Post by: adrenaline_X on November 15, 2008, 03:20:00 PM
Back ground :
Bought a broken 360 that was RROD error 0102. I used the x-clamp replacement that uses m5 bolts through the bottom of the case as well as adding Artic Silver 5 Thermal paste. I also cut out the wire mesh by the fans as well as cutting out some of the plastic at the back. This Fix worked for a about 4 to 5 months of Light usage on a normal tube tv. You can search the forums if you want to read up on the x-clamp mod and why it fixes the rrod. My 360 stopped working completely and loosening or tightening the screws would give me either the RROD of e74 and secondary codes related to the GPU or unknown. I had baked other 360s in the past and results were mixed for a lot of people.. some revived their completely dead 360s and other melted and blew up their capacitors. Check this thread out for my first run at baking them in the oven. This is a oven virgin and hasn't been baked/heat gunned/ etc ( Last Ditch Resort To Fixing Rrod - After X-clamp Mod (, RROD - this works for me.) (http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=629455)
I did a lot of reading up on the causes of the RROD and symptoms and about re-flowing / re-balling fixing the RROD. Search the forums if you want to learn more about re-balling / re-flowing.
The Method:
Pre-Heat your oven to 500F (240-260C) . This was the max my oven would go and I verified it with a oven thermometer. This Temperature is above the melting point of lead free solder. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solder#Lead-free_solder)
Place the prepared 360 in the oven for 8-10 minutes
This time around I decided to try some things differently.. the first time around, caps began leaking, and everything was smoking and sizzling.. The 360 still worked, but leaking cap isn't the best thing in the world. This time around I decided to pinpoint the heat that the motherboard received. I did't have insulation handy (i live in an apartment) so I dug threw my dresser for some old shirts (2 to be exact plus some wool socks) First thing i did was remove the mother board from the case and then removed xclamp fix so all i had is the mother board with all the removable parts removed (sata cables, ROL board and fans) Second I wrapped my thick shirts around one side of the board (top and bottom) leaving the gpu and cpu exposed.
(IMG:http://i420.photobucket.com/albums/pp287/adrenaline_x/DSC02088.jpg)
(IMG:http://i420.photobucket.com/albums/pp287/adrenaline_x/DSC02090.jpg)
Note : I added socks to open parts here so that all you could see was the bottom of the gpu and cpu
http://i420.photobucket.com/albums/pp287/a..._x/DSC02090.jpg
I did the same for the other side of the board and kept it in place with electrical tape . So what i had left is the cpu and gpu dies exposed on both sides of the board with all the capicators and eject buttons insulated with a thick layer of clothing.. Next I wrapped the both sides of the board with a double layer of tin foil, completely covering everything. Use Wire to keep it in place (i used electrical tape but it melted and began smoking.
(IMG:http://i420.photobucket.com/albums/pp287/adrenaline_x/DSC02091.jpg)
(IMG:http://i420.photobucket.com/albums/pp287/adrenaline_x/DSC02092.jpg)
Then I carefully made a slit to expose the cpu and gpu dies and folded the tin foil down and under the clothes. (picture 2). After making sure everything was well covered, I placed in on a cookie sheet and placed it in the pre-heated oven for 8-10 minutes.. I noticed some smoke about 5 minutes in so i quickly took it out.. to my relief it was just the electrical tape on the out side of the tin foil melting and burning so I placed it back in to keep baking for another 5 minutes.
I let it cool and removed the tinfoil and clothing.. I inspected the board and everything was like it was before. The caps weren't bulging this time around and the electical tape holding the clothes in place was soft but in tack. I removed all the old thermal past and applied a new layer of Artic silver 5. I used two washers thick between the motherboard and gpu heat sync and 1 washer between the motherboard and cpu heatsync.. I lightly tightened the bolts just enough to provide adequate heat transfer from the dies to the heatsync... I turned it on and it fired up.. Then I turned it off..
Next I did the 12 GPU cooling mod found here. You don't have to cut your fan wires to do this so it was quick and easy. http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=637955. This step is NEEDED because if you can't keep the GPU die cool, the RROD will mos likely come back from everything flexing again and breaking the contact between the chip and the mother board. You want to keep the GPU heat sync cool enough so that you can keep you hand on it while someone is playing halo 3 or gears of war... split my fan shroud so that the GPU fan ONLY sucks air though the GPU heat sync.. I found the 12v fan mod to the gpu to be too loud and just switched it to the 9v mod listed on the link above.. The Heat sync was still hot to the touch so i added tape to the bottom of the shroud to make sure the air wasn't leaking under it.. I used incense to watch the air flow and saw that is was leaking in behind the GPU cooler. Once I removed all the air gaps, the Heat synce was slightly warm to the touch while Playing GOW2 for HOURS (like 4-5 hours).
So far i have about 20-30 hours on this 360 after baking it two weeks ago.. between playing COD4 , GOW2 and Guitar hero, it is still trucking.. I spent alot time testing to make sure the heat sync was slightly warm to the the touch and NOT BURNING HOT.
If you aren't going to do the cooling fan mod, don't bother trying this.. First time I did this a year ago I didn't do any cooling mods and the GPU heat sync was too hot to touch..
Anyhow... Once again I took a completely dead 360 and made it work again..
I had tried the using m5 bolts and washers for the x-clamp mod..
I had tried using pieces of a credit card in the 4 corners of the GPU die to give equal pressure on the chip. (http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=657442)
I pretty much tried everything, and read through a lot of fixes and before I sold the console for parts i thought i would try baking this 360..
Anyhow, i thought I would post my findings incase anyone is in a similar situation. I have a 1 year old arcade (falcon) that i use for main 360 but this one had the DVD flashed so i didn't want to get rid of it but i also didn't care if i melted.
Post Results if you attempt it and the cooling mods
- Adrenaline_x
This post has been edited by adrenaline_X: Nov 15 2008, 11:28 PM
Post by: adrenaline_X on November 15, 2008, 03:37:00 PM
Update : this has been working for over 3 weeks now with out any issues.. I don't know how long it will hold up but have some faith in this time around.
I think this is a much better method then the heat gun as BOTH sides of the board are being heated EQUALLY at the same time vs the heatgun method. You need to keep the heat high so that board and chips reach the right temperature and evenly
Make sure you well insulate the rest of the components and take the time nessicary to completely cover all the other parts.. The first go round last year ended up with people melting thier sync and eject buttons and blowing capicators
DO NOT USE convection ovens (fans that circulate the air within ) as their is a chance you can move the chips with enough air current.
Anyhow... This works as a last ditch effort before parting out your 360.
MAKE SURE You do the cooling mods and test to make sure your GPU heat sync is only slightly warm to the touch after playing for a couple of hours. Mine is and it took incense smoke and electrical tape to plug up the holes and get great air flow over the gpu.. I can keep my hand on it now while someone is playing GOW2
This was not made with the Noobie in mind and I did alot of reading in these forums about x-clamp mods, fan should mod (a well sealed one which is a must) and the GPU fan 9volt to 12 volt mod (which is very easy)
If you have tried everythign this may work for you
just don't skip any steps or rush the insulation of the motherboard or you will mess it up Thanks.
Post by: manatarms25 on November 15, 2008, 04:06:00 PM
I have also tried something like this and had good luck, my advice? Have a fire extinguisher handy also!!
Post by: jimbobjim on November 15, 2008, 04:18:00 PM
I think advising folks to do this is a bad idea.
Post by: adrenaline_wave on November 15, 2008, 11:49:00 PM
QUOTE(jimbobjim @ Nov 15 2008, 05:54 PM) 
So you cook food in the same oven that you just filled with chemicals from a baked 360 board?
I think advising folks to do this is a bad idea.
Yo.
No disrespect or anything, but I think you are mistaken. You aren't Baking the board and releasing chemicals as you suggest.. If anything you may release some chemicals from the electrical tape melting but it's not solidifying on your oven walls.. In fact I would suggest that the oven cleaners you may use to clean your oven would be far worse as the chemicals are being applied to your oven walls and may stick around until you bake your thanks giving dinner. Engineering labs at the local universtiy suggest using the oven to adhere BGA chips to home made circuts. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
Perhaps if your capicators blow because you didn't insulate the rest of the board well you may get some nasty chemicals hanging around.
But in my case you are just using hot air to attempt to reflow the solder beneath the GPU.. And solder is not going to release chemicals.. By your theory, using a heat gun would do more damage to your body as you would be inhaling the chemicals that may be released while you stand over the board.. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
Anyhow, google BGA + oven and you can read up on how people use this technique (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
Thanks for the input.
This post has been edited by adrenaline_wave: Nov 16 2008, 07:52 AM
Post by: Lugnut on November 17, 2008, 07:38:00 PM
after taking a few messed up mobo's and testing oven temps. I came to the conclusion that the absolute most I could bake the board ( while still in the steel cage) was 350 degrees for 9 minutes then turn up the oven to 400 for 2 more minutes, my oven is digital and i did not check what the actual temps are. Anyways, by doing this, The caps do not leak but I can see that they are just about ready to start bulging, all the connectors and plastic seems fine, except for boards that have blue eject/sync buttons.
I then took a "fresh" 3 rrod 0102, did the same to it. 350 degrees, in open cage ( with no mobo screws) for 8 minutes then 2 minutes at 400 ( stove takes almost the full 2 minutes to raise the temp to 400 so this step may be pointless and dangerous, doing just the 350 for 10 minutes is probably suffice). As soon as i pull the oven door open i pull the rack out and hit the gpu with 1000 degree's from my heat gun, I do it for about 10 seconds. I figure since the board is at least around 170C that I dont need to hit it much with the heat gun on that high of a setting. Sure enough the mobo doesnt warp on me like crazy, this was the problem i was having with all heatgun attempts no matter how much i tried preheating the bottom etc. I obviously had less flex with preheating the bottom good, but i think unless the whole boards temp isnt raised evenly you'll get some kind of warpage.
So far the system has run fine for a day. Now to keep it from warping the main board again i went ahead and jb welded the gpu + CPU to the board. ( No jb weld does not conduct electricity, actually you could pour it all over the motherboard let it dry and it would still work fine)
Post by: manatarms25 on November 17, 2008, 07:57:00 PM
QUOTE
went ahead and jb welded the gpu + CPU to the board. ( No jb weld does not conduct electricity, actually you could pour it all over the motherboard let it dry and it would still work fine)
Thats awesomeJust don't tell M$ that. I would not put that past them, I mean come on they tried gluing them down
Post by: Lugnut on November 17, 2008, 08:42:00 PM
Post by: Moegames on November 18, 2008, 01:08:00 AM
QUOTE(adrenaline_X @ Nov 15 2008, 04:56 PM)
As the topic suggests, this thread will deal with fixing your Dead RROD - errors 0102-0022-0021 - e74. By baking it in the oven.. Cooling Mods are a must after baking it to stop if from RROD again.
Back ground :
Bought a broken 360 that was RROD error 0102. I used the x-clamp replacement that uses m5 bolts through the bottom of the case as well as adding Artic Silver 5 Thermal paste. I also cut out the wire mesh by the fans as well as cutting out some of the plastic at the back. This Fix worked for a about 4 to 5 months of Light usage on a normal tube tv. You can search the forums if you want to read up on the x-clamp mod and why it fixes the rrod. My 360 stopped working completely and loosening or tightening the screws would give me either the RROD of e74 and secondary codes related to the GPU or unknown. I had baked other 360s in the past and results were mixed for a lot of people.. some revived their completely dead 360s and other melted and blew up their capacitors. Check this thread out for my first run at baking them in the oven. This is a oven virgin and hasn't been baked/heat gunned/ etc ( Last Ditch Resort To Fixing Rrod - After X-clamp Mod (, RROD - this works for me.) (http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=629455)
I did a lot of reading up on the causes of the RROD and symptoms and about re-flowing / re-balling fixing the RROD. Search the forums if you want to learn more about re-balling / re-flowing.
The Method:
Pre-Heat your oven to 500F (240-260C) . This was the max my oven would go and I verified it with a oven thermometer. This Temperature is above the melting point of lead free solder. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solder#Lead-free_solder)
Place the prepared 360 in the oven for 8-10 minutes
This time around I decided to try some things differently.. the first time around, caps began leaking, and everything was smoking and sizzling.. The 360 still worked, but leaking cap isn't the best thing in the world. This time around I decided to pinpoint the heat that the motherboard received. I did't have insulation handy (i live in an apartment) so I dug threw my dresser for some old shirts (2 to be exact plus some wool socks) First thing i did was remove the mother board from the case and then removed xclamp fix so all i had is the mother board with all the removable parts removed (sata cables, ROL board and fans) Second I wrapped my thick shirts around one side of the board (top and bottom) leaving the gpu and cpu exposed.
Note : I added socks to open parts here so that all you could see was the bottom of the gpu and cpu
http://i420.photobucket.com/albums/pp287/a..._x/DSC02090.jpg
I did the same for the other side of the board and kept it in place with electrical tape . So what i had left is the cpu and gpu dies exposed on both sides of the board with all the capicators and eject buttons insulated with a thick layer of clothing.. Next I wrapped the both sides of the board with a double layer of tin foil, completely covering everything. Use Wire to keep it in place (i used electrical tape but it melted and began smoking.
Then I carefully made a slit to expose the cpu and gpu dies and folded the tin foil down and under the clothes. (picture 2). After making sure everything was well covered, I placed in on a cookie sheet and placed it in the pre-heated oven for 8-10 minutes.. I noticed some smoke about 5 minutes in so i quickly took it out.. to my relief it was just the electrical tape on the out side of the tin foil melting and burning so I placed it back in to keep baking for another 5 minutes.
I let it cool and removed the tinfoil and clothing.. I inspected the board and everything was like it was before. The caps weren't bulging this time around and the electical tape holding the clothes in place was soft but in tack. I removed all the old thermal past and applied a new layer of Artic silver 5. I used two washers thick between the motherboard and gpu heat sync and 1 washer between the motherboard and cpu heatsync.. I lightly tightened the bolts just enough to provide adequate heat transfer from the dies to the heatsync... I turned it on and it fired up.. Then I turned it off..
Next I did the 12 GPU cooling mod found here. You don't have to cut your fan wires to do this so it was quick and easy. http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=637955. This step is NEEDED because if you can't keep the GPU die cool, the RROD will mos likely come back from everything flexing again and breaking the contact between the chip and the mother board. You want to keep the GPU heat sync cool enough so that you can keep you hand on it while someone is playing halo 3 or gears of war... split my fan shroud so that the GPU fan ONLY sucks air though the GPU heat sync.. I found the 12v fan mod to the gpu to be too loud and just switched it to the 9v mod listed on the link above.. The Heat sync was still hot to the touch so i added tape to the bottom of the shroud to make sure the air wasn't leaking under it.. I used incense to watch the air flow and saw that is was leaking in behind the GPU cooler. Once I removed all the air gaps, the Heat synce was slightly warm to the touch while Playing GOW2 for HOURS (like 4-5 hours).
So far i have about 20-30 hours on this 360 after baking it two weeks ago.. between playing COD4 , GOW2 and Guitar hero, it is still trucking.. I spent alot time testing to make sure the heat sync was slightly warm to the the touch and NOT BURNING HOT.
If you aren't going to do the cooling fan mod, don't bother trying this.. First time I did this a year ago I didn't do any cooling mods and the GPU heat sync was too hot to touch..
Anyhow... Once again I took a completely dead 360 and made it work again..
I had tried the using m5 bolts and washers for the x-clamp mod..
I had tried using pieces of a credit card in the 4 corners of the GPU die to give equal pressure on the chip. (http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=657442)
I pretty much tried everything, and read through a lot of fixes and before I sold the console for parts i thought i would try baking this 360..
Anyhow, i thought I would post my findings incase anyone is in a similar situation. I have a 1 year old arcade (falcon) that i use for main 360 but this one had the DVD flashed so i didn't want to get rid of it but i also didn't care if i melted.
Post Results if you attempt it and the cooling mods
- Adrenaline_x
LOL thats fucking cute dude..i must admit i got a nice giggle out of this when i read this post and peeped out the pic's..but in all seriousness, i can honestly see this working as a "make-shift" reballer.. in a sense i suppose. I will defiantely keep this in mind if any of my current 2 xbox 360 goes up creek again..my two current boxes never rrod'd.. but i had have a few in the past that did..i no longer have those..i parted the system for sale
This post has been edited by Moegames: Nov 18 2008, 09:12 AM
Post by: adrenaline_wave on November 18, 2008, 10:56:00 PM
Hehe.. Well... I did have some experience baking them in the past over a year ago with mixed results...
My 360 is still trucking along.
DO NOT BAKE YOUR 360 IN THE CAGE!! Feck.. Don't EVER do it.. You will melt the caps, the eject button etc.
If you follow my steps above and cover the rest of the board, you can pre-heat the oven to 500f and put it in for 8 minutes. I verified the internal temperature with a oven thermometer.
The electrical tape melted and smoked on the outside.. The tape holding the clothes in place UNDER the two layers DID NOT MELT and can off all in one string.
You don't have to worry about the caps and other things moving around as the temperature doesn't become hot enough. I wanted to throw in a temperature sensor under the folded up t-shirts but I didn't have on at the time.
You are applying heat to the top and bottom of the CPU and GPU at the same time.. AND you are not going to burn the board like you can with a heat gun.
Then DO your cooling mods and make sure you play gow2 or alike for a for a 1/2 hours and check to make sure the GPU heatsync is cool to the touch.. if it isn't keep working on your cooling mods until it is.. Don't just slap it back together and hope the best.. It's pointless.. HEAT is killing the stupid thing..
One a side not NXE launches tomorrow.. I can't wait to try it out while connected to live !
also... don't skip and steps OR take short cuts.. Give yourself a couple of hours when you attempt this so you don't rush and make sure you have the board insulated..
Anyhow.. I would only attempt this if everything else has failed
Post by: craz3d on November 18, 2008, 11:04:00 PM
All in all, I think this is irresponsible posting. Naturally, anyone that follows this advice has it coming to them, but shouldn't we be trying to prevent people who might not know the hazards of overheating electrical components and plastics before they stick their 360 in an oven and further damage it, or worse forget about it and set their house on fire?
edit: I admit I skipped over your introduction at first and didn't realize that you'd already attempted an X-clamp fix with some success; however, I still feel advising people to do this is a bad idea.
This post has been edited by craz3d: Nov 19 2008, 07:07 AM
Post by: adrenaline_wave on November 18, 2008, 11:25:00 PM
QUOTE(craz3d @ Nov 19 2008, 12:40 AM) 
This might have worked for you, but it screams "fire hazard" when I read it. This fix seems remarkably similar to the towel trick - minus the towel - and while it may work for some time it doesn't seem to me like it will have a better success rate than an X-Clamp fix or a new cooling system entirely.
All in all, I think this is irresponsible posting. Naturally, anyone that follows this advice has it coming to them, but shouldn't we be trying to prevent people who might not know the hazards of overheating electrical components and plastics before they stick their 360 in an oven and further damage it, or worse forget about it and set their house on fire?
edit: I admit I skipped over your introduction at first and didn't realize that you'd already attempted an X-clamp fix with some success; however, I still feel advising people to do this is a bad idea.
No offense but I think you are ignorant when it comes to how MS installs these chips in the first place.. This is HOW THEY INSTALL the chips in the first place.
DO some reading about reballing on google..search "chip pcb oven" Spend a few days reading like I did and then come back and POST YOUR research... Not just what you think.
Anyhow as my initial post states, this was not directed at noobs to the site.. I'm a director of Infrastructure / senior network admin and have been fixing and modding computers for the last 20 years... So this isn't some hair brained trick i came up with on a whim.
If think if you read up on it you would understand the difference between what the towel trick does and what this is meant to do... When you use the towel trick you are simply overheating the gpu.. This method is meant to cheaply reflow the solder between the GPU and CPU.. overheating the 360 with a towel does not heat the air and motherboard to the melting point of lead free solder (check wikipedia, i posted the direct link to prove it) this does.. or attempts to.
But whatever.. I love how everyone is bashing this
I did my research, came up an experiment to test my theory and then posted my results... Re-read my post and you will see that I attempted ALL the Sane test fixes (x-clamp, improved x-clamp) You are going to do more damage witha 1800F heat gun blowing air then you are with regulated and directed hot air in the oven.
Here : Start reading
http://www.beloev.net/gbvio.html
http://openhardware....uff/ToasterSMD/
http://www.instructa...-Soldering-BGA/
http://wiki.xda-deve...ame=WallabyJTAG
I'm trying to bring my research to people that have tried everything and their 360 will no longer function.. Follow the steps above and see how it goes.. if your 360 is dead, you aren't going to make it any worse.
Soo... if you don't have anything enlighting to bring to the table, sit on your hands.. I know people think this is crazy and a fire hazard, but instead of reacting, take the time to do some searching and research.. this
isn't meant to be preformed by kids.
edit: I don't mean to come across as being harsh or angry, I'm not.. A forum is meant to be a discussion of ideas by like minded individuals.. I'm not saying this is the best fix, or that everyone should try it.. Just posting my results from ideas I came up with. There are obvious fire hazards if precautions aren't taken (ie : insulted the rest of the board from the intense heat).. WIth that being said, i think you have a better chance of burning down your house will frying something in a firying pan... You don't have anything inately flammable on the board and you don't have a source of ignition (unless you have a gas stove).
Post by: wyldstallions on November 19, 2008, 04:55:00 AM
I too had limited success with the rrod, error 0102 which after xclamping through the chassis worked for a short while, maybe a week but with freezes, then after more fiddling turned into an e74.
Also tried the penny/rubber/xecutor rrod fix with no success.
One thing I did note is the motherboard is visibly warped at the rear near the fans, it seems to me to be because of the chassis, there is an indent point that the rear of the dvd screws into (approx. in the middle) which seems to be too high, only by a mm or so but enough to distort the middle of the board upward. You can see it easily with the fans removed. I took a hammer and adjusted this peg (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
Having read this white paper from manncorp XBOX 360 rework station it would seem that even and controlled reflow is the best answer. As far as I can see using a hot air gun is so random, you cannot be sure of correct or even temp, nor can you heat both sides of the board at the same time. The possibility of error is high.
So heres what I did.
Prep work:
I removed the board from the chassis then using some blu tac covered the eject and controller sync buttons. Then using some old socks (adult size) used these to carefully cover the caps connectors etc, basically leaving the GPU, CPU and ram clear. The socks were stuck to the board using electrical tape and also to the underside of the board to cover the various connectors.
Then I took some blu tak and rolled it into several long thin sausages, about 5mm in diameter. Then applied this to the board basically between the components I wanted exposed and the electrical tape. Essentially making a gasket. I also did this on the back side of the board around the GPU, CPU and ram.
Then I took a large piece of alu tin foil and started at the edge of the board started to wrap the board but leaving it slack pressed the foil into the blu tak to seal it, (Thus no fabric or tape is directly exposed to heat source). Then wrapped it around the back and pressed it into the rear gasket.
Then using a small craft knife cut the foil in the middle of the gasket. Lastly I wrapped a few more layers of foil over the cap areas, edges etc, not using anything other than the distortion of the foil to hold it in place.
Cooking:
Using our domestic fan assisted electric oven I set the temp to 220-230C which again according to all ref should be sufficient to cause the solder to reflow.
To check I took some flat foil and but a lump of blu tak in the middle then took several lengths of solder and placed them in it (taking a short length and making it a small L shape was useful as it easily showed the points that the solder would soften or melt.
I then put this test piece in the oven to ensure it was hot enough and the fan airflow wasn't going to cause any problem. I then observed and timed how long it would take for the solder to melt. I also tested with solder that was already heated and cooled to check the effect was the same.
Basically we want to heat the gpu, cpu solder to reflow before excessive heat soak gets through the insulation and damages or melts anything else.
I found that approx 270 seconds (4 1/2 mins) was sufficient to melt my test pieces. (5 mins max).
So then I shoved in the prepared board, for the just under 5 mins at approx 230C.
At the end when I opened the oven there was a small amount of smoke from the electrical tape so I pulled the board out and left it to cool on the side. After about an hour I carefully removed all the insulation, blu tak etc and reassembled into the chassis using x clamp replacement method.
There is no visible damage to any components on the board, nothing has fallen off or moved, the solder on the underside of the board has become a more golden colour consistent with how it should when it has reached reflow temp.
(cooling mods are whisper max fans, xcm core cooler running at 5v and shroud mod which it had before failure anyway)
Connected it all up and the dam thing worked. Have now been running it on and off for 8 hours or so with GOW2 and not a freeze or glitch so far.
I have no expectation of it being a permanent fix if there is such a thing but as this is a spare box its nice to get a bit more life from it.
The main considerations of this fix is, protecting vulnerable components and using sufficient heat but not for too long.
This post has been edited by wyldstallions: Nov 19 2008, 01:00 PM
Post by: ppajko on November 21, 2008, 11:15:00 AM
QUOTE(wyldstallions @ Nov 19 2008, 07:31 AM)
I have come up with my own but very similar method of this after doing some research.
I too had limited success with the rrod, error 0102 which after xclamping through the chassis worked for a short while, maybe a week but with freezes, then after more fiddling turned into an e74.
Also tried the penny/rubber/xecutor rrod fix with no success.
One thing I did note is the motherboard is visibly warped at the rear near the fans, it seems to me to be because of the chassis, there is an indent point that the rear of the dvd screws into (approx. in the middle) which seems to be too high, only by a mm or so but enough to distort the middle of the board upward. You can see it easily with the fans removed. I took a hammer and adjusted this peg
Having read this white paper from manncorp XBOX 360 rework station it would seem that even and controlled reflow is the best answer. As far as I can see using a hot air gun is so random, you cannot be sure of correct or even temp, nor can you heat both sides of the board at the same time. The possibility of error is high.
So heres what I did.
Prep work:
I removed the board from the chassis then using some blu tac covered the eject and controller sync buttons. Then using some old socks (adult size) used these to carefully cover the caps connectors etc, basically leaving the GPU, CPU and ram clear. The socks were stuck to the board using electrical tape and also to the underside of the board to cover the various connectors.
Then I took some blu tak and rolled it into several long thin sausages, about 5mm in diameter. Then applied this to the board basically between the components I wanted exposed and the electrical tape. Essentially making a gasket. I also did this on the back side of the board around the GPU, CPU and ram.
Then I took a large piece of alu tin foil and started at the edge of the board started to wrap the board but leaving it slack pressed the foil into the blu tak to seal it, (Thus no fabric or tape is directly exposed to heat source). Then wrapped it around the back and pressed it into the rear gasket.
Then using a small craft knife cut the foil in the middle of the gasket. Lastly I wrapped a few more layers of foil over the cap areas, edges etc, not using anything other than the distortion of the foil to hold it in place.
Cooking:
Using our domestic fan assisted electric oven I set the temp to 220-230C which again according to all ref should be sufficient to cause the solder to reflow.
To check I took some flat foil and but a lump of blu tak in the middle then took several lengths of solder and placed them in it (taking a short length and making it a small L shape was useful as it easily showed the points that the solder would soften or melt.
I then put this test piece in the oven to ensure it was hot enough and the fan airflow wasn't going to cause any problem. I then observed and timed how long it would take for the solder to melt. I also tested with solder that was already heated and cooled to check the effect was the same.
Basically we want to heat the gpu, cpu solder to reflow before excessive heat soak gets through the insulation and damages or melts anything else.
I found that approx 270 seconds (4 1/2 mins) was sufficient to melt my test pieces. (5 mins max).
So then I shoved in the prepared board, for the just under 5 mins at approx 230C.
At the end when I opened the oven there was a small amount of smoke from the electrical tape so I pulled the board out and left it to cool on the side. After about an hour I carefully removed all the insulation, blu tak etc and reassembled into the chassis using x clamp replacement method.
There is no visible damage to any components on the board, nothing has fallen off or moved, the solder on the underside of the board has become a more golden colour consistent with how it should when it has reached reflow temp.
(cooling mods are whisper max fans, xcm core cooler running at 5v and shroud mod which it had before failure anyway)
Connected it all up and the dam thing worked. Have now been running it on and off for 8 hours or so with GOW2 and not a freeze or glitch so far.
I have no expectation of it being a permanent fix if there is such a thing but as this is a spare box its nice to get a bit more life from it.
The main considerations of this fix is, protecting vulnerable components and using sufficient heat but not for too long.
First of all I would like to say that I love xbox360-big fan-, but this is so sad that ideas like this have to happen in order for the system to work again. Does M$ see this and if so what do they think of this? There must be a response from them about these ideas. This system has to be the cheapest quality made product in History ! I also had 3rrod 1 year ago and now I have 4 fans and 114db of noise. This is ridiculus. But ofcourse I will still use the system because it had good games.
Post by: nuzz on November 26, 2008, 09:35:00 AM
Got it covered in folie and a towel, 10 minutes in a preheated oven and voila. Working again
