Post by: Xbox-Scene on May 15, 2008, 09:27:00 AM
Xbox Live BanHammer Specialist on 'theGAYERgamer' GamerTag Posted by XanTium | May 15 10:51 EST | News Category: Xbox360 |
| From stepto's blog (FYI: MS employee): Quote
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Post by: Mike4 on May 15, 2008, 09:44:00 AM
Though it's not a big deal, I just want to play devil's advocate for a second. I have to disagree with the comment that the name "TheStraighterGamer" would also be banned. I don't think so. That name could imply many things and I wouldn't necessarily assume it had a sexual connotation. That being said, I'm sure someone will want to try it out now and will actually be banned - not because it actually could be offensive, but because Microsoft will have to stand by their word.
Post by: eyric101 on May 15, 2008, 09:55:00 AM
QUOTE(Verity @ May 15 2008, 12:22 PM) 
The guy freely admits that he is gay, and his (now banned) gamertag simply reflected that.
If anything, Microsoft is actively promoting homophobia (and intolerance) by their action of banning that tag.
You completely missed the point in your kneejerk reaction to not be homophobic. It is against the TOS to advertise your sexuality on Xbox Live PERIOD.
Post by: Mike4 on May 15, 2008, 10:04:00 AM
QUOTE(Verity @ May 15 2008, 11:22 AM)
The guy freely admits that he is gay, and his (now banned) gamertag simply reflected that.
If anything, Microsoft is actively promoting homophobia (and intolerance) by their action of banning that tag.
You clearly missed the point. The Terms of Use state "[a member may not] Create a Gamertag or use text in other profile fields that may offend other members. This includes comments that look, sound like, stand for, hint at, abbreviate, or insinuate any of the following: profane words/phrases, sexually explicit language, sexual innuendo, hate speech (including but not limited to racial, ethnic, or religious slurs), illegal drugs/controlled substances, or illegal activities."
If the gamer was black and called himself a racial slur, that would be unacceptable. If the gamer was white and called himself a racial slur, that would be unacceptable. If the gamer was Asian and called himself a racial slur, that would be unacceptable. You see where I'm going with this? According to the Terms of Use, it doesn't matter if you may not be offended by it or if you are exactly what it is it sounds like you're offending. If it breaks the Terms of Use that you agreed to when you signed up, there are consequences. That's life. There are plenty of other areas in life where he may use terms like that (and far worse if he wants) and that would be perfectly acceptable. XBOX Live is not one of them. End of story.
Post by: Mike4 on May 15, 2008, 10:08:00 AM
QUOTE(Mitch111788 @ May 15 2008, 11:39 AM)
i can see this being offensive if he wasnt gay and was trying to make fun of gays but is there any proof that he wasnt actually gay?
He was gay. Since that has no relevance, you clearly missed the point too.
Post by: Verity on May 15, 2008, 10:26:00 AM
QUOTE(Mike4 @ May 15 2008, 06:40 AM)
You clearly missed the point.
Well, I see the mindless dogpiling has begun. I'm afraid you've missed the point. I'm just continually amazed at the sheer number of Microsoft sychphants, especially the ones who claim to hate defending them.
QUOTE
If the gamer was black and called himself a racial slur, that would be unacceptable. If the gamer was white and called himself a racial slur, that would be unacceptable. If the gamer was Asian and called himself a racial slur, that would be unacceptable.
I fail to see where 'gay' is a slur, especially if the guy happens to be gay. Anything can be considered 'offensive' to somebody out there.
QUOTE
According to the Terms of Use...blah blah blah
Ah, but don't you see... after the carefully couched response about comparing and contrasting each complaint to their ToS, all Microsoft really did here was tacitly admit that any complaint against a gamertag will simply be construed as 'objectionable' to some minor subset of people. I find it objectionable that so many people find so many things 'objectionable'.
Now I'm going to quit typing so I can register the tag TheSnailGamer, at least until some Snail's Rights activist complain and get me banned.
Post by: AcidPenguiN on May 15, 2008, 10:32:00 AM
whatever they're currently doing to curb racism and bigotry isn't working, and they need to find a way that does.
I propose the ability to record a sample of any gamertag's in-game voice chat and have the ability to attach that to a filed complaint.
Post by: echto on May 15, 2008, 10:47:00 AM
Is Microsoft homophobic or just a bunch of perverts?
Microsoft is messed up in the head to automatically think of sex when looking at a word. What about definitions such as 'Happy'. I don't see any reference to sex in the webster's dictionary. See the link.
http://dictionary.re....com/browse/gay
I would be surprised if this did not get blown way out of proportion in the press.
Post by: evans05 on May 15, 2008, 10:58:00 AM
Post by: jimjom on May 15, 2008, 11:18:00 AM
Post by: nachomans on May 15, 2008, 11:31:00 AM
If you need to express yourself, I think xbox live is not the place to go.
Nobody cares about your sexual preferences, at least in live.
And yes, there are a lot of people that when read gamertag like this one, starts to make stupid commentary in the rooms.
Does it make you feel better to have an "anthrax free", "IlikeSh*t" gamertag? or something like that? I dont understand people..
Post by: Johnwinger on May 15, 2008, 11:49:00 AM
QUOTE(eyric101 @ May 15 2008, 12:31 PM)
You completely missed the point in your kneejerk reaction to not be homophobic. It is against the TOS to advertise your sexuality on Xbox Live PERIOD.
Why even bother replying to that guy. He's obviously trolling.
M$ did the appropriate thing.
Post by: HotKnife420 on May 15, 2008, 11:54:00 AM
QUOTE(biscoito @ May 15 2008, 06:57 PM)
how about Mike Hunt, would it be banned too ?
<As Ogglethorp> You get it? Michael Hunt! HAhahahaha!
Post by: Heet on May 15, 2008, 12:01:00 PM
Post by: stunna on May 15, 2008, 12:19:00 PM
Post by: DMAddict on May 15, 2008, 12:54:00 PM
Post by: Gerjan on May 15, 2008, 01:09:00 PM
Post by: IgotGAME_IGN on May 15, 2008, 01:37:00 PM
Don't choose CONTROVERSIAL gamertags and you won't have this problem
Whether you are gay or jewish or fat or an alien or whatever....if you don't want the chance of your gamertag being banned....don't choose something stupid.
Post by: damarsman on May 15, 2008, 02:07:00 PM
They are the ones promoting homophobia. If this guy is openly gay or even claims to be then they are just on a power trip. They forget 360 is a console for adults who can take a joke. So what if a little kid sees it. Live even says they can't control what happens online completely. Taking away peoples freedoms....
Post by: newfie4ever on May 15, 2008, 02:14:00 PM
Sry having a bad day!!
Post by: Goldenbear on May 15, 2008, 02:37:00 PM
QUOTE(IgotGAME_IGN @ May 15 2008, 01:13 PM)
I have a suggestion:
Don't choose CONTROVERSIAL gamertags and you won't have this problem
Whether you are gay or jewish or fat or an alien or whatever....if you don't want the chance of your gamertag being banned....don't choose something stupid.
So what about "StraightShooter"?
Accroding to the explanation, this could be construed as sexual and banned.
Not saying MS did the wrong thing in this case. I'm just pointing out that one-size-fits-all censorship policies just don't work for all situations.
Post by: draken333 on May 15, 2008, 04:47:00 PM
So if my name "TheButLoverGamer" was created will they ban it because the word but can be interpreted as butt? Or will it hold by what my name really means, everything but loving gamer. Sorta like how we call ugly women these days, a ButHerFace. Everything is hot but her face.
Post by: d-x-j on May 15, 2008, 04:59:00 PM
the word GAY means "Happy"
we only use it in context to mean homosexual.
so to me... a GAYERGAMER is a more happy one, not someone trying to advertise their sexual prefrence.
this may end up becoming a big topic, ill bet we can hear about it on the news in the next week or so.
Post by: dmb062082 on May 15, 2008, 05:23:00 PM
Post by: Havok on May 15, 2008, 05:30:00 PM
"Twinkerbell"
He would advertise and never be caught by M.S.
Post by: Foe-hammer on May 15, 2008, 07:02:00 PM
Post by: HotKnife420 on May 15, 2008, 07:07:00 PM
QUOTE(Gerjan @ May 15 2008, 08:45 PM)
But gay means happy to.. So it could mean theHAPPIErgamer...
While it may still stand as a dictionary definition, who actively uses it like that? You'd be better off defending a name like 'Fag Smoker', as many people in GB still refer to cigarettes as 'fags' (Australia does too, I believe).
I recall in my 11th grade English reading, there was a book where a character says "Niggard"; I consulted my teacher to determine if the origin was racial or not, and found that it was making reference to a miser. However, as nobody in today's society (or a few years ago when I was still in that class, for that matter), you can understand how easily I was ready to mis-interpret the context of the word.
With other cultures, it might be more likely that someone could interpret "gay" as "happy", but Microsoft is a US based and originated company. I believe that "gay" is still used in other countries as "happy" anyways, but it falls under the curse of the idiom (for those who don't know, an idiom is a word or phrase that has an understood colloquial meaning, but would entirely lose that meaning in a direct translation. e.g. "Burning the midnight oil" is a common phrase to define working late, but the direct definition would make no sense, as oil doesn't have a sense of time... Ignite the midnight petroleum...).
Post by: echto on May 15, 2008, 08:13:00 PM
QUOTE(UHYVE @ May 15 2008, 06:45 PM)
It's not a sexual innuendo though. I kind of agree with Microsoft, if they are actually willing to ban a gamertag like "TheHeterosexualGamer". But their ToS really needs some looking at. Legally speaking, "TheGayerGamer" is not an innuendo, it is just a statement with no hidden connotations (i.e. Not an innuendo). You would think that the lawyers at Microsoft would have a grasp at the English language, but contrary to Microsoft's PR statement about this incident, there is no rule about having a gamertag like the one in question (I can't think of any rule that this gamertag is breaking, seriously, look up the word innuendo). I think Microsoft need to state in their ToS that no gamertag is allowed of any sexual nature, but as it is, this rule isn't currently in place, Microsoft have no grounds to ban "TheGayerGamer".
PS Typing "define: Innuendo" into google:
"A hint or indirect suggestion, often with a sinister connatation."
So, no, Microsoft are in the wrong here. I agree with the concept of no sexual content on Xbox Live, but they actually need to state it in their ToS if they are going to start banning people.
I agree.
Post by: Foe-hammer on May 15, 2008, 11:20:00 PM
QUOTE(jimmysbluecat @ May 15 2008, 10:53 PM)
Crazy how some people feel they need to stand up for their group when it gets attacked/limited socially/and killed solely based off of group membership... Its a good thing black people never stood up for their rights by making a scene until people started paying attention and doing what is right...
QUOTE(Foe-hammer @ May 15 2008, 07:38 PM)
I don't care what group someone is affiliated with. There's no need to draw attention to yourself on xbl for reasons as such.
Throwing in the racial card... how predictable.
This is xbl, not some civil rights protest, ffs. Step down from the soapbox.
Post by: biscoito on May 16, 2008, 12:08:00 AM
Post by: iwannadie on May 16, 2008, 02:35:00 AM
Post by: Trevante on May 16, 2008, 10:54:00 AM
QUOTE
Ugh ok homophobe. Ugh did your father or mother teach you to be straight? When did this talk occur? Oh ya, that's what I thought. Your FEAR of somebody telling your son what "gay" speaks volumes about your homophobia.
What dmb said is not homophobic at all. It's a preference. Saying "I don't want my children to learn about homosexuality through XBL, he can learn when he's older" is different from saying "I don't want my children to learn about homosexuality at all. I want to completely hide and shelter him from all aspects of homosexuality for the rest of his life", which is not what he said at all.
He simply does not feel that his son is old enough to start learning about homosexuality, especially on XBL. How is that homophobic? There are people who don't want their children to read the bible, go to church or pray to god. They don't discriminate against Christians or those that do read the Bible, they just prefer that they and their Children do not participate in the Christian religion. Does that make them Anti-Christians? Does that mean that they have an irrational fear/hate (as is a phobia) of Christians? No, it simply means that their preferences are to not participate in Christian religion. Just because DMB said he doesn't want his 10 year old learning about homosexuality at 10, doesn't mean he's being homophobic.
In the same way, it's kinda like how your parents don't tell you (at least they shouldn't) about the Birds and the Bees until they feel you're old enough. Would you want someone explaining to a 10 year old how to have sex and get a girl pregnant on XBL? Would you want someone explaining to a 10 year old how gay men have sex and why they can't have babies? XBL is not really the place to learn life lessons, especially from someone you really don't know at all....
QUOTE
Facts: Heterosexuality is oftens backed up with an unatural sense of masculinity. Thus, why men are so violent. While the "gaygamer" gets scapegoated.
Why don't you start thinking for yourself, bigot.
Where did you get the masculinity bit from? Completely irrelevant. Which men are violent? All men are violent? Does that include the homosexual men? Are you saying homosexual men can't be masculine too?
It sounds to be like you're thinking at all, and the name calling doesn't help your weak argument much either.
QUOTE
I wonder what other aspects of humanity you shelter from your children... but I am sure they are allowed to play games rated M with head tearing off action, hell if they were playing games designed for kids their own age I doubt they would ever run into someone who has discovered their sexuality, not too many sexually aware viva pinata players.
Very weak argument. How do you have any idea what kind of games his kids are allowed to play? Just because most of the games you know are M-rated head chopping shooters, doesn't mean his kid doesn't play other non-violent games. Your ignorance is further demonstrated by your ability to only list Viva Pinata as a game designed for kids.
http://www.target.com/Xbox-360-E-Rated-Vid...p;node=16075351
There's quite a few E-rated games there that both little kids, teenagers, and grown adults could be playing online (namely the sports games). Burnout Paradise too. Why would 10 year old DMB junior want to learn about men holding hands after a round of NBA Live 08?
QUOTE
So, anyone with black,white,red,yellow or any other color descriptive word in their GT has to be banned too right? Those words could be used to describe a race, which is against the TOS?
It depends on the full gamertag. The whole situation here is how a word is interpreted. In America, the word Gay can be interpreted to mean happy, homosexual, or stupid (like when people say "that's gay", but aren't really talking about something homosexual). Most people interpret gay as meaning homosexual.
Black,white, red, yellow, or any other color word can only describe a race with other describing words attached to it.
If your gamertag is YellowAndBlackMustangGT, no one's going to think of your race, they're going to think of your car.
If your gamertag is BlackGamer808, your gamertag will get banned. If somehow it doesn't get banned, you'd certainly get flamed to hell anyways.
QUOTE
Why does being gay equate sex? This is a crazy notion. The gamertag clearly refers to the love of another man. How dare Microsoft ban this while hatred runs ramped in more gamertags than not.
That statement is very contradictory and very ridiculous.
There is no question that the gamer involved in this situation wanted the "gayer" in his name to represent his sexual orientation. Why are people still trying to say that there's a different meaning to the word gay? If that's how the guy wanted it to be used, then that's how it should be looked at.
QUOTE
I fail to see where 'gay' is a slur, especially if the guy happens to be gay. Anything can be considered 'offensive' to somebody out there.
Very easy.
Westward Elementary school in Middleton, Virginia (I just made that up, I don't think it exists)
Lunchtime. The 3rd grade kids are at the playground. Bully Tim gathers his friends and says, let's all pick on Little Johnny.
A minute later, Little Johnny is surrounded by Bully Tim and his henchmen being called "gay", "queer", "faggot", and other similar names.
The school principal comes to the playground, breaks up the circle and takes Bully Tim and all his friends to his office.
He asks Bully Tim and his friends where they learned such foul language at such a young age.
One by one, they all eventually reveal that they learned those names by hearing other people say them to a certain player (By the gamertag of "theGAYERgamer") after an intense, neck-to-neck race in Burnout Paradise.
But don't worry, Little Johnny wasn't permanently hurt by the situation. In fact, he's now a very sucessful multi-platinum record producer. Little Johnny all grown up
and so on and so on. Excuse the lame story, but you get the point. You might not find it offensive, but others will. Little kids aren't ready to handle things like homosexuality, especially on XBL...
This post has been edited by Trevante: May 16 2008, 06:01 PM
Post by: echto on May 16, 2008, 02:39:00 PM
QUOTE(dmb062082 @ May 15 2008, 04:59 PM)
I wouldnt want my 10 year old playing with this guy or talking to him, no thanks. Not with a tag like that. Little kids do not need to be opened up to the world of gay men through video games. Let them find out when they get older, or learn more from someone else, like his/her mother or father, not the Gay gamer.
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My site... a little bit of emulation mixed with some world news and puppy blood. Enjoy.
There must be nothing wrong with little kids and puppy blood. That is unless your Vick...
Post by: Foe-hammer on May 17, 2008, 05:46:00 AM
QUOTE(jimmysbluecat @ May 16 2008, 01:51 PM)
Than maybe you should call the press and have an official statement where you explain what areas are designated for protest.... Hey that sounds a lot like free speech zones... I am just throwing this out there but are you a W fan¿
Still on the soapbox, i see...
If by "W fan" you mean Wyoming Cowboys, then yes. But what does that have to do with anything? Or are you going to use some other fallacy statement (you have all ready used Red Herring and Slipper Slope) to back up your argument? You are very predictable.
Post by: Vegita on May 18, 2008, 07:41:00 PM
QUOTE(UHYVE @ May 16 2008, 02:45 AM)
It's not a sexual innuendo though. I kind of agree with Microsoft, if they are actually willing to ban a gamertag like "TheHeterosexualGamer". But their ToS really needs some looking at. Legally speaking, "TheGayerGamer" is not an innuendo, it is just a statement with no hidden connotations (i.e. Not an innuendo). You would think that the lawyers at Microsoft would have a grasp at the English language, but contrary to Microsoft's PR statement about this incident, there is no rule about having a gamertag like the one in question (I can't think of any rule that this gamertag is breaking, seriously, look up the word innuendo). I think Microsoft need to state in their ToS that no gamertag is allowed of any sexual nature, but as it is, this rule isn't currently in place, Microsoft have no grounds to ban "TheGayerGamer".
PS Typing "define: Innuendo" into google:
"A hint or indirect suggestion, often with a sinister connatation."
So, no, Microsoft are in the wrong here. I agree with the concept of no sexual content on Xbox Live, but they actually need to state it in their ToS if they are going to start banning people.
+1 you nailed it exactly. It is NOT innuendo as their TOS. Nothing was violated by the name - but that's besides the point. As someone else mentioned just go into the gameplay on live and you'll hear far worse things than "GAYER".
Post by: HotKnife420 on May 19, 2008, 11:40:00 AM
QUOTE(UHYVE @ May 16 2008, 02:45 AM)
It's not a sexual innuendo though.
PS Typing "define: Innuendo" into google:
"A hint or indirect suggestion, often with a sinister connatation."
So, no, Microsoft are in the wrong here. I agree with the concept of no sexual content on Xbox Live, but they actually need to state it in their ToS if they are going to start banning people.
How is gay in "TheGayerGamer" not a hint or indirect suggestion of his sexuality, especially when he's already admitted the "Gayer" was a reference to his own sexuality. Saying he's the "Gayer" gamer could mean he's happier, as a double meaning, but the "hint or indirect suggestion" is still there.
Post by: JORT on May 27, 2008, 01:40:00 PM
QUOTE(Trevante @ May 16 2008, 05:54 PM)
Just because DMB said he doesn't want his 10 year old learning about homosexuality at 10, doesn't mean he's being homophobic.
Yes it does. Point being sex is not taught its learned. And it's rediculous to think that gay people can't control themselves into "tricking" or "teaching" little boys on xbox live. There is no evidence to suggest that homosexuals spread their views. I'd argue that ANY sexual preference or orientation should never be taught on xbox live, however the heterosexual lifestyle is taught everyday, but how come nobody sees the danger in this? The danger being that more heterosexuals are pedophilics. Oh, and the fact that nobody can live up to the "categorical heterosexual."
QUOTE(Trevante @ May 16 2008, 05:54 PM)
Where did you get the masculinity bit from? Completely irrelevant. Which men are violent? All men are violent? Does that include the homosexual men? Are you saying homosexual men can't be masculine too?
No its not. You must define heterosexuality and homosexuality in order for it to violate the TOS. How is homosexuality and heterosexuality sexually explicit? Saying he is a gay gamer does not say that he likes to suck some other guys balls. Maybe he is asexual, but loves men. Simply put, How can you define gay through a sexual act? Heterosexuality is not defined by the sexual act, but rather gender roles.
I retract my previous statement on personal attacks and I apologize if I offended anybody.