Post by: uk-hitman on November 14, 2004, 05:03:00 AM
But I think M$ will have the Serial Number Linked to the MAC Address.
I think every brand of Network cards has its own range of MAC's ? (could someone confirm this)
Thanks
Post by: Gn0ver on November 14, 2004, 07:52:00 AM
| QUOTE (inVinCiBleGaMa @ Nov 14 2004, 03:58 PM) |
| I dunnno..... like DVD Drives and HDDs they probqbly are all mismatched anywway. AND it would be too much wok on the Xbox Assembly Line to keep track of every MAC ID and every EEPRom. Gn0ver, you may just have help me find my answers. And i've also seen a poll on these forumz that said "Made my own EEPROm using Config Magic" and a few ppl said yes so maybe it can be done. |
I agree with inVinCiBleGaMa, keeping track of EEPROM's and MAC Adresses would be too much work, especially when you thing a lot of boxes are repaired and stuff.
The only thing we need is confirmation of two things:
- Does the EEPROM really contains information about the Xbox hard drive, and is this used during the check as described in the marriged theory (EEPROM+HDD_ID=unique)
- Can we alter and 'build' our own valid (for xblive) EEPROM using configmagic?
Post by: Panick on November 14, 2004, 08:36:00 AM
If you could build a legit EEPROM for Live I think someone would've figured this out by now instead of buying new EEPROMs at $8-10 a pop.
Now if the EEPROM is what is checked during the Marriage Theory test (and there's a good chance it is) is it possible to change just the HD model and serial to the one that you swapped into the box? And if so, will that stop you from being banned?
Post by: bengu on November 14, 2004, 08:38:00 AM
Post by: Lord-Icon on November 14, 2004, 08:48:00 AM
| QUOTE (Panick @ Nov 14 2004, 05:39 PM) |
| Yes EEPROM really contains information about the HD that was shipped with the machine (serial number and model), yes the EEPROM really contains the MAC address and serial number of the XBox in question. Ask yourself this: if they can put the serial in the EEPROM and on the sticker on the bottom of the XBox and on the warranty card that comes with the XBox, how much extra effort do you think it would take for them to record the MACs? They may not know exactly what MAC is in a particular box but I bet they know the range of MACs for a given range of serial numbers. If you could build a legit EEPROM for Live I think someone would've figured this out by now instead of buying new EEPROMs at $8-10 a pop. Now if the EEPROM is what is checked during the Marriage Theory test (and there's a good chance it is) is it possible to change just the HD model and serial to the one that you swapped into the box? And if so, will that stop you from being banned? |
Err I don't think so ...
The eeprom doesn't hold information of the HDD ...
I have hacked into it and it only holds the xbox s/n and MAC address ...
Post by: Lord-Icon on November 14, 2004, 09:09:00 AM
I swapped the HDD form th modded xbox into my working xbox , and Im still connected to live .
As I have said in the past , no HDD s/n is passed to M$ .... fact !
Post by: Panick on November 14, 2004, 10:16:00 AM
| QUOTE (Lord-Icon @ Nov 14 2004, 05:51 PM) |
| Err I don't think so ... The eeprom doesn't hold information of the HDD ... I have hacked into it and it only holds the xbox s/n and MAC address ... |
First off, watch the ConfigMagic video. The EEPROM does store the HD serial and HD model (and apparently it can be changed).
This is everything stored in the EEPROM:
XBOX VERSION
KERNEL VERSION
XBOX RAM
XBOX SERIAL NUMBER
XBOX MAC ADDRESS
XBOX ONLINE KEY
XBOX VIDEO MODE
XBOX XBE REGION
XBOX HDD KEY
XBOX CONFOUNDER
XBOX HDD MODEL
XBOX HDD SERIAL
XBOX HDD PASSWORD
XBOX DVD MODEL
It's highly probable that MS is checking the EEPROM against whatever HD is currently in the machine. If they're different, the box gets banned.
Post by: syntaxx_error on November 14, 2004, 10:19:00 AM
| QUOTE (Panick @ Nov 14 2004, 07:19 PM) |
| First off, watch the ConfigMagic video. The EEPROM does store the HD serial and HD model (and apparently it can be changed). This is everything stored in the EEPROM: XBOX VERSION KERNEL VERSION XBOX RAM XBOX SERIAL NUMBER XBOX MAC ADDRESS XBOX ONLINE KEY XBOX VIDEO MODE XBOX XBE REGION XBOX HDD KEY XBOX CONFOUNDER XBOX HDD MODEL XBOX HDD SERIAL XBOX HDD PASSWORD XBOX DVD MODEL It's highly probable that MS is checking the EEPROM against whatever HD is currently in the machine. If they're different, the box gets banned. |
Is there a way to view what is stored in my eeprom ?
Are we ban again if we buy a new xbox ?
Post by: mrjkwik on November 14, 2004, 10:33:00 AM
now, if we knew for a fact that all they scanned was the eeprom, we may be able to disable the "write to" on the eeprom, where it would retain the original info.
only chink in anything i've said is, i have "write to eeprom" enabled in avaluanch. if i didnt have it enabled, would it still have updated my hdd?
Post by: Panick on November 14, 2004, 10:36:00 AM
| QUOTE (mrjkwik @ Nov 14 2004, 07:36 PM) |
| only chink in anything i've said is, i have "write to eeprom" enabled in avaluanch. if i didnt have it enabled, would it still have updated my hdd? |
More importantly, have you been banned yet?
If you have then we can rule out the EEPROM reading as a possibility. If not it's still a good possibility.
Post by: mrjkwik on November 14, 2004, 12:08:00 PM
now, if it does autoupdate, and the eeprom writes in new data when new hardware is put in, then it may not matter whether or not i have "enable eeprom writing" in ava or not.
if that is the case, someone responded to another post i made with a link to a switch that could be installed to prevent writing to eeprom. so my thinking goes to IF, always an IF because i dont know everything. but IF, you were to install this switch, flip it to off to disable any eeprom writing, then change your drive, that may be a work around. just a matter will the xbox operate without the eeprom being updated to what hdd is in it.
can people with upgraded drives check their eeproms and see if it reflects the new drive, or the stock drive?
Post by: Panick on November 14, 2004, 12:31:00 PM
Without cracking the encrypted stream that gets sent to Live (which borders on the impossible to do within a decent timeframe) there is simply no way to know for sure what they are scanning for the bans.
Post by: rob_ocelot on November 14, 2004, 12:47:00 PM
| QUOTE (Gn0ver @ Nov 14 2004, 09:19 PM) |
| Ok, so if the eeprom really updates automatically, MS is just checking your new EEPROM against your old one, perhaps by serial number (and MAC-address?). Which means that some vital changes in the EEPROM bans you from xboxlive. This makes the check less advanced as we think it is. It might just be an EEPROM to EEPROM check. If your HDD differ you get banned, but may be also if your xbe region or videomode gets changed. |
I think you may be on to something here. It certainly does explain why some people have been banned and others have not. The changing EEPROM into is the ONLY way M$ knows we have changed something.
My take on this is that M$ tried a 'shotgun' approach. Back in April (amd since then) the new live code reported your EEPROM info. Six months later they send out a 'blast' and took out as many modders as they could in one go by doing a second automatic EEPROM comparison. Halo 2 had this code, but also sent out a shot the day before to get the ones who didn't buy H2.
Before this point though EEPROM info was NOT automatically compared unless a different BIOS was detected -- which usually resulted in a ban.
In situations like these where there are conflicting results and confusion usually Occam's Razor applies -- The simplist solution is more than likely the correct one.
My theory is that M$ simply modified their code now to send EEPROM data every time you log on and a compare is done. This might be happening only with gamertags that have been previously banned or with everyone.
There is still room for yet another check on top of an EEPROM compare but the preliminary results from the banning survey are ruling out any specific configurations (alternate dashboards on c: with no upgraded HD, etc).
This 'Mutating EEPROM' theory would give the exact same results as the Marriage theory, with the added bennefit that it's much simpler for M$ to implement with a slight change in code -- rather than trying to shoehorn in a new way to scan the Xbox for something they could not detect before.
Post by: Lord-Icon on November 14, 2004, 12:50:00 PM
and both xboxes send
1 your sbox serial number
2 your MAC address
I have not found and s/n for HDD's
Further more ther eeprom dosn't hold any information of your stock drive . it will scan what ever is connected to the ide port
Post by: mrjkwik on November 14, 2004, 01:12:00 PM
| QUOTE |
| Gn0ver Posted on Nov 14 2004, 03:19 PM Ok, so if the eeprom really updates automatically, MS is just checking your new EEPROM against your old one, perhaps by serial number (and MAC-address?). Which means that some vital changes in the EEPROM bans you from xboxlive. This makes the check less advanced as we think it is. It might just be an EEPROM to EEPROM check. If your HDD differ you get banned, but may be also if your xbe region or videomode gets changed. We still need to know if we would be able to make a valid EEPROM by just changing the serial. Could any banned xbox user please try this with configmagic? And what if we could make the eeprom sort of 'locked, so it doesn't changes it's content automatically. It would perhaps than be able to show your stock hard drive, while it is actually not there?! These things are all just theory, but are worth exploring! |
nice to see someone saying that. i've posted it in several threads on about the 11th, and even started one for it, but i just got ignored due to the panic i guess. here's the link to that thread if you/anyone wants to take a look and weigh in on it. i said it because obviouslyt m$ already has easy access to the eeprom if they can ban it, and it contains all the info that people were talking about in the "marriage" theory. so why go through the effort to scan the drive itself for the serial/model.
on a side note on my previous post, good in theory i think, flawed in execution. sure, it would be great if we could trick them to think that it has the stock hdd by preventing writing the new hdd to eeprom, but i didnt think about the fact that it writes the new lock key there as well. so even IF we could prevent it, the the key wouldnt be present unless its saved somewhere else other than the eeprom.
Post by: mrjkwik on November 14, 2004, 01:26:00 PM
| QUOTE |
| inVinCiBleGaMa Posted on Nov 14 2004, 04:20 PM And Panick, can u change the HDD Serial and model thru config magic?? Then I wouldnt need 2 get a new EEPRom cuz I cud just use y current 1 and change the HDD serial on the EEPRom. |
going on marriage theory, you would still have the same xbox serial. would need to have all of them edited and locked.
Post by: Lord-Icon on November 14, 2004, 01:36:00 PM
I use 2 pieces of software
1 Ethereal
2 A good hex editor
Start Ethereal and start your xbox try and log into live .
stop Ethereal and look for KRB5 under protocol (ther should only be 2 on a banned xbox 4 on a working xbox)
open the first KRB5 and save it as a file .
Use a hex editor to look at this file and scan for your MAC and serial number .
You will find both there
Post by: Lord-Icon on November 14, 2004, 01:45:00 PM
here you go ...
I have blanked out my s/n
And whats that at the end of the s/n @xbox
A small team and I are still working on this ,
Will keep you all up to date .....
Post by: Lord-Icon on November 14, 2004, 02:38:00 PM
There are 5 of us working on this problem ..
Quite a scare aint it ... mind you , you have to know what you are looking for .
As I said in a few posts , I can see both
xbox s/n
MAC Address
Post by: mrjkwik on November 14, 2004, 10:43:00 PM
seems fully possible, my eeprom lists my upgraded drive, and i never used config or anything else. so it updated itself.
what i was thinking is if you could remove those strings, embed hdd info, maintain same .bin size, and have an operating xbox.
i dont know, just thought i'd relay what i saw. i have a hex editor and opened it with my eeprom.bin, but i have no idea what i'm looking at. its all jiberish to me. point me to where i can learn about reading that stuff, and i'll see if i can.
Post by: Lord-Icon on November 15, 2004, 04:51:00 AM
Booted !!!!!.
:I
I wonder if there is a match with the xbox s/n and MAC ,,,,
still working on this
PS. Keep up the good work all , Im sure we will have a solution by the end of the week .
Post by: A.Z.BEST on November 15, 2004, 05:12:00 AM
| QUOTE (Panick @ Nov 14 2004, 07:19 PM) |
| First off, watch the ConfigMagic video. The EEPROM does store the HD serial and HD model (and apparently it can be changed). This is everything stored in the EEPROM: XBOX VERSION KERNEL VERSION XBOX RAM XBOX SERIAL NUMBER XBOX MAC ADDRESS XBOX ONLINE KEY XBOX VIDEO MODE XBOX XBE REGION XBOX HDD KEY XBOX CONFOUNDER XBOX HDD MODEL XBOX HDD SERIAL XBOX HDD PASSWORD XBOX DVD MODEL |
That's a stupid lie. EEProm contains:
XBOX SERIAL NUMBER
XBOX MAC ADDRESS
XBOX ONLINE KEY
XBOX VIDEO MODE
XBOX XBE REGION
XBOX HDD KEY (my Xbox is dead ATM and I can not verify it
)XBOX CONFOUNDER (dunno what it is, so I'm puttin' it here
)And how do you think; that after changing the hdd EEProm changes just like that? LOL, you're funny, it looks that you've never been playing with CM. Try editing EEProm on the fly and try to change hdd s/n
.And the things that have to be changed in an EEProm to make it 'new':
XBOX SERIAL NUMBER
XBOX MAC ADDRESS
XBOX ONLINE KEY
--------------
Taken from xbox-linux.org:
The serial number looks like this:
418932 33205
LNNNNNN YWWFF
FF is the code of the factory (02: Mexico, 03: Hungary, 05: China, 06: Taiwan), L the number of the production line within the factory, Y the last digit of the production year, WW the number of the week of the production year, and NNNNNN the number of the Xbox within this week.
-----------------
Change only one N of the NNs value. Nothing more! The MAC adress: change of the digits- whichever you like and for the Online Key... I don't know
. Try to change one of the digits that you like/ don't like . Shall work after this. BUT: remember that you can ban an innocent person! Remember that it won't give you 100% guarantee to unban you and make a fuckin' backup of your EEProm (even banned as long as it works good with everything else), befeore playing with CMF.It's all just to give you some sight on the case. I think that there might be some holes/ mistakes in this info
. I don't and I won't try this method, cause I don't have any modded Xboxes and don't wanna get banned/ don't want my GT to be flagged.
Post by: solid7x2 on November 15, 2004, 06:26:00 AM
or am I thinking of this incorrectly...
Post by: A.Z.BEST on November 15, 2004, 09:48:00 AM
Post by: solid7x2 on November 15, 2004, 10:49:00 AM
1) take a modded xbox that is currently on xbox live unbanned and working
2) take an old random banned eeprom.
3) take the info off the working xbox eeprom, and manually put it on the banned eeprom
4) flash the changed eeprom onto the unbanned xbox
This way, if the 'marriage theory' is correct, it wont be violated because its still using the same hard drive.
In addition I was wondering if when you get banned it writes something onto your eeprom, which poses this question (which may have previously been answered). If you have been banned, but have a backup of your eeprom before it has been banned, what happens when you re-flash the backed up eeprom to your hard drive. (probably stays banned, but just curious as i thought of this just now)
Post by: mrjkwik on November 15, 2004, 11:44:00 AM
| QUOTE |
| A.Z.BEST® Posted on Nov 15 2004, 08:15 AM That's a stupid lie. EEProm contains: XBOX SERIAL NUMBER XBOX MAC ADDRESS XBOX ONLINE KEY XBOX VIDEO MODE XBOX XBE REGION XBOX HDD KEY (my Xbox is dead ATM and I can not verify it sad.gif) XBOX CONFOUNDER (dunno what it is, so I'm puttin' it here tongue.gif) And how do you think; that after changing the hdd EEProm changes just like that? LOL, you're funny, it looks that you've never been playing with CM. Try editing EEProm on the fly and try to change hdd s/n wink.gif. And the things that have to be changed in an EEProm to make it 'new': XBOX SERIAL NUMBER XBOX MAC ADDRESS XBOX ONLINE KEY |
so with he said, its basically agreeing with what i said in my last post. that the hdd serial and model is not STORED in the eeprom. but the info is retrieved and shown. when you get a copy of config magic, it is showing you what your current setup is because its retreiving that info. note that the dvd drive is not on that list either. so i assume the 2 easiest harddrive upgrades do not have their serials/models STORED in the eeprom.
why i said about being able to remove these retrieve strings and replacing them with STORED data wasnt to get people back online. but to protect a new setup. if i had this info stored in the eeprom,then upgraded the drive, the problem wouldnt be there.
of course, this is if they aren't retrieving the info from the hdd itself. i just dont see why they'd have to if its being reflected in the eeprom.
more code to write, more money to burn. seems to me they always take the cheapest route to get the quickest result.
Post by: zerouseven on November 17, 2004, 12:43:00 AM
abd now my xbox nuked
Post by: spinr34 on November 17, 2004, 02:13:00 AM
it would help if i knew where it was getting all these values from and if they are really encrypted to begin with and the dash is decrypting it or if they are really stored in plain text.
Post by: spinr34 on November 17, 2004, 02:22:00 AM
| QUOTE (Gn0ver @ Nov 15 2004, 01:40 PM) |
| We need someone with a banned xbox, willing to try and make a new EEPROM, by altering the xbox serial using configmagic! We really need to know if this creates valid EEPROM's! It would help us supporting the marriage theory! |
i'd be willing to test it, i mean wtf do i have to lose ;p something i would like to test though is getting a known valid eeprom, swapping and stealthing my original hd for my current one and seeing what happens then. there might have been reports already on this but i've read so many posts i don't really remember all of them. if this is true, it could further prove the marriage theory and disprove say the lpc one or vice versa. but hell i'll even try "generating" an eeprom, don't think it will work but like i said what do i have to lose
Post by: LinoX on November 21, 2004, 05:01:00 PM
Post by: ssj4android on November 22, 2004, 04:45:00 PM
Post by: mc_365 on November 22, 2004, 08:58:00 PM
Post by: eeee074 on November 27, 2004, 09:18:00 PM
Post by: cromat44 on November 27, 2004, 11:21:00 PM
can't hurt... i might try it myself...