Post by: PvtPepper on December 02, 2007, 12:06:00 PM
Post by: twistedsymphony on December 02, 2007, 11:08:00 PM
All controllers require a security chip to function on the console and MS dictates who can use the chip to manufacture controllers.
The wireless guitar was the first non MS controller to be allowed to use wireless connectivity and Millions of dollars were spent for the privilege, one which I highly doubt you'll see another company get for at least another year or two... if ever.
you have a higher chance of seeing pigs fly over a frozen hell than you do seeing a generic 3rd party wireless guitar controller...
Post by: grim_d on February 02, 2020, 06:01:00 PM
Post by: BoNg420 on February 02, 2020, 07:37:00 PM
Post by: ILLusions0fGrander on December 03, 2007, 10:14:00 PM
QUOTE(BoNg420 @ Dec 3 2007, 10:37 PM) 
what pisses me off you cant use the MS battery packs for the guitars
agreed, however im still on the same two AA that came with it. Then again, i havent played much since i got call of duty 4
Post by: twistedsymphony on December 04, 2007, 07:09:00 AM
QUOTE(grim_d @ Dec 3 2007, 08:01 PM)
i thought the guitar came with a usb dongle as to bypass the security chip? is that just ps3?
AFAIK the PS3 doesn't have any controller security to speak of.
The security chip is required for ALL 360 controllers, wired and wireless. The Wireless also requires an additional encrypted wireless receiver/transmitter chip that they refused to license to anyone.
This is why the Team Xtender keyboard and mouse adapter requires you plug in a wired controller, it basically uses it for the security chip since Team Xtender couldn't get licensing to install the chip in their own product.
it's also why I had to use the guts of a 360 controller to do my Saturn adapter.
QUOTE(BoNg420 @ Dec 3 2007, 09:37 PM)
what pisses me off you cant use the MS battery packs for the guitars
Launch Week for the 360 I went to the store to buy a Play n Charge kit... I took one look at the shelf saw that the PnC kit was $15, had a charge capacity of 22mAh, would only work with the 360 controllers, and I had to plug in the controller to charge it.
opposite the 360 display were a set of energizer rechargeable $15 for 4 AA rechargeable +charger with a charge capacity of 25mAh, they'd work with anything and since there were 4 batteries I could charge 2 while I was using 2 and swap out never having to plug the controller in, not to mention it would work with anything.
An Extra MS battery was $12... a 2nd pack of 4 AAs was only $7
I bought the Energizer batteries and never looked back... and it was a great decision.
-My batteries hold a charge longer
-I never have to plug in a cable since I always have a pile of AA batteries charged and ready to go
-In addition to the 360 controllers I can use the batteries on my Wii controllers, Wavebirds, Guitars, IR remotes... ANYTHING needing AAs.
-I spent dramatically less money per controller than the "official" solution.
Crack open that fancy MS brand rechargeable and you'll find 2 cheap third rate Sanyo AAs in there... And people complain about Sony fanboys buying polished turds just because of the name
Post by: grim_d on December 04, 2007, 09:10:00 AM
QUOTE(twistedsymphony @ Dec 4 2007, 02:45 PM)
AFAIK the PS3 doesn't have any controller security to speak of.
The security chip is required for ALL 360 controllers, wired and wireless. The Wireless also requires an additional encrypted wireless receiver/transmitter chip that they refused to license to anyone.
This is why the Team Xtender keyboard and mouse adapter requires you plug in a wired controller, it basically uses it for the security chip since Team Xtender couldn't get licensing to install the chip in their own product.
it's also why I had to use the guts of a 360 controller to do my Saturn adapter.
yeah but the ps3 uses a wireless dongle to bypass the bluetooth, i wasn't referring to any security features. I just thought that it was the same for 360 so they didnt have to use MS's wireless. But nevermind.
Post by: twistedsymphony on December 04, 2007, 10:23:00 AM
QUOTE(grim_d @ Dec 4 2007, 11:46 AM)
yeah but the ps3 uses a wireless dongle to bypass the bluetooth, i wasn't referring to any security features. I just thought that it was the same for 360 so they didnt have to use MS's wireless. But nevermind.
Basically they were going to do the dongle because they THOUGHT they could get certified for it but Since MS would still need to approve the dongle they basically caved and let them use the real wireless system for what I can only assume are the following two reasons:
1. The other versions were all going to be wireless and they didn't want to be outdone
2. MS had no plans to make their own wireless guitar so it posed no threat to their bottom line.
The reason the PS3 used a dongle was because Bluetooth really isn't the best tech for game controllers... it's got enough lag and connectivity problems that the GH team basically decided it wasn't fast/reliable enough to use for a music game with the kind of accuracy GH requires.
The 360's wireless system is a double edged sword... on one hand it's a much much better system for game controllers since it was designed for high speed lag-less communications. Bluetooth was designed to be cheap and power efficient for thing like wireless headsets and short range data communication where it lag is ok as long as it seems relatively quick... The downside to the 360's protocol is the upside of Bluetooth however... the 360's protocol is locked down so no one but MS can use it... Bluetooth is something anyone can use and develop for.
Though that could be fixed if MS just stopped playing gatekeeper and opened the protocol.
Post by: grim_d on December 04, 2007, 10:56:00 AM
QUOTE(twistedsymphony @ Dec 4 2007, 05:59 PM)
Though that could be fixed if MS just stopped playing gatekeeper and opened the protocol.
well it does stop the mass amount of SHIT 3rd party controllers if anything
Post by: twistedsymphony on December 04, 2007, 02:24:00 PM
QUOTE(grim_d @ Dec 4 2007, 01:32 PM)
well it does stop the mass amount of SHIT 3rd party controllers if anything
Very true, but at the same time if you want a racing wheel the only real option is the official racing wheel since MS wont allow even GOOD 3rd party developers like Logitech to use the wireless protocol OR the force feedback protocol.
This also means no good 3rd party dance pads for DDR, the only option is the crappy pack-in, It means no good wireless arcade style controllers for the XBLA or quality joysticks like the X-Arcade, it also dramatically sets back the mod community. I highly doubt you'll see another converter like the Saturn adapter simply because it's so expensive and complex to get it to work... similarly you wont ever see any cross platform controller adapters made by companies like datel because MS wont give them licensing for such products.
They basically gave themselves a monopoly over their own console... 1st party stuff is usually superior quality but now they control their own competition. MS could let their controller quality slide into the gutter and jack the prices up and they wouldn't have any incentive to change or fix any of it because they control the competition.