Post by: mxlegend99 on June 20, 2003, 12:51:00 AM
Post by: mxlegend99 on June 23, 2003, 02:28:00 AM
Pity that, they IMO, would have had the best odds on succeeding, but there are still many ppl capable i guess, but those may require an open source net browser to port, are there any available?
I would love to see one, i wish i where capable of creating xbe files from programs sources... but i tried it, and im too lazy to get it to work
Post by: The unProfessional on June 23, 2003, 09:57:00 AM
. Besides, how much would it suck to surf the web from an xbox controller... I just don't think the demand is there, considering the work requirements.The email client is probably a little more useful, but not much. Once again, who wants to send and receive email with an xbox controller... I suppose it would be useful for receiving and reading email if you have only an Xbox and not a computer around (can't imagine that happening too often).
Why use an Xbox for web browsing and email when there's a PC around??
Just my thoughts... I personally wouldn't want to write a browser for the Xbox because it would be ALOT of work, and probably wouldn't be too useful to most people.
Post by: xahur on June 23, 2003, 11:43:00 AM
Post by: The unProfessional on June 23, 2003, 02:57:00 PM
Oh, btw... dont do drugs, man, they're bad for you.
Post by: aweirdguy on June 30, 2003, 01:33:00 PM
| QUOTE |
| who wants to send and receive email with an xbox controller |
I agree it sounds like a neat idea, but unless you're installing linux and a keyboard it would be a major pain to use.... and then you wouldn't need a special browser. Who wants to tab thru web links like webtv? And it would suk bigtime to write an email choosing letters with the controller....
Post by: bombzhome on July 19, 2003, 07:05:00 PM
Post by: BenJeremy on July 23, 2003, 09:01:00 AM
Web browsing in 2003 -> Damn bat guano insanely difficult.
Why? Take a look at the source for most web pages these days... Flash, Java, VBScript, extensions... there are countless issues to navigate around just to display a single page correctly. Let's not even get to the notion of fetching data through firewalls and proxies. Let's not get into the notion of supporting web forms and the HTML UI functionality.
- and when somebody does do it, everybody will cry about how it doesn't support this, or it doesn't support that... or how broken some pages look.
Writing a web browser these days is a proposition akin to writing a Windows clone (backwards compatible with existing software). You need a good size development team, set requirements, test procedures, etc. It's just not a simple task.
Post by: Carsten on July 24, 2003, 07:42:00 AM
Post by: The unProfessional on July 24, 2003, 02:19:00 PM
Post by: Carsten on July 26, 2003, 10:01:00 AM
Post by: contrast on July 28, 2003, 01:18:00 PM
Atleast then I don't have to start Linux for 8 minuten and it takes another 3 to shut it down.
It's allready a start, i'm sure millions of people would be happy with that allready.
It would be a big event !
Post by: makobhawkin on July 29, 2003, 09:22:00 PM
Post by: windragz on July 30, 2003, 11:54:00 PM
| QUOTE (The unProfessional @ Jun 23 2003, 06:57 PM) |
| browser for the Xbox because it would be ALOT of work, and probably wouldn't be too useful to most people. |
you are mostly right, but the concept behind a x-web browser is based on a web reader and not on a web surfer tool. A web reader will be useful for watch some video available on internet and read newspaper or whatever.
Btw, any xbox application is basically equal to a macromedia flash applet, so you have to render any single interaction and this aspect make the lines of code grow grow grow...explode
I've a half idea and I'm investigating on this interesting and uncovered area. I hate linux and I'd like an indipendent application such xbmp in order to browse and read, maybe the new posts of this forum
Post by: Zedix on July 31, 2003, 10:56:00 AM
Post by: da_frog on July 31, 2003, 12:00:00 PM
Post by: san9jay on August 18, 2003, 03:27:00 AM
Post by: Chief Dominator on August 18, 2003, 06:01:00 AM
I really will be great Xbox Scene might have one but how says anyone can't build it with OXDK
Post by: The unProfessional on August 18, 2003, 10:20:00 AM
But, it wouldn't be a problem for any of the dash authors to build it in when they have time. I'm sure we'll see it sooner or later.
As for the browser, I doubt it'll happen. Even with basic HTML 3.2 compliance, it's not a weekend project. If a small team was formed for the sole purpose of writing a browser for the xbox, the project would probably take a couple of months minimum.
I'd consider getting a team together to do it, but i'm still trying to squeeze out time for jihad.
Post by: dre145 on August 19, 2003, 10:41:00 PM
Post by: courtjester on August 21, 2003, 04:25:00 AM
a friend told me these ran on a low end archimedies (can't spell for toffee) based system.
i've never user one but just thought that if you were going to emulate anything to do web browsing this would be the way to go.
cj
Post by: Novahux on August 21, 2003, 05:01:00 AM
even the ones with broadband support are avaliable for next to nothing on eBay
http://cgi.ebay.com....5&category=3320
640x480 is just impossible to browse web pages with out smashing your mouse to bits, let alone an xbox controller trying to emulate a keyboard.
Like most ppl, I would try it for 5 mins and then delete it, its hardly worth the effort for someone to code it.
Post by: BlaCkAdDa on August 24, 2003, 06:15:00 PM
I understand it wouldn't be great for surfing, but that's not the point... I see it as great for the followin
* Having bookmarked sports/news pages which you can call up and read on your telly in the morning/day
* Having a bookmarked TV guide...hm what shall I watch to night
* Having bookmarked web radio... lets put some dance music on....
* Checking email (not necessarily writing responses)
People just need to open their mind about the potential benefits of this thing rather than saying how it wont be able to do xyz.
Most likely the answer will come via Linux... I'm keen to see Dynebolic on my 1.1 xbox, but even better would be a stripped down version where I could default it just to boot to my browser to check my news/sports and stuff.
Post by: The unProfessional on August 25, 2003, 02:58:00 PM
Would it be nice? yes... but i doubt anyone wants to spend the enormous amount of time doing it so 100 people can use it 5 seconds a day. See what I mean? :-
Wouldn't you rather have more people working on homebrew games?
EDIT: It would probably take less time for someone to crank out a stripped-down linux kernel with minimal module loading for increased loading speed. It would probably be released as an ISO, so you can just pop it in and boot without any mod to the hard disk. That would probably take less time and headache than writing a proprietary D3D-based web browser.
Post by: ZubZeroo on August 28, 2003, 02:23:00 PM
Post by: BlaCkAdDa on August 28, 2003, 04:30:00 PM
Post by: * illusion * on August 28, 2003, 07:49:00 PM
| QUOTE |
| Is it possible to port Windows XP to Xbox cuz its basically just a computer, and w/ an OS installed + proper sound, video, and network drivers you can use the integrated webbrowser (IE) if I'm not wrong? Just a thought, no flaming plz.... |
Lets try and get Bill to do it
Post by: BlaCkAdDa on August 31, 2003, 05:09:00 PM
Post by: ZubZeroo on September 03, 2003, 10:03:00 AM
| QUOTE (BlaCkAdDa @ Aug 25 2003, 03:15 AM) |
| * Having a bookmarked TV guide...hm what shall I watch to night * Having bookmarked web radio... lets put some dance music on.... |
I know some countries got tvguide on XBMP...
And u can also listen to a shoutcast stream...
look at www.xbmp.de
Post by: akarnid on September 03, 2003, 01:16:00 PM
Post by: .:**:. on September 03, 2003, 04:40:00 PM
and more.
Post by: BlaCkAdDa on September 03, 2003, 09:41:00 PM
Post by: Swisha on September 05, 2003, 01:38:00 PM
Post by: Xega on September 05, 2003, 11:34:00 PM
Post by: BlaCkAdDa on September 07, 2003, 06:01:00 PM
Post by: zerowizard on September 10, 2003, 02:25:00 AM
Post by: onlyme on September 13, 2003, 08:20:00 AM
| QUOTE (cyberheater @ Sep 13 2003, 09:25 AM) |
| You could browse the web on the dreamcast and that was 5 years ago. I'm sure someone will do it. That for me would be a killer app. |
ok fromeverything i have read and been told porting a browser to the xbox would be a pain in the ass, as i was told it took mozilla around 5 years to clean up the code alone.
and in response to the dreamcast post they were all top of the range coders with alot more resourses and funding available to them, im sure if someone could get the sponsorship to do something like this they would try.
Post by: BlaCkAdDa on September 17, 2003, 06:27:00 PM
You could edit a config file for your net settings PPoE, Gateway or direct connectoin and away you go, everyone is going to be on the same hardware platform, so it shouldnt' be too hard... hmmm maybe if someone could get DSL (Damn Small Linux) working on XBOX, this could be done easilly (or if someone is good with the cloop stuff they could go back to the XBOX Linux Live project that has been abandoned) I couldn't figure out how to add a prog to that cloop stuff... though I'm hoping once I actually get Linux running on my PC I'll have more hope
Post by: The unProfessional on September 18, 2003, 10:52:00 AM
Trust me guys, I don't shoot down these browser ideas because I think it's fun. If you want to try it, I'd love to see some attempts made at it - and I'd have alot of respect for anyone who got something going. I'm just letting you know why you haven't seen it done yet.
If you're a programmer posting these ideas, why not make an attempt at it? If it interests you, go for it! That's why all of us are here... to do what we enjoy!
EDIT: Dreamcast also used a windows CE-based OS, yeah? So it's a completely different task than writing a DX-based browser. And most importantly, the xbox project has no financial support (as someone already pointed out)
Post by: normal01 on September 24, 2003, 06:27:00 PM
Post by: The unProfessional on September 24, 2003, 07:00:00 PM
Porting an existing browser (As pointed out before) is still a bitch. All the rendering must be ported to D3D. It's do-able... just need someone willing to invest the time.
Nothing in software is ever as easy as it may sometimes sound. Shoot, people even complain about their first "hello world" app.
Post by: Bender_Unit_1 on September 24, 2003, 07:49:00 PM
NO! My poor screen! Why did I think if I lit my monitor afire, that it would light the thread on fire? why oh why of why....
-Bender
PS: just couldn't help myself with that one.
Post by: deveng on September 26, 2003, 08:17:00 AM
Post by: Mr. Tom on September 27, 2003, 02:34:00 AM
that having been said, i started reading this thread just becuase i was sitting here thinking: "damn i wish i had a web browser i could use on my xbox without having to start linux"
why? because its something i dont have now.
Post by: shortstuff22090 on September 27, 2003, 05:38:00 PM
Post by: Sottilde on September 27, 2003, 11:00:00 PM
Post by: shortstuff22090 on September 28, 2003, 12:10:00 PM
Post by: The unProfessional on September 29, 2003, 03:56:00 PM
If you really really want it that bad, start digging through the linux source code, so you can see the mess for yourself.
I'm not trying to roadblock your ingenuity here, but you need to understand what you're suggesting before you suggest it... know what i mean?
Two options:
1) Port mozilla, re-writing all low-level rendering code to D3D routines... lots of work
2) Currently, you must boot a full linux kernel. Build a stripped-down linux kernel for the xbox, which loads nothing but the requirements for web surfing. Well, you want to maintain full driver support, but somehow *remove* all security. You want to support some hardware, but you don't want to worry about the unecessary hardware. This, but not that... this, but not that, etc.... oh, and it has to work =]
Get my drift? It's kind of a bitch.
here's the question to ask yourself. Do either of the above tasks seem practical when you can already surf the web on your box? You can... it just takes a while. Is the speed increase worth months of work? if you say Yes, that's good, I'm glad someone feels that way. But most programmers are quite busy, so keep an eye out for one that's interested in investing the time.
Take care all
Post by: The unProfessional on September 29, 2003, 09:34:00 PM
Post by: shortstuff22090 on October 07, 2003, 08:50:00 AM
Post by: BlaCkAdDa on October 08, 2003, 08:21:00 PM
First step is to understand the cloop methods it uses so you can add items to the distro... try playing around with that and adding and/or removing some parts on your pc... if you can do that we've got to first base.
second step would then tbe to find all the drivers/bits & pieces we need to add for xbox, then.... I think you can see where I'm going with this....
It might be easier to start with the older 'xbox linux live' release at that point though and try adding dillo or mozilla to that (can't remember if it 'xbll' had network support or not, but that may be the first hurdle) in theory I think this would be easier as it already boots and runs on xbox, though I'm not sure how we'll go with RAM on that.
Post by: shortstuff22090 on October 09, 2003, 01:11:00 PM
Post by: shortstuff22090 on October 10, 2003, 11:08:00 AM
Post by: Fardo123 on October 15, 2003, 11:32:00 PM