Post by: Xbox-Scene on June 29, 2008, 11:42:00 AM
| A update to a xbox1 based application to manipulate partitions of xbox harddrives... Whats New/Fixed: -Update by Bomb Bloke (see end of document for my moment on the soapbox). -Cluster size update correction. -Automatically uses 64k clusters when formatting > 512GB partitions, 128k clusters when formatting > 1TB partitions, and so forth. (New system does not allow for users to 'toggle' cluster size via Y button). -Switched display of megabytes to equal 1,048,576 bytes (1024^2). -Extended partitions are now displayed in gigabytes. Official Site: n/a (by Bomb Bloke) Download: n/a (built with XDK) News-Source: Xbins.org Full Readme |
Post by: alexh on June 29, 2008, 12:39:00 PM
Last year I lost a load of data on my 400Gig drive because it had the default cluster size... worked fine for ages and then bang... started loosing DIR's and files :-(
This post has been edited by alexh: Jun 29 2008, 07:39 PM
Post by: Bandit5317 on June 29, 2008, 12:31:00 PM
That's enough to backup like 300 xbox games.
Post by: Maturion on June 29, 2008, 01:25:00 PM
Post by: capboy210 on June 29, 2008, 01:05:00 PM
QUOTE(Bandit5317 @ Jun 29 2008, 02:07 PM) 
Awesome, larger than 1 TB partitions. That means the xbox will be ready to go when the new 2 TB drives come out
That's enough to backup like 300 xbox games.Easily more than that. Thats about what 1Tb will get you...
And 128k clusters!! I wonder if thats enough to affect the performance of the hard drive! Im not sure... Someone who tries this should fill us in.
But will this version work in conjunction with debug bioses found in xbins?
Post by: alexh on June 29, 2008, 02:03:00 PM
This post has been edited by alexh: Jun 29 2008, 09:03 PM
Post by: AmyGrrl on June 29, 2008, 02:31:00 PM
Post by: alexh on June 29, 2008, 03:03:00 PM
QUOTE(AmyGrrl @ Jun 29 2008, 09:31 PM)
I just wonder if the person made an option to resize the screen a little... alot of the program gets cut off and its hard to make out what you are doing...
RTFM?
QUOTE(Bomb Bloke)
One other problem people have reported re XBPartitioner is that the video display is sometimes stretched to something greater then that of their screen. In these cases you should check that your display settings in the MS Dash match that of your television set's capabilities.
Post by: AmyGrrl on June 29, 2008, 05:21:00 PM
Post by: AWD Bus on June 29, 2008, 07:14:00 PM
QUOTE(alexh @ Jun 29 2008, 03:03 PM)
You should still try to use a 67 BIOS with both F and G partitions to reduce the amount per partition
Actually you do not need to do that. I have done a ton of 500s and a few 750s with no trouble at all. All on G partition. There is NO REASON to even mess with the F partition.
The original program would do 1.2 tb anyways. I have used this program so many times, Huge thanks to the guy who wrote it!
Post by: Milleman on June 30, 2008, 05:40:00 AM
So where do I find the new wonderful XBPartitioner Version 1.1 for download?
Post by: Heet on June 30, 2008, 06:39:00 AM
Can definately use this in the near future!
Post by: alexh on June 30, 2008, 06:48:00 AM
QUOTE(AWD Bus @ Jun 30 2008, 02:50 AM) 
Actually you do not need to do that [use a 67 BIOS]. I have done a ton of 500s and a few 750s with no trouble at all. All on G partition.
Erm, if you have a G partition... that means you ARE using a 67 BIOS (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)
This post has been edited by alexh: Jun 30 2008, 01:53 PM
Post by: AWD Bus on June 30, 2008, 06:13:00 AM
QUOTE(Milleman @ Jun 30 2008, 07:16 AM)
Sounds lovely!
So where do I find the new wonderful XBPartitioner Version 1.1 for download?
Xbins. Just search for that and you will know more.
Post by: quell on June 30, 2008, 09:37:00 AM
Post by: RolfLobker on June 30, 2008, 01:18:00 PM
QUOTE(quell @ Jun 30 2008, 05:37 PM)
Are you guys using adapters or something? I thought 1Tb drives are only SATA?
1TB P-ATA drives are freely available.
Post by: Bandit5317 on June 30, 2008, 10:09:00 PM
QUOTE(quell @ Jun 30 2008, 11:37 AM)
Are you guys using adapters or something? I thought 1Tb drives are only SATA?
You can buy SATA to IDE adapters, which is what anyone puting a SATA hdd in their xbox uses. Some people have had problems with drives using these adapters, though.
I know the xbox uses the FatX file system, but I was thinking about it and realized that these guys essentially just created the Fat64 and Fat128 file systems, at least I think (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) .
Post by: mikeraach on July 01, 2008, 12:47:00 PM
QUOTE(alexh @ Jun 29 2008, 07:39 PM)
Brilliant, couldn't come at a better time. I am retiring my old 750Gig PATA drive from my main PC for two new 1TB SATA drives. It will be good to know I can use it safely.
Last year I lost a load of data on my 400Gig drive because it had the default cluster size... worked fine for ages and then bang... started loosing DIR's and files :-(
Post by: MrFish on July 01, 2008, 05:22:00 PM
QUOTE(Bandit5317 @ Jul 1 2008, 05:09 AM)
I know the xbox uses the FatX file system, but I was thinking about it and realized that these guys essentially just created the Fat64 and Fat128 file systems, at least I think
.The '32' in 'FAT32' refers not to the size of the clusters, but to the length of each FAT entry. The FAT is, essentially, an array of pointers*, so with 16-bit pointers, the array can be only 2^16 long. (If it were longer, there would be no way to point at any entry after the 2^16th one). 32-bit pointers mean 2^16 more clusters.
All this does is increase the cluster size, not the number of clusters there are. FATX32**, were it to exist, would be able to handle 4k clusters on multi-terabyte drives.
* Each directory entry points at a single cluster. To read the file, you go read that cluster, and then look the cluster number up in the FAT. If the FAT entry points to another cluster, you read that one and look that one up, until you get to a FAT entry that marks the end of the file.
** Not to be confused with FAT32X, which (IIRC) is just FAT32 in a partition that extends beyond the ~0.12GB LBA barrier.
------------------------------------------------------
Hey, Xbox-Scene guys!
How about updating http://xbox-scene.com/bios_retail.html so's it tells us which BIOSes support this XBPartitioner partition table?
That is, if you're not too busy hunting down price-cut rumours, Microsoft press-releases, and random stuff you found on a blog to pad the front page with.
Post by: MrFish on July 01, 2008, 05:50:00 PM
QUOTE(mikeraach @ Jul 1 2008, 08:23 PM)
I've had my xbox mess up as well after it had been working fine for a long time. When I would transfer a new file to a partition, the file would be corrupt, and I even found that some of the other files on that partition would become corrupt (it would flash segments of video from the file I was copying when playing the file that was already there). Is this a cause from using the default cluster size? A reformat fixed it---until it did it again 6 months ago. I'm afraid that its going to happen again....
QUOTE
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
-- Albert Einstein, (attributed)
Yes, this is a result of using the default cluster size, and thus making a filesystem that's too small for the partition that contains it. What's happening is that at some point the FATX driver overflows, causing the target cluster to wrap around, and start writing from the front of the drive again.
Obviously this will overwrite files that are already there, or (if you're lucky) the boot block or FAT.
Consensus seems to be that the Xbox is artificially limited* to 2^24 clusters, so 16k clusters will get you 256GB; 32k, 512GB; and 64k, 1024GB partitions that don't corrupt themselves. But I've not had any reason to try any of this, so don't take my word for it; do some research.
* (The theoretical limit is 2^28, and there's no reason a closed platform like FATX couldn't use the whole 32-bit field for 2^32 clusters. IIRC, 9x is capped at 2^22, and has other limits as well)
Post by: bmcclint on July 01, 2008, 10:14:00 PM
It reads like some BIOSs can read the partition table from the disk rather than from the BIOS so this suggests that a custom layout can be accomplished. Has anyone ever experimented with this?
Thoughts are using a 1GB flash with a basic C, X, Y, and Z and the rest an E drive enough to store XBMC. Since I stream everything to the system no need for a 8GB disk or an optical. Solid state XBOX.
Anyway...anyone have pointers? What BIOS to use and will xbpartitioner allow me to create a legal file system on a 1GB CF card?
Thanks...
Post by: ldotsfan on July 02, 2008, 07:08:00 AM
QUOTE(bmcclint @ Jul 2 2008, 12:14 PM)
I went down this road about a year ago but no real answers.
It reads like some BIOSs can read the partition table from the disk rather than from the BIOS so this suggests that a custom layout can be accomplished. Has anyone ever experimented with this?
Thoughts are using a 1GB flash with a basic C, X, Y, and Z and the rest an E drive enough to store XBMC. Since I stream everything to the system no need for a 8GB disk or an optical. Solid state XBOX.
Anyway...anyone have pointers? What BIOS to use and will xbpartitioner allow me to create a legal file system on a 1GB CF card?
Thanks...
It's not just bios support. You won't be able to find a dash that handles non-standard sizes for X,Y,Z,C,E.
Post by: MrFish on July 02, 2008, 01:41:00 PM
QUOTE(ldotsfan @ Jul 2 2008, 02:44 PM)
It's not just bios support. You won't be able to find a dash that handles non-standard sizes for X,Y,Z,C,E.
XBMC would probably work. And if not, it's GPL, so it could certainly be modified to work. I'd assume most dashboards will work out the box, though: I don't know of one that can't cope with the much enlarged E drive of the debug Xbox.
If you used a 1GB CF, you wouldn't be able to play games anymore (even from DVD): they need their 1GB cache partition, and can't work without it. I don't think XBMC is too happy about running out of cache space either. 4GB might be a goer, though.
Post by: ldotsfan on July 03, 2008, 08:10:00 AM
QUOTE(MrFish @ Jul 3 2008, 03:41 AM)
XBMC would probably work. And if not, it's GPL, so it could certainly be modified to work.
It's a lot of work. The FATX support in XBMC still depends on the kernel. Writing the filesystem support from scratch is going to be quite a big project by itself.
Post by: MrFish on July 03, 2008, 12:43:00 PM
QUOTE(ldotsfan @ Jul 3 2008, 03:46 PM)
It's a lot of work. The FATX support in XBMC still depends on the kernel. Writing the filesystem support from scratch is going to be quite a big project by itself.
Don't follow: this newspost is about a utility that (with the help of compatible kernels) manipulates custom partition tables. The work's been done already.
The only modification necessary to XBMC would be to correct any assumptions it was making about free space.
Post by: ldotsfan on July 04, 2008, 08:28:00 AM
QUOTE(MrFish @ Jul 4 2008, 02:43 AM)
Don't follow: this newspost is about a utility that (with the help of compatible kernels) manipulates custom partition tables. The work's been done already.
The only modification necessary to XBMC would be to correct any assumptions it was making about free space.
http://xbmc.svn.sour...bmc/FileSystem/
Can you point out the relevant files to change?
Post by: MrFish on July 05, 2008, 12:16:00 AM
QUOTE(ldotsfan @ Jul 4 2008, 04:04 PM)
http://xbmc.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/xbm...bmc/FileSystem/
Can you point out the relevant files to change?
Stop obsessing about the filesystem. That's handled by the API the XDK provides. XBMC doesn't deal with the filesystem directly which is why you can run it on a debug Xbox, even though the E drive is the wrong size. FWIW, the 'filesystem' directory you posted is all code that implements a VFS that can access (amongst other things) the XDK-provided FATX code. It's what lets mplayer, the audio player, etc. open stuff over SMB, play stuff from inside RARs, etc. It's got nothing to do with getting data off the disk; that's handled with the standard API calls. If everyone had to write their own FATX support, there's no way your Xbox would last more than a week or two without the disk getting trashed.
The assumptions you'll need to look for are things like trying to decompress the weather icons onto a scratch partition that's no-longer big enough. They'll be all over the shop, and you'll probably won't find them in one go (unless you happen to regularly use a hundred percent of XBMCs features). Find/replacing accesses to the scratch partition with accesses to a directory in E would probably be a good start, though.
Post by: ldotsfan on July 05, 2008, 12:09:00 AM
QUOTE(MrFish @ Jul 5 2008, 02:16 PM)
That's handled by the API the XDK provides. XBMC doesn't deal with the filesystem directly which is why you can run it on a debug Xbox, even though the E drive is the wrong size. FWIW, the 'filesystem' directory you posted is all code that implements a VFS that can access (amongst other things) the XDK-provided FATX code. It's what lets mplayer, the audio player, etc. open stuff over SMB, play stuff from inside RARs, etc. It's got nothing to do with getting data off the disk; that's handled with the standard API calls. If everyone had to write their own FATX support, there's no way your Xbox would last more than a week or two without the disk getting trashed.
Precisely because FATX support depends on XDK API hence it's not going to be easy when you change the standard partition sizes to fit 1GB. You can't depend on the XDK anymore - you have to write your own filesystem code - that's what I was trying to say. I don't think you will find direct references to scratch partitions in the XBMC code - it's probably created by the API calls during execution - but I could be wrong.
Post by: MrFish on July 05, 2008, 12:06:00 PM
QUOTE(ldotsfan @ Jul 5 2008, 07:45 AM)
Precisely because FATX support depends on XDK API hence it's not going to be easy when you change the standard partition sizes to fit 1GB. You can't depend on the XDK anymore - you have to write your own filesystem code - that's what I was trying to say.
There's no way the Xbox can't support a filesystem smaller than 1GB: The C partition, out of the box, is only 500MB long. The XDK code doesn't know or care how the disk is layed out: if it did, then nothing would work on the debug xboxen, and for games to run off the F drive, every game manufacturer in existence would have to have written in support for every conceivable size the F drive might be (and to run off the G drive, they'd have had to have predicted the future invention of LBA48).
The FATX driver manipulates filesystems not on the raw disk, but on block devices provided by the kernel; to change the size of the partition, you just need to change the size of the block device. Just modify the BIOS to map the block devices onto the disk differently, and you'll have differently-sized filesystems (assuming you format them; otherwise you'll have differently-sized partitions full of bollocks). Because the FATX driver is the only thing that sees any changes, you don't need to make any changes to anything at a higher level than it: the only thing you have to do is modify the partition table, and format the partitions. No changes are needed in userland, barring obvious things like not trying to use space you don't have.
And you don't even need to hack any BIOS: the work's already been done. Just flash an LBA48v2 BIOS, fire up XBpartitioner, make partition 2 500MB, partition 1 250MB, and partitions 3-5 50MB each. Reboot, format, job done.
Even in the highly unlikely event that you're right about FATX not working on partitions smaller than the ones the xbox ships with, it still makes no difference to your ability to use XBMC: there's plenty room to install it on the C drive, and the C drive is the exact same size as on a standard Xbox. There's no way that can't work.*
Hell, if you used a 2BG card you could play games: make partition 2 500MB, partition 1 250MB, and partitions 3-5 750MB and overlapping each other. As far as the Xbox is concerned, the X, Y and Z drives are all valid, and just happen to have the same data on them. As long as you never write to more than one at a time (which you won't, unless you explicitly try to), you won't corrupt the FS, and even if you do, so what? It's just a disk cache. You'd probably need to blow away localcache00.bin on every boot, but that's a trivial modification.
QUOTE(ldotsfan @ Jul 5 2008, 07:45 AM)
I don't think you will find direct references to scratch partitions in the XBMC code - it's probably created by the API calls during execution - but I could be wrong.
IIRC, XBMC does mess around with the mounts while it's loading (mostly to move the D drive to be the Q drive, but also to mount the userprofile to a drive), but it is very likely that it does just use the scratch partition it's been assigned. Most straightforward hack would be to remap it onto somewhere on the E drive when the rest of the drive letters are getting remapped.
Post by: hoof_hearted on July 05, 2008, 07:46:00 PM
QUOTE(AWD Bus @ Jun 30 2008, 07:49 AM)
Xbins. Just search for that and you will know more.
How do you download from there? That just had NFO. I've been searing all over (including rapidshare, torrents, etc). I am at my wits end. No one on the web has this. I am used xbpartitioner 1.0 and my F drive went corrupt (had it as one big drive and using a 400G HD, softmod). I tried to redo the partition, but xbpartitioner seems to be locked now (just shows my hd already partitioned, but 'A' won't cycle the options) I was going to try two HDs (F and G), but can't seem to get that now.
Post by: xboxgamer733 on July 05, 2008, 07:55:00 PM
QUOTE(hoof_hearted @ Jul 5 2008, 08:22 PM)
How do you download from there?
Just use this.Post by: hoof_hearted on July 05, 2008, 08:15:00 PM
Post by: MrFish on July 05, 2008, 10:43:00 PM
QUOTE(hoof_hearted @ Jul 6 2008, 03:51 AM)
Much appreciated. Got it on my xbox. Any idea what would cause it to "not work". What I mean is that when I launch it, it shows the screen, but won't let me do anything. When I press A, it does not cycle through. When I press start, it tells me to press Y, but does not format. BTW, this is a softmod. I had it do this last month, and the way I got around it, is by sticking the HD, back in the PC, and doing a "prepare from scratch". THis allowed me to format one big F drive and even cycle with the A button to see all the other options. Is is a once-use only thing?
At the risk of asking the insultingly obvious, it isn't, by any chance, asking you to 'press y', because 'Custom partitions will not work with this BIOS'?
If not, perhaps using black to delete the partition table, (and maybe restarting xbpartitioner)? Write it down on paper first, so's you can restore it.
Post by: ldotsfan on July 06, 2008, 05:58:00 AM
QUOTE(MrFish @ Jul 6 2008, 02:06 AM)
Because the FATX driver is the only thing that sees any changes, you don't need to make any changes to anything at a higher level than it: the only thing you have to do is modify the partition table, and format the partitions. No changes are needed in userland, barring obvious things like not trying to use space you don't have.
And you don't even need to hack any BIOS: the work's already been done. Just flash an LBA48v2 BIOS, fire up XBpartitioner, make partition 2 500MB, partition 1 250MB, and partitions 3-5 50MB each. Reboot, format, job done.
Even in the highly unlikely event that you're right about FATX not working on partitions smaller than the ones the xbox ships with, it still makes no difference to your ability to use XBMC: there's plenty room to install it on the C drive, and the C drive is the exact same size as on a standard Xbox. There's no way that can't work.*
Hell, if you used a 2BG card you could play games: make partition 2 500MB, partition 1 250MB, and partitions 3-5 750MB and overlapping each other. As far as the Xbox is concerned, the X, Y and Z drives are all valid, and just happen to have the same data on them. As long as you never write to more than one at a time (which you won't, unless you explicitly try to), you won't corrupt the FS, and even if you do, so what? It's just a disk cache. You'd probably need to blow away localcache00.bin on every boot, but that's a trivial modification.
Things aren't that simple:
1. Most posts on LBA48 bios relate to the treatment for F and/or G drives. It's quite a leap of faith to assume non-standard sizes for X,Y,Z will work just like that out of the xbox. Physically the sectors for X,Y,Z are laid out first before C and E. I've done some work on xboxhdm and the linux tools confirm the physical layout of X,Y,Z. Even a chipped bios will make some underlying assumptions on these partitions and those will be broken in your proposed partition scheme.
2. In order for XBMC's to be copied to the non-standard C partition (its starting address has been changed), you need to find a dash that runs from dvd that reads the oz_paulb style partition table and uses the new location for C partition so that you can copy the XBMC files over. Today I don't think any such dash exists.
So for both bios and dash, there's some gaps to overcome to achieve the outcome described
Post by: hoof_hearted on July 06, 2008, 07:33:00 AM
QUOTE(MrFish @ Jul 6 2008, 12:19 AM)
At the risk of asking the insultingly obvious, it isn't, by any chance, asking you to 'press y', because 'Custom partitions will not work with this BIOS'?
If not, perhaps using black to delete the partition table, (and maybe restarting xbpartitioner)? Write it down on paper first, so's you can restore it.
No, it is displaying this warning:
!!!!!!!! WARNING !!!!!!!!
Changed partitions will be formatted!
Press Y to continue or any other button to abort.
After I press Y, it just goes back to the main xbpartitioner screen as if nothing happened.
Black does nothing either.
This all worked when I first setup the harddrive. Now it does not. I am cursios what I could have did to "break" it.
Post by: MrFish on July 06, 2008, 02:44:00 PM
QUOTE(hoof_hearted @ Jul 6 2008, 02:33 PM)
No, it is displaying this warning:
!!!!!!!! WARNING !!!!!!!!
Changed partitions will be formatted!
Press Y to continue or any other button to abort.
After I press Y, it just goes back to the main xbpartitioner screen as if nothing happened.
Black does nothing either.
This all worked when I first setup the harddrive. Now it does not. I am cursios what I could have did to "break" it.
It should be going back to the main screen, but the bar at the bottom should display the various things it's doing. You should get it saying 'writing partition table', and then 'formating device 0', etc.
Maybe there's an error in there?
Have you tried deleting the partition table and writing a new one? There's some way to make it do that and not format the partitions.
Post by: MrFish on July 06, 2008, 03:04:00 PM
QUOTE(ldotsfan @ Jul 6 2008, 01:34 PM)
Things aren't that simple:
1. Most posts on LBA48 bios relate to the treatment for F and/or G drives. It's quite a leap of faith to assume non-standard sizes for X,Y,Z will work just like that out of the xbox. Physically the sectors for X,Y,Z are laid out first before C and E. I've done some work on xboxhdm and the linux tools confirm the physical layout of X,Y,Z. Even a chipped bios will make some underlying assumptions on these partitions and those will be broken in your proposed partition scheme.
It's quite a leap of faith to assume that the BIOS does what it says it will?
I have some evidence to the contrary: http://img58.imagesh...nshot000is8.png
I set it up in the following order: [c]
- [y][z][e]
BIOS is X2 5035 on TSOP. XBMC is installed on the C drive. XBMC is a rather out-of-date home-build.
It plays videos, browses the network, shows me the weather just fine. I've not tried any games, but I don't imagine they'll work - not enough swap space.
Now a few caveats: I'm actually using an Xbox hard disk here, because I don't have any disks that small to hand. I think it will work if you dd the image over a 1GB drive, but I don't have the kit necessary to test this yet. If anyone's interested, I'll try it in a few days when I can get my hands on a smaller drive and a dd rig.
dd is going to have to be involved at some point, because xbpartitioner, boxplorer, xbmc, and many more won't run without present and formatted save and swap partitions (which can't exist until you've partitioned and formatted the drive. Catch 22.). They can be diminutive, but they do have to exist. What this means is that you'll need to (at the very least) dd the partition table for a 1gb partition set over to the small drive before you can boot with it present and run something that's not evox.
I think I've proven that there's nothing in the application or API layer that prevents you doing this. It's yet to be demonstrated whether there's a BIOS that can boot a disk this size, but I think I've also demonstrated that a BIOS can boot a layout this size. I'd be interested in any reasons you think I haven't. I'll also do my best to answer questions on how I installed it.
QUOTE(ldotsfan @ Jul 6 2008, 01:34 PM)
2. In order for XBMC's to be copied to the non-standard C partition (its starting address has been changed), you need to find a dash that runs from dvd that reads the oz_paulb style partition table and uses the new location for C partition so that you can copy the XBMC files over. Today I don't think any such dash exists.
So for both bios and dash, there's some gaps to overcome to achieve the outcome described
See above. I think I've demonstrated pretty conclusively that there's no reason at the application level why XBMC can't work with seriously non-standard partition layouts. No changes to XBMC (or evox) were performed or necessary, because there's nothing magic about the dashboard: it's just an application like any other.
Post by: ldotsfan on July 07, 2008, 05:35:00 AM
QUOTE(MrFish @ Jul 7 2008, 05:40 AM)
I set it up in the following order: [c]
- [y][z][e]
Now a few caveats: I'm actually using an Xbox hard disk here, because I don't have any disks that small to hand. I think it will work if you dd the image over a 1GB drive, but I don't have the kit necessary to test this yet. If anyone's interested, I'll try it in a few days when I can get my hands on a smaller drive and a dd rig.
dd is going to have to be involved at some point, because xbpartitioner, boxplorer, xbmc, and many more won't run without present and formatted save and swap partitions (which can't exist until you've partitioned and formatted the drive. Catch 22.). They can be diminutive, but they do have to exist. What this means is that you'll need to (at the very least) dd the partition table for a 1gb partition set over to the small drive before you can boot with it present and run something that's not evox.
I think I've proven that there's nothing in the application or API layer that prevents you doing this. It's yet to be demonstrated whether there's a BIOS that can boot a disk this size, but I think I've also demonstrated that a BIOS can boot a layout this size. I'd be interested in any reasons you think I haven't. I'll also do my best to answer questions on how I installed it.
See above. I think I've demonstrated pretty conclusively that there's no reason at the application level why XBMC can't work with seriously non-standard partition layouts. No changes to XBMC (or evox) were performed or necessary, because there's nothing magic about the dashboard: it's just an application like any other.
Yes, please share your secrets with us
I'm sure there's others who would want to do what you did and setup a pure XBMC non-gaming rig with non-standard partitions.
With your permission, I'll be cross-linking this post to another x-s forum.
Post by: MrFish on July 07, 2008, 02:34:00 PM
QUOTE(ldotsfan @ Jul 7 2008, 01:11 PM)
Yes, please share your secrets with us (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
I'm sure there's others who would want to do what you did and setup a pure XBMC non-gaming rig with non-standard partitions.
I thought I already did: flash lba48 BIOS, [if drive is blank: boot evox, format], run xbpartitioner, adjust partition tables to your liking, boot evox, format, install xbmc, beer.
The tripping point, at the moment, is the BIOS. Or maybe the Xbox itself. X2 5035 won't boot my 1GB device, even with a valid partition table. No error message, just a FRAG. This is almost certainly due to its brain-damaged 'config file on a disk we shouldn't even be reading this early in the boot process' scheme.
IND-5003* stops with an error 9: Xbox rejects drive ("kernel - HDD parameters (PIO/DMA/or size {debug}, certain size minimum is required for debug) "). The drive in question is a 1.6GB Quantum Fireball.
Both BIOSes can boot the exact same string of sectors off the disk the Xbox comes with, so it's definitely the hardware.
I'll have more time to look at it on wednesday/thursday, but totally don't mind if someone wants to try and scoop me. In fact, I'd welcome it. Try this kind of thing out, see what happens.
So where do we stand?
- IND-5003 is the best option, as it gives error codes, can be set to boot without having to read its settings off the disk, and is 256k, so it'll fit in a cheapmod/budget TSOP.
- Ancient drives from 1996 don't work. For reasons unknown. Is it capacity? If so, what are the cutoffs?
- Modern drives do work, and you get an extra 1.4GB through getting rid of the swaps (rising to ~1.9 if the only thing on your C drive is a shortcut to XBMC). In addition, you can consolidate the whole lot on to E, and have all your free space in one partition.
- Given the above, a compactflash card may or may not work. I've not got the adapter I need to try it**.
*Obligatory 'I'm an idiot' story: the 'enable 480p' in iND's setup ap, despite being hidden in the animation tab, actually sets the Xbox's default screen resolution. If you have a TFT HDTV, best enable it, or the box will go into Helen-Keller mode, and you'll have to reflash it without the benefit of a screen to look at.
**I do, however, have a 4GB microdrive kicking around. Remember when the idea of 4GB of flash was so completely out there that it was a sensible idea to stuff a winchester inside the can of a compactflash?
QUOTE(ldotsfan @ Jul 7 2008, 01:11 PM)
With your permission, I'll be cross-linking this post to another x-s forum.
I don't think there's anything much to report: the current state of play is pretty unimpressive.
Post by: ldotsfan on July 08, 2008, 07:32:00 AM
QUOTE(MrFish @ Jul 8 2008, 04:34 AM)
I don't think there's anything much to report: the current state of play is pretty unimpressive.
I'm interested in this non-gaming setup - bigger than the stock 8Gb.
1. Minimum sizes for X,Y,Z,C. X,Y,Z as small as possible as long as the chipped bios can boot.
2. C will hold just a shortcut xbe to XBMC on E.
3. E will be custom size - big enough for XBMC.
4. F will be media partition custom size.
Will this boot on a 256k bios like ind-5003?
Post by: MrFish on July 08, 2008, 10:23:00 PM
QUOTE(ldotsfan @ Jul 8 2008, 03:08 PM)
I'm interested in this non-gaming setup - bigger than the stock 8Gb.
1. Minimum sizes for X,Y,Z,C. X,Y,Z as small as possible as long as the chipped bios can boot.
2. C will hold just a shortcut xbe to XBMC on E.
3. E will be custom size - big enough for XBMC.
4. F will be media partition custom size.
Will this boot on a 256k bios like ind-5003?
Yes, I've tested that configuration, albeit with a larger C drive. The only times it didn't boot for me was when I was using the ancient 1.8GB drive. I injected the iND configuration, but I don't think you actually need to (you'll be without your bios configuration when you're formatting/partitioning, but the defaults are pretty sensible). You'll have to do without the MS dashboard, but I think XBMC can do everything it does now.
XBPartitioner is pretty user-hostile; I found the best way to do this kind of thing was to remove every partition, and then add them back in the order I wanted them on the disk. Next version: on-screen keyboard, please.
Something you might want to experiment with is removing C entirely: most BIOSes can boot anything you like, including subfolders (such as e:\xbmc\xbmc.xbe). I've not tried it with iND, but I think it will work.
If you don't want to modify XBMC, I'd recommend making X,Y,Z around 25MB: it uses them for stuff like extracting the weather textures.
A caveat with iND: if you're using component HDTV and you disable the intro, the video never gets initialised, and you don't get to see anything. Fix it by booting into x-dsl (re-initialises the video, but even if it doesn't, you can append 'ssh' to start sshd on boot) and reflashing.
Post by: ldotsfan on July 09, 2008, 06:04:00 AM
QUOTE(MrFish @ Jul 9 2008, 12:23 PM)
Yes, I've tested that configuration, albeit with a larger C drive. The only times it didn't boot for me was when I was using the ancient 1.8GB drive. I injected the iND configuration, but I don't think you actually need to (you'll be without your bios configuration when you're formatting/partitioning, but the defaults are pretty sensible). You'll have to do without the MS dashboard, but I think XBMC can do everything it does now.
XBPartitioner is pretty user-hostile; I found the best way to do this kind of thing was to remove every partition, and then add them back in the order I wanted them on the disk. Next version: on-screen keyboard, please.
Something you might want to experiment with is removing C entirely: most BIOSes can boot anything you like, including subfolders (such as e:\xbmc\xbmc.xbe). I've not tried it with iND, but I think it will work.
If you don't want to modify XBMC, I'd recommend making X,Y,Z around 25MB: it uses them for stuff like extracting the weather textures.
Thanks for the detailed instructions, I'll try this soon.
Post by: bmcclint on July 09, 2008, 11:10:00 PM
QUOTE(bmcclint @ Jul 2 2008, 05:14 AM)
I went down this road about a year ago but no real answers.
It reads like some BIOSs can read the partition table from the disk rather than from the BIOS so this suggests that a custom layout can be accomplished. Has anyone ever experimented with this?
Thoughts are using a 1GB flash with a basic C, X, Y, and Z and the rest an E drive enough to store XBMC. Since I stream everything to the system no need for a 8GB disk or an optical. Solid state XBOX.
Anyway...anyone have pointers? What BIOS to use and will xbpartitioner allow me to create a legal file system on a 1GB CF card?
Thanks...
Too any and all interested...Working, mostly, on a v1.1 flashed with EVOX M8plus using a 6gb hdd only partitioning only 900mb. I say mostly cuz still waiting on CF to IDE order. Partitions are 1=250,2=500,3-5=50. Boots just fine, reports only the 900mb and steams video, music and pics from smb.
Ordered SYBA CF to IDE adapter and 1 GB 80x CF card. Will be here Fri, got my power adapter and shorty IDE cable and hope to test the solid state version this weekend.
---v1.1, EVOX M8plus, XBPARTITIONER 1.1, UNLEASHX(newest), XBMC 11/07.
---Built a UDF cdrom with unleashx as default.xbe, xbpartitioner.xbe and folders for C and E preconfigured. M8 kernel boots in this order D:/default.xbe, C:/bootdash.xbe (using and INI for E:/apps/xbmc/deffault.xbe, E:/apps/unleashx/default.xbe, c:/xboxdash.xbe), c:/xboxdash.xbe, c:/default.xbe. Edited with evtool and flashed w/ raincoat.
I honestly believe it will run on a 256mb which I have and will test. Since I have no desire to play games at all I don't think I need the xbox dash software at all and XBMC is ~127mb. So...1=25,2=150,3-5=25. Might work...E shouldn't need much for the few UDATA and TDATA entries and XYZ don't seem to use much cache so 25 each should suffice. Can't add much to C but if I remove all the visualizations, languages, skins, scripts and the like should be able to fit more.
All in all it seems to be working. More to come...
Post by: Milleman on July 10, 2008, 05:26:00 AM
QUOTE(AWD Bus @ Jun 30 2008, 08:50 AM)
Actually you do not need to do that. I have done a ton of 500s and a few 750s with no trouble at all. All on G partition. There is NO REASON to even mess with the F partition.
The original program would do 1.2 tb anyways. I have used this program so many times, Huge thanks to the guy who wrote it!
What BIOS do you use in order to use the G drive only?
I've played around with my existing X2-4983.67 Bios, but starting the XBPartioner 1.1 it will nag about "lba48 not found". It doesn't work formatting the G only (partition 7) either.
So... How did you do it?
Post by: MrFish on July 10, 2008, 12:04:00 PM
QUOTE(Milleman @ Jul 10 2008, 01:02 PM)
What BIOS do you use in order to use the G drive only?
I've played around with my existing X2-4983.67 Bios, but starting the XBPartioner 1.1 it will nag about "lba48 not found". It doesn't work formatting the G only (partition 7) either.
So... How did you do it?
You need an lba48v2 BIOS. Ones I've tried are x2 5035, and iND 5003. Elsewhere in this thread Evox m8plus is reported compatible.
If your BIOS doesn't support partition tables, XBPartitioner is right to nag: if you set up a partition table and format it, but your BIOS doesn't support it, then when you reboot the BIOS will use its hardcoded partitions, which won't correspond to the filesystems XBPartitioner has just set up.
QUOTE(bmcclint @ Jul 10 2008, 06:10 AM)
Ordered SYBA CF to IDE adapter and 1 GB 80x CF card. Will be here Fri, got my power adapter and shorty IDE cable and hope to test the solid state version this weekend.
I'm interested in your results: when I tried a 1.6GB winchester (albeit not with evox m8), the XBox refused to boot, with error code 9.
A partitioning scheme I used on an Xbox I just built was the original 10GB drive, with no F drive, and a larger than normal E drive. Your system might benefit from a similar approach: remove the C drive entirely, boot straight off the E drive.
Overlapping cache partitions might also be worth trying, but I think I'm just recommending this because I want to know if they work, but am too lazy to try it myself.
Post by: bmcclint on July 11, 2008, 07:15:00 PM
QUOTE(MrFish @ Jul 10 2008, 07:40 PM)
You need an lba48v2 BIOS. Ones I've tried are x2 5035, and iND 5003. Elsewhere in this thread Evox m8plus is reported compatible.
If your BIOS doesn't support partition tables, XBPartitioner is right to nag: if you set up a partition table and format it, but your BIOS doesn't support it, then when you reboot the BIOS will use its hardcoded partitions, which won't correspond to the filesystems XBPartitioner has just set up.
I'm interested in your results: when I tried a 1.6GB winchester (albeit not with evox m8), the XBox refused to boot, with error code 9.
A partitioning scheme I used on an Xbox I just built was the original 10GB drive, with no F drive, and a larger than normal E drive. Your system might benefit from a similar approach: remove the C drive entirely, boot straight off the E drive.
Overlapping cache partitions might also be worth trying, but I think I'm just recommending this because I want to know if they work, but am too lazy to try it myself. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
Well no go. Trying the SYBA card and the 1GB CF card I get error 09. It doesn't like the HD parameters or something. More later...guests just arrived...
Post by: bmcclint on July 13, 2008, 11:46:00 AM
QUOTE(bmcclint @ Jul 12 2008, 02:15 AM)
Well no go. Trying the SYBA card and the 1GB CF card I get error 09. It doesn't like the HD parameters or something. More later...guests just arrived...
OK...didn't have much time to report the other day.
Well just putting the SYBA(SD-CF-2IDE-U) w/ Transcend 1GB 80x CF card resulted in an Error 09, supposedly the HDD parameters are bad, but w/ no CF card installed I get error 07, HDD timeout, as expected so the XBOX is seeing the CF card.
OK...I'm not 100% convinced that its the XBOX as I cannot get my PC to 'use' this setup either. The bios sees the CF card and adapter and reports a Transcend device but hangs after the floppy seek. Not sure what is actually wrong. Until I can get the PC to see this device and install to it I am not convinced I cannot use this in the XBOX.
Next question...If this turns out to be a parameter thing in the XBOX is this information stored in the kernel? Can it be altered or is some piece of hardware outside of the kernel trowing an error. I know a 1GB setup will format out , as it already works on a 6.0GB HDD, but is there a 'limit' on the HDD size. Unfortunately I don't have anything smaller than that antique 6GB drive.
More later...
Post by: MrFish on July 14, 2008, 12:17:00 PM
QUOTE(bmcclint @ Jul 13 2008, 07:22 PM)
OK...didn't have much time to report the other day.
Well just putting the SYBA(SD-CF-2IDE-U) w/ Transcend 1GB 80x CF card resulted in an Error 09, supposedly the HDD parameters are bad, but w/ no CF card installed I get error 07, HDD timeout, as expected so the XBOX is seeing the CF card.
OK...I'm not 100% convinced that its the XBOX as I cannot get my PC to 'use' this setup either. The bios sees the CF card and adapter and reports a Transcend device but hangs after the floppy seek. Not sure what is actually wrong. Until I can get the PC to see this device and install to it I am not convinced I cannot use this in the XBOX.
According to Dan Rutter*, CF cards should just work, at least as far as the BIOS is concerned, but not all of them show up as non-removable, and not all of them can do DMA. This could be tripping the Xbox up, but if your PC can't boot it, it's pointing to a problem with the card, the adapter, or a combination of the two. I'd try known-gooding the card by sticking it in a USB reader and formatting it, then after that working on the adapter.
Something quick to try, though, is making sure it's not trying to boot off the card, and making sure your master/slave stuff is done properly (two devices on the same address tend to show up as one properly named device that doesn't work properly and stops the machine from booting).
* http://www.dansdata....askdan00025.htm
QUOTE(bmcclint @ Jul 13 2008, 07:22 PM)
Next question...If this turns out to be a parameter thing in the XBOX is this information stored in the kernel? Can it be altered or is some piece of hardware outside of the kernel trowing an error. I know a 1GB setup will format out , as it already works on a 6.0GB HDD, but is there a 'limit' on the HDD size. Unfortunately I don't have anything smaller than that antique 6GB drive.
My money's on there being a lower-limit hardcoded into the BIOS, which none of the hacks ever thought of removing. This is going on the error description for error 9 that I found further up the thread, and the fact that it failed with a small hard drive, which is not really that exotic a piece of kit. I'm incredibly rusty with IDA, and I doubt that even when I could work it, I'd have been able to find the alleged size check in the boot process.
I think productive things to try and do would be to try to find the minimum size limit, and to try to attract the attention of someone involved in the hot-patching stuff the softmods do nowadays. The patcher is all open-source, so the chances are that someone involved with it might actually want to help you*. The Evox and iND people might be a good second choice, but I'd be surprised if they were still around.
*(rather than going MINEMINEMINE no modifying copyright
Post by: bmcclint on July 25, 2008, 10:03:00 PM
Anyway got a stripped down Fedora Core 2 installed on the 1GB card and it boots perfectly. I'm pretty impressed with the speed as well. Boots faster that I had thought. The install was about 700MB so it fit fine without a swap partition.
So...with that the card and adapter seem to work fine. As far as the XBOX goes there is something else it doesn't like. I might try an 8GB CF card just to satisfy my curiosity.
Anyway...More later...
Post by: bmcclint on August 01, 2008, 10:56:00 PM
QUOTE(bmcclint @ Jul 26 2008, 05:03 AM)
Sorry...been back logged with a lot lately...
Anyway got a stripped down Fedora Core 2 installed on the 1GB card and it boots perfectly. I'm pretty impressed with the speed as well. Boots faster that I had thought. The install was about 700MB so it fit fine without a swap partition.
So...with that the card and adapter seem to work fine. As far as the XBOX goes there is something else it doesn't like. I might try an 8GB CF card just to satisfy my curiosity.
Anyway...More later...
Update...Works with an 8GB CF card. Have a few issues but they are most likely hardware and I suspect another forum post would be best. Anyway...running XBMC in a 1.1 w/ HDD, CDROM cables and fan removed. Totally silent and works. Partitioned out 1GB (320, 512, 64, 64, 64). Since those CF cards are supposed to balance the writes I should theoretically prolong the life by 8x. Well see...
Anyway...remaining issues are blinking green light, I assume since its missing CD, and it turns off after 5-10 minutes. Might be overheating but this box has an iffy power supply so I'll test on another system with a stable power supply...
Thanks for the advice...
Post by: Sleel on February 21, 2010, 01:41:00 PM
Post by: Heimdall on February 21, 2010, 02:03:00 PM
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