Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 06:47:00 PM
The connectivity test SHOULD succeed even if your box is chipped.
If it fails there are kerberos/handshaking problems at work which may be related to misconfiguration or problems at MS's servers.
The failure will occur with new non-modded systems as well, and seems to be somewhat random.
2 - Upon an initial XBLive connect via a game (if connectiviity is good), your Xbox will receive an "update".
This update is capable of detecting the Mod chip and retail CD.
It does NOT matter if your XBox is chipped or not, during the update process.
3 - After the update if you start an XBLive game (and connectivity is good) your mod chip will be detected if on. This will prevent your from connecting to the game servers. The troubleshooting dialog will still NOT report any trouble.
4 - If you turn OFF the mod chip on the same machine (without connectivity issues) the same RETAIL games will play fine.
5 - The problem is NOT related to ANY software on the hard drives nor kernel & Bios VERSIONS.
I've run 4034 bioses on 3894(?) machines and XBLive works fine.
The Dashboard used once the update is complete is the SAME for all Xboxes.
I've unlocked and swapped out hard drives from IDENTICAL working and nonworking Xboxes, then relocked. The problem ALWAYS travels with the motherboard itself.
6 - Machines are NOT detected and BANNED over time. I've had units WITH mod chips on line since the start of the retail period.
Simply turning OFF the mod chip restores game operation on retail games.
7 - Accounts are NOT detected and BANNED over time. I've used the SAME accounts in all cases as a further check.
8 - This is NOT an IP or MAC address issue. I've swapped both on many non-working and working machines, again the problem stays with the motherboard.
It MAY be related to the serialization of the motherboard's EEPROM.
E. G. Certain serial numbers are not being accepted or more correctly replied to by the servers.
9 - This (connectivity) is NOT related to how old the machines were or if they EVER had a mod chip installed.
Old machines both work and not work as observed above.
10 - This is NOT a "banned" serial number problem.
New unchipped machines, old unchipped machines exhibit identical problems.
In all cases the machines never get a response from the server.
A banned machine will receive a not-authenticated reply from the server. This never happens (YET!).
11 - MS is spreading FUD about this entire process.
They are purposely misreporting what is occuring and/or their techs are not up to speed, etc.
The on-line techs also seem not to know what is going on.
12 - This is occuring with great frequency on non-modded Xboxes.
It is unlikely that MS will take back 30% of all Xboxes out there for repairs since they do not work on XBLive.
13 - Bottom line:
If you get connecitivity in the Xblive tab, turn off your mod chip and PLAY!
14 - You will need to be able to disable the mod chip via a switch or other type mechanism to go onto XBLive games.
15 - There are no ill effects to be had by leaving your mod chip ON.
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 06:57:00 PM
| QUOTE (Kickace1616 @ Nov 16 2002, 01:54 AM) |
| ok but how do you get connectivity in the first place to update?? you said that after the update, if you turn off ur modchip, you will be able to play games fine, thats if you can connect in the first place. If i accidently forgot to turn off my modchip once & it doesn't let me play--would i never be able to use xb live again or would all i have to do is turn of my modchip & retry?? Another question: What happens if you connect for the first time with the modchip on & try to update?? |
I don't understand how I can be more clear about this.
CONNECTIVITY is not a mod chip issue.
GAMEPLAY via LIVE -IS-.
If you get NO connectivity via the XBLive tab, then you are screwed until MS gets around to fixing the problem, (if ever).
The key is that VERY VERY LAST ICON on the test page!
If you GET connectivity via the TAB then you can play XBLive w/o any problems IF and only IF you turn OFF your mod chip.
Doing so requires that your hard drive be locked of course.
XBlive does NOT care about larger locked hard drives.
Post by: Satan00 on November 15, 2002, 07:00:00 PM
like boot the backup and then turn off your mod while xbox is on?
Post by: Malafax on November 15, 2002, 07:02:00 PM
In addition though, I have the connectivity issue on my chipped box BUT I was able to connect to the XBL service before like 11/12/02 for a couple of days. My point being that the situation is not hopeless I was able to connect before but now I am not.
Post by: pike-old on November 15, 2002, 07:04:00 PM
Most folk who fail the connectivity test, DID, AT SOME POINT, HAVE A CONNECTION, AND A CHIP TOO!
Folk with a chip and still getting connectivity have got a design of chip that will work if switched off - fair play and well done to anyone with a modchip that has a switch or is a mode 3 matrix
BUT, you MUST accept, if someone did have a working connection and a chip, and their setup has not changed, and now they get 'not found' then their chip HAS been detected and they have been zapped - the only thing to have happened in between being the MS forced update....
Finally if you have a virgin box and no connection thwen you have a tech support issue and the right to satisfaction/refund
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:04:00 PM
| QUOTE (Kickace1616 @ Nov 16 2002, 02:00 AM) |
| i knew that conectivity is not a modchip issue, i was just simply asking if someone found a way to get conectivity. once again: if i have my modchip on once i get conectivity, i know i will not be able to play---but will all i have to do is turn of my modchip & retry or will it never work since i tried with my modchip?? |
I did answer your question in the original post.
It doesn't matter if you EVER connect with a mod chip or not.
Connectivitity is NOT mod chip related.
Game play -IS-.
Disable the mod chip (if you have connectivity) and play away.
Didn't you see the line where I said this?
Enable the mod chip and try to connect, and you'll eventually be brought to the "XBLive could not connect" screen in the game.
This offers you the opportunity to try the troubleshooter.
If you try the troubleshooter it will report NO problems whatsoever.
Turn off the MOD chip and reboot, and you are fine again!
Post by: Satan00 on November 15, 2002, 07:05:00 PM
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:07:00 PM
| QUOTE (pike @ Nov 16 2002, 02:04 AM) |
| Most folk who fail the connectivity test, DID, AT SOME POINT, HAVE A CONNECTION, AND A CHIP TOO! Folk with a chip and still getting connectivity have got a design of chip that will work if switched off - fair play and well done to anyone with a modchip that has a switch or is a mode 3 matrix BUT, you MUST accept, if someone did have a working connection and a chip, and their setup has not changed, and now they get 'not found' then their chip HAS been detected and they have been zapped - the only thing to have happened in between being the MS forced update.... Finally if you have a virgin box and no connection thwen you have a tech support issue and the right to satisfaction/refund |
GAWD! ARE YOU FULL OF IT!
I've now replied to this trite trash soo many times I can't believe it.
IT HAPPENS ON NEW UNCHIPPED XBOXES!
NEW, meaning never used!
NEVER CONNECTED.
NEVER CHIPPED!
WHAT IS NOT TO UNDERSTAND?
This is -NOT- a mod chip detection issue.
PERIOD!
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:08:00 PM
| QUOTE (Satan00 @ Nov 16 2002, 02:05 AM) |
| can you disable the mod while hte xbox is on? iwanna boot my backups and then disable mod |
Nope: Way ahead of you.
I tried this, it doesn't work.
You wouldn't believe all the difference combinations I tried since early this morning.
It pays to have 6 machines laying around to facilitate this.
Post by: Kickace1616 on November 15, 2002, 07:11:00 PM
do you think i shoudl attempt to flash my eeprom with the anonymous eeprom since you said that it may be the serial that is causing the connection problems??
what are the chances of my xbox breaking?? do you think i should take the chance??
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:11:00 PM
| QUOTE (Kickace1616 @ Nov 16 2002, 02:00 AM) |
| Thanks for the post, it will help alot of people. i knew that conectivity is not a modchip issue, i was just simply asking if someone found a way to get conectivity. once again: if i have my modchip on once i get conectivity, i know i will not be able to play---but will all i have to do is turn of my modchip & retry or will it never work since i tried with my modchip once?? You said this: It MAY be related to the serialization of the motherboard's EEPROM. E. G. Certain serial numbers are not being accepted or more correctly replied to by the servers. ----Do you think i shoudl flash my eeprom to the anonymous eeprom release?? i have never flashed my eeprom, what are thw chances of my xbox not working?? |
According to Xboxhacker.net, changing the serial numbers does not seem to work (yet).
It may be that they simply utilized non-working or inappropriate serial numbers in the EEPROM though.
Post by: Malafax on November 15, 2002, 07:14:00 PM
If we have the connectivity problem then we simply have to wait and see what happens over the next few days.
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:15:00 PM
| QUOTE (pike @ Nov 16 2002, 02:10 AM) |
| OPCODE - I have some mist clearing. My mates xtender xbox has no connectivity issues. You say, fit a switch and it will work I suspect 'leave it a week' and it will revert to 'not found' How, then, under your system, do we explain his 1 week working xecutor with switch, that now is 'not found'.... Finally, his xtender 1.1 - disregarding fitting a switch. He has an untouched drive and whatever bios came with the xtender - it's not evos or anything - looks like the normal dash. Would you recommend burning a virgin dash to cd to try and revert back? Under your theory that should work? No? |
NO, NO, NO, NO, NO!
I too have a machine that worked before, then quit working last week during the switchover, and no longer works at all, mod chip or not.
The machine was NEVER on long enough last week to receive any update or have the mod chip detected, yet it's stopped working. Prior to that it worked just fine.
Now even with the update it doesn't work while other chipped machines do.
CONNECTIVITY is a seperate problem. It IS NOT related to mod chip detection.
Please re-read the above sentance until you understand as I keep saying this over and over to you!
If his machine fails the connectivity test, then currently NOTHING you can do will work.
Nada, zip, zero (as of yet until someone figures out something I'm unaware off!).
Post by: Satan00 on November 15, 2002, 07:17:00 PM
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:19:00 PM
| QUOTE (Malafax @ Nov 16 2002, 02:14 AM) |
| So if the problem with connectivity follows the MB hardware and not the moded xbox then M$ must be obligated to fix the problem. The connectivity problem we are seeing then is related to some kind of oversight on M$'s XBL server farms and not the fault of consumer xbox's, modded or un modded. |
This may very well be.
We don't know for sure, though if you think about it, it is a VERY likely scenario.
How long it will take (if they do attempt a fix) may be dependant upon how many people complain about NEW (and old) unchipped machines not working.
If they get a deluge of complaints, then they may actually do something about it to all of our benefit.
Bottom line: Turn off Mod chip, XBLive works if you have no connectivity issues.
Think about it.
This is all M-I-C-R-O-S-O-F-T needs!
Now you need to go out and buy the games if you want to play online.
Good solution for them, an inconvenience for us, but not a horrible problem.
After playing a game I just might indeed like it enough (if I'm addicted to on-line play) to go out and get it for this reason.
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:20:00 PM
| QUOTE (Satan00 @ Nov 16 2002, 02:17 AM) |
| has anyone been blacklisted yet?? |
Not that I know off.
Believe me I would be the first.
I've tried so many machines and combinations since last night that my account would have been the first to go.
Post by: CZECH on November 15, 2002, 07:22:00 PM
Post by: Malafax on November 15, 2002, 07:23:00 PM
I would think that the connect one day and not the other issue would be due to M$ migrating their servers over from accepting Beta testers to the retail kits and in doing so added something that fouled things up.
Post by: pike-old on November 15, 2002, 07:25:00 PM
If I've connected with an xecutor switched on, then later off, I'm presuming MS know that and have seen it, and have bounced me from games...
Q1. Can MS detect a chip that is being used that is turned off?
Q2. if they've detected me, then I have a hurdle to overcome...If I'm ringing saying I can't connect, the they could lay the blame with my chip (though u say it is not the problem), even though it may not be the problem. Right? Easy get out, although not one they've used with me, yet!
So, whats needed is bona fide unmodded x box owners to kick up a stink. With their solution comes help for us all....
Q3. But, how many bona fide unmodded x boxes cannot connect and what percentage of the user base is it???Is it enuff to casue action to be taken??
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:26:00 PM
| QUOTE (pike @ Nov 16 2002, 02:17 AM) |
| But, there appears NO solution to the latter, and some parts of the world have been Live for months..... For this to be true, MS would be seizing on the confusion to say they are banning folk found to be using chipped machines. It's a play on words, but they are banning them from the games, I suppose they never actually said they were preventing them hooking up to the servers Ok, so my only remaining hurdle to becomming a convert is as above- you can connect one day, but not the next...WHY? You've downloaded an UPDATE, remember... |
This type of confusion is typical MS.
How many thousands of times have they done it in the past.
Again doing what I described is an EXCELLENT solution for them.
Say one thing which looks almost egregious, but actually do something far more benign.
They get what they want (you to buy the games for On-line play) and you are not totally unhappy.
Re: Why?
The actual answer is we don't know. It is MOST likely to be a server problem.
Were it to be a mod chip issue ONLY people who ever used a mod chip on their systems would be affected. It would not have affected new and old unmodded machines.
Instead it seems to affect a random sampling of both!
This makes the single highest likelyhood to be a server authentication issue which is PERFECTLY consistent with what I (and many many others) are reporting as being observable with sniffers.
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:27:00 PM
| QUOTE (epac @ Nov 16 2002, 02:20 AM) |
| Something i found out about the xbox live: I do NOT have a modded xbox (waitin' for X2). I do have a firewall (go figure). It seems that i can go as far as connecting to Xlive for a bit (ie: enough to get through a couple of menus), but can't start playing. Now, I talked about it with my sysadmin at work. we tryed to put the box on the live net (ie: not behind the firewall, but next to it, network wise), and behold, all the problems went away. So if you have some type of firewall, i would recommend you set your xbox behind it, and set it as a DMZ machine (most little broadband router can do that). I hope this helps anyone... |
This is totally unrelated to this topic and belongs elsewhere.
Post by: PillMonster on November 15, 2002, 07:30:00 PM
I told you it was via a downloaded code block - correct.
I'm TELLING you your boxes ARE blocked.
Of course the bloody kerberos packet isn't getting back a response. The servers don't want to give you one cos your blocked.
The serial number of your box, and probably a key value generated by that inconsipicous code downloaded and executed from live has squirreled away somewhere.
If you are so sure - please connect to Live when your chip enabled. Then wait 4 days. If you can still connect then I'm wrong. Why not try it? (I'm not talking about having mod disabled when you download the update either)
Just on a side point - that update could occur at any time in any future game.
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:33:00 PM
| QUOTE (pike @ Nov 16 2002, 02:25 AM) |
| Stick with me on this. If I've connected with an xecutor switched on, then later off, I'm presuming MS know that and have seen it, and have bounced me from games... Q1. Can MS detect a chip that is being used that is turned off? Q2. if they've detected me, then I have a hurdle to overcome...If I'm ringing saying I can't connect, the nthey could lay the blame with my chip (though u say it is not the problem), even though it may not be the problem. Right? Easy get out, although not one they've used with me, yet! So, whats needed is bona fide unmodded x box owners tokick up a stick. With their solution comes help for us all.... Q3. But, how many bona fide unmodded x boxes cannot connect and what percentage of the user base is it???Is it enuff to casue action to be taken?? |
Q1: No, not if the machine was rebooted from the non-modified mod chip.
Q2: No See below.
| QUOTE |
| So, whats needed is bona fide unmodded x box owners tokick up a stick. With their solution comes help for us all.... |
AGAIN DON'T YOU READ ENGLISH?
I have TWO UNMODIFIED VIRGIN systems. One with the problem and one without.
There are a slew of people reporting and calling in with the same problem as well.
I've "kicked up the stick" which is why I've posted all of this.
Q3: About 20%-30% of UNMODDED Xboxes cannot connect!
This is about the same ratio of modded (but switched off) boxes.
See the pattern?
It's not the mod chip to blame with CONNECTIVITY ISSUES as I've asserted. The ratios are identical!
GAMEPLAY is a totally different matter.
If you have connectivity
Mod chip on = XBLIVE no work (reports are running about 90%)
Mod chip off = XBLIVE work (on same machine, reports about 90%)
This is for ACTUAL game play on RETAIL or RETAIL XBLive demo games.
Notice that the MOD CHIP ON = NO WORK is not 100%.
There may be various reasons for this, including that the user (like I did at first) is using a game like REVOLT which is still communicating with the BETA servers. Even with the mod chip ON REVOLT was still working a few hours ago.
Also there may have been a few systems that received an earlier version of an unfinished "update" that is still working(!!!), though I'm merely speculating.
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:41:00 PM
| QUOTE (PillMonster @ Nov 16 2002, 02:30 AM) |
| I'm TELLING you your boxes ARE blocked. |
HIGHLY
HIGHLY
HIGHLY
UNLIKELY
READ MY PREVIOUS POSTS AS TO WHY?
Your XBox's Chipped versus unchipped state is NEVER reported to the servers, EVER!
How do I know?
Virgin, just out of box non-working Xbox on same network with packet sniffers NEVER reports mod chip state.
Virgin, just out of box working chipped (identical) Xbox on same network with packet sniffer NEVER reports mod chip state.
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 07:45:00 PM
| QUOTE (pike @ Nov 16 2002, 02:33 AM) |
| To my mid if you get three green lights on othr areas and a red for 'x box live not found' then ur setup is fine and theres a glitch on that machine. This is verifiable by slapping in another machine that then instantly connects. It's sorting the wheat fro mthe chaff thats the problem If the damage is random, there will be a lot of folk calling tech support with chips fitted adding confusion, along with the cabbages adding confusion. How will MS see and route out this particular problem, or will they use smoke/mirrors and confusion to ignore it??? |
Here I go with your earlier arguement.
I have a machine which worked one day, but not another, yet nothing changed.
The problem arose on it on Tuesday. Prior to then it worked perfectly.
It was never moved, booted, etc.
It's NOT a setup issue and I can see it's communication attempts going out to the internet. It resolves the IP's, it sends the initial handshake and waits forever for the non-existant reply.
It was last turned on for XBLive play three weeks ago.
Tuesday morning it never connected to anything.
I don't think MS can ignore the problem as there are simply WAY too many unmodified Xboxes with the same issues.
Post by: Lovaboy on November 15, 2002, 08:09:00 PM
Post by: Satan00 on November 15, 2002, 08:11:00 PM
Post by: lucasz on November 15, 2002, 08:26:00 PM
I can tell you why MS isn't letting people know it's a server problem that they're working on. I can tell you why everything looks normal like a highly successful launch with 100% uptime. Imagine how the press would react. Imagine how humiliated MS would be. Imagine a few billion dollars that MS is using to back this service. MS has a LOT riding on Xbox Live and they will do whatever it takes to avoid bad publicity. Hell, I'd lie too if it were my ass on the line!
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 08:31:00 PM
| QUOTE (lucasz @ Nov 16 2002, 03:26 AM) |
| Thanks for clearing this whole mess up. I can tell you why MS isn't letting people know it's a server problem that they're working on. I can tell you why everything looks normal like a highly successful launch with 100% uptime. Imagine how the press would react. Imagine how humiliated MS would be. Imagine a few billion dollars that MS is using to back this service. MS has a LOT riding on Xbox Live and they will do whatever it takes to avoid bad publicity. Hell, I'd lie too if it were my ass on the line! |
YES!
The new XBLive forums have some interesting posts from people who call themselves MVP (huh?) that are somehow connected to XbLive, and admit that something is not right.
They are saying:
"I will try to contact some people tonight and see if I can scare up some details.
For all of you who were beta testers: Please do me and all of your fellow testers a favor and help keep people calm. You all know how freakin' cool XBL is and you can guess how monumentally huge it is to switch from beta into production. Glitches are bound to happen; anybody even remotely connected to software development or system engineering can attest to that!
Please be patient as MS works through this. I'll try to get you information as soon as I can."
Heh...
Post by: Satan00 on November 15, 2002, 08:41:00 PM
Post by: joeflux on November 15, 2002, 08:43:00 PM
Post by: angone54321 on November 15, 2002, 08:50:00 PM
I have the update, and yes the mod was on. I have set up an account, and yes mod was also on. And i pass the connectivity test i get green circles on the 4 tests and says im connected, and yes i did have the mod on. Now the thing is when i try to play a game or view my account it will say cannot connect to live, please try again. Now from what i read u say if i pass the connectivity part, all i have to do is disable my modchip and i will be able to play online.
Is this correct? so if im passing the connect test, all i have to do is disable my chip and i can play.
Post by: lucasz on November 15, 2002, 08:52:00 PM
| QUOTE (angone54321 @ Nov 16 2002, 03:50 AM) |
| so if im passing the connect test, all i have to do is disable my chip and i can play. |
CORRECT
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 08:57:00 PM
| QUOTE (lucasz @ Nov 16 2002, 03:42 AM) |
| Yes, glitches are bound to happen, but whomever decided to roll out the kerberos authentication 4 days before Xbox was released should be shot in the head. Probably some idiot manager. Rolling out the Kerberos and making any other final changes should have been done two weeks before launch. |
LOL!
YES! This should have been handled months earlier during the beta period.
Someone seriously screwed up!
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 08:59:00 PM
Flip the switch and play from ORIGINAL disks.
Post by: Satan00 on November 15, 2002, 09:00:00 PM
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 09:02:00 PM
| QUOTE (Satan00 @ Nov 16 2002, 04:00 AM) |
| its gay how ms decided to do this new "procedure" of sorts right at retail, shoulda done during beta, damn fools |
I'll bet that they thought that they would be giving something away to the modders... typical MS B.S.
Post by: bagel5009 on November 15, 2002, 09:23:00 PM
, but we'll see through the fog in a few days hopefully
Post by: bagel5009 on November 15, 2002, 09:24:00 PM
| QUOTE (opjose @ Nov 16 2002, 03:57 AM) | ||
LOL! YES! This should have been handled months earlier during the beta period. Someone seriously screwed up! |
Simple. They know us hackers OWN them. Period.
Post by: Satan00 on November 15, 2002, 10:10:00 PM
you can not turn your modchip off after you boot your xbox, no way about booting backups there buddy.. you have to play with a disabled-mod xbox, only way, thats if you get connectivity, if you dont, you're fucked, you still should be getting connectivity even with a mod on, just that you cant play games
Post by: fatbastard911 on November 15, 2002, 10:12:00 PM
Post by: Satan00 on November 15, 2002, 10:15:00 PM
thats what i'm understanding here
Post by: angone54321 on November 15, 2002, 10:19:00 PM
Does anyone in here know wtf thier talkin about or is this whole forum just people contradicting what each person says?
Post by: Satan00 on November 15, 2002, 10:19:00 PM
Post by: clifface on November 15, 2002, 10:21:00 PM
Post by: brywalker on November 15, 2002, 10:25:00 PM
THERE IS A BLACKLIST!
The other 2 systems that could connect to xbox live with the mod as of tonite get the...
XBOX LIVE NOT FOUND error!!
This is after updating to the recent version and trying to get on for the past few days.
It looks like they just have a list and they are getting to them one by one. It is just a matter of time before all systems that have tried to get online with a mod are killed.
STOP FOOLING YOURSELVES!
Post by: Fuzzy on November 15, 2002, 10:26:00 PM
Post by: brywalker on November 15, 2002, 10:32:00 PM
I was right about the mod protection.
I was right about it not being random server problems.
But whatever.
When opjose tells you in a couple of days that they are blacklisting systems I will reply with a hearty UP YOURS.
Post by: Fuzzy on November 15, 2002, 10:33:00 PM
Post by: pvwr on November 15, 2002, 10:41:00 PM
| QUOTE |
| HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA your an idiot |
I guess he doesn't deserve that. NONE can tell if there's a blacklist so far, not even opjose, despiste his great efforts to discover everything from client side, he, and nobody else on this end of the stick, can't say whether there is or not a blacklist.
Yes, the connectivity issues on the non-MODDED boxes are server/router/firewall problems. With MODDED boxes that where detected as having a modchip, I don't think so. HERE it may be a mixed bag, and the idea for MS IS to play blind an don't tell straight about the modchip detection, so I really believe they would hide the error as something like that for people to take their modded boxes to service.
And let's not forget that even by yesterday, when people where discussing aboutr modchip detection, there was someone YELLING at every other user claiming that it was a server issue and nothing more than that. So no need to call other people idiot, because you never know tomorrow and what will be proven true ...
Post by: pvwr on November 15, 2002, 10:48:00 PM
| QUOTE |
| ur an idiot brywalker . havnt u been reading anything opjose has been saying, he has been running tests on multiple xboxs. and he sounds like he knows what hes saying. Unlike urself where ur intelligence is explained out by using CAPS and not facts. |
Remember who got the last laugh? Who said there was nothing as modchip detection on Live just yesterday? And yes, he knew what he was saying also
.I expect MS to overcome this modchip switch sooner or later. C'mon, it's not that hard: WTF is a drive F doing on this XBox? What is this ilegal ***dash.xbe file? What is the directory e:\games doing here? MAME-X, did we ever released a game by that name? How come this hard disk has 120GB? No need to be silly, anyone who knows a little programming know that it's even easier to detect than the ilegal code on the modchip.
Also, I bet that they're starting to include the code to detect modchips on games (if they aren't doing that by now), which people are playing and making backups by now and thinking that all's cool, and most likely won't get on Live.
Yeah, people may find hacks, but the way things are going, they won't stop so easily and if people want to play their Live games, yeah, getr a new box, it's easier than following countless threads and hoping that "perhaps tomorrow everything will be fine".
Post by: angone54321 on November 15, 2002, 10:49:00 PM
Post by: Ph34R on November 15, 2002, 10:51:00 PM
Post by: DKo5 on November 15, 2002, 10:56:00 PM
Unfortunately, I get the connectivity issue, so I am out of luck at the moment. I am going to pick up a new system tomorrow (selling my modded one to my brother-in-law), so we'll see how that goes.
Thanks a bunch for all the GREAT info! Thanks to Zander as well for the initial packet sniffing - really good information to gather.
Post by: VaporStone on November 15, 2002, 10:56:00 PM
THANX!!!
Post by: shanafan on November 15, 2002, 10:56:00 PM
| QUOTE |
| This is about the worse CS I have ever heard of. ( Xbox Online Support has joined ) Xbox Online Support : Hello and welcome to the Xbox Interactive Online Support. My name is Francisco. Me: : XBOX LIVE NOT FOUND. I have called and called and called AND NO ONE HAS AN ANSWER FOR ME Xbox Online Support : The service is experiencing some technical problems, due to final adjustments My xbox gives me "XBOX LIVE NOT FOUND" Xbox Online Support : The service is experiencing some technical problems, due to final adjustments Me: What is the "Technical Problem" Xbox Online Support : The Xbox service is unstable now. That mean it may work with only a couple of customers Me: a couple...what 3 people can play XBL? Xbox Online Support : I have received more that 3 complaints about that issue Me: I want to know what the technical problem is. Xbox Online Support : Sorry, we don't handle that sort of questions. If you want further information please contact our tech support team. You can reach them at 1-800-4MY-XBOX (1-800-469-9269), and their hours of operation is from 9am to 1am EST. It's toll free for North America. Me: I have called 4 times already. Me: No one gives me an answers or solutions. Me: Or even an ETA when this problem will be fixed. Xbox Online Support : Sorry, I have no further information for you. Xbox Online Support : Goodbye I have been on the Xbox Forums as well too many Unmodded Xboxs having the same problem. I hope MS fixes this shit, cuz I wanna play. |
LOL...SURE that was what the conversation was
Post by: N00bvin on November 15, 2002, 11:06:00 PM
Post by: shanafan on November 15, 2002, 11:08:00 PM
| QUOTE |
| Am I giving in... for now. I want to play GAMES, the whole POINT of the Xbox and I intend to do it and to have FUN. In less than a month... this may all be worked out (and most places have a 30 day return policy, right?). Not that I would do that, but an option for some. |
I have a blast working with the utilities and downloading games. If it is resolved in less than a month, why did you spend $300 then? You can't return opened games...
Post by: pvwr on November 15, 2002, 11:16:00 PM
Post by: Questioner on November 15, 2002, 11:31:00 PM
Post by: Cybersage on November 15, 2002, 11:49:00 PM
| QUOTE (pvwr @ Nov 16 2002, 06:16 AM) |
| I was following this bullshit for the last 3 days, and guess what, I'm not playing at all, but readind damn posts which in the end solve nothing. |
me too...were just curious I guess
Cheers
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 11:55:00 PM
| QUOTE (angone54321 @ Nov 16 2002, 04:58 AM) |
| ok guys its me again, i have been reading everything u guys have in here. to refresh you guys. i have the executer chip now installed with a swicth. I updated dash , got an account, and i connect throught the status panel perfectly. The mod chip was on during this whole time. But i wasnt able to play a game or view my personal info, it would just say cannot connect to live, try again later. Now i was told from u guys that if i can connect in the status panel all i have to do is boot my xbox with a retail game, [im using nba2k2], and then switch off my chip. And i would be able to play the game. Well i goto Live Play and i select my gamename, and it loads for abit saying signing in user. then says cannot connect to xbox live would u like to goto connect status panel? So i choose "yes" takes me to the panel goes through the 4 checks everything passes. Says im connected. Then i hit done, and takes me back into nba2k3, and i try to play and says the same thing. Cannot connect do u wanna goto the status panel. now i followed everything exactly how u said but its not working. It just makes no sense to me if it connects through the status menu why wouldnt it connect through the game. Is this another WinME disaster, lol " opjose " please respond ur the only guy in here that actually sounds like u know what ur saying. |
Yes it should respond and you should be able to log in.
I'd suggest you first try with the RETAIL DEMO games.
NOTE: there are a LOT of connection problems now.
I only can find a few FAST connections most appear relatively slow.
I have been able to get online for a whacked sessions (in case you see my moniker, yes indeed it's me!) on modded units with the mod chip switched off.
But this normally takes several tries before I get a good connection to a game.
BTW: If you see me on line, I may NOT have the headphones on since I'm testing various machines.
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 11:57:00 PM
| QUOTE (brywalker @ Nov 16 2002, 05:25 AM) |
| Just to let you all know... THERE IS A BLACKLIST! The other 2 systems that could connect to xbox live with the mod as of tonite get the... XBOX LIVE NOT FOUND error!! This is after updating to the recent version and trying to get on for the past few days. It looks like they just have a list and they are getting to them one by one. It is just a matter of time before all systems that have tried to get online with a mod are killed. STOP FOOLING YOURSELVES! |
No you are quite wrong. There is no "blacklist" (YET).
Post by: opjose on November 15, 2002, 11:58:00 PM
| QUOTE (brywalker @ Nov 16 2002, 05:32 AM) |
| Whatever. I am tired of telling people whats going on just to be told I am wrong. I was right about the mod protection. I was right about it not being random server problems. But whatever. When opjose tells you in a couple of days that they are blacklisting systems I will reply with a hearty UP YOURS. |
No again you are wrong.
There are indeed server problems.
There are multiple problems at play at the moment.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 12:07:00 AM
| QUOTE (pvwr @ Nov 16 2002, 05:41 AM) | ||
I guess he doesn't deserve that. NONE can tell if there's a blacklist so far, not even opjose, despiste his great efforts to discover everything from client side, he, and nobody else on this end of the stick, can't say whether there is or not a blacklist. Yes, the connectivity issues on the non-MODDED boxes are server/router/firewall problems. With MODDED boxes that where detected as having a modchip, I don't think so. HERE it may be a mixed bag, and the idea for MS IS to play blind an don't tell straight about the modchip detection, so I really believe they would hide the error as something like that for people to take their modded boxes to service. And let's not forget that even by yesterday, when people where discussing aboutr modchip detection, there was someone YELLING at every other user claiming that it was a server issue and nothing more than that. So no need to call other people idiot, because you never know tomorrow and what will be proven true ... |
I'm PURPOSELY putting modded Xboxes on line to try to get some closure on this AND GET BANNED. So far I haven't "lost" a one.
If the machine has worked since this morning, it has no problems whatsoever as long as you switch off the mod chip to play games.
You can leave it connected to XBLive via the console, or the game itself, all day long with the mod chip turned on.
You can also repeatedly try to connect with a modded machine WITHOUT getting "banned" as some are erroneously assuming.
I've been trying a slew of different combinations and possibilities.
I've gone as far as modifying serial numbers and MAC addresses in the EEPROM (fortunately I haven't ruined a system yet!).
Note: The SERIAL number and MAC address are tied together.
You CAN overcome the CRC checks by carefully adjusting values, e.g. up on one, down on another.
I'm fairly tired of all this testing and breaking up systems.
There is one final thing that I would like to try but I may not...
... taking the EEPROM dump from a working system over to a non-working one and reburning. Of course I'd also would have to swap hard drives.
I STRONGLY suspect that this -WILL- work as this would migrate the machines "identity" from one unit to another.
For those who care...
YES virginia you CAN change the serial number on your machines and the MAC address. It -IS- stored in the EEPROM and not elsewhere.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 12:10:00 AM
| QUOTE (rhipidon @ Nov 16 2002, 07:03 AM) |
| Assuming that there isn't a blacklist yet, why would MS keep us in the dark about the server problems? I've spent 3 hours on the phone tonight trying to get them to admit to either banning serial numbers or having server problems with no luck. Every time I would mention the connectivity problem they would tell me that it was my ISP, or that my MAC address was wrong (which of course it isn't, as I played just fine in the beta). |
Why?
Your guess is as good as mine.
They have NO reason to keep a blacklist secret other than some minor publicity. If anything they have plenty of reasons to publish it's existance if this is what they are doing, to discourage future modders and returned machines.
As someone pointed out, if there are server problems, they have EVERY reason on earth to NOT say anything about it. It would be a HUGE embarassment to the company if this were true.
E.G. Xbox goes Live, and Crashes (headlines),
You can extrapolate the headlines from there on!
Post by: dvdvideo on November 16, 2002, 12:17:00 AM
I just disabled my Matrix in mode 3 and I cannot connect to live servers.
(it passes the first three then fails the forth)
I hope I can find out by tommorow as I have a $30 off coupon that I can use on a second xbox that expires tommorow.
I'd hate to buy it for no reason, but as it stands, based on your info, I have no way of knowing if it is the servers or my box.
One other thing, I put in the memory card into my controller for the first time, it is detected and everything, seems to work fine. However, when I go into my saves on the hard drive the only optin that comes up is delete!
Is there some sort of secret copy function? Or is my box screwed? It did this with both my 40 gig and my 8 gig original, with the mod enabled and disabled!
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 12:23:00 AM
| QUOTE (XboxFan1 @ Nov 16 2002, 07:14 AM) |
| Hey opjose thanks for all your insight! One of the tutorials on how to run a modded XBox and get it to work with XBL says that we should use the ybox bios and put the original xbobdash.xbe back on the file system. Since my evox bios boots up to evoxdash.xbe can I do the following to connect? (I have the beta version of XBL installed already.) 1. Put the original xboxdash.xbe back on the C partition. 2. Disable my mod chip by setting the switches on my Matrix to disabled. 3. Boot normally to the MS Dash to verify it works. 3. Reboot with the XBL final version install disc and install XBL. 4. Play demo or final version XBL live games with the mod chip disabled. I have read every post in here and I believe this is a prudent approach based on the posts I have seen. What's your take? Would your revise or add any steps to the process I have outlined above? Thanks for any input! |
Yes this should work.
However before you go to all of this trouble, TRY the connectivity test as this is currently the best indicator of sucess.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 12:26:00 AM
| QUOTE (dvdvideo @ Nov 16 2002, 07:17 AM) |
| Opjose, great work it is really helpfull to some of us. I just disabled my Matrix in mode 3 and I cannot connect to live servers. (it passes the first three then fails the forth) I hope I can find out by tommorow as I have a $30 off coupon that I can use on a second xbox that expires tommorow. I'd hate to buy it for no reason, but as it stands, based on your info, I have no way of knowing if it is the servers or my box. One other thing, I put in the memory card into my controller for the first time, it is detected and everything, seems to work fine. However, when I go into my saves on the hard drive the only optin that comes up is delete! Is there some sort of secret copy function? Or is my box screwed? It did this with both my 40 gig and my 8 gig original, with the mod enabled and disabled! |
Re: ALWAYS start with the connectivity test.
If it doesn't work, nothing you do will (currently) get you back on.
If the connectivity test works you should be able to disable the mod chip and get online. If you can get logged in, in the game, everything is fine.
Re: Delete
Hit the RIGHT DPAD to go "into" the screen. You are selecting the ICON which only displays DELETE. This is normal.
Post by: angone54321 on November 16, 2002, 12:32:00 AM
Quote
Yes it should respond and you should be able to log in.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 12:37:00 AM
In other words you CANNOT disable it after the boot.
You MUST disable it, then boot. The OEM XBLive dashboard must also be installed on the hard drive.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 12:38:00 AM
| QUOTE (angone54321 @ Nov 16 2002, 07:32 AM) |
| also i heard that my harddrive needs to be locked. i have a upgraded 80gig hard drive i installed, i used one of the HDDprepare programs on it. So i dont know if its locked or not, if it isnt how would i go about locking it. |
To be able to turn OFF your mod chip, your replacement drive -MUST- be locked.
Prepping the drive is not enough. See the tutorial I posted on this.
Post by: RedSlug on November 16, 2002, 12:49:00 AM
| QUOTE (opjose @ Nov 16 2002, 01:47 AM) |
| 1 - Failure of the connectivity test is NOT a mod chip issue at all! The connectivity test SHOULD succeed even if your box is chipped. If it fails there are kerberos/handshaking problems at work which may be related to misconfiguration or problems at MS's servers. The failure will occur with new non-modded systems as well, and seems to be somewhat random. |
If youv'e experienced this with "with new non-modded systems", what did Micosoft say the problem is?
(I cannot get connect from dashboard or game)
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 12:52:00 AM
| QUOTE (RedSlug @ Nov 16 2002, 07:49 AM) | ||
If youv'e experienced this with "with new non-modded systems", what did Micosoft say the problem is? (I cannot get connect from dashboard or game) |
They don't!
They blame EVERYTHING other than their servers!
This has led to all the confusion and people insisting that it's a blacklist.
Post by: RedSlug on November 16, 2002, 12:53:00 AM
Post by: angone54321 on November 16, 2002, 01:00:00 AM
Post by: slappynutz on November 16, 2002, 01:04:00 AM
I know that they'll probably get a permanent ban list together someday, I'm just hoping that they do it later rather than sooner ... ie after the next Xbox price drop so buying a redundant machine just for Live won't sting as much.
Post by: Pr0crastin8r on November 16, 2002, 01:05:00 AM
Opjose, I'm sure you could use some rest from all this chaos.
Post by: joeflux on November 16, 2002, 01:13:00 AM
| QUOTE (lesslinger @ Nov 16 2002, 06:51 AM) |
| just a quick question. where do i go to see how to install the switch?> I have evo2.4 installed. 29 wires. where would i put the switch inbetween what wires? Thanks |
Go to xbox-scene and find the link that teaches you how to put a switch in. That's how I learned today.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 01:14:00 AM
| QUOTE (angone54321 @ Nov 16 2002, 08:00 AM) |
| hahah sorry dude its me again. i hate to bug ya, but i cant find ur tutorial on how to lock the harddrive. and what does locking the harddrive actually do? will i still be able to store backups on it in the future |
sigh...
http://www.xbox-scen...es/lock-hdd.php
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 01:16:00 AM
| QUOTE (slappynutz @ Nov 16 2002, 08:04 AM) |
| Opjose, I've had several Xbox tech support flunkies admit that there are server issues. I saw you post in the official forum over at Xbox.com and that Boid guy seems to indicate that his contacts within the Xbox Live "team" do admit that there are server authentication issues. While that's far from an "official" statement I think they know that there are problems and hopefully will work it out soon. I know that they'll probably get a permanent ban list together someday, I'm just hoping that they do it later rather than sooner ... ie after the next Xbox price drop so buying a redundant machine just for Live won't sting as much. |
Yeah there seems to be a lot of confirmations of server side issues on various threads.
There are just way too many unmodified Xboxes failing to connect too.
And once you DO connect you should see the problems which are occuring right now.
Everyone is complaining about the "server not responding" problems within the game.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 01:17:00 AM
| QUOTE (ChocoboLee @ Nov 16 2002, 08:16 AM) |
| Opjose, thanks for all your hard work in testing this. I really hope there is currently no ban, but what do you think about this... i talked to online support and here is what the guy said: "MS will defend the gaming experience for our users on Xbox Live, and will not approve the use of any game cheating devices for the Xbox gaming platform. This is a violation of the Xbox Live Terms of Use. If users attempt to access Xbox Live with an Xbox installed with modified hardware or unapproved software, their Xbox will be blocked from accessing the service now and in the future. MS reserves the right to take other appropriate action in the future, which could include canceling the user's subscription." "No, unfortunately once a box has been banned it can never be back online. You can use your same account on a new Xbox." He claims that there is a blacklist. Also the fact that you cannot get yourself banned does not mean for sure that there is no blacklist. It's possible that it takes time for all the servers to synch up... i.e. for every server to get the updated blacklist. I guess only time will tell, but I sure hope you are right because I'm thinking of getting myself a Matrix modchip. (I have Enigmah Final now.) Getting a new modchip is much easier and cheaper than buying another Xbox just to play on Xbox Live. Keep up the good work! |
I've already answered this exact post earlier up on this thread.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 01:18:00 AM
| QUOTE (Pr0crastin8r @ Nov 16 2002, 08:05 AM) |
| You know what I say? Let's all go get piss drunk, sleep for a week straight, and wake up when this is all better... Opjose, I'm sure you could use some rest from all this chaos. |
Yeah I'll bet the MS techs would love to do this too, but I bet it's overtime in Redmond this weekend.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 01:20:00 AM
| QUOTE (ChocoboLee @ Nov 16 2002, 08:16 AM) |
| He claims that there is a blacklist. Also the fact that you cannot get yourself banned does not mean for sure that there is no blacklist. It's possible that it takes time for all the servers to synch up... i.e. for every server to get the updated blacklist. I guess only time will tell, but I sure hope you are right because I'm thinking of getting myself a Matrix modchip. (I have Enigmah Final now.) Getting a new modchip is much easier and cheaper than buying another Xbox just to play on Xbox Live. Keep up the good work! |
LOL!
There are ONLY two IP's receiving the authentication requests at present.
There is no "syncing" to speak of as the entire "farm" is sitting in the same room AFAIK.
Post by: wiseblood on November 16, 2002, 01:45:00 AM
I can connect to MechAssault and Ghost Recon and play unencumbered for hours.
I cannot connect anymore to Whacked or MotoGP fom the retail Live disc, even though I was able to after I first bought it earlier today.
Maybe they just blacklisted me from those 2 games, since I can play the other 2 without any problems?
Highly improbable, it sounds more like server problems right now.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 02:03:00 AM
| QUOTE (ChocoboLee @ Nov 16 2002, 08:27 AM) | ||
Thanks! Good to hear. While you are at it.... Matrix or X-ecutorII? And why? Thanks! |
I'm betting on Executor II.
If they do it right it should be less problematic than the Matrix.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 02:14:00 AM
(don't worry it IS safe)
Turn ON your Mod chip & boot your Xbox.
Go into the XBLive Tab and go to account management.
Notice that you now you get a different error message than what others are reporting here when their machines fail to connect (RED X).
This is a kerberos REJECTION of your machine.
Now turn the mod chip OFF and reboot.
Try again.
Notice that now things work. Your machine was accepted via the kerberos servers.
Interesting eh?
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 02:18:00 AM
| QUOTE (angone54321 @ Nov 16 2002, 09:15 AM) |
| hey it me again. on locking the harddrive. i did everything in the tutorial u sent me, and i entered the pass to lock the drive, and it said OK. and sent me back to the a:. so i ran the drive checker again and it showed it was locked. so i threw it back in the xbox with jumpers in correct posistions. but it wont load anything. it wont load from the drive and it wont even load the cd-rw evox. all i get is that repair ur xbox screen. also if i maybe enetered the pass worng would it have accepted it like it did? i dont know im just so stressed out over this just to play some noobs in nba2k3 |
Did you put the drive in the Xbox FIRST, then run EVOLUTION-X's BACKUP command to generate the -NEW- password?
I hope you didn't try to use the password from your original drive which many newbies do!
Post by: ChocoboLee on November 16, 2002, 02:24:00 AM
| QUOTE (opjose @ Nov 16 2002, 09:14 AM) |
| Notice that you now you get a different error message than what others are reporting here when their machines fail to connect (RED X). This is a kerberos REJECTION of your machine. |
What's does this different error message say?
Post by: ZeAuReLiEn on November 16, 2002, 02:25:00 AM
I've got a Xbox with a modified internal bios. I can't disable this bios for the moment (waiting for an X-Ecuter 2 Pro to do that).
I try to setup my Live account, the connexion test is successfull but when I enter my subscription code it is rejected ?
Is that a modchip issue ? That's normal or should I be able to setup my account with the modchip enabled ?
Thanks
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 02:27:00 AM
| QUOTE (angone54321 @ Nov 16 2002, 09:21 AM) |
| ok first off i dont have a backup command in my evox menu. what i did was boot the harddrive and copy the password file to my desktop. is my drive fucked now? |
No!
You must GENERATE the password for the NEW drive via EVOLUTION-X's BACKUP command.
If the command does not appear, you are using an older evox.ini file (probably you copied it from an older version).
Then you FTP the password file down and use it as per the tutorial.
Unlock the drive again using the password you gave it before (hint, copy the text file OFF the floppy disk and print it first!)
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 02:28:00 AM
| QUOTE (ZeAuReLiEn @ Nov 16 2002, 09:25 AM) |
| Hi, I've got a Xbox with a modified internal bios. I can't disable this bios for the moment (waiting for an X-Ecuter 2 Pro to do that). I try to setup my Live account, the connexion test is successfull but when I enter my subscription code it is rejected ? Is that a modchip issue ? That's normal or should I be able to setup my account with the modchip enabled ? Thanks |
That's right, you MUST disable the mod chip to perform ANY account configuration now.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 02:30:00 AM
| QUOTE (ChocoboLee @ Nov 16 2002, 09:24 AM) | ||
What's does this different error message say? |
"Xbox Live service is busy or not available now"
Or something close to that.
It is NOT the same error as the connectivity test message.
If you flip off the mod chip and reboot, the problem goes away!
Post by: ChocoboLee on November 16, 2002, 02:41:00 AM
| QUOTE (opjose @ Nov 16 2002, 09:30 AM) |
| "Xbox Live service is busy or not available now" Or something close to that. It is NOT the same error as the connectivity test message. If you flip off the mod chip and reboot, the problem goes away! |
Thanks. Let's just hope MS gets their act together and fix this "Xbox Live not found" error soon.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 02:49:00 AM
They have a BIG problem on their hands.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 02:57:00 AM
You need to use the unnlock 2.0 program instead.
Post by: slappynutz on November 16, 2002, 03:02:00 AM
Quote
Wow the connection problems are ALL over their own forums now!
Post by: angone54321 on November 16, 2002, 03:03:00 AM
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 03:12:00 AM
| QUOTE (angone54321 @ Nov 16 2002, 10:03 AM) |
| hey dude where do i get unlock 2.0. i download a few and it dont say what versions |
UnLockX.exe Ver 2.0
An all in one program for your hard drive.
This Program is based on source code from Martin Gerdes, an editor of the german "c't" magazine.
The article was published in c't 11/91 "Platten-Auslese - Konfiguration von AT-Bus-Platten lesen"
And more reasentley programs written by imh0 (Miguel).
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1) Now will Lock your hard drive or unlock and disable passwords all in one program !!
2) Will backup your password to a file and will not over-write it
3) Password backup file is time stamped.
4) No need to use atapwd.exe to view drive status.You can see at a glance if your drive is locked or unlocked.
5) Now you only have to enter your password one time.
Requirements
1) UnLockX.exe must be run in pure DOS Mode,No windows dos box.
2) Drive must be on the primary IDE channel ( Master Or Slave).
Note
Please use this program at your own risk.
Post by: angone54321 on November 16, 2002, 04:07:00 AM
Post by: Andola on November 16, 2002, 04:12:00 AM
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 05:25:00 AM
| QUOTE (angone54321 @ Nov 16 2002, 10:33 AM) |
| ok dude i did the unlockX 2.0 i enter the password [triple checked pass] and i select to unlock i hit enter. it tells me drive will not unlock. |
It's either already unlocked or you are using the wrong password.
Please move these posts to another thread. They don't belong here!
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 06:11:00 AM
| QUOTE (Killah2km @ Nov 16 2002, 12:51 PM) |
Hey, now that we know that it is the modchip causing xbl games not to work online, can someone please post a tuitoral on how to make a switch (I use enigma final)  |
Tutorials are on the tutorial page.
Post by: Killah2km on November 16, 2002, 06:24:00 AM
, I am about to go to radioshack now get the goods and install this baby, XBL here I come
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 06:31:00 AM
| QUOTE (Zander @ Nov 16 2002, 01:13 PM) |
| It also might not be a bad idea to come up with terminology for the 2 current live issues. The Live Mod-detection issue and the Live Connectivity issue (I dunno), trouble is, for ALOT of ppl with 0 troubleshooting skills they are not able to properly determine which boat there are in. Which leads to mis-information and hysteria. Might want to clean the faq up a bit (some ppl think turning the mod off AFTER the post that they can get on live, "I switched of off" O_o) and come up with hard terms so there is no splitting of hairs here, other forums and IRC. :/ Willing to help, Z |
You hit the nail on the head.
As frequently happens, eliminating or solving problems like this entails first being able to describe the problem (hmmm isn't that an old programming axiom?).
Newbies and the "sky is falling" crowd tend to further cloud the issues with speculation and conjecture which is often stated as fact even though it's groundless.
WHAT -IS- needed is for someone to save off the EEPROM contents from a working and a non-working machine of EXACTLY the same revision level.
With XBLive installed on both.
Then re-program the two EEPROM's so that the machines "exchange" identities. (they could restore the original contents back afterwards...)
This would help to settle the serialization questions and also point to a possible solution/workaround to the problem.
I'll bet that the connectivity problem will travel with the identity, not the hardware.
I have tried modifying the serial number of a machine, but in so doing I found that the MAC address is also closely tied to the serial number.
This may invalidate the tests reported on xboxhacker.net where they tried this as a potential fix, which did not work.
I'll bet that the eeprom contents must be "consistent" to something at MS... this is why I suspect that swapping may indeed work.
---
It may also be that the M-icrosoft techies are aware of the problem(s) but need some management input as to how to go about implementing the fixes. They STUPIDLY elected to start XBLive on a weekend! (big mistake... duh...)
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 06:32:00 AM
| QUOTE (Killah2km @ Nov 16 2002, 01:24 PM) |
| Sweet thanks MR. opjose , I am about to go to radioshack now get the goods and install this baby, XBL here I come |
Just make sure that the connectivity test works FIRST otherwise your efforts will be in vain for the moment.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 06:38:00 AM
| QUOTE |
One of my modded xboxs was getting the infamous Xbox live not found error. After numerous calls to the very unhelpful desk with no fix. I decided to try a few things to get my box on live again. What eventually fixed it was snagging the serial number/online key/mac address from one of my virgin systems and placing it on the "banned" xbox. After which it hopped right on. After my success I was wondering what would happen if I dumped the old eeprom back on there and I bet you can guess what happened. Xbox live not found. Perhaps someone smarter then me will come up with a better solution then snagging another eeprom from a non-banned box but for now that is what is working for me. |
Note: the machines are -NOT- "banned" the servers are merely not replying to them which is different!
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 07:37:00 AM
| QUOTE (xxxboxxx @ Nov 16 2002, 02:31 PM) |
| Now suppose with me if you will there is a "BLACKLIST" and M$ has a firewall (doesnt have to be a firewall, can just be a program) set up to analyze your connecting packets and check them with a list. If your serial number is on the list your packets are blocked. Thus resulting in not being able to connect. This is possible since this information is sent in your packets: Xbox.Version=1.00.4831.5 Title=0xFFFE0000 TitleVersion=268595456 SN.(MY SERIAL NUMBER)@xbox.com It would also explain while your problem on the systems you cant connect with stay with those systems. I'm sorry I havent read 10 pages of posts but I wonder have you tried changing the serial number of the none working ones to one of the working ones? To test this? |
I have no desire to retype pages and pages of posts to prove my original assertions yet again, but suffice it to say that the blocking is an ACCIDENT for the moment.
The mod chip detection is NOT!
These two things are NOT equal.
Yes kerberos authentication could be purposely made to block certain machines. But someone screwed up royally as it's blocking non-modded systems in droves as well!
And -YES- you can transfer the "identity" of one machine to another to fix the connectivity problem.
HOWEVER the two machines can never be on the same LAN, network, or internet at the same time again... ever.
Post by: CybrJnkie on November 16, 2002, 08:20:00 AM
Using Enigmah with a switch. Flashed bios already with a WD 100 gig 5400 RPM drive in there. Thanks
Post by: Suicide28 on November 16, 2002, 10:22:00 AM
| QUOTE (glock115 @ Nov 16 2002, 05:19 PM) |
| In my opinion they are banning serial numbers. I have been able to connect with no problem with my chip disabled but I did make several attempts (in the name of testing) to sign on with the mod chip enabled. This morning rolls around and I am unable to sign on. I was able to get on as late as yesterday morning. Explain that one. |
Are you getting the "Xbox Live Not Responding" or "Not Found"? I am getting the Not responding error when just trying to edit my account.
Is this serverside issues or is this the dreaded modchip detection?
Sorry if this was already answered.
Post by: boblinders on November 16, 2002, 10:26:00 AM
Post by: Suicide28 on November 16, 2002, 10:28:00 AM
| QUOTE (glock115 @ Nov 16 2002, 05:26 PM) |
| XBOX LIVE NOT FOUND |
So i would have to assume that if i am getting a NOT RESPONDING it is the serverside and i have not yet been hit with the modchip detection?
Post by: bornonce on November 16, 2002, 10:45:00 AM
| QUOTE (Suicide28 @ Nov 16 2002, 05:28 PM) | ||
So i would have to assume that if i am getting a NOT RESPONDING it is the serverside and i have not yet been hit with the modchip detection? |
The key is to HOW FAST you get the "XBOX LIVE NOT FOUND" from the dashboard. If you go through the first three steps and then IMMEDIATELY get "Xbox Live Not Found" your machine has been disabled from even ATTEMPTING to connect. There is no negotiation with the server.
Real connectivity issues take much longer. This has been thoroughly discussed by the myriad of Beta testers who can no longer use a modded machine that worked PERFECTLY until the last couple of days of Beta testing. It is a modchip issue in this case, and those that won't finally accept the fact are in hopeful denial.
Sorry to burst your bubble of optimism.
Post by: Suicide28 on November 16, 2002, 10:48:00 AM
| QUOTE (bornonce @ Nov 16 2002, 05:45 PM) | ||||
The key is to HOW FAST you get the "XBOX LIVE NOT FOUND" from the dashboard. If you go through the first three steps and then IMMEDIATELY get "Xbox Live Not Found" your machine has been disabled from even ATTEMPTING to connect. There is no negotiation with the server. Real connectivity issues take much longer. This has been thoroughly discussed by the myriad of Beta testers who can no longer use a modded machine that worked PERFECTLY until the last couple of days of Beta testing. It is a modchip issue in this case, and those that won't finally accept the fact are in hopeful denial. Sorry to burst your bubble of optimism. |
My bubble is not burst so much, it takes around 15 - 20 seconds before i get the message back. So it sounds like it might be a server issue. I dunno. Maybe a bit too hopeful.
Post by: clifface on November 16, 2002, 10:50:00 AM
Post by: bornonce on November 16, 2002, 11:04:00 AM
Second, they tipped their hand. Instead of waiting until the actual service had gone live (including the UK) and catching THOUSANDS of modchip users now everybody with a modchip knows to simply disable it until you go live. Now you have really unbalanced the playing field, because games like Motogp allow you to build custom riders and open unlockables OFF-LINE, which can easily be done with a pirated copy of the game. With the new tools coming out, it has been demonstrated how an XBE can be changed to an EXE, dissassembled and edited, and the changed back to an XBE. (See the SEGA GT tutorial for an example so cheating off-line to be used on-line looks like a real possibility.
The NEXT step might be more ominous. Suppose in the future every game uses modchip detection. This could be flagged in a hidden file to your HDD. Go online even with the modchip disabled, BANG!, you are nailed. Games themselves might implement modchip rejection, so that use of backups would be rendered useless (at least until an XBox guru figures out how to defeat it).
However, this should really energize the underground XBox community. Since it was the Beta testers that got shafted, I wish them the greatest of success in defeating MS.
Post by: bornonce on November 16, 2002, 11:07:00 AM
| QUOTE (Suicide28 @ Nov 16 2002, 05:48 PM) |
| My bubble is not burst so much, it takes around 15 - 20 seconds before i get the message back. So it sounds like it might be a server issue. |
Yes, if it takes 15-20 seconds for you to get that from the dashboard that is not the modchip problem. The modchip problem displays the message in under a second.
Post by: CFL on November 16, 2002, 11:14:00 AM
Why do I get the "Xbox Live not found" error?
During the beta, you can check the status of the servers on the home page of the beta Web site. If the service is up and running and you receive this error, you are likely having a different problem. Here's are a couple things you can try:
First, make sure that your Xbox is connected directly to your modem. Next, power your modem down for 2–3 minutes and then power it back up again. This power- cycling of the modem is sometimes necessary when changing from one device to another (in this case, changing from your PC and connecting your Xbox).
If you're still seeing the same error, you may need to manually configure the MAC address on the Xbox to match the MAC address of your PC. You can find this setting in the "Advanced" section of the Network Settings menu in the Dashboard. If you are unsure about how to determine the MAC address on your PC, or if you are still unable to connect after configuring the MAC address, call technical support at 0800 587 1102.
This is just bs! They know they have problems and are making suggestions that just don't work. I have tried this a few times and still no luck.
Post by: GeForce2000 on November 16, 2002, 11:16:00 AM
Post by: bornonce on November 16, 2002, 11:33:00 AM
| QUOTE (GeForce2000 @ Nov 16 2002, 06:16 PM) |
| So would it be safe to say that most of the beta testers aren't able to get online? Because it kinda makes me wonder how many of us here were beta testers and now find ourself not able to get on. And how no beta testers with moded boxes can. |
Such a blanket statement would be inaccurate.
(1). Many Beta testers who went online with the modchip enabled can no longer get online. The box doesn't even try. This is the XBOX DISABLED mode.
(2). Some Beta testers have modded boxes but never went on-line with an alternate BIOS. This is the MODDED XBOX that has not been detected (yet) mode.
(3). Some Beta testers have used a modded box online, but were not put in the XBOX DISABLED mode. This might be a function of which server they happened to connect to at a given time. Perhaps not all of the Beta servers were running with the same state configuration during Beta testing? Their xboxes will probably be prevented from connecting at the server (it is a different mode; this one seems to be server rejection rather than the XBOX DISABLED mode).
(4). Some Beta testers are just having connectivity issues that have nothing to do with modchips. This is a true server-side validation or connection issue.
I have seen (or at least heard of) examples of all of the above. But this much is clear: you are inviting disaster if you go on-line with a modchip enabled (if it is using an alternate BIOS. Mode 3 connectivity is not an issue becuase it uses the original BIOS). Don't do it!
Post by: Fuzzy on November 16, 2002, 11:38:00 AM
)
Post by: glock115 on November 16, 2002, 11:45:00 AM
Post by: Satan00 on November 16, 2002, 11:45:00 AM
i would say something, but i'm acting a lil lazy, all i know that theres no way you're gonna play the fucker with a mod on, if you get connectivity, you get connectivity, if you dont, its ms's fault
this was my 500th post, wheee
Post by: glock115 on November 16, 2002, 12:06:00 PM
Post by: nic949 on November 16, 2002, 12:07:00 PM
| QUOTE (MadEx @ Nov 16 2002, 10:57 AM) |
| Has anyone tried the eject hack trick? Does this allow you to go online? I don't feel like opening my X-Box everytime I want to play Live, and everytime I want to play THPS4 off my HD. Any good tutorials on fitting an extendable switch to a Matrix? |
http://xbox-scene.fx...217eb19767eb8a9
Post by: MadEx on November 16, 2002, 12:12:00 PM
| QUOTE (glock115 @ Nov 16 2002, 07:06 PM) |
| Yes you will be able to go online with the eject trick which basically disables the chip. Dont, however, make the mistake of attempting to sign on with the chip enabled because you may suffer the same fate which I have which is being BANNED. |
Don't scare me, I've tried it ONCE with MechAssault...
Post by: bornonce on November 16, 2002, 12:17:00 PM
Post by: Satan00 on November 16, 2002, 12:19:00 PM
Post by: bornonce on November 16, 2002, 12:21:00 PM
| QUOTE (Satan00 @ Nov 16 2002, 07:19 PM) |
| i wonder if MS even knows they have server problems, or even cares |
Iam reasonably sure they care. They don't want to suddenly get a lot of bad press about how unhappy users are with their new service. First impressions are sometimes all the public remembers.
Post by: bornonce on November 16, 2002, 12:24:00 PM
| QUOTE (Metroid-X @ Nov 16 2002, 07:20 PM) |
| How do you defeat it? |
Simple. Never go online when you are running an alternate BIOS. The current software seems to detect modchips only when running the live startup software. We'll just have to see what future software can do, however (including next-generation games. UH!!!).
Post by: Questioner on November 16, 2002, 12:33:00 PM
Post by: MadEx on November 16, 2002, 12:55:00 PM
Post by: er0sion on November 16, 2002, 01:16:00 PM
| QUOTE (brywalker @ Nov 16 2002, 05:32 AM) |
| Whatever. I am tired of telling people whats going on just to be told I am wrong. I was right about the mod protection. I was right about it not being random server problems. But whatever. When opjose tells you in a couple of days that they are blacklisting systems I will reply with a hearty UP YOURS. |
Actually, i somewhat believe you. I dont own a modchip (yet) or xboxlive, but MS cant really afford let users hackup their console and stuff anymore than they already do (well they can because they have a big budget, but you know what i mean). Also, if you read that MS post from the xbox forums, it says:
"Q: Will MS block modified Xboxes? What will MS do with boxes that have been modified?"
MS will defend the gaming experience for our users on Xbox Live, and will not approve the use of any game cheating devices for the Xbox gaming platform. This is a violation of the Xbox Live Terms of Use. If users attempt to access Xbox Live with an Xbox installed with modified hardware or unapproved software, their Xbox will be blocked from accessing the service now and in the future. MS reserves the right to take other appropriate action in the future, which could include canceling the user's subscription.
Xboxlive is a revolutionary step for any gaming console. Therefore, they are proably assuming that many of its xbox users will utilize the online capability since broadband is more widely available and cheaper. With that thought in mind, if many of its users use xboxlive, they can use that to their advantage to combat piracy.
So although they might not be doing anything now, i think it would be safe to assume that they do have the capability of getting some internal information from the xbox when connected and using that to blacklist your box. Although it might be safe to switch off your chip now, i would still be weary. Fortunately there are alternatives to xboxlive. MS didnt hire someone to keep track of modchip scene for nothing. This sort of stuff has always been a cat and mouse game. Hackers ALWAYS have the advantage, ALWAYS. I have a feeling the xbox is in for a very bumpy ride (for xboxlive users anyway). Just remember, MS has an anti-piracy TEAM with a few brains while the scene has a COMMUNITY with a few thousand.
Post by: Zander on November 16, 2002, 01:42:00 PM
Z
Post by: VaporStone on November 16, 2002, 01:48:00 PM
Post by: Robeyone on November 16, 2002, 01:52:00 PM
X: 0000 - F021
Y: 00AB - 6860
Z: 8015 - 1917
Just a thought
Post by: Fuzzy on November 16, 2002, 01:55:00 PM
Post by: Zander on November 16, 2002, 02:04:00 PM
They are just a obsfuciated way of showing your Ip configuration information. It's coded form of your IP, DNS, etc.
Z
Post by: dvdvideo on November 16, 2002, 03:21:00 PM
The old machine won't even connect to xbox live to tell me I have a good or bad account. It's all ok anyhow, I kind of wanted a clean machine to play xbox live on. That way I know I can play no matter what happens to the other one. The modded one will never go online.
Post by: Robeyone on November 16, 2002, 03:21:00 PM
Post by: weez on November 16, 2002, 03:33:00 PM
| QUOTE (dvdvideo @ Nov 16 2002, 03:21 PM) |
| For anyone who wanted to know, bought a new machine today and recovered the xbox live account, works perfectly. The old machine won't even connect to xbox live to tell me I have a good or bad account. It's all ok anyhow, I kind of wanted a clean machine to play xbox live on. That way I know I can play no matter what happens to the other one. The modded one will never go online. |
dvdvideo,
Why buy just one new xbox, why not two new boxes. Just feed in to M$'s pockets.
Next thing you know they will ban your XBL account because it logged on with a modded box (read your user agreement, they have the right). Then you'll probably go out and buy another kit too.
This S#!T makes me sick.
Weez
Post by: Fuzzy on November 16, 2002, 03:34:00 PM
) says that its a server problem and we should wait...then we wait...dont you know anything about these forums? lol
Post by: Fuzzy on November 16, 2002, 04:33:00 PM
Hes like superman
Post by: bsmack on November 16, 2002, 05:21:00 PM
Post by: dvdvideo on November 16, 2002, 05:27:00 PM
Post by: cyberblade on November 16, 2002, 06:02:00 PM
Post by: Sarkoon on November 16, 2002, 06:10:00 PM
| QUOTE (Robeyone @ Nov 16 2002, 08:52 PM) |
| Has anyone thought of checking the error codes that you get when you fail to connect to see if there is some simularities. Test you connectivity and then hit the yellow button and post what your X, Y, and Z result was. If we see simularities between the boxes that may tell us something. X: 0000 - F021 Y: 00AB - 6860 Z: 8015 - 1917 Just a thought |
I recorded my X Y and Z information before I modded my xbox, and before I started having any connection problems. Here's the comparison:
Pre-Mod, Everything Working Config:
X: 0000 - F001
Y: 00A8 - 4860
Z: 8015 - 1917
After-Mod, while experiencing "Xbox Live Not Found" Error:
X: 0000 - F001
Y: 00A8 - 6820
Z: 8015 - 190D
Now I realize some of that information is a hash of IP settings, but mind you I changed nothing. Same Internal IP, same DNS server, etc.
I wonder what information DID change?
-Sarkoon
Post by: GRiMMX on November 16, 2002, 07:26:00 PM
XBOX LIVE,... the server info is in the game it self,.. (says xbox techies)
Can't sum1 figure out a way to create their own server?
Can't sum1 change the setting in the game itself to direct you to the server of choice (not M$)?
if so,.. this would give us our own NON-M$ XBOX Live!
or,.. am i wrong?
Post by: 7stu7 on November 16, 2002, 08:01:00 PM
Post by: GRiMMX on November 16, 2002, 08:09:00 PM
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 10:49:00 PM
| QUOTE (bornonce @ Nov 16 2002, 06:07 PM) | ||
Yes, if it takes 15-20 seconds for you to get that from the dashboard that is not the modchip problem. The modchip problem displays the message in under a second. |
No!
QUIT spreading this incorrect crap!
There is -NO- mod chip detection during the connectivity test phase.
Mod chip detection is ONLY done at game launch. Period.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 10:53:00 PM
| QUOTE (bornonce @ Nov 16 2002, 06:57 PM) | ||
opjose originnaly said that NONE of the connectivity issues were modchip related(look at his early posts). He has now changed his tune (look at his later posts). 3900 posts, of which 3900 have had some inaccuracies. Earlier posts were FLAT WRONG!!! If you don't believe me then go ahead, use your modded xbox with alternate BIOS enabled, find yourself no longer able to connect sometime in the future, then you and opjose can spend the rest of your lives trying to figure out why you are having server-side problems. And for your information NONE of my posts have been wrong. I have speculated on what might be happening, but then I clearly stated that it was speculation. |
No I haven't changed my original position.
It is NOT a mod chip issue. You are merely twisting things to conform to your unfortunately erroneous assumptions which are not ground in any fact.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 10:54:00 PM
| QUOTE (glock115 @ Nov 16 2002, 07:06 PM) |
| Yes you will be able to go online with the eject trick which basically disables the chip. Dont, however, make the mistake of attempting to sign on with the chip enabled because you may suffer the same fate which I have which is being BANNED. |
Mod chip or no, you are not being "banned".
This is idiotic at present.
It occurs with the same frequency on non-modded systems as well.
Previously working non-modded machines have been dropping off like flies all day!
I lost two non-modded units today.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 10:55:00 PM
| QUOTE (bornonce @ Nov 16 2002, 07:24 PM) | ||
Simple. Never go online when you are running an alternate BIOS. The current software seems to detect modchips only when running the live startup software. We'll just have to see what future software can do, however (including next-generation games. UH!!!). |
Again WRONG!
Mod chip detection is only implemented in game startup.
You can hit the connectivity test all day long or even try to log in via the games and NEVER get any problems whatso ever when you later disable the mod chip.
Duh.
Post by: mzenone on November 16, 2002, 10:58:00 PM
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 11:02:00 PM
| QUOTE (Sarkoon @ Nov 17 2002, 01:10 AM) | ||
I recorded my X Y and Z information before I modded my xbox, and before I started having any connection problems. Here's the comparison: Pre-Mod, Everything Working Config: X: 0000 - F001 Y: 00A8 - 4860 Z: 8015 - 1917 After-Mod, while experiencing "Xbox Live Not Found" Error: X: 0000 - F001 Y: 00A8 - 6820 Z: 8015 - 190D Now I realize some of that information is a hash of IP settings, but mind you I changed nothing. Same Internal IP, same DNS server, etc. I wonder what information DID change? -Sarkoon |
X Y and Z are not related to something IN the machine.
It is directly related to connectivity testing.
Wanna see?
Disconnect your patch cable and try the "Y" trick.
Interesting eh?
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 11:11:00 PM
| QUOTE (mzenone @ Nov 17 2002, 05:58 AM) |
| if its not a mod detection at dash(opjose)...so why does my modded xbox fail at connection (at dash), but my non-modded unit doesnt?.... |
I have no desire to retype everything again.
Read from the top and the other pinned topic and you will have your answer.
Post by: CireZero on November 16, 2002, 11:16:00 PM
I can connect in the dash but i can't connect to creat a new account. My chip is disabled... but i can connect to one but not the other.. any thoughts.
Post by: Retard Monkey on November 16, 2002, 11:20:00 PM
Amen.
Post by: CireZero on November 16, 2002, 11:21:00 PM
Honestly i think Opjose works for M$ and is our informant to help us out.. haha.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 11:40:00 PM
| QUOTE (CireZero @ Nov 17 2002, 06:16 AM) |
| OpJose.. now here's something for you... I can connect in the dash but i can't connect to creat a new account. My chip is disabled... but i can connect to one but not the other.. any thoughts. |
Yeah this is a known server side problem at M-icrosoft.
It also happened during the beta for a while.
It actually happened to me when I first went to activate my account(s).
It took almost a week before MS corrected the problem.
You are not the only one seeing this as the XBLive forums are replete with similiar postings from people.
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 11:41:00 PM
| QUOTE (CireZero @ Nov 17 2002, 06:21 AM) |
| Amen brother Retard... Honestly i think Opjose works for M$ and is our informant to help us out.. haha. |
<---- Oh no!
I've been labeled MS "Spy".
Post by: opjose on November 16, 2002, 11:43:00 PM
| QUOTE (Retard Monkey @ Nov 17 2002, 06:20 AM) |
| Retard Monkey WARNS whoever "talk back" at Mr. opjose.... he good man, but will strike you down with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to destroy and poison my brothers. And you will KNOW his name is the opjose when he lays his vengeance upon thee. Amen. |
GAWD it's nice to have "Retard Monkey" around here to introduce levity.
After sailing thru a slew of posts from the clueless (some who deserve summary execution for their alarmist ways) it's posts from the Retard Monkey that bring me back to earth.
Post by: DaGamePimp on November 17, 2002, 01:44:00 AM
--- DGP ---
Post by: angone54321 on November 17, 2002, 02:08:00 AM
Post by: opjose on November 17, 2002, 02:44:00 AM
| QUOTE (angone54321 @ Nov 17 2002, 09:08 AM) |
| ok i have a real question this time. u guys talk about replacing all the xboxdash and stuff. but what if i just load evox from the cd if i wanna play a backup live game? wouldnt that just eliminate all the worry about the files. Since the xboxdash will all be default. |
No.
You are confusing the XbLive problems with the dashboard update nuking issue.
These are all seperate.
Post by: warbeast on November 17, 2002, 05:04:00 AM
i say this because it looks like stops the serial numbers in the mod bios ie evolutionx bios and when u turn mod off it works as they see the eeprom serial numbers so what if u take them serial numbers and use then in your mod/bios?
Post by: ZeAuReLiEn on November 17, 2002, 11:19:00 AM
| QUOTE (opjose @ Nov 17 2002, 05:55 AM) | ||||
Again WRONG! Mod chip detection is only implemented in game startup. You can hit the connectivity test all day long or even try to log in via the games and NEVER get any problems whatso ever when you later disable the mod chip. Duh. |
When I try to setup my Live account with an enabled Modchip that says my subscription number is incorrect. I can't try with a disabled mochip but it seems that problems can occur before the launch of a game...
Post by: VaporStone on November 17, 2002, 11:29:00 AM
THANX
Post by: tbryce311 on November 17, 2002, 01:13:00 PM
what Im not getting though is tgs.xboxlive.com seems to only be an aliase of as.xboxlive.com
Post by: angone54321 on November 17, 2002, 01:15:00 PM
Post by: tbryce311 on November 17, 2002, 01:25:00 PM
Post by: NetJunkie on November 17, 2002, 01:27:00 PM
| QUOTE (tbryce311 @ Nov 17 2002, 08:13 PM) |
| I geuss we could all be a bunch of pricks and unite a DOS attack against their servers..... what Im not getting though is tgs.xboxlive.com seems to only be an aliase of as.xboxlive.com |
My guess is later they'll be migrated to seperate systems.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 12:41:00 AM
| QUOTE (emoney @ Nov 20 2002, 07:30 AM) |
| ok, opjose, just to get this straight..... you can go to the OEM dashboard with the mod chip OFF any time you want right?? |
Heh, let me restate this.
With the mod chip OFF you can -ONLY- go to the OEM dashboard as evolution-X will not run!
Post by: Beantown on November 20, 2002, 01:07:00 AM
GREAT work opjose!!!
Post by: ArMaGeDdOn on November 20, 2002, 01:44:00 AM
opjose is the main man. i'm just taking guesses here. so, yeah. don't trust the system even with your modchip set to off. only trust a physical disconnect. for now.
hopefully something comes through. remember, hasn't even been a week since release of xbox live. lots of breakthroughs [well, just really good theories and ideas] have come through so far. let's wait to see what they do for us.
Post by: ArMaGeDdOn on November 20, 2002, 02:02:00 AM
and matrix is easy to install. just don't ask how i burnt mine. anyways, no, mine turned out fine. i had to rewire parts of the chip, but it's basically easy to do. very easy. don't pay more than $3 for installation of it since it's not hard to do.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 03:57:00 AM
| QUOTE (Beantown @ Nov 20 2002, 08:07 AM) |
| So, is it feasible to develop a utility to "reset" the "report-in-flag"? Or some other way to recover the EEprom to original based on current contents with a "set" flag? GREAT work opjose!!! |
Yes and no.
Once the Xbox is on the "list" so to speak, the damage is done.
This is why the utility to modify the serial number/mac and header is needed.
This MAY permit us to UNDO the banning, then coupled with the F:boot bios you would have a workable way around the entire problem.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 04:01:00 AM
| QUOTE (emoney @ Nov 20 2002, 08:32 AM) |
| sorry for being a newbie..... but now you got me confused..... you said MS CAN detect a mod chip even when off, but you say you can use live if you keep you never visit the xboxdash or go to the live menu of a game with the mod chip on..... which is it? |
No they cannot ACTUALLY detect a mod chip when off.
They utilize "misdirection".
E.G. they get you to run the updated dashboard (with mod chip detection code built in) when you turn ON your Xbox. This sets something (a flag, a bit?)
Then even if you turn the mod chip OFF, upon the next connection your Xbox "reports in" that you have a mod chip in your machine.
After that bye bye connection.
This is why you CAN use Live if you NEVER use the updated M-icrosoft dashboard (and/or game) with your mod chip turned ON.
The F_Boot bios gives you a workaround.
As I posted previously you must make sure that NO ONE -EVER- boots up and runs an XboxLive enabled game, then attempts a connection, with the mod chip turned on or you are SOL again.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 04:04:00 AM
| QUOTE (emoney @ Nov 20 2002, 09:18 AM) |
| what's the best bios (for live as well) and can matrix only have one? and is there an option to never boot to xbox dashboard? |
You CAN do this but you have to be very careful with a few settings and things.
Your best bet is to start with the F_boot bioses, which get you half way there.
Then BEFORE you install the Xbox Live "update" disk, copy your C:\ partition to F:\
Install Evolution-X to F:\
Point it's XboxDashboard entries to F:\msxboxdash.xbe
THEN with the mod chip OFF and rebooted, run the XBLive updates.
Bingo a relatively SAFE Xbox as long as you keep people out of XBLive games with the mod chip ON.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 04:08:00 AM
| QUOTE (ArMaGeDdOn @ Nov 20 2002, 08:44 AM) |
| sorry, the detect even with chip off is my theory. because technically the chip is still attached, and we're not sure how MS checks for a modchip [not 100% sure anyways], i just said that it's best to be cautious about that. opjose is the main man. i'm just taking guesses here. so, yeah. don't trust the system even with your modchip set to off. only trust a physical disconnect. for now. hopefully something comes through. remember, hasn't even been a week since release of xbox live. lots of breakthroughs [well, just really good theories and ideas] have come through so far. let's wait to see what they do for us. |
It's almost impossible for them to detect an LPC mod chip with the LPC mod switched OFF.
Their "trick" to getting you to run a mod chip detection snippet of code with the chip ON is what gets you.
It's a bit of subterfuge on their part, but it's quite effective.
Thanks to my still working MODDED Xbox I know this is the case.
I sacrificed another one to provide a control.
(Thank god for good and patient friends!)
Post by: b0b on November 20, 2002, 05:59:00 AM
Zander seems to have a deep understanding of the server structure MS is employing with live. Would it be possible once we had the required information about the packets to patch the xbox and xbl dash so it would spoof the authorization ticket?
Post by: mavmf on November 20, 2002, 06:25:00 AM
| QUOTE |
They utilize "misdirection". E.G. they get you to run the updated dashboard (with mod chip detection code built in) when you turn ON your Xbox. This sets something (a flag, a bit?) Then even if you turn the mod chip OFF, upon the next connection your Xbox "reports in" that you have a mod chip in your machine. After that bye bye connection. This is why you CAN use Live if you NEVER use the updated M-icrosoft dashboard (and/or game) with your mod chip turned ON. |
I have a matrix chip in mode 3 with ONLY the MS dash installed.
I therefore have gone to the MS dashboard with the modchip enabled as I don't have any other dash to go to (and I don't always boot straight to a game when I turn it on)
I haven't been banned in over a week yet.
The thing I haven't done is try the connection attempt or change any settings in the dashboard with the modchip enabled.
So it seems to me that I CAN access the MS dashboard with my modchip enabled, without it settting a flag to ban me the next time I connect with the modchip off. Maybe I'm just lucky... anyway I'm prepared to buy another box when this one eventually does get banned.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 06:48:00 AM
| QUOTE (b0b @ Nov 20 2002, 11:27 AM) |
| We'll If Zander is right then this flag or bit must have been created by the XBL beta disc. It might be possible that code in both the updated xboxdash.xbe as well as XBL's xbe are cooperating, in that the ms dash is detecting not the mod but the fact that homebrew software is running on the box via HD scanning. XBL's installer obviously had the power to read the contents of the drive at this time back when XBL was in beta. So then it scanned the c: e: f: drives for known evox dashbroad names as we'll as sizes and checksums. That is why people with there evox dash named as xboxdash.xbe had there files updated. The update knowning that xboxdash.xbe is what was popular to name the evox dash ignored the fact the checksums didn't match what it expected and overwrote it with the update code then it wrote data somewhere safe about the fact the checksum didn't match. On Nov 15 upon running the XBL live dashborad that flag was sent to the XBL and the server allowed you to connect for the purposes of dumping your eeprom to ban your mac address as we'll as the header (they didn't look for the serial number since they already had it since you needed to be a registered member at xbox.com to enter the beta. if this is true then when the online key zander speaks of is transmitted to XBL it says to the server ok this is valid but our server says it's also banned and then returns an incorrect redirect command to multicast for the XBL serice as Zander said. If i'm right then useing the blank serial eeprom from pixel8 before useing xbl would of also prevented this at least up until the ban which wouldn't matter since they never got your orginal eeprom in the first place wish I had thought of that before. |
No they are not scanning the drives, as I've been able to take a drive from a NON-working machine and transfer it to a working one without problem.
(of course after unlocking and relocking).
The only thing which has kept the second modded machine connected is that I have NEVER used the M-icrosoft dashboard and Xbox Live with the mod chip turned on.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 06:49:00 AM
| QUOTE (mavmf @ Nov 20 2002, 01:25 PM) | ||
I have a matrix chip in mode 3 with ONLY the MS dash installed. I therefore have gone to the MS dashboard with the modchip enabled as I don't have any other dash to go to (and I don't always boot straight to a game when I turn it on) I haven't been banned in over a week yet. The thing I haven't done is try the connection attempt or change any settings in the dashboard with the modchip enabled. So it seems to me that I CAN access the MS dashboard with my modchip enabled, without it settting a flag to ban me the next time I connect with the modchip off. Maybe I'm just lucky... anyway I'm prepared to buy another box when this one eventually does get banned. |
Yeap it could be at connection time via the XBLive tab.
When the animation is running the packets are initially sent out.
This is why the failure looks almost instant to the "banned" boxes.
Post by: Beantown on November 20, 2002, 06:58:00 AM
| QUOTE (opjose @ Nov 20 2002, 10:57 AM) |
| Yes and no. Once the Xbox is on the "list" so to speak, the damage is done. This is why the utility to modify the serial number/mac and header is needed. This MAY permit us to UNDO the banning, then coupled with the F:boot bios you would have a workable way around the entire problem. |
So your convinced that there is really a list after reporting in for the first time?
I was thinking that maybe the "flag" is now built in to the eeprom or other encrypted header info when attempting to establish a connection. This way M$ doesn't need to maintain a "list".
Post by: __Blaz0__ on November 20, 2002, 07:57:00 AM
Post by: shommel on November 20, 2002, 08:03:00 AM
is it out yet?
Steve
Post by: HeavenX007 on November 20, 2002, 08:07:00 AM
| QUOTE |
| One question here, has anyone tried to wipe their HDD clean(Back to original state) and reload the software for live? Basically start over. I am thinking of doin this myself, but need to get my switch installed |
but if you already got listed and banned then it wont matter what you do to your system, unless you can replace your serial and mac as well.
Post by: Sev on November 20, 2002, 08:12:00 AM
So the current idea seems that xboxdash.xbe is doing a check and setting an EEPROM flag which is picked up on the next Live connect attempt.
Firstly, has anyone with a modded but unbanned machine (and an EEPROM backup) been able to see a change in the X, Y and Z values when they attempt to connect to Live without a CAT5 cable plugged in, after going to the MS updated dash?
Even without the connection test, has dropping into the updated xboxdash.xbe with a modchip on effected a change in the EEPROM settings?
As far as I can tell, moving from Live beta to full live didn't change my xboxdash.xbe or the xodash directory contents - xboxdash.xbe only changed once, and that was when the Beta Live was installed. I have backups of my system state in each of these three situations - before beta, with beta, with full, I'll compare them a little later.
The 'Live performing an update' happened to me when I ran the MotoGP demo from the full Live disc. This appeared to load a new MotoGP XBE file onto the E drive. I didn't notice any other major changes.
There are fragments of 'connection' messages in the xboxdash.xbe file,
has anyone noticed network activity from the dash at any point, even before trying to do a connectivity test?
The X, Y and Z settings. At least some of these seem to be bitfields, for example bit 5 of X (if you see it as a 32 bit number) appears to mean 'MAC address overriden). Does anyone have any more?
Maybe it's also time to move this to a new thread eg 'What's really happening'?
Post by: __Blaz0__ on November 20, 2002, 08:12:00 AM
Post by: Sev on November 20, 2002, 08:27:00 AM
For me, there are no differences between the beta and full versions of:
xboxdash.xbe
xodash\xonlinedash.xbe
xodash\update.xbe
This was a PAL beta. The files were dated 23 August 2002.
The lengths, respectively, are:
1,633,220 bytes
1,819,192 bytes
1,914,880 bytes
Post by: BenJeremy on November 20, 2002, 08:41:00 AM
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 09:12:00 AM
| QUOTE (Beantown @ Nov 20 2002, 01:58 PM) | ||
So your convinced that there is really a list after reporting in for the first time? I was thinking that maybe the "flag" is now built in to the eeprom or other encrypted header info when attempting to establish a connection. This way M$ doesn't need to maintain a "list". |
No I've reflashed a non-working Xbox with an eeprom dump I made ages ago. No go.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 09:13:00 AM
| QUOTE (__Blaz0__ @ Nov 20 2002, 02:57 PM) |
| One question here, has anyone tried to wipe their HDD clean(Back to original state) and reload the software for live? Basically start over. I am thinking of doin this myself, but need to get my switch installed first. |
Yeap, doesn't help for the connectivity problems.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 09:13:00 AM
| QUOTE (shommel @ Nov 20 2002, 03:03 PM) |
| What is f_boot bios anyway. is it out yet? Steve |
Yes, it loads the dashboard from F:\
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 09:19:00 AM
| QUOTE (Sev @ Nov 20 2002, 03:12 PM) |
| I guess it's about time we actually start looking at what's really happening around the detection side of things so we can be sure, rather than giving theories, if we can. So the current idea seems that xboxdash.xbe is doing a check and setting an EEPROM flag which is picked up on the next Live connect attempt. Firstly, has anyone with a modded but unbanned machine (and an EEPROM backup) been able to see a change in the X, Y and Z values when they attempt to connect to Live without a CAT5 cable plugged in, after going to the MS updated dash? Even without the connection test, has dropping into the updated xboxdash.xbe with a modchip on effected a change in the EEPROM settings? As far as I can tell, moving from Live beta to full live didn't change my xboxdash.xbe or the xodash directory contents - xboxdash.xbe only changed once, and that was when the Beta Live was installed. I have backups of my system state in each of these three situations - before beta, with beta, with full, I'll compare them a little later. The 'Live performing an update' happened to me when I ran the MotoGP demo from the full Live disc. This appeared to load a new MotoGP XBE file onto the E drive. I didn't notice any other major changes. There are fragments of 'connection' messages in the xboxdash.xbe file, has anyone noticed network activity from the dash at any point, even before trying to do a connectivity test? The X, Y and Z settings. At least some of these seem to be bitfields, for example bit 5 of X (if you see it as a 32 bit number) appears to mean 'MAC address overriden). Does anyone have any more? Maybe it's also time to move this to a new thread eg 'What's really happening'? |
It's unlikely to be something in the EEPROM as I've gone back to older saves of an Eeprom before being banned, without sucess.
The XYZ values change all the time on non-modded and modded systems.
The EEPROM changes all the time as well, so it is difficult to tell if a "bit" was set in it, but again I've gone to an older save (way before the machine was even used on XBLive for the first time) and it doesn't work, even with a HD wipe to back it up!
The UPDATE occurs the first time you log into the "new" service and it doesn't matter which game you use...
I got the update from Whacked Retail on one machine.
And from other programs on others.
Before you drop into the Live tab the network address of an unmodified Xbox is not even set up. While the small video plays, the initial packets are sent.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 09:20:00 AM
| QUOTE (__Blaz0__ @ Nov 20 2002, 03:12 PM) |
| I guess what I am getting at, are we sure there is an actual list or a flag that is sent out from our box saying "yes" allow to connect , or "no" dont connect. It just seems so unfair to ban a serial. I mean why punish someone who wants to right their ways and actually remove the mod from their system, cause they care more about playing live. |
By test varying combinations (and ruining 7 machines vis-a-vis XBLive) I've been able to eliminate the EEPROM, Hard Drive, etc.
Unless there is something else buried in the hardware that can be reprogrammed that we do not know about it's all being done at the server.
Post by: Websteria on November 20, 2002, 10:03:00 AM
since I have not have live "Update" itself from MS is my xbox blocked at this time, or will I be able to still run live as long as I disable the chip before I login to the "Real" live for the first time.
Thanks.
Jeff
Post by: pride on November 20, 2002, 10:10:00 AM
and i agree: must be the public school system...although i can't get snooze's method to work...imma fiddle with it later...time to go back to class!
Post by: Sev on November 20, 2002, 10:13:00 AM
Live is set up and working, all with modchip off.c) someone boots the original dash with modchip on, and doesn't attempt to eonnect with Live.
By comparing the differences between c and b, hopefully not too much should have changed, as you've not gone near the Live tab.
Also, in a situation above, I wonder if it's possible to revert state c to state b and avoid a ban happening. This would help indicate if anything in EEPROM is a 'ban me next time' flag, though obviously it would be wasteful of Xboxes to try this.
I'm about to check myself what's changed. I wouldn't expect much to change here unless you specifically changed an option. Rewriting EEPROM for no real reason would shorten it's life.
I'm looking at everything code-side at the moment.
Post by: dripgoss on November 20, 2002, 10:16:00 AM
Post by: andreo on November 20, 2002, 10:27:00 AM
| QUOTE (revenant @ Nov 20 2002, 11:45 AM) | ||
you nailed it... this is more entertaining than the "Arctic Silver III rulez and Radio Shack paste users are heretics" on the newsgroups! what a bunch of 'i-opened-my-Xbox-and-dicked-around-inside-and-now-it-dont-work' nincomppops... the mis-information here is very entertaining! i blame it on the public school systems... *poof* |
who the hell invited this dude to the party?
Post by: BenJeremy on November 20, 2002, 10:33:00 AM
| QUOTE (BenJeremy @ Nov 20 2002, 11:41 AM) |
| Waiting for 10 new topics posted asking if new X2 and Evo-X BIOSes prevent XBL from detecting them in 5... 4.. 3.. 2... |
Doh! did I speak too soon????
What is the deal with the latest X2 BIOS??? Anybody know what the "XBL Checks" thing is all about?
Post by: TITODAWG on November 20, 2002, 10:35:00 AM
| QUOTE (opjose @ Nov 20 2002, 01:49 PM) | ||||
Yeap it could be at connection time via the XBLive tab. When the animation is running the packets are initially sent out. This is why the failure looks almost instant to the "banned" boxes. |
OP!! What is really going on? I've gat a matrix(evox2.5 bios) and virgin HD (XBL Dash) and have had no problems in mode 3 now since launch. I did the live install in mode 1(mod diabled). Then I switched to mode 3(swap mode). Also Ive never attempted to connect with mod enabled(but diabled from swap rather). I then went and disabled the mod again yesterday(MODE 1) and have been all over the livedash(to include sucessful connectivity tests. I'm thinking about leaving it in mode 1 for now so I don't accidently connect with it enabled. I think I'll keep it that way until the dust settles and WE REALLY KNOW WHAT IS GOING ON. If your deductions are correct how come MODE 3 seems to work for me and many others(as i've read on IRC). It sends us right back to the livedash. Could it be because we are not running another dash or a non-virgin HD?? A lot of questions. Maybe you could try experimenting with a virgin box and a matrix.
Post by: Websteria on November 20, 2002, 10:40:00 AM
| QUOTE |
| OP!! What is really going on? I've gat a matrix(evox2.5 bios) and virgin HD (XBL Dash) and have had no problems in mode 3 now since launch. I did the live install in mode 1(mod diabled). Then I switched to mode 3(swap mode). Also Ive never attempted to connect with mod enabled(but diabled from swap rather). I then went and disabled the mod again yesterday(MODE 1) and have been all over the livedash(to include sucessful connectivity tests. I'm thinking about leaving it in mode 1 for now so I don't accidently connect with it enabled. I think I'll keep it that way until the dust settles and WE REALLY KNOW WHAT IS GOING ON. If your deductions are correct how come MODE 3 seems to work for me and many others(as i've read on IRC). It sends us right back to the livedash. Could it be because we are not running another dash or a non-virgin HD?? A lot of questions. Maybe you could try experimenting with a virgin box and a matrix. |
From what I understand you won't have problems unless you've gone onto live with your modchip active. The people who are having problems seem to have gone onto live with their modchips active and thus are banned. Hope that answers your question. (also, how do you quote the person's name, etc)
Post by: Sev on November 20, 2002, 11:10:00 AM
I'm actually surprised so little changed.
There is only a single bit difference in the entire EEPROM.
Bit 1 of 0xFD is set now, it wasn't before (was 0x09, is now 0x0B).
I'm not saying this is related to a modchip check, and I'll *never* say reversing it will make a difference (because it'd make no sense for that to be the case, banning would be far easier once it happened once) but it's possible this could be a 'carrier' flag. Having said that, the HD partition table could hold such information as well.
My quest is to find out exactly how this is being done.
Post by: Sayten on November 20, 2002, 01:13:00 PM
| QUOTE (teacup @ Nov 20 2002, 05:33 PM) |
| To start with, we can change the serial of an xbox, and when we try to connect to live with it (modchip on) this serial/MAC gets banned. My idea is too create a program on the xbox that cycles through serial numbers, logs on and gets that number banned. |
That's not going to work. In the eeprom, there is an online key that is used to encrypt the initial authentication packets. This is a shared secret that M$ also has, and its associated with that serial number. The key is never transmitted over the network, so M$ uses the transmitted serial number to look up the appropriate key. Each Xbox has a unique online key. So, if you change the serial number, but don't use the correct online key, then M$ won't be able to decrypt the packets and can't authenticate the Xbox.
| QUOTE (teacup @ Nov 20 2002, 05:33 PM) |
| Since the xblive account doesn't get banned, just the xbox, a single account and xbox could ban hundreds of serial numbers. |
I think M$ would notice this and ban the account after awhile.
Post by: Zander on November 20, 2002, 01:15:00 PM
^
^
agreed.
Z
Post by: Ph34R on November 20, 2002, 01:20:00 PM
Why are they being put on the banned list when they have no such Chip running?
Post by: Sev on November 20, 2002, 01:54:00 PM
The Live 'Update' people see after using full games is, as far as I can tell so far, an executable update for that game itself. If you have a modchip, check the number of XBE files you have on your E: partition before and after such checks.
This is why the demo MotoGP updated when I first used it from the nonbeta Live, and why Whacked! didn't. It'd also be the reason why the 'update' was instantiated from different retail discs. This is what the code seems to say.
That update could result in a game with further modchip checks being run instead of the default.xbe it originally used.
I'm actually looking for the modchip check itself, I haven't found it yet. There are many many things it could look for, not just BIOS checksums.
But either way, so far, I can prove that Live games have the chance to update their own executable, and this can be run instead of their own default.xbe .
Post by: prime on November 20, 2002, 03:39:00 PM
Forcing us to use an original game in order to play on XboxLive is not a huge deal, and I can understand the whole hard drive thing because of cheat issues, but not allowing us to use a Mod Chip, if this is the case (which we aren't 100% sure yet), that really really sucks, particuarly for those of us who don't want our kids to play with our original (non-online) xbox games.
prime
Post by: NaughtyNu on November 20, 2002, 03:58:00 PM
| QUOTE (pride @ Nov 20 2002, 05:10 PM) |
| you can still logon. You just need to buy the kit. mod detection isn't done until AFTER you sign on and get the required update |
When did they impliment the update? Just wondering since I haven't been able to connect to Live since before retail along with others but never used the beta for about 2 weeks before retail (I got bored with MotoGP)
Just pondering if I'm 'blacklisted' or not, probably am with my luck.
Post by: scoobster on November 20, 2002, 04:39:00 PM
So go to Blockbuster, just get the hell out of here chump
Post by: NoMention on November 20, 2002, 04:51:00 PM
Sounds viable to me. I don't have a packet sniffer though...
Post by: Sayten on November 20, 2002, 05:19:00 PM
| QUOTE (NoMention @ Nov 20 2002, 11:51 PM) |
| After reading all of this, I have but one question. Where are all the packet sniffer junkies out there that will make EvoX have its own emulated XBox Live tab? It can't be that hard to have EvoX (or whatever dashboard you are using) have it's own implementation of the XBox Live protocols. There are numerous service emulators out there that all run on this simple concept. Let's trap the packets as they come to and from the Xbox and build our own XBox Live app. Then, we could force the XBox to not notify MS that the XBox is modded, etc. Sounds viable to me. I don't have a packet sniffer though... |
Go right ahead, but I can tell you this. Without knowing how to decrypt the packets that XBL uses, all the packets look the same. The only thing that is visible is the Kerberos exchange to authenticate and negotiate encryption keys. Only way to get at those packets will be to pry open the Kerberos packets and extract the session keys. That might be possible for people with modchips, but for unmodded Xboxes, its next to impossible.
Post by: VaporStone on November 20, 2002, 05:21:00 PM
Post by: adamkd on November 20, 2002, 05:35:00 PM
| QUOTE |
| opjose is a little 14 year old living in arkansas. he never gets much attention at school, and all the girls think he's "yucky". suddenly, everyone on these boards think he's like the fucking messiah, because he claims to have a modded xbox that can connect to XBL with NO PROBLEMS, even though all the rest of us can't. |
I have one as well and have no problems connecting either. If you read the conditions which he laid out for connecting to xbox live with a chip maybe you would understand.
Post by: Fuzzy on November 20, 2002, 05:36:00 PM
Post by: Fuzzy on November 20, 2002, 05:47:00 PM
Post by: Fuzzy on November 20, 2002, 07:38:00 PM
Post by: Sayten on November 20, 2002, 10:11:00 PM
| QUOTE (yourstruly @ Nov 21 2002, 02:37 AM) |
| Personaly I believe it is server side almost anything else would be foolish. |
The blocking is definately done on the server side. People have reported seeing differences in the Kerberos response packets on machines that are banned.
| QUOTE (yourstruly @ Nov 21 2002, 02:37 AM) |
| There is one other place that they might have put something: In the CPU! Has anyone heard of Intel's Microcode update technology..... In theory it's to dynamicly update chip bugs, but it would be a hell of nasty place for them to put mod-chip blocking..... |
Yeah, but microcode updates are stored in volatile memory. Once you kill the power, the updates disappear. So, atleast on the PC side of things, the system bios uploads the updates to the cpu on startup.
Post by: Bificus Beefy M.D on November 20, 2002, 10:29:00 PM
Post by: bluespot on November 20, 2002, 11:32:00 PM
If you'd been around these forums for any amount of time, you'd know that opjose is married, has children, and is one of the most knowledgable people that any of us will ever meet.
He is one of the few people that actually puts real thought into all his posts, something that seems to be increasingly rare here.
There's a good reason people believe what he says...he's almost always right.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 11:55:00 PM
| QUOTE (Websteria @ Nov 20 2002, 05:40 PM) | ||
From what I understand you won't have problems unless you've gone onto live with your modchip active. The people who are having problems seem to have gone onto live with their modchips active and thus are banned. Hope that answers your question. (also, how do you quote the person's name, etc) |
Yes this sums it up.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 11:57:00 PM
| QUOTE (Sev @ Nov 20 2002, 06:10 PM) |
| I've just checked my EEPROM contents since my first ever backup, and the situation I have now. I'm actually surprised so little changed. There is only a single bit difference in the entire EEPROM. Bit 1 of 0xFD is set now, it wasn't before (was 0x09, is now 0x0B). I'm not saying this is related to a modchip check, and I'll *never* say reversing it will make a difference (because it'd make no sense for that to be the case, banning would be far easier once it happened once) but it's possible this could be a 'carrier' flag. Having said that, the HD partition table could hold such information as well. My quest is to find out exactly how this is being done. |
MS also "holds" restrictived information in inaccessible areas of the memory card.
There is no reason why they couldn't also set the flag on a non-used sector of the hard drive.
However the only contradiction to this is that I've been able to move drives from banned machines to non-banned units without a problem.
Once you are connected and banned, it's all moot though.
Post by: opjose on November 20, 2002, 11:59:00 PM
| QUOTE (Sayten @ Nov 20 2002, 08:13 PM) | ||||
That's not going to work. In the eeprom, there is an online key that is used to encrypt the initial authentication packets. This is a shared secret that M$ also has, and its associated with that serial number. The key is never transmitted over the network, so M$ uses the transmitted serial number to look up the appropriate key. Each Xbox has a unique online key. So, if you change the serial number, but don't use the correct online key, then M$ won't be able to decrypt the packets and can't authenticate the Xbox.
I think M$ would notice this and ban the account after awhile. |
Correct again!
I've played around with this and it seems that indeed the KEY and serial number and MAC address are interrelated.
This is why the taking an EEPROM from a non-banned system works, where a simple modification of serial number & mac address does not.
Post by: opjose on November 21, 2002, 12:01:00 AM
| QUOTE (Ph34R @ Nov 20 2002, 08:20 PM) |
| What about all the Unmodded boxes who are having this problem? Why are they being put on the banned list when they have no such Chip running? |
That's the big joke at present.
It seems that M-icrosoft's scheme is far too overzealous.
Their message boards are repleat with even more people complaining in droves every single day, that their Xboxes are not connecting (connectivity) yet are not modded.
A small percentage of these may be bad setups, refurbished/returned systems (from modders!), etc. But not all of them.
The number of systems affected seems to be fairly big though.
Post by: opjose on November 21, 2002, 12:02:00 AM
| QUOTE (Sev @ Nov 20 2002, 08:54 PM) |
| Zander: doubly agreed. The Live 'Update' people see after using full games is, as far as I can tell so far, an executable update for that game itself. If you have a modchip, check the number of XBE files you have on your E: partition before and after such checks. This is why the demo MotoGP updated when I first used it from the nonbeta Live, and why Whacked! didn't. It'd also be the reason why the 'update' was instantiated from different retail discs. This is what the code seems to say. That update could result in a game with further modchip checks being run instead of the default.xbe it originally used. I'm actually looking for the modchip check itself, I haven't found it yet. There are many many things it could look for, not just BIOS checksums. But either way, so far, I can prove that Live games have the chance to update their own executable, and this can be run instead of their own default.xbe . |
Yes very true.
Post by: opjose on November 21, 2002, 12:07:00 AM
| QUOTE (NoMention @ Nov 20 2002, 11:51 PM) |
| After reading all of this, I have but one question. Where are all the packet sniffer junkies out there that will make EvoX have its own emulated XBox Live tab? It can't be that hard to have EvoX (or whatever dashboard you are using) have it's own implementation of the XBox Live protocols. There are numerous service emulators out there that all run on this simple concept. Let's trap the packets as they come to and from the Xbox and build our own XBox Live app. Then, we could force the XBox to not notify MS that the XBox is modded, etc. Sounds viable to me. I don't have a packet sniffer though... |
The only problem is that this would have to be done "outside" of the Xbox itself as the games love to update themselves at connection time.
Ideally you would connect to live using your non-modded Xbox and capture the correct response packets.
These would be analysed for your specific Xbox to determine what the servers are expecting.
Then you would add the trapped data to a response filter on your (Linux!) firewall which would intercept the XBLive packets going out that reveal your modded device.
Since the filter would replaced the authentication responses with good authentication code, the remote servers would never learn that you xbox has a mod chip in it.
If you could do this, then you would not even have to worry about the mod chip being on or not, as the fix would be handled outside the Xbox.
It's all UDP stuff though.
Post by: opjose on November 21, 2002, 12:11:00 AM
| QUOTE (Fuzzy @ Nov 21 2002, 02:38 AM) |
| if its server side why can 70% of the users connect |
Are you referring to 70% total or 70% of modded systems.
Having seen way too many modded systems "drop off" I would assume you mean the former.
In which case, MS screwed the pooch so to speak.
Their anti-mod protection is WAY too agressive and tends to block even unmodded machines.
Of course there is an error factor in there too. Misreported units, (reported as unmodded but actually not) misconfigured routers, refurbs, returns where were modded then resold, etc.
Post by: ArMaGeDdOn on November 21, 2002, 12:17:00 AM
http://xbox-scene.fx...f840461aef24947
i mean, will that work well? just as well as having 2 xbox systems? (considering xbox is never installed on the modded drive).
please take a look and post something in there. i think that would be a pretty much 100% un-bannable setup. i would like your comments though.
thanks.
Post by: opjose on November 21, 2002, 06:03:00 AM
| QUOTE (joeflux @ Nov 21 2002, 07:09 AM) |
| opjose, can M$ after banning your xbox. Keep you from playing your backups that are not Live type? Or the ban is only to keep from connecting online? |
So far there are still no mod chip detections in games.
I expect to start seeing that too in a few months though.
Post by: -wr- on November 21, 2002, 04:30:00 PM
I should start off by saying that I am in no way affiliated with Team Assembly... just passing on the news.
This was just posted on Team Assembly's web site at:
http://www.assembly.co.za/
___________________________________________
11/21/2002 - Successfully Logged on to XBOX LIVE with Changed XBOX Serial Number and MAC Address !!!
Thats Right folks !! We have done it.. We could tonight successfully change the XBOX Serial Number and MAC Address to something we wanted and the XBOX LIVE Network Dash picked the changed Serial number and MAC Address up !!!!
We Then successfuly signed on to XBOX LIVE with the NEW serial number and MAC address with the MOD Chip removed.. the XBOX LIVE System was 100% happy with the NEW Serial Number !!!!
While we were at it, With our New Serial and MAC we played a bit of Online UNREAL Championship (And kicked some ass!!)
This is a GREAT step forward to help understand why a 100% stock and a un-modified XBOX with all modifications removed can NOT access XBOX LIVE....
Please beware that this is for informational purposes ONLY you MUST only use XBOX LIVE with an un modified XBOX as stated in the XBOX LIVE agreements.. please also see disclosure at the bottom of this page...
Post by: phantazma1 on November 21, 2002, 05:43:00 PM
Post by: yourstruly on November 22, 2002, 03:46:00 PM
| QUOTE |
| He is also using COPIED games online with success as long as the switch for the chip is OFF!! |
Are you SURE this is what you mean?
AFAIK you cannot use coppied games at all with the switch off.
Unless this is a typo or miscomunication, I would disbelieve your friend.
Post by: opjose on November 22, 2002, 05:39:00 PM
| QUOTE (-wr- @ Nov 21 2002, 11:30 PM) |
| I should start off by saying that I am in no way affiliated with Team Assembly... just passing on the news. This was just posted on Team Assembly's web site at: http://www.assembly.co.za/ ___________________________________________ 11/21/2002 - Successfully Logged on to XBOX LIVE with Changed XBOX Serial Number and MAC Address !!! Thats Right folks !! We have done it.. We could tonight successfully change the XBOX Serial Number and MAC Address to something we wanted and the XBOX LIVE Network Dash picked the changed Serial number and MAC Address up !!!! We Then successfuly signed on to XBOX LIVE with the NEW serial number and MAC address with the MOD Chip removed.. the XBOX LIVE System was 100% happy with the NEW Serial Number !!!! While we were at it, With our New Serial and MAC we played a bit of Online UNREAL Championship (And kicked some ass!!) This is a GREAT step forward to help understand why a 100% stock and a un-modified XBOX with all modifications removed can NOT access XBOX LIVE.... Please beware that this is for informational purposes ONLY you MUST only use XBOX LIVE with an un modified XBOX as stated in the XBOX LIVE agreements.. please also see disclosure at the bottom of this page... |
There is one minor problem with this.
They merely changed the serial number and the MAC address, on a non-banned system.
This does NOT "unban" a system which is already aflicted.
Post by: Fuzzy on November 22, 2002, 05:40:00 PM
| QUOTE (opjose @ Nov 23 2002, 12:39 AM) | ||
There is one minor problem with this. They merely changed the serial number and the MAC address, on a non-banned system. This does NOT "unban" a system which is already aflicted. |
i wish...
Post by: opjose on November 23, 2002, 06:23:00 AM
If you had it on, welcome to the banned box club.
Post by: Lucid on November 25, 2002, 12:10:00 PM
Post by: Zander on November 25, 2002, 12:43:00 PM
Z
Post by: forcelite on November 25, 2002, 01:23:00 PM
Keep us updated
Post by: opjose on November 25, 2002, 01:37:00 PM
| QUOTE (Lucid @ Nov 25 2002, 07:10 PM) |
| By the way...My XBOX was never banned OPJOSE. |
Congrats if true... But give it a few days to be certain.
Post by: Zander on November 25, 2002, 07:19:00 PM
Z
Post by: hehbo2k2 on November 25, 2002, 07:55:00 PM
Post by: bearauto on November 26, 2002, 01:34:00 AM
| QUOTE (CyberPunk @ Nov 26 2002, 12:23 AM) |
| Can the Enigmah chip be switched off? Also, if I add a switch, is my Box now banned from attempting to use Live. |
You guys really should try reading at least a few pages from this thread...
Anyway, here's the gist of it:
If you have attempted to access LIVE with your modchip ON, then more likely than not, your xbox is "banned." Getting a switch after the fact of being "banned" will not help you to be "unbanned." In other words, if you're "banned" already, you're SOL.
And yes, you can install a switch for the enigmah, just do a search for the process of doing so.
Post by: knowledgeiv on November 26, 2002, 06:09:00 AM
Post by: Zander on November 26, 2002, 07:36:00 AM
Z