Post by: Xbox-Scene on April 15, 2007, 11:13:00 AM
Guitar Hero II or it's new patch possibly bricking 360's Posted by HSDEMONZ | April 15 12:37 EST | News Category: Xbox360 |
| Saw this on the XBOX.com forums this morning, over 100 posts from gamers complaining that GHII, or it's new patch has wrecked havoc on thier consoles, bricking some, while making other unstable. Quote
Keep in mind, that 360's, like any hardware will not last forever. Every time MS releases a dash update, we see some 360's "die" and everyone blames the update. Every time we see a particular game get an update or new maps etc, we see more consoles "die" and everyone blames the new updates. I don't know anyone who has had a problem with their GHII, or recent issues with their 360 after having started playing GHII. So, if you fear the Game or the update is the "culprit" of these 360 death's consider waiting for more info to get posted. - HSD News-Source: XBOX.com forums |
Post by: Darkjasper on April 15, 2007, 10:09:00 AM
Not going to be picking this game up for a while.
Post by: sicknasty413 on April 15, 2007, 10:17:00 AM
I have guitar 95065.
Updated with the patch last night.
Beat 10 songs on hard and 1 song on expert. Go me!
Post by: PuckX on April 15, 2007, 10:20:00 AM
Come on do you seriously believe that any 360 has been out long enough to start dying due to old age of hardware! I almost spit out my breakfast after reading that statement.
I will agree however, that people are too quick to blame the updates, and we never hear the full story on how their 360 was treated, but dude seriously the 360 needs to be out a couple more years before they fall under the hardware will not last forever statement.
As far as the GHII issues is concerned, I doubt an update to the game software is bricking the systems, however, it is a curious series of events that I will be watching closely.
Post by: ILLusions0fGrander on April 15, 2007, 10:29:00 AM
Post by: simond10 on April 15, 2007, 11:09:00 AM
QUOTE(simond10 @ Apr 15 2007, 05:28 PM) 
This has just happened to me on PGR3, ive played this game for HOURS on end before.
I loaded it up as usual, it logged me out of xbox live for no reason, i dropped back to the dashboard and tested my connection.. alls fine so i logged back in.
Loaded pgr3 again, and it logged me out again! then crashed!
I rebooted my system and BAM! 3 red lights!
Switched the comsole off, disconnected all the cables and left it for about half an hour.
Tried to switch the console on again, started to boot but crashed on the xbox logo.
Switched the xbox off and tried again 10 minutes later, booted up fine and tried pgr3 again, loaded a goham heros race and crashed almost immidiatley after starting the race. Black Screen! GAH!
Restarted the console and loaded up F.E.A.R instead seemed to be working fine, played for about 30 mins then ejected the disc, instead of going back to the dashboard i was greeted with the black scrren again. WTF?!
Crap, just froze playing the Monster Madness demo, got 3 red lights on restart, waited a few mins and restarted now all seems fine on the dashboard at the moment.
Also did'nt there used to be an 'edit post' button on these forums?
Post by: openxdkman on April 15, 2007, 11:13:00 AM
Too bad official dashboard doesn't do that...
Without temperature stats the -always- premature death of this console will always remain a mystery...
Post by: BRD on April 15, 2007, 11:15:00 AM
Post by: HSDEMONZ on April 15, 2007, 11:38:00 AM
QUOTE(PuckX @ Apr 15 2007, 10:27 AM)
Come on do you seriously believe that any 360 has been out long enough to start dying due to old age of hardware! I almost spit out my breakfast after reading that statement.
I stand by my comment. I fully believe that the warranty period is as long as we can expect hardware these days to last. the days of buying a piece of electronics and watching it last 10 years is over. I remember buying my original VHS and BETA machines, and watched them work long and hard under shitty conditions for 5, 10, and more years.
these days.. brand name electonics just aren't doing that anymore. People are far more likely to buy hardware today, and replace it in 2 year due to failure or wanting the latest greatest. Manufacturers no longer strive to make quality components that stand the test of time.
Especially stuff branded with the MS or Xbox logo. that's not to say we shouldn't want, or expect our stuff to last longer. I do. but, given what we've seen, and the half assed qc and manufacturing we're seeing, I don't expect 360's (or other game consoles for that matter) to last 3 or more years anymore. This stuff simply isn't built to last. Whether that is to planned obsolescence or to just shotty hardware and manufacturing.. I do not know.
This is by no means limited to the MS/Xbox camp. We all have stories of friends who owned, 2, 3 or more PS2's due to dying lasers, etc.
It's just no longer really reasonable to expect that the hardware we buy, will last much longer than the warranty anymore. It's a shame those extended warranties stores try to sell us sometimes aren't worth the paper they are written on, as we sure can use those extra years.
To tell the truth.. my LIVE 360 unit.. which is my second.. (first one died, sure enough.. just as the original warranty ended) I doubt will last long into 2008. If it does, I'll actually consider myself fortunate. I don't abuse the hardware, and in fact maintain and keep my hardware in better conditions and environments than most that surf these boards. It doesn't change the fact I have little faith in any modern day 360, PS3 surviving much past it's first or second birthday.
QUOTE(simond10 @ Apr 15 2007, 11:16 AM)
Also did'nt there used to be an 'edit post' button on these forums?
You have 10-15 minutes from the time you submit a post to go back and edit it. After that, it's committed. Necessary evil due to user abuse on this site.
QUOTE(blankaz @ Apr 15 2007, 11:40 AM)
Hey guys why does it seems to me that latly many guys get 0102 errors(3 RED LIGHTS/3RLD)??
or maybe it always been this way ?
i had this error too about a week ago but seems like i fixed it at last even though i thought it was impossible
Sorry to hear that, but I doubt your "fix" will last long. If the box is in warranty, get it replaced asap. 1-800-4-my-xbox
Post by: jamie123 on April 15, 2007, 11:41:00 AM
Post by: bucko on April 15, 2007, 11:50:00 AM
Post by: MeanMF on April 15, 2007, 11:55:00 AM
Post by: petegas on April 15, 2007, 12:09:00 PM
Post by: Tony42077 on April 15, 2007, 12:12:00 PM
QUOTE(HSDEMONZ @ Apr 15 2007, 06:45 PM)
these days.. brand name electonics just aren't doing that anymore. People are far more likely to buy hardware today, and replace it in 2 year due to failure or wanting the latest greatest. Manufacturers no longer strive to make quality components that stand the test of time.
Especially stuff branded with the MS or Xbox logo. that's not to say we shouldn't want, or expect our stuff to last longer. I do. but, given what we've seen, and the half assed qc and manufacturing we're seeing, I don't expect 360's (or other game consoles for that matter) to last 3 or more years anymore. This stuff simply isn't built to last. Whether that is to planned obsolescence or to just shotty hardware and manufacturing.. I do not know.
That sounds like the same montra that Chrysler used back in the 80s. "People want a new car every 5 years, so we'll make the cars last 5 years." One thing that I do know, is that 360s don't last nearly as long as the original Xbox. I've modded over 80 Xbox1s and all but 3 (ver1.0 PS problems) of them are still running fine (aside from a DVD drive problem here and there). Of the 15 Xbox360s that I have I have first-hand knowledge of, 4 of them had to be sent back for the 3 rings of death. The parts that they use are either of less quality, or the nature of the part allows for a higher failure rate.
I have no doubt that most of people's problems are from heat issues. All of my friends that stand their 360s up vertically have yet to have any problems, while all of the '3rod' 360s sat horizontally.
Hopefully the new smaller CPUs will cut down on the number of hardware failure rates, because the current rate is unacceptable. 3-5% my ass. If every 360 out there was played for an average of 2 hours a day, we would be seeing numbers closer to 15-20%. Overall, I would have to say that MS has made more lemons with the 360 than any other hardware they've produced.
With all of that being said, you shouldn't have to baby a game system to keep it running longer than a year.
Post by: Tony42077 on April 15, 2007, 12:16:00 PM
QUOTE(bucko @ Apr 15 2007, 06:57 PM)
Well here in the UK the weather is getting pretty hot. Maybe that has something to do with it? I think these people are looking to blame someone just to get some money by suing or something.
No, there just mad because their 360 is a flawed piece of shit. When your's craps out after the year warranty (if it already hasn't) you can blame the game that is in the DVD drive.
Post by: bennyblanco420 on April 15, 2007, 12:34:00 PM
Post by: AYB Faithless on April 15, 2007, 01:05:00 PM
Post by: ILLusions0fGrander on April 15, 2007, 01:09:00 PM
Post by: twistedsymphony on April 15, 2007, 01:23:00 PM
I was actually in the middle of a marathon session today when I saw this news post and had a good chuckle.
---------------------
FWIW I probably take better care of my console then most people... I'm not talking about light useage, it gets played non-stop all the time.
the ambient temp of the room never goes above 66F (based on the layout where the 360 sits is often cooler then that). the console and the PSU are on separate shelves to keep their heat from interfering with each other and both have 6+ inches of free flowing air on 5 of their 6 sides.
Since the console was setup on launch day it had only ever been moved once when I re-wired my game room. Based on the fact that the game room is in a basement the floor is concrete and the stand is metal and glass the console probably doesn't even get vibrations from people walking around the room or other things.
Why am I telling you all this? Because it shows that things like updates and games don't do jack to damage your console, mine is complete proof of that. It's played more then 2 3rds of the Xbox 360 catalog and the only time is has never given me any grief.
I'm not saying that everyone should have to treat their console like a precious jewel just the fact that when all things are handled properly games will not kill your console.
--------------------------
When you power up your console it stresses it more then during normal powered on use.... the stress on most electronics during the boot process is usually much higher then it is even after running for hours and crunching it's capacity's worth of numbers.
Because of this it's not surprising that consoles almost always fail when powering up and not in the middle of a game. Also a reboot after hours of play is more harsh on the console then a cold boot after sitting for hours. When considering this is not at all surprising that consoles which are close to dying choose to finally kick the bucket after an update. the boot process at that point is the most stressful. Once a console is near dead due to heat stress or other abuse it only takes one really stressful reboot to put the final nail in the coffin
... at least that's my hypothesis.
Even still, modern electronics are built for an average lifespan of 18 months to 2 years... just because lots last beyond that point doesn't mean they're designed to do so, nor do companies go out of their way to intentionally shorten the lifespan of a console.
Post by: gli7ch on April 15, 2007, 01:54:00 PM
*Edit* With my new 360, i have it sitting vertically inside of my mini-fridge, keeping it at a nice cool 40 degress farenheit
Post by: dirtlegdan on April 15, 2007, 03:20:00 PM
QUOTE(gli7ch @ Apr 15 2007, 03:01 PM)
Yup, I highly doubt it is GHII or the patch, or any game/patch for that matter, oh wait, i forgot about that patch that kills everyone's 360 who has even thought about owning a PS3....yea that one happened to me...
*Edit* With my new 360, i have it sitting vertically inside of my mini-fridge, keeping it at a nice cool 40 degress farenheit
Just wait for that condensation!
Post by: Roam on April 15, 2007, 03:21:00 PM
Post by: epsilon72 on April 15, 2007, 03:35:00 PM
QUOTE(HSDEMONZ @ Apr 15 2007, 10:45 AM)
I stand by my comment. I fully believe that the warranty period is as long as we can expect hardware these days to last. the days of buying a piece of electronics and watching it last 10 years is over. I remember buying my original VHS and BETA machines, and watched them work long and hard under shitty conditions for 5, 10, and more years.
these days.. brand name electonics just aren't doing that anymore. People are far more likely to buy hardware today, and replace it in 2 year due to failure or wanting the latest greatest. Manufacturers no longer strive to make quality components that stand the test of time.
Sad but true. My SNES still runs fine after 15 years. I definitely don't expect my PS3 to last that long.
Maybe I should hold off a little bit longer before buying a 360...or perhaps the problems will never be fully resolved and I should just get one anyway...I dunno.....
I wonder what problems the Elite will have....
Post by: SpiderX1016 on April 15, 2007, 03:56:00 PM
QUOTE(gli7ch @ Apr 15 2007, 01:01 PM)
Yup, I highly doubt it is GHII or the patch, or any game/patch for that matter, oh wait, i forgot about that patch that kills everyone's 360 who has even thought about owning a PS3....yea that one happened to me...
*Edit* With my new 360, i have it sitting vertically inside of my mini-fridge, keeping it at a nice cool 40 degress farenheit
Are you really doing that? Because that isn't good for the 360.
Post by: BRD on April 15, 2007, 04:30:00 PM
The real bitchcore problem with any warranty on this system is the damn downloaded content. If you get a new 360, your downloaded stuff on the HDD is usable only if you are online. You really get fucked over because MS's half-assed hack way of fixing the problem of replacing your DLC after a warranty can take 3 months, as it did for me (I don't see why it should take 3 months to generate codes for MS points, unacceptable).
Post by: TheIrishLad on April 15, 2007, 04:43:00 PM
QUOTE(gli7ch @ Apr 15 2007, 02:01 PM)
Yup, I highly doubt it is GHII or the patch, or any game/patch for that matter, oh wait, i forgot about that patch that kills everyone's 360 who has even thought about owning a PS3....yea that one happened to me...
*Edit* With my new 360, i have it sitting vertically inside of my mini-fridge, keeping it at a nice cool 40 degress farenheit
If your serious I'd say your Xbox 360 is on a fast road to death by condensation.
Post by: gli7ch on April 15, 2007, 05:08:00 PM
Post by: LostIt on April 15, 2007, 05:08:00 PM
Things I've returned this year...
-Xbox 360 - just under 1 Month old, 2 or 3 days after I installed PGR 3 with the Wireless Racing Wheel (Install Drivers)
-Wireless PS2 Guitar Hero Controller - The yellow button never worked.
-Pelican XBox (orig) controller - Right analog stick didn't work.
-PSP - Screen had a scratch on the inside of the screen (backside)
It's amazing how much time I have to waste standing in line at the local Best Buy. It feels like I spend more time at customer service than most of the employees. You would think I'm insulting the customer service people by returning defective hardware by the way they act.
Just wait.... in the near future I can see retailers stamping the bottom of every receipt with the word
GOTCHYA!
Sorry folks, the days of Quality Merchandise are Gone! (But in theory the merchandise works great! Just don't ask anyone to manufacture it correctly.)
Edited (Added)
Could the drivers be what is causing the problems? I installed the Wireless Racing Wheel drivers and it was soon after my XBox had an identity complex... It kept telling me to "Please place this disc in an XBox 360 console to play it" no matter what 360 game I inserted (even Gears of War which was brand new at the time.) Funny eh? Maybe some drivers are causing problems with specific hardware o nthe 360... How many different versions of the 360 are there?
Post by: LostIt on April 15, 2007, 05:31:00 PM
Also, there is no way I would have forked over the $450 for the premium bundle, $60 a game (which more than likely won't be compatible with the next gen) if I thought it was only going to last 2 or less years. That is seriously on the low end of quality even for todays manufacturing standards. Come on, I've got a Commodore 64 that still works!
Post by: gli7ch on April 15, 2007, 05:49:00 PM
QUOTE(LostIt @ Apr 15 2007, 07:38 PM)
Come on, I've got a Commodore 64 that still works!
How much electricity does it take to run a Commodore 64, compare that to the 360...
Post by: LostIt on April 15, 2007, 06:00:00 PM
Post by: m00nstone on April 15, 2007, 06:36:00 PM
Additionally, I'm concerned with the idea that the 360 cannot be downgraded to earlier firmware in order to deal with problems. I'm sure this level of security is costing microsoft, and obviously 360 buyers, big time.
And ironically, the only thing this has accomplished is preventing people from running homebrew.
I guarantee you MS is regretting the efuse, while firmware modders happily play backups.
So... until I'm hearing better stability reports from the 360 scene, I'll continue to enjoy my 2 xboxs (one modded, one not), and my Wii.
Post by: luther349 on April 15, 2007, 07:12:00 PM
the guy says it was a launch system and we all knoe alot of those where indded defectiv i relly dought any patch or game did it it just happond to fail at that time. most say we get only a small percent of xbox gamers but relly pretty mutch any xbox gamer i ever talked to on live or whatever knoe abought xs im pretty shure we got more then 50% of them looking at this site.
and yes i pay 400$ for anything i expect it to last for years hell i payed 50 bucks for my dreamcast and it still works fine other then needing some new av ables couse my tv doesent like using rca. my snes indded did die on me but it was after the n64 came out so i traded my huge stack of games in and got a launch n64 for like 50 bucks lol and my n64 still works. my ps1 did die my ps2 did die. the point is i guess the 360 would not be the first time a system failed on me it does happon but in those days there not many large gaming sites like xs to vent on.
Post by: grim_d on April 15, 2007, 07:37:00 PM
Post by: L337CH337 on April 15, 2007, 08:49:00 PM
Post by: feflicker on April 15, 2007, 10:22:00 PM
That being said, some lucky bastard is going to post "i've had mine since launch, no problems, and so have my buddies". However, that doesn't change the fact that many people have had experiences like mine. I believe it to be FACT that the 360 has some issues with the CPU/GPU/MOBO dying, especially on the launch consoles...
Post by: HSDEMONZ on April 15, 2007, 10:30:00 PM
QUOTE(Roam @ Apr 15 2007, 03:28 PM)
They not only need a CPU temp monitor, they also should have something that monitors what kind of load the CPU's are under. I know with my computer sometimes a background program will freeze and the CPU will be under 100% load until I kill the process. How much stress can the Xbox 360 components take?
[OFF TOPIC]
I've got this problem now. A few errant programs, don't exit gracefully, and when they do that, it leave the system running 100% CPU load or close to it. Which is a problem for me atm.. as I'm working on making my system quiet without going the water cooling route, opting for quiet fans, reduced fans, and larger heatsinks to dissipate heat. when this happened to the PC.. I went from 35 degrees celcius to 74+ and came home to find it had more or less choked, becoming unstable. (I'll never know how hot it got, as the software monitoring temps on the PC was likely no longer updating the screen properly either)
[/OFF TOPIC]
One thing I wan't people to understand, is that my views are simply that.. my views. however, they are based on my growing experiences. I personally view just about all major electronics manufacturers as crooks and con artists. Few, put their money where their mouth is anymore. Quality just isn't what it used to be. For every guy that can come into this thread and tell us a story how all of his recent stuff from the last 5 years still works great, we can find another who will damn his sotries, ans give us the opposite of how his such and such died prematurely and unexpectedly without abuse or modification having been a factor.
I have no doubt whatsoever, I can go out tomorrow, buy say.. a Samsung HD DVD set top player, and enjoy it. It'll probably last 2 years. maybe a bit longer. but there is no way it'll survive regular usuage and be working on it's 10th birthday. I can make the same guarantee if I bought some higher end hardware too. While all of this tech has become more advanced, and techniques in manufacturing have produced incredible innovation, it seems that a sacrifice to the longevity of the hardware goes hand in hand with the new toys we're presented with.
i'll still buy all the new things on the market. I'll still expect them to last.. but I'll know that in time, some of those things are going to cause me to spend great amounts of times in return lines, and on the help/support phone lines getting RMA numbers for shit. It's the new reality.
10-20 years ago.. If you have a Sony VCR, you either took it back to where you bought it if it was under the store policy, or, or contacted Sony. If you were lucky, there'd be one phone number, and their RMA dept was run by a few people. these days, these large companies have massive RMA depts. spread out across the country, and in different countires, etc. the Nature of the beast is that despite the claims by MS, and other manufacturers to what the numbers really are, this shit will die, alot of prematurely, and people aren't just rolling over and automatically buying a new one from a store. We want, and expect the manufacturers to keep this stuff running for a reasonable amount of time.
bitch is.. what is reasonable?
You will NEVER get MS, SONy, or anyone else to say, state how long these things SHOULD run for minimally. SONY/SCEA will never say.. our game consoles.. will RUN for 3 years. Will RUN for 5 YEARS before failure. At best.. all we have is their warranty policy periods. that is the only measure any manufacturer gives us.
some will give you numbers like MTBF, etc. But, the numbers that really mean something to us is how long will they cover it? For consoles.. for 360.. least we now have a universal minimum of 1 year.. 2 if you are EU if I am correct.
While no manufacturer would ever want to, or could really afford to warranty anything beyond it's expected life (after all.. I don't care how much you care about your customer, you really don't want to be ojn the hook for maintaining a device beyond a certain period of time) they come up with a number, that reflects how long they thing it will last, guantee run without issue. They take that number, and figure out the costs of what will fail even that number. there is some sort of equation that is used. Once that balance is met, that is the magic number. Clearly, the Warranty, is meant to be a worst case lifespan for a product, and one that reflect a small percentage or the product. Stuuf would clearly last longer. however, given that formula that is used, tehy know, statistically how long most hardware will survive, and how much is expected to fail.
I do think.. that things need to change. I do think that warranties, and their longevity should go hand in hand with the cost of the unit. I do think that a device that cost 500$ should last 5 years without fail. I think if the manufacturer needs to charge more up front to make sure that happens, then by all means they should. I'm not against any company charging a fair price to cover costs. I am against paying crazy money and getting little for it.
As for GHII, updated my 5 month old 360.. played a number of tunes.. no instant death, no issues. I don't expect any sudden death issues to arise from my GH sessions.. or the fact I've updated GHII. If I'm wrong.. you can expect a fuming DEMONZ to come back and rant and bitch like a maniac. Until then.. i'm going to enjoy my GHII.
Got my 100% achievement today, so I'm a happy camper all around. (literally, it's the first time in ANY 360 game where I made an effort to earn an achievement.)
EDIT: I was going to correct all the typos.. then I realized I made so many.. and it's late.. fuck it. Have a laugh at my expense tonight guys. Peace.
Post by: twistednailsofv on April 16, 2007, 12:02:00 AM
also with the patch... isn't the patch suppose to meet these high M$ stadards... i mean you see so many things get delayed... jeez... i guess M$ put all of the money and eggs into that basket to let this patch go w/o throughly testing it... remember how much PR they did for the 360 version of Guitar hero... I mean to sit and let this problem of messed whammy's mess up there sales ould in a buisness sense... be stoopid... but it pactical real world sense... well, you need to heavy testing before releasing such patches... probably causes random glithes and burned or just messed up your XBOX 360's...
sorry for you guys... hope you people get your 360's fix...
p.s. you should check out the thread on the 360 telling you what's wrong with itself... it's done w/o opening it up... it'll tell you the error code by pressing the 360's buttons on the front of the system. The one i got was a 0102 error... if you have warranty do't opn th 360... just send i in for repairs... for those w/ nothing to lose... open i and just a decnt hair dryer or hot gun and blow away... basically your gonna wanna like seriously... and i mean seriously heat the motherboard... trust me i had to leave my hair dryer on high and blowing on the thing for 10 mins... and then let it cool, do both sides of the motherboard... like i said... do this if you nothing to lose... you may also wanna consider eBay...
if you think i'm crazy... I could careless, i fixed several 360's this way... and both my 360's are out of warranty cuz I voided it... so when you got nothing to lose... you just try to repair it... or you ebay it... and there are people high up in this forum that can tell you that the most ridiculous ways to fix the 360 are sometimes the best way to... aka the rubberband trick and so on... etc. etc
peace
Post by: feflicker on April 16, 2007, 12:37:00 AM
I haven't heard of this button sequence to get your error code (only knew about reading the error based on which lights were on/off). If someone has that link to that thread please PM it to me, I haven't been on the boards much, must have missed it...
Post by: jeff10 on April 16, 2007, 12:38:00 AM
QUOTE(HSDEMONZ @ Apr 15 2007, 12:45 PM)
I stand by my comment. I fully believe that the warranty period is as long as we can expect hardware these days to last. the days of buying a piece of electronics and watching it last 10 years is over. I remember buying my original VHS and BETA machines, and watched them work long and hard under shitty conditions for 5, 10, and more years.
these days.. brand name electonics just aren't doing that anymore. People are far more likely to buy hardware today, and replace it in 2 year due to failure or wanting the latest greatest. Manufacturers no longer strive to make quality components that stand the test of time.
Especially stuff branded with the MS or Xbox logo. that's not to say we shouldn't want, or expect our stuff to last longer. I do. but, given what we've seen, and the half assed qc and manufacturing we're seeing, I don't expect 360's (or other game consoles for that matter) to last 3 or more years anymore. This stuff simply isn't built to last. Whether that is to planned obsolescence or to just shotty hardware and manufacturing.. I do not know.
This is by no means limited to the MS/Xbox camp. We all have stories of friends who owned, 2, 3 or more PS2's due to dying lasers, etc.
It's just no longer really reasonable to expect that the hardware we buy, will last much longer than the warranty anymore. It's a shame those extended warranties stores try to sell us sometimes aren't worth the paper they are written on, as we sure can use those extra years.
To tell the truth.. my LIVE 360 unit.. which is my second.. (first one died, sure enough.. just as the original warranty ended) I doubt will last long into 2008. If it does, I'll actually consider myself fortunate. I don't abuse the hardware, and in fact maintain and keep my hardware in better conditions and environments than most that surf these boards. It doesn't change the fact I have little faith in any modern day 360, PS3 surviving much past it's first or second birthday.
You have 10-15 minutes from the time you submit a post to go back and edit it. After that, it's committed. Necessary evil due to user abuse on this site.
Sorry to hear that, but I doubt your "fix" will last long. If the box is in warranty, get it replaced asap. 1-800-4-my-xbox
Sorta off topic but i worked for GE,, General Electric for 10 years and the manufactured had a small wire or something of the sort that would last around 4-5 years. During a meeting the question came up that it would cost no more money to replace the part where the motor would likely last 20 years. The response was ((( these specs are used for a reason if you replaced a part in 3 years versus 20 would you still have a job))
point in case Yes things can be made to last longer but at what cost to the peoplethat manufacture them, Also replacement parts division gets no money either... Its no a conspiracy just a fact...
Ps I would never buy anything with the name GE, Dayton, Whirlpool All have GE parts.
just my 2cents
Post by: Charbless on April 16, 2007, 12:58:00 AM
It is shocking but i know lot of people when theres becomes loud or goes bit slow they wack it to sort it lot of the time it works but it can't be healthy another thing I know so many people that put it close to thing like speakers/subs and just lob them in small spaces.
In some ways this 360 failing after 2 years or so isn't really a problem for UK people because are sales of goods act states electrical stuff should last 6 years if it doesn't and can proof it's hardware fault can claim for it.
Post by: twistednailsofv on April 16, 2007, 01:01:00 AM
QUOTE(feflicker @ Apr 16 2007, 02:44 AM)
@twistednailsofv, while I agree that their is some truth in this whole "heat gun fix", that (in my estimation) only fixes 10% of dying 360's at best. Plus, the ones this "fixes" usually just end up dying again a week later, a month later, etc. It's worth a shot before you toss something out, or sell it for parts, but let's not look at this like it is some magic fix by any stretch of the imagination.
I haven't heard of this button sequence to get your error code (only knew about reading the error based on which lights were on/off). If someone has that link to that thread please PM it to me, I haven't been on the boards much, must have missed it...
agreed that it only fixes a portion of 360's... however... it's rare that a 360 really fails like i mean like GPU or CPU or RAM... I mean majority of time you have to agree it's generally user error or mishandling... which is not to say that poor or shotty manufacturing isn't to blame either... but if you look at motherboards now and then you can see they do make suck fixes to prevent the previous errors of the past... I find it rare that a 360 or a Xbox 1 is beyond repair... I mean to be beyond repair must had some serious problem...
also generally with fixes the heat gun... well with me the hair dryer has saved me and some of my friends of having to go buy a new one... well, so far at least...
Post by: twistednailsofv on April 16, 2007, 01:19:00 AM
QUOTE(jeff10 @ Apr 16 2007, 02:45 AM)
Sorta off topic but i worked for GE,, General Electric for 10 years and the manufactured had a small wire or something of the sort that would last around 4-5 years. During a meeting the question came up that it would cost no more money to replace the part where the motor would likely last 20 years. The response was ((( these specs are used for a reason if you replaced a part in 3 years versus 20 would you still have a job))
point in case Yes things can be made to last longer but at what cost to the peoplethat manufacture them, Also replacement parts division gets no money either... Its no a conspiracy just a fact...
Ps I would never buy anything with the name GE, Dayton, Whirlpool All have GE parts.
just my 2cents
i made this point too... but then again... GE makes money on consumer things... they sell you a dryer... they dun sell you the detergeent and clothes to go with it...
Microsoft maks no money off a console... it's makes most of it's money from licensing games and accessories, or the sale of it's 1stparty accessories...
if anyone is familiar with insurance... there's a scale of how much it costs to repair it vs. profit... if it's only on or 2 people getting the problem, you settle or your fix it for them... if eeryone's gonnahave a problem and sue them... then they'll consider a recall... but i'm using the car method of insurance when selling and making cars... and blah blah lah... for M$ third probably sitting somewhere thing about a newer version of the 360 as this one is already falling apart... I doubt the Elite is versions 2.0... it's more version 1.1 and 1/half... just to be like eff you PS3 we got HDMI, were ready for the future... and the to the Wii, whats up chump you still got 50 wores you need to connect to your TV, grow up... =P
I can see in the future them allowing people to fork over a 100 or 200 in exchange to get a HDMI model... but it's probably for those people with warranty seals still intact...
besides...HDMI is over rated... your not going to see that mainstream for years... DVD has only boomed recently... it took how long... and with HDMI complaint TV's costs $1,000+ easily and HD DD and Blu-Ray player another $500 to $1,000 plus easily... by the time HDMI becomes the standard is when the the next gen system comes out...
Post by: spinr34 on April 16, 2007, 02:27:00 AM
Post by: BoNg420 on April 16, 2007, 03:33:00 AM
Post by: Exobex on April 16, 2007, 05:13:00 AM
Under the Sale of Goods Act, retailers are responsible for faulty goods (that are not 'of satisfactory quality') for up to six years after you bought them. In Scotland the period is five years after something goes wrong. 'Satisfactory quality' covers various aspects that could be wrong with the goods, including whether they've lasted as long as you could reasonably expect. A 'reasonable' lifetime for different products is not defined in law and would ultimately be for a court to decide. But, for example, you might reasonably expect a £600 television to last longer than 18 months, but you wouldn't necessarily expect compensation if a £20 kettle broke down in this period.
More info here.
Post by: grim_d on April 16, 2007, 05:29:00 AM
QUOTE(LostIt @ Apr 16 2007, 12:15 AM)
Don't even get me started on Quality Control (or lack there of.)
Things I've returned this year...
-Xbox 360 - just under 1 Month old, 2 or 3 days after I installed PGR 3 with the Wireless Racing Wheel (Install Drivers)
-Wireless PS2 Guitar Hero Controller - The yellow button never worked.
-Pelican XBox (orig) controller - Right analog stick didn't work.
-PSP - Screen had a scratch on the inside of the screen (backside)
It's amazing how much time I have to waste standing in line at the local Best Buy. It feels like I spend more time at customer service than most of the employees. You would think I'm insulting the customer service people by returning defective hardware by the way they act.
you must be a very unlucky person. In all my days on this earth the only thing that iv'e had a problem with was my NDS lite when i got it, the bottom screen had a dead pixel.
Post by: LostIt on April 16, 2007, 05:42:00 AM
You say paranoia, I say shotty manufacturing. I hope you enjoy your $450 investment turning door stop as much as others did.
Manufacturer's who sell garbage get no remorse from me... maybe my money (stupid me), but no remorse when I see people pirating their wares.
Post by: grim_d on April 16, 2007, 05:46:00 AM
QUOTE(LostIt @ Apr 16 2007, 12:49 PM)
spinr34
You say paranoia, I say shotty manufacturing. I hope you enjoy your $450 investment turning door stop as much as others did.
Manufacturer's who sell garbage get no remorse from me... maybe my money (stupid me), but no remorse when I see people pirating their wares.
well you would, since youve had a faulty console.
Post by: shinomen on April 16, 2007, 07:59:00 AM
From what I've seen so far, modding a 360 takes opening the console and breaking the warranty sticker, which voids the warranty. So if MS breaks your console and you have to send it in they will most likely fix it for you if the warranty sticker is in tact. But if that warranty sticker is not in tact they "will not touch it" (I was told this by a support rep) even if you offer to pay for the service.
I don't remember the first xbox having so many problems like the 360 has had, but it is a different beast with more interactivity and updates than the first xbox, plus I wasn't paying attention when the first xbox came out.
I do know that my brother called me up and said that his 360 has bricked with the 3 red lights. My first response was "You were playing Guitar Hero II right?" ..........."how did you know that?"
Post by: ThaCrip on April 16, 2007, 12:01:00 PM
QUOTE(Tony42077 @ Apr 15 2007, 02:19 PM)
That sounds like the same montra that Chrysler used back in the 80s. "People want a new car every 5 years, so we'll make the cars last 5 years." One thing that I do know, is that 360s don't last nearly as long as the original Xbox. I've modded over 80 Xbox1s and all but 3 (ver1.0 PS problems) of them are still running fine (aside from a DVD drive problem here and there). Of the 15 Xbox360s that I have I have first-hand knowledge of, 4 of them had to be sent back for the 3 rings of death. The parts that they use are either of less quality, or the nature of the part allows for a higher failure rate.
I have no doubt that most of people's problems are from heat issues. All of my friends that stand their 360s up vertically have yet to have any problems, while all of the '3rod' 360s sat horizontally.
Hopefully the new smaller CPUs will cut down on the number of hardware failure rates, because the current rate is unacceptable. 3-5% my ass. If every 360 out there was played for an average of 2 hours a day, we would be seeing numbers closer to 15-20%. Overall, I would have to say that MS has made more lemons with the 360 than any other hardware they've produced.
With all of that being said, you shouldn't have to baby a game system to keep it running longer than a year.
i gotta agree with tony... cause the bottom line is ... when u pay 300-400 dollars for some electronic device it damn sure better last a while (3-5years minimum, closer to 5+) ... cause if a xbox360 dies within a year or two thats just bs and should be replaced for free.
and i to think the original xbox is much more reliable than the xbox360 from what i can tell so far... cause even though my xbox360 still works and dont lock up in games so far... if it's been sitting for a while (in other words completely cooled down) i usually have to power cycle it 2-3times before it shows anything on the screen at all but once it does show stuff on the screen it works perfect fine so far... and i even got a couple "Error 074" screens so far but i usually power it off and back on and it's fine.... but once the system is warm it seems to power on the first time and just work.
im guessing it's a matter of time before it dies?... cause i bought it recently for about 330 dollars (premium system) on half.com which the guy claimed it was new (said there was no box and said he just tested it to make sure it worked) which i think he sorta lied cause there where a couple user profiles on it and some downloaded content to it... but once i took it apart to mod it there was no dust build up in the fans so i think for the most part the system was new.... it was basically doing that power up issue the day i got it.
i just hope to god this system dont die cause 330 dollars for me is alot to shell out if the systems going to die anytime soon and the only reason i bought the system was to play Forza Motorsport 2 which aint even out til may 15th 2007 or so.
so basically as far as i can tell the original xbox is far more reliable then the xbox360 is (atleast in terms of any major issues) ... cause i had my original xbox since around aug 2004 and it was my cousins before this and he got his around the time they came out (it's a v1.0 xbox) and thats still working 100percent perfect to this day (besides the thomson dvd-rom drive died, which i replaced with philips).... plus the heat does feel quite warm going out the back of the system (xbox360)... i wish microsoft would have put faster fans in it... cause i would rather have a little more noise if the cooling is quite a bit better than risk damage to the system cause of lack of cooling just cause microsoft wants the system to be quite
Post by: feflicker on April 17, 2007, 12:14:00 AM
