Post by: mohomeboy on June 01, 2006, 08:33:00 AM
I seem to sence a deja vu happening
Seen it all before.
Atari
Panasonic
Sega
ATARI Jaguar:
What Went Wrong: Really, a better question would be "What went right?" From its poorly distributed launch in 1993 right through to its ignominious death in 1995, the Atari Jaguar was one disaster after another. I should know -- I was among the first to buy one in 1994, thanks to relentless hyping in the notorious Die Hard Game Fan. Game Fan hyped the thing raw in its inimitable way ("Atari is back ... come pet the cat.") so I was expecting something amazing. Instead I got a $250 hunk of plastic that ran Cybermorph, a strangely mediocre pack-in game that had nothing on Super Mario Bros., or even Altered Beast. As the months passed, the software releases crawled onto EB's shelves like crippled slugs, and consisted of a generally un-compelling mix of un-enhanced 16-bit ports and Amiga-spawned Eurotrash. Until I bought the motorcycle racer Super Burnout last year, my Jag library consisted of five games. The Jag was clearly not the best investment I've ever made.
PANASONIC 3DO:
What Went Wrong: 3DO was an interesting experiment that looks seriously flawed in retrospect. Hardware manufacturers licensed the technology from 3DO, leaving 3DO to oversee software matters. The hardware licensees like Panasonic and Goldstar were free to price the systems as they pleased, though, and in the beginning that meant around $700. Needless to say, only the most insane early adopters took 3DO up on this proposition, and were rewarded with a bizarre library of FMV dreck, primitive 3D engines, and the odd well-executed action game. Surprisingly, Japanese developers really took an interest in the system, and contributed many titles to its odd hodge-podge of a software line-up. If only MS could have had that luxury over half a decade later
Sega Dreamcast:
What Went Wrong: With so much going for it, Dreamcast had just as many shortcomings. First off, Sega had pissed off its fans and retailers and publishers far too many times with the Saturn, 32X, and Sega CD. Its timing also really hurt the system. The Dreamcast didn't fit in with the PlayStation and N64, nor did it fit with the PlayStation 2 and Xbox. It was a tweener. It's still one of my favorite systems, though, and will always hold a place in my heart. Dreamcast proves how difficult it is to bring out a successful console, and definitely died before its time. -- Justin "Violent" Leeper
(Quotes from gamespy)
All in all if you look back over the last 25 years or so, every (winning) console brand has lasted for 2 consoles except for Atari, they screwed up by not releasing their console on time.
Sega Master System and Mega drive (genisis in the usa)
Nintendo and Super Nintendo
Playstation And Playstation 2
MS should be coming into it's own now, but Nintendo looks like they are going to come up off the ground again, don't forget they are still cashing in on the Gamecube (profit).
As alwasy Nintendo inovating the industry.
Low price point has been announced (sub $250)
So if you ask me I think Nintendo's Wii is going to rule the next gen wars, followed by xbox 360 then followed by quite some distance the ps3.
Don't get me wrong the ps3 is an amazing console but, the price point is too high, and by the time the console drops in price will be too late for them. The games will be amazing.
All the Major console makers have done a bad console or two.
Atari 7800, Jaguar
Nintendo Virtual Boy, Gamecube (well not as sucessfull as it should have been)
Sega Saturn, Dreamcast (Amazing kit, too much too soon) (Again ps3 heading this way)
I guess now is the time to accept defeat that sony is going down.
As a super hardcore gamer I own every console (except for 1 or 2 real rare pieces) so i will end up buying a ps3 but no time soon.
P.S sorry for the long winded essay, just wanted to post a small post but passion drove me to do this (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
Post by: calderra on June 01, 2006, 09:48:00 AM
Sorry to say this fanboys but i feel like sony is going downhill with the ps3
-Many fanboys agree, actually.
ATARI Jaguar:
Bad comparison. NOTHING was right about the Jaguar. It has gone down as having everything down to one of the worst controllers ever released for a console. No comparison, because it would have had to do SOMETHING right to for m a basis for comparison (at least the PS3 is TRYING to push next-gen with BluRAy, for example)
PANASONIC 3DO:
Better comparison. It was interesting technology that, for the most part, just cost too damn much. Other problems happened, but nobody was buying it in the first place.
Sega Dreamcast:
From what I saw of numbers, if SEGA hadn't wasted their time trying to win over Japan, they'd still be in the console race and we'd be in a 4-way run-off right now (or 3-way, since Nintendo would have had less space in the market on both 64 and Gamecube). Japan hated SEGA, and wasn't going to try anything the company was pushing hardware-wise. Over the rest of the world, if SEGA had used the money they wasted on Japan for advertising, Dreamcast would have been at least in the race enough to finish off that generation running strong.
"All in all if you look back over the last 25 years or so, every (winning) console brand has lasted for 2 consoles except for Atari, they screwed up by not releasing their console on time."
-For whatever reason, the third-gen offering from most companies always sucks. NES? Kickass. SNES? Even better. N-64? Oddball controller, lack of games for most of its life, huge mistake overpricing games by sticking to cartridges... just a wad of problems. As is the case with PS3- just incredible mistakes. To remain in control of the console race, a top dev would have to just not screw up in the third iteration. What the heck happens? Why?
"MS should be coming into it's own now, but Nintendo looks like they are going to come up off the ground again, don't forget they are still cashing in on the Gamecube (profit)."
-Uhhh... to "cash in" on a console, it has to be selling units. With the new Zelda moving to Revolution, Gamecube lost the last tiny hope of remaining alive.
"As alwasy Nintendo inovating the industry."
-Except wth N-64, where people often mistake "innovation" and "oddball ideas that crucified the console". And Gamecube, which basically had no innovation except that they forgot to put a second trigger on the left side. Yeah, you can say "it wasn't necessary", but by that same standard neither was the Z-trigger in the first place, and they could have at least mirrored the button to balance the controller.
"Low price point has been announced (sub $250)"
-It needs to hit $200 for Nintendo to really have their shot at dominating this generation. There's almost no question there anymore- Wii60 needs to cost exactly as much as PS3. It's the perfect attack. Sure, the $250 console would do well, but the $200 price point would make the system.
"So if you ask me I think Nintendo's Wii is going to rule the next gen wars, followed by xbox 360 then followed by quite some distance the ps3."
-And Nintendo isn't direct competition to the 360, because 360's aim is still to push "next-generation" gaming. Also remember that MS isn't really in this war to sell consoles- the point of the Xbox is for MS to push Sony out of their spot in home entertainment, so instead of playing your Sony DVDs on your Sony player (etc), the Xbox 360 does all that. So technically, MS would "win" this generation if that happened, because they would have accomplished the origional mission goal of the Xbox project.
"Don't get me wrong the ps3 is an amazing console but, the price point is too high, and by the time the console drops in price will be too late for them. The games will be amazing."
-Will they be? I stopped caring about the PS brands a long time ago. Square-Enix's RPGs are ALL the same now- especially with their effeminate shy blonde lead. Oh, and the lead falls in love but is afraid to say it? No way! Metal Gear Solid is like watching a really bad SciFi movie. "His name is Big Boss? And that dude is a clone? WTF?". Never played Devil May Cry, never wanna. Etc, etc etc.
The Xbox platform serves up the kinds of games I like, and anything Playstation used to have that I like is either multiplatform (Grand Theft Auto) or has a counterpart on my console (Gran Turismo -> Forza 2). For me, there's absolutely zero interesting titles coming to PS3 right now. Plus, look at all the awesome console exclusives- Table Tennis, Gears of War, Halo 3, Oblivion... I'm really happy with my console. [And who cares if some "exclusives" are also on PC? I'm a console gamer, not a PC gamer.]
Anyway, the 360 is probably going to "win" this console race. Nintendo and M$ are going to duke it out for first and second place, and regardless, Xbox completes its goal of beating Sony out of your entertainment center. If Nintendo wins, MS is still the top "next-gen" system, because Nintendo's offering really aims away from the hardcore crowd and into casual consumers, which doesn't really take that much away from 360 at all. Besides, the idea of Wii60 will remain strong, and the largest percent of people will probably own both a Wii and a 360 in the end, even if Wii outsells 360 overall.
I just can't wait to see how Sony corp. will stay alive once BluRay takes the hit we might wind up seeing after the PS3 launch.
Post by: mohomeboy on June 01, 2006, 10:14:00 AM
But again you have made a fair point.
And the whole Zelda thing, it is coming out on the GC aswell as Wii. And unlike xbox every unit they sell they are loosing money, Nintendo is still making money on the few $99 GCs they sell.
Post by: incognegro on June 01, 2006, 11:12:00 AM
Post by: Elemino on June 02, 2006, 02:14:00 PM
Also Nintedo was doing great. In fact, if they had remained on track, they would probably still be the number 1 company today. If any of you remember your history, it was Nintendo that actually went to Sony to create a next-gen game system that eventually was dropped. It left Sony with the bill of development and one logical choice. Continue and release the console and the first Play Station was born. Prior to that, there were actually a few SNES games with Sony's name stamped on them. Bram Stroker's Dracula for instance. Still I think Nintendo cannot lead anymore, because they've simply decided to keep the image of the gaming system for children. They make much more money on their portable systems.
I think MS will be the first to break the 2 Legit then Needs to Quit mold. MS definately makes dumb mistakes at times, but they are getting much better. They also have these periods in their history when they become very innovative, and right now is one of them. Unless they purposly pull the plug, I doubt the 360 is the last excellent game system we will see from them.
Sony... Get a life, no one wants to pay $600 for a F***ing game system! Talking about it's a PC, you know what kind of upgrades you could make to a PC for $600???
Post by: paranoia4422 on June 02, 2006, 06:30:00 PM
Post by: incognegro on June 02, 2006, 09:17:00 PM
QUOTE(paranoia4422 @ Jun 3 2006, 01:30 AM) 
Zelda is going to release on Gamcube and Wii simultaniously, so learn the facts or get the fuck off the forums.
I think ur missing the point. If the zelda is coming to the wii and the wii is backcompatible then why buy a gamecube? Nintendo essentially killed the cube (which isn't exactly a bad thing IMO)
Post by: Elemino on June 03, 2006, 12:22:00 AM
QUOTE(paranoia4422 @ Jun 2 2006, 07:30 PM)
Zelda is going to release on Gamcube and Wii simultaniously, so learn the facts or get the fuck off the forums.
Post by: Deftech on June 03, 2006, 08:58:00 AM
QUOTE(paranoia4422 @ Jun 2 2006, 08:30 PM)
Zelda is going to release on Gamcube and Wii simultaniously, so learn the facts or get the fuck off the forums.
calm down there cheech. If everyone that didnt know "everything" got the F off the forums, you'd be a lonely person.
I'd hate to see you in a real debate, nothing but F bombs and "come back when you learn something"
And Yes, A Vs P on Jaguar rocked! It will always be in my top 10
Post by: incognegro on June 04, 2006, 04:36:00 PM
QUOTE(Deftech @ Jun 3 2006, 04:05 PM)
calm down there cheech. If everyone that didnt know "everything" got the F off the forums, you'd be a lonely person.
I'd hate to see you in a real debate, nothing but F bombs and "come back when you learn something"
And Yes, A Vs P on Jaguar rocked! It will always be in my top 10
Post by: killab138 on June 08, 2006, 01:30:00 PM
viva la dreamcast!!......ok sorry.
Post by: LivHard on June 08, 2006, 01:29:00 PM
Post by: KaRiL on June 08, 2006, 06:22:00 PM
Sony has a huge fan base and when kenny k says he will sell 5 mill units, with out any games for the system sadly he's right
plus sony has huge franchises: MGS, Final Fantasy, Gran turismo, to name a few, guaranteed million sellers when they drop.
couple that with the fact that while it may not be anyone around here, there will be people out there buying the system for the blu ray player
problem with your comparison is you are comparing PS3 with systems no one bought(or hardly anyone - DC fanboy)
PS3 will sell out launch day and for months after that. you will see them in rich football players houses on CRIBS and put into wack ass cars in pimp my ride. if it turns out to be garbage or not, it will still be a status symbol.
bottom line a lot of people will buy it and they will buy games for it
will it beat out the 360 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/uhh.gif) thats a better question
Post by: incognegro on June 11, 2006, 04:21:00 PM
QUOTE(LivHard @ Jun 8 2006, 08:36 PM)
I'm sure all that money MS is loosing on every xbox they sell is really affecting bill gates pockets
Not really since theyre hardly manufacturing them anymore........
Post by: Martinchris23 on June 12, 2006, 08:29:00 AM
QUOTE(KaRiL @ Jun 9 2006, 01:22 AM)
I have to disagree with the original poster
Sony has a huge fan base and when kenny k says he will sell 5 mill units, with out any games for the system sadly he's right
plus sony has huge franchises: MGS, Final Fantasy, Gran turismo, to name a few, guaranteed million sellers when they drop.
couple that with the fact that while it may not be anyone around here, there will be people out there buying the system for the blu ray player
problem with your comparison is you are comparing PS3 with systems no one bought(or hardly anyone - DC fanboy)
PS3 will sell out launch day and for months after that. you will see them in rich football players houses on CRIBS and put into wack ass cars in pimp my ride. if it turns out to be garbage or not, it will still be a status symbol.
bottom line a lot of people will buy it and they will buy games for it
will it beat out the 360
thats a better questionSadly there is too much truth in this statement. People with money will buy them because they can. I'm pretty sure that the 'core' version won't sell as a BluRay player - with no HDMI output, the $500 price tag would be far too steep. It would be more cost effective to buy the $600 version.
It's also too steep for a games console-cum-bluray player IMHO, seeing as it's not definite what format will win the war. Look at Betamax and UMD - both Sony, both failed. Their track record isn't in choosing media - it's in the ability to sucker millions of people into buying a 'flying car'.
Post by: Elemino on June 13, 2006, 02:22:00 PM
QUOTE(halofun121 @ Jun 12 2006, 06:17 PM)
Just because they failed on all of those formats doesn't mean they aren't going to win this one out.
I honestly believe people are going to buy the PS3 regardless of the price.
Post by: DragoNs on June 14, 2006, 03:44:00 PM
QUOTE(incognegro @ Jun 2 2006, 11:24 PM)
I think ur missing the point. If the zelda is coming to the wii and the wii is backcompatible then why buy a gamecube? Nintendo essentially killed the cube (which isn't exactly a bad thing IMO)
I think some people wont get the WII right on release and maybe some want to play it on gamecube, im actually debating if i should buy it for just gamecube because there will be those days where i dont feel like having to use the WII controllers.
Post by: Serious Sam on June 14, 2006, 08:05:00 PM
QUOTE(KaRiL @ Jun 8 2006, 08:22 PM)
I have to disagree with the original poster
Sony has a huge fan base and when kenny k says he will sell 5 mill units, with out any games for the system sadly he's right
plus sony has huge franchises: MGS, Final Fantasy, Gran turismo, to name a few, guaranteed million sellers when they drop.
couple that with the fact that while it may not be anyone around here, there will be people out there buying the system for the blu ray player
problem with your comparison is you are comparing PS3 with systems no one bought(or hardly anyone - DC fanboy)
PS3 will sell out launch day and for months after that. you will see them in rich football players houses on CRIBS and put into wack ass cars in pimp my ride. if it turns out to be garbage or not, it will still be a status symbol.
bottom line a lot of people will buy it and they will buy games for it
will it beat out the 360
thats a better questionWell here's the ticker. I remember seeing alot of Laser Disc players in rich homes and we all know what happened to the Laser Disc
. Sure, I agree that the wealthy will purchase whatever new electronics hit the market but will that alone make the device a great seller? NO! For a game console to succeed in this market it will have to sell to the masses not only the wealthy. It will need to have a good supply of developers making killer titles for it. I have yet to see any title for the PS3 that will make me fork out $600 for it. MGS looks great but one game isn't worth that high price tag. Final Fantasy isn't for everyone. Grand Turismo will probably be great but yet another racer for a very expensive console, no thanks!
People this coming xmas will have 3 consoles to chose from and most people buying on xmas are on a budget. Here's what they'll have to chose from; $250 Nintendo Wii, $400 (or less by xmas) Xbox 360 Premium pack wich will probably be bundled with a game or an accessory, and a $500 - $600 PS3 and knowing Sony it wont come bundled with anything.
The choice seems pretty clear to me.
