Post by: Xbox-Scene on November 12, 2009, 02:57:00 PM
Xbox Boss Chris Lewis Defends Anti-Piracy Crackdown Posted by XanTium | November 12 16:57 EST | News Category: Xbox360 |
| From sky.com: Quote
Full Story: sky.com (incl. video interview) |
Post by: chorizo1 on November 12, 2009, 02:59:00 PM
Post by: vinz on November 12, 2009, 03:03:00 PM
QUOTE(chorizo1 @ Nov 12 2009, 10:59 PM) 
AMEN.
PRAISE THE LAWD!! SWEET JESUS IN HEAVEN!
Post by: CardnalSyn on November 12, 2009, 03:07:00 PM
Protect them from WHAT?!?!
Post by: rossmac on November 12, 2009, 03:08:00 PM
QUOTE(CardnalSyn @ Nov 12 2009, 11:07 PM) 
"Clearly it's important for us to be able to stamp down on that to protect the 10 million people that are already on Xbox 360 in Europe for instance."
Protect them from WHAT?!?!
Rising prices of games caused by others not purchasing it?
Post by: STICKY_BUD on November 12, 2009, 03:10:00 PM
Post by: CardnalSyn on November 12, 2009, 03:14:00 PM
QUOTE(rossmac @ Nov 12 2009, 04:08 PM)
Rising prices of games caused by others not purchasing it?
oh...i thought they made up the difference by charging already outrageous prices for accessories and add ons...
Post by: T3chWarrior on November 12, 2009, 03:17:00 PM
Here is my middle finger to microsoft
.l..
Post by: notmyrealname on November 12, 2009, 03:26:00 PM
they're all proud in sh!t, they should be ashamed of their lack of skills, yes we still don't know how they're doing it it, but for 4+ years it was us laughing at them, and they have a whole team of engineers behind them.
cocky mofos, that's the reason Windows and Microsoft is the #1 hackable platform.
I know what hurts them....
that one guy has outsmarted him for so long and he's doing it out of goodwill, and "big shocker" no profit involved...gasp...(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif),,,, M$ go suck a lemon.
Post by: phigmeta on November 12, 2009, 03:27:00 PM
And i am unapologetic about buying a wii this weekend ... no biggy xbox folks.... but guess who just purchased a Wii and preordered Mario for the wii.
Piracy sells your platform you freaking morons
I buy a lot of games ... but not for the xbox anymore. Once folks figure out how they ban and can prevent it ... I will consider buying games for the 360 again.
Post by: noobcube on November 12, 2009, 03:28:00 PM
QUOTE(rossmac @ Nov 12 2009, 05:08 PM)
Rising prices of games caused by others not purchasing it?
They're not protecting anyone from anything. In fact, banning Xbox Live members/consoles will just mean less people online; so it's going to hurt the XBL/online community.
QUOTE
have modified their Xbox in some way that will allow them to download games that they haven't purchased legitimately
Really, we can use our 360's to download games illegitimately? And I've been using my PC this whole time
QUOTE
we're unapologetic about that
Post by: xboxjason on November 12, 2009, 03:29:00 PM
QUOTE
"If it's clear someone is downloading pirated copies or have modified their Xbox in some way that will allow them to download games that they haven't purchased legitimately and yes we lock that account down and we're unapologetic about that," he said.
That's okay, we're unapologetic about modifying our purchased xboxes... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)
This post has been edited by xboxjason: Nov 12 2009, 11:30 PM
Post by: Martinchris23 on November 12, 2009, 03:30:00 PM
QUOTE(rossmac @ Nov 12 2009, 10:08 PM)
Rising prices of games caused by others not purchasing it?
Absolute bollocks (pardon my French)
Halo was the biggest selling game for the original Xbox and didn't go Platinum until...? Yep, Halo 2, approx 2.5 years later? Why? Because they were still shifting copies at £40 ($70) a pop in the UK. More recently, CoD: MW was still being sold at retail price because it was still moving off store shelves. It's still the same price as MW2 in most stores!
Now look at LBP and KillZone 2 for the PS3: Both have been reduced in price within 12 months of release (in fact LBP was discounted to £10 within 4 months). Are you telling me they're reduced because they're selling well?
Not once has the games industry demonstrated a desire to reward the purchasing of games by reducing the costs because sales are exceptionally high. In the business world, it's counter-intuitive. I don't blame MS for doing what they've done, however the age old excuse "to pay for the ones who pirate the games" has grown grey hairs. If truth be told, if we ALL stopped buying games the price would plummet. Games are priced as any other item (even those which cannot be duplicated): If it keeps selling, keep the price as is. Once interest starts to wane, drop the price (release as a Platinum title).
So buy your games if you want to (I do and am quite happy to do so at the right price!), but don't blame the high cost on others as it's simply untrue.
Post by: dragonranger on November 12, 2009, 03:43:00 PM
HOw does it protect them by banning modded console?
Post by: BEVEL on November 12, 2009, 03:45:00 PM
This post has been edited by BEVEL: Nov 12 2009, 11:46 PM
Post by: amak1131 on November 12, 2009, 03:50:00 PM
QUOTE(rossmac @ Nov 12 2009, 03:08 PM)
Rising prices of games caused by others not purchasing it?
ROFL. That has to be the funniest comment I've read on this issue. Piracy has little damage on the industry. Why? More than likely, those who downloaded it were never going to buy it anyway! A downloaded game does NOT equal a lost sale, it equals a lost POTENTIAL sale.
They're charging outrageous prices because they get away with it, simple as that.
Post by: tech3475 on November 12, 2009, 03:54:00 PM
Just wondering, are they banning just the consoles or accounts as well? This is getting confusing because of all these mixed reports.
Post by: Martinchris23 on November 12, 2009, 03:55:00 PM
QUOTE(dragonranger @ Nov 12 2009, 10:43 PM)
what is the thing that M$ try to protect those Legit XBL gamers from?
HOw does it protect them by banning modded console?
Those who are banned cannot play games installed to the HDD any longer - who are they protecting here?
Post by: turk3y on November 12, 2009, 04:04:00 PM
QUOTE(40_ounce @ Nov 12 2009, 11:57 PM)
What I haven't heard anyone say about all this banning crazyness is it's not going to stop piracy. People are still going to pirate xbox360 games and play them. They might get a new console and mod it or just keep the banned console to have one for offlne play and a regular console for only games they want to play online.
no but it does help to increase thoes ever so important holiday sales figures for the board and general propaganda. The only thing it protects is their pocket whilst showing the likes of EA they are trying to fight it.
Post by: zainday on November 12, 2009, 04:08:00 PM
Themselves!
I think they are just trying to cut things off at the pass......
If a banned console can install games on the hdd maybe there worried about a ONE BOOT DISC scenario coming to the scene soon with the all the new homebrew stuff going on....wouldnt be to far outta site....
250 gigs of games on one hdd with a single boot disc, wouldn't be to good for them.....
let see.....pay for online and games or would people rather have offline and 250 gigs of games with a solo boot disc......LOL.....
Post by: Sin3xtreme on November 12, 2009, 04:09:00 PM
QUOTE(40_ounce @ Nov 13 2009, 08:27 AM)
What I haven't heard anyone say about all this banning crazyness is it's not going to stop piracy. People are still going to pirate xbox360 games and play them. They might get a new console and mod it or just keep the banned console to have one for offlne play and a regular console for only games they want to play online.
you hit the nail on the head right there (modded for offline unmodded for online)
it will allways be a cat and mouse effect and at the end of the day M$ is just wasting their time becouse notmatter what they do modders will allways evolve and change tactics
Just ask punkbuster and their war on aimbots
Post by: yugluc on November 12, 2009, 04:27:00 PM
There's 19 mil. 360's in USA. Halo 3 ODST sold 1.5 million copies. @$60 each, that's 90 million dollars
Microsoft grossed. What do you actually think the're development cost was??? Even to spend 10% of that (9 million) considering they are just reusing/upgrading the current assets, they just made a Shat load of cash.
say you have a million people playing backups online + the people who bought it. Another $200+ million in XBOX Live fees + DLC.
That's $300 million going directly to them cause it was developed in house.
MS is making a killing with DLC, even from the piraters, they prob end up spending more without knowing it!!
And they say to protect the online community, but PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong.
Even if your modded and playing a backup, there's no possible way anymore to change game files to cheat online without being caught. So aren't people playing backups, playing fair?
Post by: Grim187 on November 12, 2009, 04:40:00 PM
I would like to see a %100 accurate statement about...anything from Micro$soft regarding its members, updates to its software(i.e. dash) and moves it takes (against pirates).
I don't trust anything (%100) that major nelson says (he has been known for leaking things tho
).
Post by: death69inc on November 12, 2009, 04:55:00 PM
and yet agian they wont tell me why
this is bull halo and elite both banned and they seem to think its ok
no firmware mods no 3rd part hdd
only thing is a rrod fix nad a fan upgrade on my elite and it was banned today @&@)*$&@)$@!*$&@$
Post by: Artlover on November 12, 2009, 05:06:00 PM
QUOTE(zainday @ Nov 12 2009, 06:08 PM)
If a banned console can install games on the hdd maybe there worried about a ONE BOOT DISC scenario coming to the scene soon
You still haven't explained how this stop piracy.
For any such "one boot disc" option to work, one would need a modded console anyways.
Which means they can just as easily play the disc they burned that they needed to install it to the HDD to begin with.
Wait, maybe you mean they will borrow their friends disc? Well, their friend can just burn them their own copy for them. Unless you mean borrow their friends original. But again, since you would need a modded console to use the boot disc, and games can be had for free for people who have modded consoles, that makes no sense.
Wait again, maybe you mean rentals? Again, need modded console for boot disc, so why would someone pay a rental fee for something they could get for free.
QUOTE(zainday @ Nov 12 2009, 06:08 PM)
with the all the new homebrew stuff going on....wouldnt be to far outta site....
1: Very VERY few people are lucky enough to have a console in a state that allows them to use homebrew.
2: Homebrew and replacing the dash that is needed to run games are two different things. If the latter was easily done, then we wouldn't need to bother with things like freeBoot, and just direct boot games via custom loaders. I, along with a huge percentage (if not a majority) of users, would love nothing more then to dump this damned horrible NXE crap and replace it with a nice 3rd party option that's actually clean & functional.
Post by: The Dude Z on November 12, 2009, 05:08:00 PM
QUOTE(zainday @ Nov 12 2009, 06:08 PM)
"Those who are banned cannot play games installed to the HDD any longer - who are they protecting here?"
Themselves!
I think they are just trying to cut things off at the pass......
If a banned console can install games on the hdd maybe there worried about a ONE BOOT DISC scenario coming to the scene soon with the all the new homebrew stuff going on....wouldnt be to far outta site....
250 gigs of games on one hdd with a single boot disc, wouldn't be to good for them.....
let see.....pay for online and games or would people rather have offline and 250 gigs of games with a solo boot disc......LOL.....
You can't downgrade the dashboard on a 360 that has been recently banned cause the 8xxx version dash overwrites the 1st stage Boot Loader.
In order to get banned you would have had to log into Xbox Live thus forcing you to take that update thus you wouldn't have the option to downgrade and run homebrew !
So your theory is stupid.
This was simply a big F**K You from MS to the modder.
Also known as malicious destruction of private property.
They have a right to ban a console but never have a right to disable console functionality other than connecting to Xbox Live.
Post by: bucko on November 12, 2009, 05:12:00 PM
QUOTE(chorizo1 @ Nov 12 2009, 09:59 PM)
AMEN.
+1 just hope they have all been banned now, so I can read some decent topics on X-S without it going down with stupid "zomg i'm banned posts"...
Post by: amak1131 on November 12, 2009, 05:24:00 PM
Post by: liam82517 on November 12, 2009, 05:31:00 PM
QUOTE(bucko @ Nov 13 2009, 02:12 AM)
+1 just hope they have all been banned now, so I can read some decent topics on X-S without it going down with stupid "zomg i'm banned posts"...
+1
How many posts do we really need saying the same thing over and over. I think last time I looked it was 30+ pages of people saying the same thing over and over about how they (MS) were catching people.
Post by: Deihmos on November 12, 2009, 05:54:00 PM
Post by: AllSewnUp on November 12, 2009, 05:57:00 PM
We all appreciate the work c4eva and guys like him do and if you don't then you are a retard. If c4e is anything like me he keeps doing this just to prove that he can. Piracy will never stop.
Stupid people are generally afraid of opening a console in my experience.
I think the biggest problem is people can pay to get their consoles modded for as little as $20. That inflates the numbers and inflates exposure. More exposure equals more scrutiny, and so on.
Microsoft really feels like they have won this one........That will make it even sweeter when all is well again.
Nothing wrong with buying games....it is just that most games aren't worth buying.
Post by: CocoaPistolero on November 12, 2009, 05:58:00 PM
QUOTE(rossmac @ Nov 12 2009, 05:08 PM)
Rising prices of games caused by others not purchasing it?
And on the front page of this site, 2 million people logged into LIVE to play Modern Warfare 2. Were you being sarcastic? Because from what I can see, this industry is growing larger every day and good games are massively popular and profitable no matter how many pirates there are. Just my $0.02
Post by: pinkerton on November 12, 2009, 06:04:00 PM
QUOTE(Artlover @ Nov 13 2009, 12:41 AM)
In my nearly 30 decades of doing this junk, I have never seen a scene so over-populated with people that don't deserve the privilage as I have in this generation.
WOW! That must make you over 300 years old!
Post by: CocoaPistolero on November 12, 2009, 06:22:00 PM
QUOTE(Artlover @ Nov 12 2009, 07:41 PM)
Gamecube only proved what the pirates were saying all along, that they never would have bought the game to begin with. Thus, no loss, as no sale=no sale, regardless of circumstances.
It proved it by selling as many consoles as the Xbox1 did, yet had the same attach rate despite having 0% piracy for nearly it's entire lifespan, atleast the first 4 years of it. IE: Same size user base + pirated up the ying-yang vs no piracy at all and game sales were equal between the two.
No argument that that is the way it used to be for so long.
The problem is you and many others seem to be niave about how small a number piracy is today. Casual piracy is on the rise. I speak as someone who has been in groups, had my own groups and been invovled in the scenes going as far back as the C64 & A800 days of the early 80's. Doing this stuff longer then many users here have even been alive. As I said in the other thread, piracy is on the rise, and sadly, it's on the rise amung those 'stupid' people as you call them (I call them idiots myself) because the sceners have been going out of their way this console generation to make it as easy as possible for everyone. Besides, if someone is still too stupid to do it themselves, they can just get their smart friend to do it, or send it off with $50 and have it done for them. Which they are doing. (Which I guess really says alot about the average intelligence of people because the 360 is like the second easiest system ever to mod).
In my nearly 30 decades of doing this junk, I have never seen a scene so over-populated with people that don't deserve the privilage as I have in this generation. It's patheitc, and I'm pretty disgusted with the way things are now a days. I'm not going to switch sides and join the likes of MS or anything, nor do I approve of their tactics. But honestly, I completely sympathize with them and understand why they are pushing back as hard as they are and don't exactly disagree. The scene needs a reality check and a mass purging, and this isn't exactly a bad way to accomplish that.
I don't get what you're saying... Piracy isn't l33t enough anymore?
Post by: rocky5 on November 12, 2009, 07:03:00 PM
Post by: hyfall381 on November 12, 2009, 07:13:00 PM
although that data can be recovered using an unbanned xbox, if you put that hdd back in the banned one, your stuff gets messed up again. so they have gone too far... making the banned xbox more or less unusable.
ill buy a cheap 20gb hdd from ebay solely for my banned xbox. ill use a new gamerprofile and only play games on that one that i dont plan on every going online with. for me, thats fine. but for many others who want all their saves and achievement points on one hdd, under one gamer profile, i totally understand how this can really suck.
Post by: danked on November 12, 2009, 07:29:00 PM
Post by: Miguell on November 12, 2009, 07:46:00 PM
all you have is just xboxlive..
but one day soon we will rule it
XBOX LIVE TO
suck in my finger:
..I..
Post by: xrkahn76 on November 12, 2009, 07:49:00 PM
Post by: moddr8oy on November 12, 2009, 08:32:00 PM
Post by: fatvince on November 12, 2009, 08:39:00 PM
QUOTE(rossmac @ Nov 12 2009, 11:08 PM)
Rising prices of games caused by others not purchasing it?
Ah.. So the Playstation 3 has really cheap games because there's no piracy? Gotcha!
Post by: axess68 on November 12, 2009, 09:13:00 PM
It's very odd to see it on a site that openly advertises products that enable modding, etc.
Perhaps there is a lot of hypocrisy going on. Maybe they're afraid the big bad M$ Evil Empire is going to send the underpants gnomes after them. Since it sure looks like the Underpants Gnomes built the first 360's.
Post by: coolrail on November 12, 2009, 09:56:00 PM
Post by: Nemesis2007 on November 12, 2009, 10:05:00 PM
Currently i'm running Ixtreme 1.61 BenQ played GTA:EFLC offline.
Then go on live with original halo 3 and shadowrun= no ban.
just wait patiently for lite touch c4eva has and will pull it off.
I say if you play backups offline like MW2 before release date
i would see how they could get you for offline line play by
achievement dates and such thats just my two cents
Post by: not-banned on November 12, 2009, 10:14:00 PM
Everybody I know who was banned has already bought at least one more since.
They are true examples of piracy costing the industry. The only reason they weren't buying games is because they didn't have to, and while they certainly wouldn't have bought half the games they downloaded, the fact that they rushed out to buy new consoles and games to go along with them the minute they got banned proves that MS was losing revenue by allowing them to be on Live.
I myself have no interest in actually paying for games and would simply find something else to do if given no other option. But people like me probably make up less than 10% of the total number of 360 gamers with modded consoles, so the argument that MS should leave modded consoles alone to continue getting revenue from subscriptions and DLC is completely retarded.
Post by: vintage_guitar on November 12, 2009, 10:33:00 PM
QUOTE(bucko @ Nov 12 2009, 06:12 PM)
so I can read some decent topics on X-S without it going down with stupid "zomg i'm banned posts"...
I agree.
Post by: tweak41 on November 12, 2009, 10:40:00 PM
Like a pirated game will bite you or something if you're not careful...
People know what they're doing, and they're not doing it to be malicious. They're doing it cause they're cheap, bored, or trying to make a quick buck (which is bullshit).
BUT--Microsoft isn't protecting anyone by banning modded consoles. Except maybe their own pocketbook when people go out and buy new consoles. And even then you have retail stores losing revenue on busted consoles being returned in place of the new console these people are buying.
Obviously piracy is wrong, but don't say you're protecting Xbox Live members. That's just not true.
Post by: supercheap007 on November 12, 2009, 11:06:00 PM
Lets face it, 150 on a 120 M$ harddrive will get me a 1.5 terabyte at frys...
Post by: ajennice on November 12, 2009, 11:57:00 PM
Either alot of people paid to have original firware re-flashed and the modder can really get around tearing up the warranty seal pretty good, or this ban has several holes in it.
My local game retailer has suggested in reporting this to the better business bureau/watchdog after an 80+ year old man and his wife brought in a colsom that was bought 3 days ago for them by their daughter so they could use the it as a DVD player, for netflix, and to keep in touch with the grandkids. Anyone wan' to go on a limb and this old couple is probably the pirate king and queen of the east? Also a buy/sell/trade gaming store had their DEMO console banned. No one opens a demo console.. hell it never leaves the store
Mine got hit and it never had any mods. Being I know a few people in the legal field we tookiti to a best buy and had 3 managers (store manager, department manager, and a geek squad manager) inspect it and sign a notarized letter stating it was not modded as far as they could tell. We then made copies and sent those to microsoft and the better business bureau with pictures of the console, then sent the actual console to the State attrney General.
IF it takes these steps to make them realized no everyone is the boy who cried wolf, then be it. Remember these guys said there was no RROD issue, then came out and exteneded warranties, said the dvd players didn't cause rings, then settled a 20million calss action suit and began a disk replacement program.. We all now the blue scrren of death and the vista issues. This ban was legit but affected alot of innocents of which MS will not help out. Period
As for the people stating piracy is what causes game prices to be so high.. that's BS! Does andyone pirate gasoline? It's priced pretty high! It's supply and demand... period. i saw fool forking out over 100.00 for a legit copy of MW2 3 days before it was released. If someone will pay a substancial price ofr something, then you can't blame piracy. that's greed and profiteering.
Just by visiting the forums, you can tell they knew this would get out of hand. No one will give any inssigt to what ahppededn. All questions are met wit preapproved copy and paste replies. Not may Moderators will even acknowledge some comcerns.. Usually when a company tell their employees to just use a prearranged reply and do not try to help, then that means they know something could of went wrong and they do not want to mislead anyone untill the facts are straightened out.
Post by: ajennice on November 13, 2009, 12:15:00 AM
It's going to be bigger than you think. The retailers get the grunt of all the negative in this. We can't go to Redmond, Wa and climb up in some xbox top level execs face so we do it, unmaliciously at he place where we bought it. They have zero control over it, but they do have to honor thier policies as well. If you have a warranty and your gets banned wrongly.. return it and make the store manager aware of it. The stores and distributor have a louder voice than we do as they buy these in bulk as we just buy (hope) one and make it last as long as we can.
What really sucks is in this downed economy alot of people are fed up with this and returning their consoel and just geeting a store sredit to use as holiday spending money. This essentiall takes about 215.00 per return out of that companues revenue. the smaller gaming store will be hit the hardest as NOW people will not buy the 360 over fears of getting banned for no reason at all. This in turn (no piracy) wil cause the console and gaming prices to climb as Microsoft still has to cover thier overhead for their product. If you need to have 1 million in sale and you miss it by alot, the next quarter you'll be raising the prices abouty 1-1.5% on all hardware and accessories licensed by your comapny. Beacuse in big business if you'rte losing money the stock holders are upset.. and upset stock holders usually end with CEO's losing their primo jobs and lusious salaries.
to answer GUE$$WHO - no one knows how they did this. no ne knows what the console/game updates do. They're saved on the console's memory as well as the hard drive's memory. They could of implimented a mole that now reads and reports the disk stats as well as the firmware on the console. It's just like firing up a PC after being turned off for a month. Even though you do not go to the windows update page to see if there are update, Windows will tell you.. Hey you got some updates. I think the last few console updates implimented this into our 360's
But to couter argue myself - why are unmodded console being banned??
If you've ever updated a PC prigram or DVD-rom firmware you'll notice you haceto agree to an EULA (end user license aggreement)...This was done when users initailly signed up for LIVE saying they agree with the terms...
Post by: GU3$$WH0 on November 13, 2009, 12:44:00 AM
HEY! (AJENNICE), what do you think about this part of the article after what i said in my post?
[/quote] In an interview with Sky's Anna Jones, Mr Lewis went on to defend the move.
"If it's clear someone is downloading pirated copies or have modified their Xbox in some way that will allow them to download games that they haven't purchased legitimately and yes we lock that account down and we're unapologetic about that," he said.
"GU3$$ WH0"
Post by: Strumpet on November 13, 2009, 12:52:00 AM
QUOTE(tweak41 @ Nov 13 2009, 05:40 AM)
Obviously piracy is wrong, but don't say you're protecting Xbox Live members. That's just not true.
If you look into communities such as se7ensins then you know what people can do when they have the ability to mod iso's . So yes I would go as far as saying its a legitimate claim that they are protecting xbox live users albeit a very minor number would use them techniques
Post by: GU3$$WH0 on November 13, 2009, 01:21:00 AM
QUOTE(GU3$$WH0 @ Nov 13 2009, 02:44 AM)
(AJENNICE),
I know somebody that has two moded 360's... 1 played back ups online (banned) & the other never played anything online (unbanned)... he went online today (didnt play any back ups) with the (unbanned) console & was fine... so because of that person i know... that part of the article i pointed out... plus what "c4eava" said... quote "suspect theyre going hard on the warez releases & incorrect use of abgx"... thats why believe its not the fw... bugged games can easily be planted & abgx could be crippled with a virus or worm of some sort... that notifies M$ & logs everytime you played an illigitimate copy... qoute ("overwhelming evidence") will get you banned from xbox live says a microsoft spokesperson...
"GU3$$ WH0"
Post by: d-range on November 13, 2009, 04:07:00 AM
QUOTE(trick91 @ Nov 13 2009, 05:28 AM)
if they can stop you from installing games to the harddrive, what stops them from doing the same thing for future dash upgrades? it locks you out of upgrading the dash hence u cant play anymore games offline either?
They'd have to embed each and every check directly into the dashboard then, without a way to verify CRC's, SS's etc. online, since you wouldn't be going on XBL anymore. They'd have only 2 ways of detecting a modded box left: direct inspection of the firmware, or some kind of indirect check on response times, disc jitter, that kind of stuff. The first seems very unlikely, the drives aren't made to have easy access to the firmware from software, in fact they are made to make it as hard as possible. The second could always be faked by hacked firmware as soon as the actual detection method is known (which it will be eventually). Also it seems to be a little thin to go on, crippling a console just because the disc doesn't look like a pressed one. Last but not least I think they might get into legal troubles crippling a console just by inserting a disc, instead of crippling it because you're using said disc on their online service.
That said, I don't even think Microsoft is out to get all pirates, they just want to wipe the XBL service clean of modders. There's little to gain disabling the <1% of modded consoles that will never, ever be able to go online, right now about 3% of the consoles appears to be modified, but that number will certainly drop when XBL + modded console is effectively made impossible.
Post by: ynwa on November 13, 2009, 04:12:00 AM
Post by: Exobex on November 13, 2009, 05:07:00 AM
Post by: nitussi on November 13, 2009, 06:16:00 AM
So suck it up! Because I believe for most people here, spending $200 on a new console a year is not a bad trade off for all the free or cheap entertainment you had all year long.. and you know what I mean!
Post by: minipower on November 13, 2009, 06:19:00 AM
In an interview with Sky's Anna Jones, Mr Lewis went on to defend the move.
"If it's clear someone is downloading pirated copies or have modified their Xbox in some way that will allow them to download games that they haven't purchased legitimately and yes we lock that account down and we're unapologetic about that," he said.
[/QUOTE]
So? do they have people looking for people that have downloaded games..??
What if someone downloaded a game on your I.P. that had a modded XBOX360, But you do not have a modded xbox360 yourself.
Also is it ileagal to download something and not use it?
Post by: Ranger72 on November 13, 2009, 08:30:00 AM
QUOTE(Strumpet @ Nov 13 2009, 02:52 AM)
If you look into communities such as se7ensins then you know what people can do when they have the ability to mod iso's . So yes I would go as far as saying its a legitimate claim that they are protecting xbox live users albeit a very minor number would use them techniques
It could also be said they are protecting legitimate user who pay hard earned money on their games from people who didn't.
Post by: shage on November 13, 2009, 09:12:00 AM
If you mod you get fucked so be it, but one it shouldnt be national or world news, a little girl abducted from a trailer park in the middle of nowhere doesnt even get the much press. Fucked up, but a company who releases shit design of consoles, found guilty of a faulty design, and what do they do cut back even more to save money because ms figures prob 20% will mod it, so 20% will void their warranty, and roughly 50% of them will make it out of the warranty, leaving what 30% to actually fix, and people say fuck that because you call them talk to some 3rd world country who treats you like its your fault that their box fucking broke, and then tell you its going to be weeks to get your console back. Thank god nintendo didnt do this with the 8bit because people wouldve junked the whole idea of gaming, how many of you still have the 8bit, and how many of you could plug it in and turn it on and play it right now if wanted, you come to me in 20 yrs and show me your box do the same fucking thing, rant done lol
Post by: azuziel on November 13, 2009, 09:47:00 AM
QUOTE(shage @ Nov 13 2009, 11:12 AM)
how many of you still have the 8bit, and how many of you could plug it in and turn it on and play it right now if wanted, you come to me in 20 yrs and show me your box do the same fucking thing, rant done lol
Nintendo had flaws too, remember you had to push the game down with a pen?
....my colecovision still works though.
Post by: tactical on November 13, 2009, 02:30:00 PM
1 million 360's is a lot of people so we can create "LIVE-type" place to play our LIVE games.
That would be a good counter-move.
99 percent of games have Live built into them and not that many have system link built into them and their is 10ms ping limitation on 360 for system LINK, so we have to figure out how to make "portable LIVE servers".
Then we never have to worry ever again about being banned and we form our own Mini-servers, by state/country/town and connect to closest one.
Post by: [email protected] on November 13, 2009, 02:51:00 PM
QUOTE(tactical @ Nov 13 2009, 11:30 PM)
I too am hoping now that we have 1 million banned 360's that hacker's worldwide will come up with "portable LIVE servers" where 4-16 of us can connect to play a LIVE game.
I thought there were no dedicated live servers for the games? I was under the impression that a users console was the server; saving MS money and making the players lag out all the time in the process. In this case wouldn't someone just have to find a way of hijacking MS software for linking the consoles and then set up a similar system?
Post by: Cloud Xtrife on November 13, 2009, 05:20:00 PM
QUOTE([email protected] @ Nov 13 2009, 05:51 PM)
I thought there were no dedicated live servers for the games? I was under the impression that a users console was the server; saving MS money and making the players lag out all the time in the process. In this case wouldn't someone just have to find a way of hijacking MS software for linking the consoles and then set up a similar system?
Yeah, all it takes for the xbox to create/join a multiplayer game is internet access, so what does ms really charges you for on live? avatars? what a joke.
I just bought a new PS3 and i have to say the avatars on playstation home put xbox's to shame. Not like it even matters anyway. But also the whole interface/menu looks better and more mature than the xbox dashboard which, with all the green shiny colours look pretty childish IMO.
And on top of that, while MS shows the "AWESOME" news about the upcoming facebook/twiter/blahblah update (so they can finally justify part of what they charge you for the xbox live service), i found out the PS3 has a pretty good web browser. I mean come on, having to pay for xbox live is retarded if you really think about it.
Im really considering just throwing the xbox away and buying my games for the PS3... thing would be the games... i really got into Lost Odyssey and Magna Carta 2 none of which are available for ps3 >>
Post by: seed.helper on November 13, 2009, 05:29:00 PM
QUOTE(CardnalSyn @ Nov 12 2009, 10:07 PM)
"Clearly it's important for us to be able to stamp down on that to protect the 10 million people that are already on Xbox 360 in Europe for instance."
Protect them from WHAT?!?!
FROM a worlwide virus called piracy...
piracy steals boats and may steel your xbox too
Post by: ajennice on November 13, 2009, 05:59:00 PM
On the Xbox forums several people ( and I don't believe them all) say they were wrongly banned, just for the moderators (who are jokes withn themselves) to point out a link that directs them tot he actual terms of use page.. No help, no c"all this person", no "we'll look into it". the only thing you can do is PM a person going bu TATSU24 or something. you leave your console ID and serial number and they re-verify it for you.
I've PM'ed about 80+ people that said they sent them that info. Out of the 80+ no one has had the ban lifted OR even heard back from them.
They don't give 2 rats asses over the people who worked their tails off and decided to buy their console over spending their money on anything else. I hope there is an error inthe bannings and MS has to reimburse the people who were wrongfully banned whatever the cost was to have a new consoel bought - Or if they bought a different console (PS3/WII) reimburse that too. I'd also love to see a lawsuit if this ban is goofed.
I know of 2 people personally that got the axe and 1 has NEVER had a mod done to his... the only thing that could of gotten his banned was playing from a hard drive from a modded console. He's already looked into the legality of it. Hope he gets his day and sues for big bucks.
Post by: Cloud Xtrife on November 13, 2009, 06:18:00 PM
Some even say that game publishers lose so much money cuz of pirates that they are "forced" to rise their prices. In my opinion, if games were cheap enough, i think they'd sell a lot more and piracy wouldnt even be worth it, which would still allow them to make lots of money.
Post by: MyDogAteIt on November 13, 2009, 07:12:00 PM
"Simon Aldous, partner group manager with Microsoft, told PCR that the graphical style of Windows 7 -- which he calls "Vista on steroids" -- was inspired by the look of Apple's Mac OS X. The new Windows operating system launched in October."
AND
Microsoft Store Looks Eerily Similar to Another Store
Wood floors - check
White walls - check
Employees with T-Shirt and black pants - check
Tables in the center with notebooks - check
Employees with lanyards - check
Ad with tons of app icons on a white background - check
They even open the stores the same way. With clapping employees giving high fives.
We half expect to see iPhones being sold.
This is your grand plan Microsoft? To copy Apple in every way possible?
Post by: Hellzone on November 13, 2009, 07:15:00 PM
WE! get the picture... all the news headlines are all the same, i want more info on JTAG and stuff that will make my 360 Experience more better.
Post by: mhouldey on November 14, 2009, 09:17:00 AM
QUOTE(CardnalSyn @ Nov 12 2009, 10:07 PM)
"Clearly it's important for us to be able to stamp down on that to protect the 10 million people that are already on Xbox 360 in Europe for instance."
Protect them from WHAT?!?!
QUOTE(rossmac @ Nov 12 2009, 10:08 PM)
Rising prices of games caused by others not purchasing it?
LMFAO. You mean, 'Rising prices of games caused by rising levels of game studios' greed'.
+1 for your modified statement.
QUOTE(BEVEL @ Nov 12 2009, 10:45 PM)
stop the crying lol
That's what I told your momma last night. *internet five*
QUOTE(turk3y @ Nov 12 2009, 11:04 PM)
no but it does help to increase thoes ever so important holiday sales figures for the board and general propaganda. The only thing it protects is their pocket whilst showing the likes of EA they are trying to fight it.
I agree with this of course, but surely EA must be aware of this, for instance. I.e. if we realise this, I'm sure EA does. Therefore, why would EA be appeased? It doesn't really make sense when you think it through fully. If anyone knows about cut-throat business tactics it is EA. So, they won't be hood-winked by MS, just like we haven't been. Discuss...
QUOTE(bucko @ Nov 13 2009, 12:12 AM)
+1 just hope they have all been banned now, so I can read some decent topics on X-S without it going down with stupid "zomg i'm banned posts"...
You clearly don't like piracy, yet you choose to moderate a forum filled (and if you think it isn't filled you need a serious reality check) with pirates. I think you should consider a career move (assuming moderating this forum is your full-time job, which sadly wouldn't surprise me).
Seriously, people need to stop making out like xbox-scene is a moral place to hang out. LMFAO. Total hypocrisy. In fact, why not rename it 'hypocri-scene'? C'mon, that was good. No?...
Go somewhere else and bring down some other forum instead of preaching support of piracy on behalf of XS or trying to get a rise out of one of the mods. make another account again and lose that as well.
Chancer
Post by: CardnalSyn on November 14, 2009, 09:20:00 AM
QUOTE(Cloud Xtrife @ Nov 13 2009, 06:20 PM)
Yeah, all it takes for the xbox to create/join a multiplayer game is internet access, so what does ms really charges you for on live? avatars? what a joke.
...
woah...wait a sec there...lets not forget the stupid cartoons and useless download-able backgrounds...
Post by: mhouldey on November 14, 2009, 10:05:00 AM
QUOTE(d-range @ Nov 13 2009, 11:07 AM)
They'd have to embed each and every check directly into the dashboard then, without a way to verify CRC's, SS's etc. online, since you wouldn't be going on XBL anymore. They'd have only 2 ways of detecting a modded box left: direct inspection of the firmware, or some kind of indirect check on response times, disc jitter, that kind of stuff. The first seems very unlikely, the drives aren't made to have easy access to the firmware from software, in fact they are made to make it as hard as possible. The second could always be faked by hacked firmware as soon as the actual detection method is known (which it will be eventually). Also it seems to be a little thin to go on, crippling a console just because the disc doesn't look like a pressed one. Last but not least I think they might get into legal troubles crippling a console just by inserting a disc, instead of crippling it because you're using said disc on their online service.
That said, I don't even think Microsoft is out to get all pirates, they just want to wipe the XBL service clean of modders. There's little to gain disabling the <1% of modded consoles that will never, ever be able to go online, right now about 3% of the consoles appears to be modified, but that number will certainly drop when XBL + modded console is effectively made impossible.
Well, they could have set a flag in the console during this latest ban wave to stop the console allowing its dash to be updated. That would be as easy as the HDD install feature flag. Maybe somebody has already managed to successfully update their banned console's dashboard, though.
QUOTE(MyDogAteIt @ Nov 14 2009, 02:12 AM)
Meanwhile MS continues to "copy" Apple's OS, ideas, and business plans!
"Simon Aldous, partner group manager with Microsoft, told PCR that the graphical style of Windows 7 -- which he calls "Vista on steroids" -- was inspired by the look of Apple's Mac OS X. The new Windows operating system launched in October."
AND
Microsoft Store Looks Eerily Similar to Another Store
Wood floors - check
White walls - check
Employees with T-Shirt and black pants - check
Tables in the center with notebooks - check
Employees with lanyards - check
Ad with tons of app icons on a white background - check
They even open the stores the same way. With clapping employees giving high fives.
We half expect to see iPhones being sold.
This is your grand plan Microsoft? To copy Apple in every way possible?
LOL. You think Apple are better than MS? They are both just greedy organisations. Get a grip. Also, if Apple's business plan is better than Microsoft's, it makes sense for MS to copy it. The converse is obviously also true. You think Apple fanboys are better than MS fanboys? Wrong.
Post by: Chancer on November 14, 2009, 10:34:00 AM
QUOTE(Miguell @ Nov 13 2009, 02:46 AM)
Fuck You MS you will never stop PIRATE. WINDOWS have been ALWAYS OURS..
all you have is just xboxlive..
but one day soon we will rule it
XBOX LIVE TO
suck in my finger:
..I..
you really are a dreamer. Another pirate kiddie who thinks it is so cool to buck the system.
You really believeyou or the "we" you talk about will stop this banning and detection and "Rule Xbox Live"
Get a job, pay for your stuff and then come to terms with the fact that MS will blow you apart when and where they see fit.
I really doubt they are worried by childish rantings of the piracy promoters.
Post by: kurrrrt on November 14, 2009, 05:58:00 PM
QUOTE(smn70 @ Nov 13 2009, 12:22 AM)
I dont understand how banning somebody from playing xbox live in anyway stops piracy. Not being able to get online with an xbox doesnt stop people from downloading games and playing them for free. Kinda sounds like lame excuse.
Very true! The reason they ban people is not what the say about piracy because thats bullshit after selling 30 odd million consoles game developers arent gonna run away from the 360. Its about the Christmas rush to boost there sales. Its funny how m$ have the biggest ban wave when a few months earlier the PS3 dropped in price and went slim.
QUOTE(rocky5 @ Nov 13 2009, 02:03 AM)
If C4eva does release a firmware that is the ultimate firmware MS are screwed so are all the game developers they will just turn to PS3, fine example is PSP its so damn easy to hack and pirate games on it that no Devs want to make games on it its dieing out and now that the new PSPGo is fully hacked lmao its definitely going to die so im with MS on this one i don't have any modification to my 360 nor am i going to as i want games to continue to be made for it so i can play online with my m8s and not need to worry in a couple of years when no devs want to make games for it as there is no point no one buys them any more.
and nearly every one out there who has a custom firmware pirates games they don't buy them because they don't need to its human nature to take stuff if they can get it for nothing (greed) only a small few will actually go buy the real game if they love it.
so at the end of the day Piracy does hurt every one in the long run if it does get to the point where firmwares are perfect and ms cant detect anything then prices will go up as any one that makes games will want paying and if no one is buying them then they have no choice to up the price so that they can make some profit or break even.
GO MS GET ALL THE PIRATES OFF OUR SERVERS!!!!
That is totally untrue. Game developers make way too much money already either way if there was an ultimate f/w they wouldnt run away (as a said above). Piracy happens purely because of the greed of companies wanting to make as much profit as possible. £40 a game 40 x 1,400,000 = £56,000,000 on the release of call of duty modern warfare 2 thats how much they made roughly. That alone would probably pay for everything needed to make the game. A recent survey showed that pirates spend more than non-pirates Pirates Spend More Link.
Piracy on small game developers and people who are only trying to get a bit of money now i find that greedy and stupid.
At the end of the day piracy will continue to happen. Theres ways to reduce it though and that is by lowering prices or giving the consumer more for there money.
Im not for piracy. I pay for my games but because there expensive I backed them up and I get banned for not doing anything illegal in my country (UK) I can understand why people do pirate them. Just the way i see it though when m$ and music companies start complaining about piracy like they dont make enough already!
Post by: xrkahn76 on November 14, 2009, 06:08:00 PM
Second, none of this matters now! New firmware, wont unban you, modding a new machine will get you caught again, and all the tears and crying in the world wont stop anyone- pirates or M$ from pushing forward as each sees fit. MAN UP, you modded, you got banned! END OF THAT STORY!
Third, M$ knows about scene, and they know everything we know, AND MORE!
I'm afraid M$ cooked that grenade you just picked up and it will blow up in your face before you even rear back to toss it!
Post by: hyperkine on November 14, 2009, 07:08:00 PM
QUOTE(xrkahn76 @ Nov 14 2009, 07:08 PM)
First off, I love seeing chancer's footprint on some kids face after stupid comments.
Second, none of this matters now! New firmware, wont unban you, modding a new machine will get you caught again, and all the tears and crying in the world wont stop anyone- pirates or M$ from pushing forward as each sees fit. MAN UP, you modded, you got banned! END OF THAT STORY!
Third, M$ knows about scene, and they know everything we know, AND MORE!
I'm afraid M$ cooked that grenade you just picked up and it will blow up in your face before you even rear back to toss it!
Don't care anymore about live/bans as they got rid of halo 3 rocket race in matchmaking. Been well over a year since I've played live multiplayer.
I do care they that fucked with my hardware, that they are so arrogant that they think they have the right to damage other people's hardware. My god, they are so brazen that they put it in their TOS.
I have no way to directly offset the harm they've done, so I've gone the indirect route:
http://i38.tinypic.com/jq2fjm.jpg
QUOTE(Chancer @ Nov 14 2009, 11:34 AM)
you really are a dreamer. Another pirate kiddie who thinks it is so cool to buck the system.
You really believeyou or the "we" you talk about will stop this banning and detection and "Rule Xbox Live"
Get a job, pay for your stuff and then come to terms with the fact that MS will blow you apart when and where they see fit.
I really doubt they are worried by childish rantings of the piracy promoters.
You are so delusional...it's really quite astounding. And hypocritical.
Newsflash modman: this entire site exists because people want to hack and then play pirated games. That's it, that's all. Forcing people to say "backups", pretending to be against piracy, it's all bullshit, and everyone knows it.
Post by: majinsoftware on November 14, 2009, 07:21:00 PM
QUOTE(hyperkine @ Nov 15 2009, 04:08 AM)
Newsflash modman: this entire site exists because people want to hack and then play pirated games. That's it, that's all. Forcing people to say "backups", pretending to be against piracy, it's all bullshit, and everyone knows it.
Coming from some one that joined just today.
You know this site was created for the xbox 1. And back in those days people weren't pirating stuff and the ones that did didnt use this site as it was for Home brew.
Had nothing to do with piracy and even if you were suspected of piracy you got banned.
Wish it was still like that.
Post by: majinsoftware on November 14, 2009, 07:54:00 PM
Post by: axess68 on November 14, 2009, 08:54:00 PM
Well, I've said it before and I'll say it again. In THIS country (US), you SHOULD be allowed to make one copy of a game you already own. The 360 has been known to damage discs (regardless of what the boot-licking fanboys say) and there has even been a class action lawsuit about it. Sure, M$ now SAYS they will replace the discs damaged by their machine, but getting them to actually do what they say is like pulling teeth.
Also, this BS line about "protecting the online community" is just that: BS. If they were so concerned about protecting the users of LIVE and ensuring they have a satisfying online "experience", they would be getting rid of the people who use Lag Switches, people who mod controllers, and people who attack other people verbally online (threatening, etc). I have seen a lot of complaints get issued by friends (and myself) when we were playing CoD4 online and that kind of crap was going on. M$ pretty much did nothing. They want the revenue from the non-pirate customers (belligerent, threatening, cheating = no biggie as long as they're paying).
I'm not trying to single out M$ for being a greedy corporation. Pretty much ALL corporations are greedy and unfair to their customers in one way or another. M$ just excels at it. They are a company that was built on THEFT to begin with: Bill Gate stealing the Windows architecture from Unix, etc. Don't believe me? Do some research and watch "Pirates of Silicon Valley".
In other countries, it is ok to make one backup for your own purposes. In the USA, nope. We're becoming more and more of a fascist, despotic country with each passing day (no matter WHO is President). I'm sure a lot of you who are outside the US would agree with that.
My views are:
Making a backup for your own use offline = yes. Going online with that backup = no (because games can be modified to allow cheating by certain savvy individuals).
Downloading games (Piracy) = no (Games are cheap enough now on the used racks at Gamestop, and other stores, that there really isn't a big excuse to pirate anymore. If I see a new game I want, I buy it. Period. And if you do download stuff, have the sense to not run your mouth about it. )
Post by: xrkahn76 on November 15, 2009, 12:23:00 AM
And lag switches!? Last I checked, live was using ipsec now which would make using a lag switch difficult. Then you have rapid fire blah blah blah!
Get over it, suck it up and move forward!
I can't believe I played a dozen games on xlink and then come back to see how many people are still in here posting their gripe! It was so nice to play without screaming 12 year olds bragging every time they get a kill! Ahhh silence!
Post by: axess68 on November 15, 2009, 12:30:00 AM
QUOTE(fatvince @ Nov 15 2009, 08:10 AM)
LIVE? Went on there for 1 hour.. nothing I can't do on my PC. USELESS.
Yeah, I came to the same conclusion. LIVE is overpriced. You're forced to endure advertisements. And you have to deal with a system that doesn't police cheaters and troublemakers if you want to play Multiplayer. If I'm PAYING for a service, it better be punk-free, or the punks better be dealt with in a swift manner. They get their money from the troublemakers too. So, they won't do a thing about them. No thanks, LIVE. I'll play elsewhere or not at all. And, I can get the same things on PSN (demos, Netflix, DLC, etc.) for FREE.
QUOTE(xrkahn76 @ Nov 15 2009, 08:23 AM)
lmao, laughing is so good for de-stressing! Thank you!
And lag switches!? Last I checked, live was using ipsec now which would make using a lag switch difficult. Then you have rapid fire blah blah blah!
Get over it, suck it up and move forward!
I can't believe I played a dozen games on xlink and then come back to see how many people are still in here posting their gripe! It was so nice to play without screaming 12 year olds bragging every time they get a kill! Ahhh silence!
Wow, there is no shortage of sanctimonious jackasses on here, is there.
What the heck has happened to this site? It's funny how you idiots laugh at people who make sense while you spout nonsense. It's like you're stuck on stupid.
People are still using Lag Switches. Go look on youtube, genius.
ALSO, do a web search on "How to get a host/lock on MW2". There are guides on how to screw with the servers on consoles and use lag switches. Do some research before you open your mouth and insert your shoe in it.
Post by: xrkahn76 on November 15, 2009, 01:55:00 AM
Post by: axess68 on November 15, 2009, 11:26:00 PM
QUOTE(pookiepoo @ Nov 15 2009, 09:08 PM)
So wait xbox live doesn't use dedicated servers... what on earth are microsoft being paid for then?
You're paying to view ads and have the privilege of playing on their amazing system. Don't you feel blessed?
Like I said before, they have NOTHING that PSN doesn't already have.
Even less in fact.
Post by: FreqNasty on November 16, 2009, 11:18:00 AM
QUOTE(death69inc @ Nov 13 2009, 12:55 AM)
2nd non modded console banned
and yet agian they wont tell me why
this is bull halo and elite both banned and they seem to think its ok
no firmware mods no 3rd part hdd
only thing is a rrod fix nad a fan upgrade on my elite and it was banned today @&@)*$&@)$@!*$&@$
bro, you are using harsh language while on Live
Post by: death69inc on November 16, 2009, 07:13:00 PM
QUOTE(dragonranger @ Nov 12 2009, 11:43 PM)
what is the thing that M$ try to protect those Legit XBL gamers from?
HOw does it protect them by banning modded console?
no
have a 5 start rating
no complaints filed etc
no temp bans nothing
but when you tell them you do not have it modded then they go into there spill language and hardware mods can cause it also
yet he has stood there and siad it si a piracy stop out etc yet others are getting banned there is a case where a guy bought a mw2 360 on tuesday and was banned on thursday unmodded
QUOTE(FreqNasty @ Nov 16 2009, 07:18 PM)
bro, you are using harsh language while on Live