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OG Xbox Forums => Hardware Forums => Xbox Audio/Video Technical => Topic started by: jocose on June 06, 2005, 03:36:00 PM

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 06, 2005, 03:36:00 PM

Okay, this is truly bizarre. I have been working on my modded Xbox and several others for well over a year now, and this is the first time I have encountered something like this.

My Xbox was having some problems with a bad solder point on the board. I knew exactly which one it was and quickly fixed it. I wanted to make sure everything was working so I booted up my box real quick and it worked fine with video and audio.

So, I figured I would just screw the board back in and put everything back together. After I got all the screws back in and the hardrive and DVD-ROM in place I booted it up again real quick to make sure there were no problems.

It booted all the way up to the dashboard (I could tell because I have a sound that plays when the dashboard is loaded), but there was no video.

At first I was certain that it must be either a bad cable or I simply didn't have my connections right. Since then I have tested my Xbox with 3 other cables on several TVs. Nothing works. My Xbox just boots up to the dashboard and the TV says "No Signal". There is no flicker or anything.

Nothing Happens.

I took the entire thing apart and check for an solder splash, but I have been doing this for a very long time and have always been careful so I didn't expect to find any and so far I havent, and onto of all that it seams very unlikely because the ONLY THING that changed from the point where my Xbox was working perfectly fine to the point where the video died was the fact that I simply screwed it into the case. Thats it.

Thanks for your help...

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: psychomonkey on June 06, 2005, 11:03:00 PM

I had this happen on Sunday. I unplugged my xbox because I figured I would just take it in to Best Buy and get it exchanged (warrenty), but the next morning it worked fine and has been going strong since.

I suggest giving it a rest. Who knows what is wrong, but maybe letting the RAM run out of power and clear out does the trick. That or it's a capacitator thing..after a while those lose power too, who knows.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 07, 2005, 11:47:00 AM

Well I let it sit overnight for like...I dunno...9 hours or so before I messed with it again. I tried brushing off the bottom of the board to get any kinda of small loose conductive objects out of there and right now its running on a static bag so nothing coud be shorting out.

Its still not working.

If anyone has any advice please let me know.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 08, 2005, 01:33:00 AM

Okay, I have an update. My xbox works when I hook it up to my VGA (X2VGA puts my xbox in HD mode) adapter. This makes me think that it must be some sort of configuration problem. Once again I get absolutly no signal when I hook my xbox to my TV through my RCA cables.

If anyone has any advice let me know.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: sturdycracker on June 08, 2005, 11:00:00 AM

I also an having problems with my video. The xbox has never been modded or tried to be modded and for some reason the video never comes up .. even thouhg i know its booted because i can hear the background.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 08, 2005, 04:10:00 PM

Hmm, well we might have the same problem, but you would first need to check and see if your xbox works in HD mode or not.

I never really thought that it would have been a possiblity. I figured no video meant NO VIDEO, but it apears there is just a problem with the standard RCA out, and that High Definition output is fine. Wierd.

Anways, I am still looking for a solution. I have tried restoring my EEprom from a back up I had, but that did nothing. This has to be some kind of setting or somthing. I really don't see how any physical damage could have caused this, but I guess anything is possible....

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 09, 2005, 10:27:00 PM

I would recommend trying it with somthing that puts your xbox into HD mode. A VGA adaptor such as the one I mentioned earlier (X2VGA) or the off the shelf HD pack from MS on a HD tv.

This worked for me. At least I can get video working, but I am no close to getting it working standard AV cables.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 10, 2005, 02:08:00 PM

Well, I really doubt that it is my cable or the port for that matter. I have tried my xbox with two other cables that have and still work fine with the xboxs that they belong to, and my xbox works just as it should when I hook it up to my X2VGA. I mean I don't have to twist, bend, or bump anything it works just exactly the way it should. I turn on the xbox and it shows me either the bios booting just as it always does.

Its just my RCA output that is screwed up and it has to either be physical damage to an extremely specific part of the board or setting that i know nothing aobut.

Somone must have a solution...please help!

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 11, 2005, 11:56:00 PM

Okay, does anyone have an idea as to what could have caused this, or better yet a solution?

Once again:

* My xbox will NOT output any video when I use the retail AV cable.
* Everything works fine including video if I use my X2VGA adaptor with my 21' monitor.
* This problem began right after I had finished making some simple sodler reapairs to my mod chip. I then tested my xbox and all was well. After screwing in the board with ALL the screws I tested my box again and the problem bagan.

Thanks for your help.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 13, 2005, 04:54:00 AM

bump

come on somone must have some opinion or insight. I really need help here.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 14, 2005, 01:39:00 PM

bump

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 16, 2005, 03:26:00 AM

Well, if you are having the same problem as me it couldn't be your eeprom. I restored mine from a back up and nothing changed.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 18, 2005, 09:06:00 PM

bump, Anyone?

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 20, 2005, 09:55:00 PM

come on... I mean I just want theories, I can't be theonly on having this problem.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 26, 2005, 12:01:00 PM

Not sure, you problem doesn't sound related to mine though. I still havn't figured out what could have caused somthing so specific on my box. Anways I am STILL waiting for ANY ideas I MEAN ANYTHING that people could suggest.

I am only looking for realistic options, or tests, or anything I could do to either solve this puzzle of out right fix my problem.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: linuxbazoka on June 29, 2005, 01:25:00 AM

Hello.
I have not a clue whats wrong.
But if i where you, i would try to take out the motherboard again an then test if you get video. (as you did before you screw it in)
Maybe it some kind of ground issue..

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: SteK79 on June 29, 2005, 01:32:00 AM

Its not a Problem of the Mobo or Ground.

It seems to be a Problem of the Video Settings in the EEPROM. Another User in another Thread wrote that the use of a "Enigmah Video Switcher" can restore the Box to Functional Videosettings. Now, I search for this Program but I can't find it.

Have Anyone this Program? Can he mail this to me?

Thanks

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: SteK79 on June 29, 2005, 01:56:00 AM

I have the program. I will test it today and post the results on next day.

Greetz

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on June 29, 2005, 03:23:00 AM

Interesting, however I restored my EEprom from a backup I had on my Xenium chip, and got no results. Though this is the most promising thing so far. Please let me know if you get any results.

Thanks

Oh, and on a side note I realized that I hadn't clarified that I had already tried the board outside the case. Infact, I tried it while it was sitting on a static bag. I am 100% sure its not a grounding issue.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: Birdtales on June 29, 2005, 10:09:00 AM

I had this happen a while back. Believe it or not it was the motherboard. Mine worked perfectly with Component cables and hooked up to my HDTV. No video with composite hooked up however. Mine was a filter. There is a row of filters on the top of the motherboard along the AV connector. They are black rectangles with the rightmost one being a burnt orange color. If read with a meter they read 0 ohms (continuity), mine orange one read open. Some research and the meter told me that the composite + video signal went though that orange filter. I jumpered the filter with a small wire and it worked fine after that. The filters are VERY hard to remove and replace, the solder points are on the bottom of the components and the components are very brittle.

Can't hurt to try this. Either read it out with a meter or just tack a quick jumper on it.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: SteK79 on July 01, 2005, 02:52:00 AM

I have a found a workaround for the Problem, but no solution for itself.

Tested the X-Box with an Digital AV (s-Video) Cable and it runs wonderful.

I have not found a working solution or answer why it is.
All workarounds with the "Enigmah Video Switcher", ConfigMagic to restore EEPROM Setting, test the SMD-Elements on Mobo does'nt work.

Now, my Brother have the S-Vid Cable and can Play with Video.

Has Anyone more Ideas what i can do, to restore the function of the Component (RCA) Output???

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on July 02, 2005, 04:27:00 AM

Hmmm, it does sound like this is the same problem that I am having, and damage to the motherboard does sound like a possiblity.

Its interesting that you can use S-Video, I hadn't yet thought of that. I belive that my television has support I will try that.

If you can get some pictures BirdTales that would be great.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on July 06, 2005, 08:27:00 AM

So did you ever get any results

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: Bizquick on July 06, 2005, 02:55:00 PM

I have the same problem as most of you all here do. I Have an xbox that works with the HD pack but not with the standard video cord. At first my fan didn't work either but I replaced that fuse near the AV pack. and the fan started to work again. If the Eprom is messed up how can I fix this? just flash it with a new one or replace it? I think I'll try that svideo cord Idea I have a friend with one.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: Birdtales on July 07, 2005, 06:03:00 PM

Note the 3 blue components above the video chip and under the AV port? The orange/brown one to the right of them is what was toast on mine. Similar on all versions of Xboxes.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on July 08, 2005, 06:03:00 AM

Could you post a picture of exactly what you did?

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on July 13, 2005, 04:42:00 AM

Hey, just wondering if you had gotten around to taking that pic. I really need to see exactly what was done to fix this.

Thanks

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: Zanzang on July 24, 2005, 10:43:00 AM

I'm having this exact same problem...could someone tell me in detail how to jump the filter?

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: evilant500 on July 25, 2005, 03:29:00 PM

I seem to be have a similer problum but i get some video
I resintly got a modded xbox didnt do it myself and the other day i was in the app that that's you change form PAL to NSTC and i shut down the xbox withought doing anything in the application and it was still oppen then i turned the xbox right back on. but the screen was in black and white and it flashes down the screen as if it where a move playing slow so you can see each fram but this is fast you can just barly see what you are doing so i opend a game and a app and everything is intacked and everything works sound works too. so what do you think happend and how have we concluded the best way to fix this is?

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: evilant5000 on July 25, 2005, 03:38:00 PM

hi i seem to be have a very simmeler problem

i just resintly bought a modded xbox and i was in that app that lets you switch from Pal to NTSC and i turned off my xbox with the app still open withought changing anything and then i turned it back on and the screen was in black and wich and flickering down the screen you can just barly tell what you are doing so i oppend a app and a game and everythign still works but the video is way messed up adio is still fine i tryed another AV cable and a AV cable for old TV's (you know that kind that gos right in to the cable plug,, as in TV chanels) idk what to do and i dont really trust myself to jump that chip so what do you think i should do? and what do you think is wrong i didnt really understand what is casuing every ones problum who is posting in the thread

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: evilant5000 on July 25, 2005, 03:40:00 PM

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: evilant5000 on July 26, 2005, 11:13:00 AM

this morning i turned my xbox and after about 15 min i manidged to open egmehia video switchdisc and switched my setings to NTSC and turned of my xbox this i turned it right back on and the video was fine i dont think my problume was related to but it might be worth a try if any of you can tell if you are in a app ot not once you are in it just bress B and shut down the xbox and turn it on

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: evilant5000 on July 26, 2005, 11:54:00 AM

this morning i turned on my xbox and after about 15 min of scuinting my eyes i maniged to open egsmiha video mode switchdisc and switched it to NTSC and turned off my xbox then turned it back on and the video problume was fixed

i dont think i problume was related to any of yours

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: tornol on July 26, 2005, 04:41:00 PM

use el enigmah y resolvi el problema

sigan esta guia

http://www.zxbinstal...hread.php?t=878

solo hay que bajar el enigmah en un cd-rw quemar en udf, meter y prsionar B

a ver si les sirve...

bueno a mi me sucedio por andar jugando con el xbmc

saludos

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: jocose on August 19, 2005, 12:15:00 AM

Okay, I am now on summer break and have reserected my project (fixng my xbox). I dug it out of the box I had it stored in and tested, hoping that time had possibly fixed somting.

Not the case.

It acts the exact same way that it did when I put it away.

*ONLY HD mode out works (using the Neoya X2VGA adaptor with my monitor)

*A normal AV cables only output audio NO VIDEO (I have confirmed this by testing my xbox with over 5 AV cables that have and still work on other xbox's)

If somone has a solution it would be great if they could post a pic or at least give me some direction. I have already tried just about everything I can think of to fix this thing. I really need to get it working with the normal AV cable. If that means allot soldering or some elaborate work around I am up to it.

Thanks

BTW I live in the Seattle WA area so if somone would be willing to actualy help me with this I could hook them up with some $ if they think they can fix it.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: yoshime on August 22, 2005, 06:07:00 PM

I have the same problem as jocose
No audio but video

I got the xbox from a friend, it was unmodded and i thought maybe a bios thing, so i put in a modchip in and no change.

I tried bypassing the orange filter that was suggested earlier, but that didn't do anything.

Hope this topic isn't dead, it seems a lot have this problem.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: yoshime on August 22, 2005, 06:26:00 PM

So, i've gotten a little improvement, don't get too excited yet.

Before, I had no video and the sound, AND the front led would flash red and green

So i decided to put in an old unlocked harddrive with evox installed on it and M$ dash and all. I turned the modchip on and ran it, and now the LED stays green.

Don;t know if that helps but thats all I've got

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: r-o-b on October 18, 2005, 04:13:00 PM

my friends xbox also shows no video but audio is present. (worked fine for 1 yr with x2.6)

i have bypassed that filter but composite still shows no video. i bought the M$ advance HD pack and it will show the video fine for the first 20secs, then the image will jump in various directions and eventually cut out. after a few more boot attempts, it will just not show any video at all until i leave it off for another 30min or so....

i have it stripped down to bare minimum (eject/on/off switch, motherboard & fan, mod removed) and its still exhibiting this effect.

any suggestions.

maybe its a heating issue since it shows with the HD pack, but only briefly????

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: Sir_Bacharach on October 22, 2005, 10:25:00 AM

I have the same problem, I chipped my Xbox 1.4 with an Xecutor 2.6 CE, the chip works fine because I tested it in my other x box, I've resoldered I've tried using the wire setup rather than the pin setup, both are the same, sound with no picture.

Is your xbox a V1.4 by any chance? I wonder if it's to do with the version of the motherboard or perhaps the power supply? Quite strange.

Let me know.

Rob.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: r-o-b on October 25, 2005, 11:14:00 AM

ive got a v1.4.
did you try using different output cables?

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: ncaissie on October 27, 2005, 05:46:00 AM

I have a 1.4 with a Tompson drive. Unmoded. When you turn it on the eject lights up green as normal but no sound or video. I installed the chip but no luck.
the eject went red because I had the chip turn it red with the default bios.

The screen flckers when you hit the power but thats it.

I tried the standard RCA cables and the RF one I'll try the HD pack tonight.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: slappydooda on October 27, 2005, 10:12:00 AM

I have the same problem mentioned many times before (flickering black and white). Has anyone managed to fix this with the jumper fix? If so, could someone describe it in more detail?

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: janrocks on October 27, 2005, 12:28:00 PM

Flickering B&W..wrong video setting, and your tv don't support it. (no NTSC for me) so 2 choices, find a tv that supports whatever other settings you want to use or set them right for your kit...NTSC..USA/Canada/Japan/S America.....PAL ..UK/Europe/Australia....... PAL,rest of world,.. everywhere else(not ghana..they pos+ video mod(or used 2 be when I was there..correct me if wrong) be careful of the pal60 setting, not many tv's support this..that might be the other problem here>>>??? About jumping the choke(that's what it is) try a meter probe connected to your video in socket. + a small capacitor for safety and see if you get any output...a crazy Idea I just had..maybe take your xbox to a tv salesroom and say you want to buy a tv but it MUST work with your xbox.(tryout the multi region/multi standard ones)they should at least try it (potential customer and all that)...sorry I'm real, real,real cheap!!!!.... and if one does.. quickly change your settings to what they should be...then beat a hasty retreat with some excuse like, fetch parent/partner, visit bank,..........

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: slappydooda on October 27, 2005, 02:31:00 PM

QUOTE(janrocks @ Oct 27 2005, 08:39 PM)

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: notdumb on October 28, 2005, 03:46:00 PM

Same prob...no video OR audio....my box is a V1.6...

What version is yours....

I know of a "cure" for V1.0 & V1.1 boxes but none for the V1.6 ;which I see more of everyday on Ebay... is this some kind of flaw in the newer Xbox version?

A modchip does nothing for this one.... I know a few repair shops that fix our boards at work...I wonder if they can offer any help.

One thing that would be helpful is to know where the bios is stored (which chip and where - I do know where the eeprom chip is...if it is the same location for all of the versions or what...

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: ncaissie on October 28, 2005, 06:19:00 PM

notdumb what is the cure?
Mine has no vide and no sound and it's a 1.4

I jumped the red thing but nothing changed.

I have tried HD, av and RF.

I just get a green led and it wont eject.

When I hit Eject it flashes green then stops.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: elistion on November 02, 2005, 09:10:00 PM

Here is what a normal 1.6 filter looks like.

user posted image

Here is what the apparently bad filter on this 1.4 board I have looks like.

user posted image

On to testing new shit out.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: r-o-b on November 04, 2005, 02:15:00 PM

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: msrx7mh3 on November 05, 2005, 08:58:00 PM

Any further news on this issue?

I too am having similar problems:

No video (can hear bootup sounds) via RGB

No video via S Video

No video via Component HD pack to PJ

__Xbox starts fragging soon after it finishes bootup

Have tried running a wire across the orange widget above the conexant chip to no avail

Have tried using the enigmah video disc- no joy

Anybody else?

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: elistion on November 06, 2005, 01:28:00 AM

I forgot to take pictures but I removed the orange thing via tweezers and iron and bridged it with some extra wire from a lpc rebuild and it worked fine.

Only particular problem with THAT board is once a game is loaded the machine shuts off after 10 minutes or so. I left the xbox powered on for 24+ hours, ftp'd ~60GB worth of "software" and it never had any issues. Once a game was loaded however it would shut off after 10 or so minutes. Immediately afterwards it wouldn't turn back on for about 15 minutes then the process just began over.

Is the GPU getting too hot? Power supply? I don't know where to turn now short of just finding another board to work with.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: msrx7mh3 on November 08, 2005, 12:21:00 PM

Can you confirm if XBMC and watching videos works when you bridge that filter? or if anything that puts a load on the cpu makes it crash. Thanks.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: r-o-b on November 17, 2005, 06:21:00 PM

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: msrx7mh3 on November 21, 2005, 05:46:00 PM

Many thanks for your pic- I'll give it a try later on this week and will let you all know what happens.

Cheers.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: CapnCrunch on January 02, 2006, 12:49:00 PM

Similar problem on my friends xbox, has worked fine for a while now but suddenly no video on composite (original av-cable) or RGB (third party RGB-scart), the XBOX boots without problems, audio is present, and manuevering in the blind confirms that games can be started. Perfect video with MS advanced AV-pack over s-video howeverm (composite video still broken). AV-cables works fine in other boxes

Don't have the possibility to check the filter but will do ASAP. Is it possible that there could have been a shortage or something else if video cable was removed/plugged in when the box was powered on? We did this since we swapped two boxes on the same TV. I've done this probably a thousand times on different AV-equipment over the years without problems but maybe the box can't handle it.

Anyone with the same problem? (No video on composite, but on s-video AND the box booting correct with audio) that can relate the problem to removing/plugging the cable from the TV while the XBOX being powered on?

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: CapnCrunch on January 11, 2006, 05:54:00 AM

Well I have an update on this issue. last night I wen't to my friends place, we opened his XBOX and the little blue filter looked as good as new. But just for the sake of testing I soldered a small piece of wire over the filter. Now the XBOX suddenly outputs a signal over composite video. However the image is very dark and blurry but nevertheless it confirms where the problem lies. Maybe if it was removed entirely, replaced only by a bridge, the video signal would be of good quality again, but we decided not to do so with the risk of breaking the box even more and a new cable for s-video instad of RGB will have to solve the problem. This small component seems to be very sensitive however.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: {later} on January 12, 2006, 05:45:00 AM

I've also got a 1.6 xbox with audio but no video output

I checked the filter and it was burned. So I soldered it loose and jumped it with a wire.

Result: Same thing, audio but no video

Does someone know what the exact name of that component is? Maybe I can buy a new one in the electronics store.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: mungie3 on January 15, 2006, 01:01:00 PM

I have the same problem as mentioned all of those times before, but I managed to get XBMC to work in 1080i. But everything else either runs really skewed or just no video at all. Xenium os looks really stretched, xbox startup video sequence doesnt show, but u can hear it, and only the top half of evox shows.

To get XBMC to work u need to:
have hdtv av pack.

go to MS dashboard's main menu. (navigate by sounds)
go to the bottom most tab(settings)
press down 3 times to go to video, press a
now u have a menu of:
-choose tv type
-480
-720
-1080

press down a bunch of times to get to 1080(the bottom choice)
press a
press left(selects on)
press a
back out of all menus.

the above steps should be done blindly.
now run XBMC

press down 5 times to go to settings
press right 3 times(dont press a), and down once to go to video (press a)
press right once to go to left panel(dont press a)
press down 8 times to go to resolution (press a and wait 5 seconds for it to switch), press a again to switch to the next possible resolution.

NOTE: this only works for the newer versions of XBMC and only the default skin....

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: JustDanMI on January 15, 2006, 08:21:00 PM

My Box was doing the same exact thing as well. Didn't know what happened, was playing it earlier that day, stopped, and then tried playing more later. But when I went to boot it up later, all I heard was the splash screen and then I heard my music kick on on my unleash dashboard. After trying different inputs on my tv, and trying 3 different types of cords running between the box and the tv, I had nothing left to do, but rip it open and look for things wrong. Now I've had the box for 2 years now and this was the first anything has happened, and I do alot of tinkering. After spending 2 hours looking over the board for burns or corosion, I could find nothing wrong. I put the box back together and what do you know, it works. I don't know how to explain it, but lucky me. Now I think I recall my filter looking like the bad one in the pic, but I'm not sure. I didn't see that pic till just now, and that was after I took the box apart and it started working again. I know this doesn't help anyone, but I hope the same happens for other out there as it has for me.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: mungie3 on January 16, 2006, 10:27:00 AM

Mine works too now. I completely took it apart, let it sit overnight, and put it back together in the morning...

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: mungie3 on January 16, 2006, 01:57:00 PM

This is what I had to do to my xbox to make it work:
IPB Image

this too:

As you can see I did extensive disassembling of the case, and I let it sit overnight.

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: mungie3 on January 22, 2006, 07:26:00 PM

what led to this problem? or did it come out of the blue?

Title: Help, No Video
Post by: gemiwagon on March 31, 2006, 12:56:00 AM

hey im having the same problem as most of you on here, no video but sound is ok, i jumpered the fiter with no results, removed the filter and placed wire there and still no picture...
even tried a few other filters of similar type and nothing happend...but however i think i am one step closer to figuring out this problem.

ive fried the original filter by removing it too many times but in its place i soldered just a standard 1.8 ohm resistor instead of jumping those points, then i jumpered the first blue resistor on the left of where the filer was to the 1.8ohm resistor and i got a picture but only in black a white( this would also work with the original filter, i am not able to use mine anymore).

hope this helps, maybe someone will find another resistor to link to to get colour. it could be that another one of those blue resistors is for colour i have no idea.

xboxscene.org forums

OG Xbox Forums => Hardware Forums => Xbox Audio/Video Technical => Topic started by: jocose on June 06, 2005, 03:36:00 PM