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OG Xbox Forums => Hardware Forums => General Hardware/Technical Chat => Topic started by: Wrathful on August 20, 2003, 09:47:00 PM

Title: Which Light Gun Will Work On Hdtv?
Post by: Wrathful on August 20, 2003, 09:47:00 PM

Hey does anyone know which light gun will work on a HDTV set? I was looking at the Mad Catz, but the Berreta looks cool. Or is there another choice?




Thanks

Title: Which Light Gun Will Work On Hdtv?
Post by: selfer on August 20, 2003, 09:54:00 PM

not for me

Title: Which Light Gun Will Work On Hdtv?
Post by: Dreamcazman on August 20, 2003, 10:51:00 PM

They should all work. The Dreamcast guns work in VGA mode (which is progressive) so I can't see why the Xbox guns wouldn't. As long as the signal is 60Hz. I know some guns have trouble with the 100Hz/120Hz TV's.

Title: Which Light Gun Will Work On Hdtv?
Post by: mhr_54 on August 21, 2003, 06:40:00 AM

The light guns don't work with HD becuase of the wiring of the light gun.  A light gun works by having the console contantly send it the video signal (hence the yellow controller wire) and then comparing what its photo sensor sees to the signal its getting to determine where you're aiming.  Since the yellow wire caries a composite signal and the HD TV uses component signals you can't use an Xbox lightgun on HD.  They also don't work very well with projectors or plasma screens for the same reason.

Title: Which Light Gun Will Work On Hdtv?
Post by: Dreamcazman on August 21, 2003, 10:11:00 PM

QUOTE (mhr_54 @ Aug 21 2003, 02:40 PM)

The light guns don't work with HD becuase of the wiring of the light gun.  A light gun works by having the console contantly send it the video signal (hence the yellow controller wire) and then comparing what its photo sensor sees to the signal its getting to determine where you're aiming.  Since the yellow wire caries a composite signal and the HD TV uses component signals you can't use an Xbox lightgun on HD.  They also don't work very well with projectors or plasma screens for the same reason.

I think you're talking about some old Playstation light guns...

Title: Which Light Gun Will Work On Hdtv?
Post by: mhr_54 on August 22, 2003, 02:27:00 AM

No, the yellow wire is the composite video signal needed by light guns for determining where the user is pointing, this is why they pretty much only work on standard TVs that use composite.  This is why you can't use a light gun if you use this wire for something else.

Title: Which Light Gun Will Work On Hdtv?
Post by: Dreamcazman on August 22, 2003, 02:39:00 AM

I've owned light guns for the Master System, Saturn, Dreamcast and none of them have a yellow cable which you have to connect to the composite video.

Title: Which Light Gun Will Work On Hdtv?
Post by: mhr_54 on August 22, 2003, 09:53:00 AM

You don't have to connect any yellow cable, the yellow wire is built into the standard USB cable, it's the same yellow wire you cut when you want to make the old controller detection LEDs.  The Xbox controller cable consists of +5v, Gnd, D+, D-, and a yellow wire which is only internally connected in the light guns.

Title: Which Light Gun Will Work On Hdtv?
Post by: sk8ermike6789 on August 22, 2003, 10:01:00 AM

if the yellow cable is for video output for that particuar player, then someone should be able to easily make a controller that has an LCD screen that gets the signal from the yellow wire, so when you are playing a slit screen game in the car or something, you can look at the controller screen, and only see your own half of the screen, but on the whole screen!!!

i hope someone understood that, LMAO

that would be very cool if that comes out, i know there is one out, but it gets its input from the scart cable, which is retarded becuase its like a normal TV, but smaller

Title: Which Light Gun Will Work On Hdtv?
Post by: mhr_54 on August 22, 2003, 06:31:00 PM

True, although the video output could be setup in one of two ways, and I have a fealing it's probably the second.  The first way it could be done is the Xbox console divides the video up into the number of players and then transmits it to the correct controller.  Or two, the Xbox console sends the video signal for all four and the Xbox controller determines which one it's responsible for.  The reason that I would say it's two is that there'd be no way for the Xbox console to divert the right video to the correct controller easily, and it would make for a more complex video setup.  Wheras it's extremely simple for each controller to know which player it is and filter out the rest of the signal.  When I refer to controller here I'm talking about the light gun.  The only thing is whether the data on the yellow wire is in fact a composite signal in its entirety or a stripped down proprietary version with only the neccesary coordinate data.  See, the guns work by having the Xbox insert coordinate signals on every other scan line on the TV and then having the gun detect these coordinate signals and compare them to a matrix to know where the user's pointing.  Therefore the yellow wire could either carry the entire video signal, coordinates and all, or just the coordinate signals.  If it just carries only the coordinate signals a display in the controller won't work since the video isn't there.  Yet another setup would have the controller send the coordinate signals it receives from its sensor in the reverse direction back to the Xbox console, which would also prohibit a controller screen.  Now that I say that I'd most likely say it works using this new method three, having the light guns receive the signals and transmit them back to the Xbox, which as I mentioned before would be useless in trying to connect a screen.

Now to explain to other people who don't understand why this doesn't work and HD and projector:  It probably doesn't work on HD because the Xbox wouldn't insert data on every other scan line beacuase this would reduce the quality of th video output to that of composite video and defeat the purpose of HD, therefore it would be pointless for M$ to waste time implementing it since every Xbox comes with a composite AV cable anyways.  And the reason it doesn't work well on projectors is because the signal probably isn't accurate due to lower quality inherent of projectors or completely intact since its converted to light rays shooting out into an uncontrolld environment and then bouncing back again through an uncrontrolled environment.  Whereas in tubes and projection TVs (not to be confused with projectors) the light hits the phosphorous of the TV screen in a controlled environment with high quality and then spends a short time out in the open.