to break apward bpsmx001's excellent post. Great job on this one!

"I have been a long time Sony supporter, but realistically there is NOOOO WAY that I can support them here and still respect myself as a gamer."
-Welcome to the Xbox camp. A lot of pro-Xbox people just got fed up with Sony's BS and wanted an alternative. And you're not alone- I spot topics on teamxbox.com all the time where long-time Sony fanboys are admitting they just can't take it anymore.

"Also, I don't remember the last E3 that the developers, analysts, manufacturers, press, and gamers all unanimously proclaimed that a company dropped the ball like Sony did."
-Correction, you can't remember when the press ever CORRECTLY laid the blame like this. The press have destroyed nearly every MS showing at e3 since the Xbox first arrived. Look at last year's e3- most press outlets almost laughed MS off the floor (despite the tons of playables) while lauding Sony like Killzone was the Second Coming of Christ.

"I don't see how anyone with any common sense can say that Sony had a good show."
-Ridge Racer. Riiiiiidge Raaacerrr!!!

"This failure actually started with the PS2.  [...] flat out lied about the PS2s capabilities"
-This was the #1 reason for my early support of Xbox (besides 16-player Halo LAN). Even if Xbox didn't turn out to be a commercial success, developers loved it, and MS seemed to have the right mentality. Look at the amount of multiplayer goodness generally experienced on Xbox versus PS2. I was drawn like a moth to a flame, "This is the experience I've been waiting for."

"Then SEGA proceeds to out-cool and outmanuver Nintendo to the point were even Nintendo's most loyal developer began making games for SEGA."
-Like all the Japanese companies / franchises moving to Xbox?

"Nintendo still won overall, but they lost a HUGE chunk of market share."
-Nearly identital results with X/PS2

"Nintendo thought they could arrive late to the party, show up drunk and nobody would care because after all they were Nintendo, and everybody LOVED Nintendo...RIGHT?!!"
-See the exec saying PS3'll sell 5mil even without games.

"The bottom line is that outside of fanboy loyalty there is no REAL compeling reason to be an early adopter of the PS3."
-The box has yet to demonstrate ANY justification for its price, other than being a BluRay player.

"This will either be Sony greatest comeback or the one of the biggest corporate downfalls in history...The public will ultimately decide.  But, it doesn't look good for Sony."
-Not so long ago, a fresh-faced kid walked into the biggest corporation on the planet, sat down to sell software he didn't even own, and with nothing at all to really back it up, told them "you need us". And that's how Bill Gates took the first hammerswing in the effort that finally toppled IBM as the "big brother" of the computer market. MS has done this before, and they're better at it than anyone else has ever been.

 

[Mr Invader]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again

The PS3 looks worse and worse with each passing day

The only people that buy a PS3 will be the rich snobs that are actually too full of themselves to admit that their precious long awaited ps3 is actually a bunch of crap.

Those are the real losers of the console war

The PS3 promised so much at E3 04 and 05, and at E3 06 they finally came out with the real stuff that sony was dishing out and it was really dissapointing for all sony fanboys.

Wii60 all the way!

[incognegro]

yea im getting wii60 myself, i mean two for the price of one    

by the way i made a point recently about nintendo and sony's strategies being similar in a sense. Think about it, they are both handling these console launches just like how they handle the handheld market. Sony's ps3 and psp are both over priced graphic monsters void of any real special gameplay while The DS and wii are both promising in terms of gameplay, affordability and slightly underpowered (yet nobody cares...) also they both have a unique control mechanism. Ofcourse nintendo is whooping sony's ass so I predict the same for this gen. The wild card though is MS. There is no comparison for them so I dont know how theyre gonna do but i can say this, keep doing what theyre doing now and they'll be fine.

[shenmuemaster]

I will only buy the PS3, IF I see some games that really impress me, IMO, there hasnt been anything on PS3 that has impressed me so far, because of the fact that half of them are rendered footage, and ones made to look like they are gameplay, aren't (Eight Days anyone   )

The whole tilt controller thing, im not a big fan of it, well apart from the Wii. Most of the stuff produced for the Wii looks well thought out, and will have an impressive outcome. However with the PS3, I see it as just a gimmick. I can picture the novelty of the PS3 tilt controller wearing off very quickly, and just bringing back a simple Dual shock 3 (with the shock ) Leave it to Nintendo!

Also, I will only get one, when the PS3 is cheaper. I just don't have that kind of money. But whenever I complain bout the PS3's price tag, all I hear is "The PS3 is good value for money considering you get a BluRay player...", personally I don't care for BluRay atm. I'll probably end up watchin DVDs on my standard TV for years to come, until im forced to move to BluRay when DVD is no longer available. IMO, I think HD- DVD looks more promising...

So, when PS3 drops in price, and come up with more games, i'll consider it. But for now (and probably always) im gonna stick with my 360. Better games, better controller, better online service, better price, better everything really. I'm Wii60 for now    but i'll like to see where PS3 is goin. Its gonna be an interesting next-gen console war, and im lookin forward to it  

[incognegro]

Nintendos ideas are great but the problem is they will never be taken seriously. I mean lets be honest, its a "mario party" system where all the games are gonna be great but feel like mini games. It may have fun titles but I doubt they will keep your attention for long; it will be great for impressing your parents and friends but for serious gaming you'll probably stick to a 360 or a ps3. Thats why its probably not gonna be anybodys primary system. If you do buy it, you'll probably buy a 360 also. Its the reality of things. I think nintendo knows this thats why theyre not directly competing with anyone.