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Xbox360 Forums => Xbox 360 General Forums => Xbox360's Multimedia Features => Topic started by: Xbox-Scene on December 05, 2007, 04:15:00 PM

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Xbox-Scene on December 05, 2007, 04:15:00 PM

Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Posted by XanTium | December 5 17:39 EST | News Category: Xbox360

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From extremetech.com:

Quote

Early this year I wrote about how the Xbox 360 is a flawed DVD player, complete with pictures of some of the various errors you can expect. I hoped Microsoft would fix it with each major update. So when I looked over the really long and detailed list of Dashboard updates the other day, a few things stuck out at me. One is the nebulous "Improved deinterlacer support for video playback." Could this be the DVD fix I was hoping for?

Nope. I just updated the Xbox 360 in the lab and ran it into a TV using the VGA input at 1080p. With this I used the popular HQV DVD test disc, and the Xbox 360 scored a whopping 40. That's out of 130! Rather than show you the whole scoring chart, let me break it down for you: The 360 passed the Color Bars/Vertical Detail test (nearly everything does), the Picture Detail test, and the horizontal and vertical crawls. That's it. It failed every noise reduction, film mode, jaggies, and cadence detection test there is. In nearly every case, it was a clear failure; not...even...close.

Oh, the hi-def situation isn't much better. HQV makes a hi-def test disc for HD DVD and Blu-ray players, and the 360 scores a zero (out of 100). These tests are much simpler, involving simply de-interlacing 1080i content of both regular and film mode content, and noise reduction. It's like nothing is going on there at all.

Full Story: extremetech.com

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: angryyoungnpoor on December 05, 2007, 04:45:00 PM

I bought it for games. I have 10 other dvd players that I'm able to use just fine. The added features of avi make it so that I can view avi files without going on my computer.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: mlmadmax on December 05, 2007, 04:55:00 PM

I think this guy is being overly criticle and needs to understand that most people would think the playback thrue hdmi or vga is passable. This is one of thos uber nerd video guys who's like ohhh by blue is one parsec out of calibration with the industy standard all this equipment is crap.

Playback thrue hdmi looks pretty good IMHO actually but he didn't test with that type of connection. When I used to have a component equiped 360 that looked really bad when playing dvd's even at 480p. My hdmi 360 does a dam good job of upconvering to 1080. It is not as good as my oppo so i use that but it is not like movies are unwatchable.

As far as the hd-dvd playback there is no difference in pq versus a standalone so i don't know what he is talkin about.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: feflicker on December 05, 2007, 05:06:00 PM

As far as I am concerned DVD playback is a "bonus" feature, so the fact that it will play a dvd and look half-way decent is nice. Basically my 360 is my failover DVD player, should I be on the road or my settop break at 1am.

Now, for the HD-DVD add-on, I would EXPECT that to perform well since that add-on is specifically used for movie playback...

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: flashfreak on December 05, 2007, 05:10:00 PM

The HD-DVD scoring 0 kinda makes sense. I have transformers and it looks great, but some dark scenes have a lot of noise in them, and i was just thinking that obviously its better than DVD but maybe this is as far as they can get. But now im real tempted to try it in a stand alone DVD player on my tv. The sound is great though, one part in transformers shakes my house, and im sure those of you who have it and have a nice big sub know the big im talking about.

Also, i was playing back a divx movie, and it looked crap. Was fine on my comp, but i think the 360 was playing it back in 480p. The menus (the 360 options at the bottom) looked poor and the video quality was appaling. When i put the video to standard size, it was tiny. If it was 480p, it'd be nearly fullscreen. So im not sure whats going on there but its definately crapper than i expected.

Also, why is it so hard to play videos off a disc in media centre? Only thing i can find is the library.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Gmc on December 05, 2007, 05:21:00 PM

My 360's too loud to be used as a dvd player anyway imo

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: modistru on December 05, 2007, 05:22:00 PM

The point is that it IS a DVD player regardless if you use it or not. Although it has been pointed out to be a blatently horrible player, fixing the problems it has have not been addressed (or acknowledged). See the original article for just how bad this player is. Even xbox1's SW player beats its quality. That's just not right. The horsepower exists in there for it to be upsampling/DTS and then some.

This post has been edited by modistru: Dec 6 2007, 01:27 AM

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: bucko on December 05, 2007, 05:31:00 PM

it's a games console what you expect. buy a £10 DVD player if your so bummed.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: fiya on December 05, 2007, 05:00:00 PM

QUOTE(modistru @ Dec 6 2007, 02:22 AM)

its not important. the most important feature that MS should be worrying about is game playback

As long as they keep that up, im happy.

MS is like the mother of 13 million crybabies; she just can't feed all of them at once! unfortunately, these babies have internet access...

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: feflicker on December 05, 2007, 05:38:00 PM

I bet PS3's DVD playback is AMAZING. Why? Because they delayed the release of their console an entire year to get Blueray working just right. MS$? They just released a reasonable "Free" DVD player in their console and spent that development time working on Xbox Live, the dashboard, and getting their product to market.

+1 MS$ if you ask me

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Mike4 on December 05, 2007, 05:42:00 PM

Admittedly, I'm not enough of a videophile to be able to say how great it really is, but watching a WMV-HD movie on my 360 is still pretty amazing to me. I don't have the HD DVD add-on, so the only HD content I can compare it to is what I get from cable. In my opinion, the WMV-HD movies look as good, if not better, than cable.

I don't think I ever watched a standard DVD, but that's why I have a standalone upconverting DVD player. I did try out a DivX file yesterday and I thought it actually looked pretty good.

The only thing I still wish it would play is mkv files. I thought I saw somewhere that you could stream them, but I haven't looked into how to do that yet.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: englishnamja on December 05, 2007, 05:47:00 PM

wow as a consumer.. using a TV to play my games and movies im not really bothered about this test or how badly it fails.. NO REAL DVD watching movie buff would have considered the xbox 360, xbox etc as DVD movie machines.. if i can put a movie in and it plays.. thats pretty much all i care about as a xbox user.. why not buy one of those high priced 6000$ machines which only play dvd's needs a external amp, and blah blah blah if your looking for test results.. if microsoft can fix that update and make the movies look better then yeah great..!

if your looking for really playing movies on a xbox with the same quality as a dedicated machine(s)
Amp, projector, or dsp lcd 48" - 110" tv, etc..
.. its like trying to compete with a rolls royce, using a hillman imp (google..) with 24k gold engine..although the xbox has a clearly more powerful engine than the dedicated dvd players.. its not built for the same purpose...

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Elemino on December 05, 2007, 05:29:00 PM

QUOTE(modistru @ Dec 5 2007, 06:22 PM)

You know some cars play DVD's now too... how about we start rating them?

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: elitegamer360 on December 05, 2007, 06:10:00 PM

This guy is F%$^in proper DUMB he compares the 360 DVD/HD playback with the PS3 Blu-Ray, he forgot that Sony made the PS3 as a Blu-Ray player and Microsft made the 360 as a GAMES CONSOLE. the FIRST reason WE buy the 360 is to play games with it, and the SONY FANs buy the PS3 to watch Blu-Ray movies lol..

Thats reality believe it or not F^%*in IDIOT.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: ndiddy on December 05, 2007, 06:30:00 PM

QUOTE

These tests are much simpler, involving simply de-interlacing 1080i content of both regular and film mode content, and noise reduction. It's like nothing is going on there at all.

I don't understand why you would want either of these functions in the HD-DVD player. Any decent HD TV should provide them for you.

Also, almost all HD-DVD's are encoded at 1080p so there is no need to de-interlace the signal at all.

Finally, the noise reduction should be done as close to the end of the signal stream as possible. If you do this before sending the signal through an optional a/v receiver then to the monitor you are just adding an extra step and creating the opportunity for noise to be reintroduced to the signal.

It seems to me like this guy is just looking for an excuse to wine and complain.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: joeyddr on December 05, 2007, 06:34:00 PM

christ someone call the waaahmbulance do we even know if this guys tv is calibrated properly? and who uses it to watch dvd's?

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: gnutellafan on December 05, 2007, 05:59:00 PM

Yeah, its sad that MS can't put a better DVD player in the 360 then the amazing one that the XBMC developers have put together for FREE!

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: GomerPyle on December 05, 2007, 06:12:00 PM

It wouldnt be so bad if MS was just sticking to games, but they are not they are bragging about media this and media that. And blah blah blah this isnt just a console but this is a media center. The DVD playback functions and picture quality playing dvds on the 360 is garbage!@

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: pr0ph3t- on December 05, 2007, 06:30:00 PM

QUOTE(elitegamer360 @ Dec 6 2007, 02:10 AM)

Lol, fanboy

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: kics on December 05, 2007, 06:36:00 PM

QUOTE(angryyoungnpoor @ Dec 5 2007, 05:45 PM)

I bought it for games. I have 10 other dvd players that I'm able to use just fine. The added features of avi make it so that I can view avi files without going on my computer.

yeap.... i think its a gaming console WHICH now supports divx ....

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Devedander on December 05, 2007, 06:42:00 PM

While I agree that the 360 is a game system first and DVD player second, the value it has to any particular person is going to be a perosnal decision and so isn't really the point. Just becuase you don't care about the DVD playback quality doesn't disqualify someone elses desire to have good quality DVD playback.

The real comparison here isn't to what you personally care about (again, you can't quantify that kind of thing as it's always perosnal) but rather as to what's obviously possible out there.

The main comparison (and it was listed) is the PS3... which does an excellent job playing DVDs. Sure they are completely different animals when you get down to it, but it all comes down to how well the 360 does compared to how well it could (easily/reasonably) do especially compared to the rest of the market.

If I buy a Honda Civic becuase it gets good gas mileage and I only want to ride the freeway to and from work, then I could care less that it can't handle off roading worth a darn.

But if every other econo box out there got great mileage and had similar features, but could off road like crazy... the fact that I don't care about the missing ability wouldn't weigh nearly as much as the fact that everyone else can, so there is obviously something wrong if yours can't.

The argument here isn't that anyone is crying they got ripped off on the DVD playback portion of their 360 (although many could say they did and I personally can easily understand - looking at my stack of devices, each of which does multiple things but only one thing well requiring me to take up a whole shelf to accomplish what really 2 or 3 of those thing should be able to cover - why some people would legitimately complain that the 360 has poor DVD playback) but that this is not an area where there is any legit excuse to not perform well.

The fact that you can buy a $10 DVD player that outperforms the 360 is no excuse for poor 360 performance... in fact it is even MORE a reason that there is NO excuse for poor 360 DVD performance.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: 88 Ecko Unltd 88 on December 05, 2007, 06:43:00 PM

I think this guy is an F-in idiot the 360 was invented to play video games not movies of course it has a hd dvd add on .. just cuz the ps3 has a video player included dosent make it superior at all since all the good games are on the 360 anywayz

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: HotKnife420 on December 05, 2007, 06:49:00 PM

QUOTE(xtremetech.com @ Dec 6 2007, 12:15 AM)

hese tests are much simpler, involving simply de-interlacing 1080i content of both regular and film mode content

Why on earth would you ever need to de-interlace a progressive (non-interlaced) signal? Am I missing something?

QUOTE(mlmadmax @ Dec 6 2007, 12:55 AM)

Being an "uber nerd"? Outside of "uber" itself being "nerdish", the fact is out of a possible 130 it scored 40. While some of the things tested may be trivial to you, for some, they WILL make a difference.

QUOTE(Elemino @ Dec 6 2007, 02:05 AM)

You know some cars play DVD's now too... how about we start rating them?

WE weren't rating anything. This review was posted on a completely different website, and posted here because it's xbox-related (duh). To expand, do you honestly think they don't have websites that rate care DVD players (not to mention countless other products). Am I to understand you have a problem with the consumer being fully informed?

Seems it doesn't matter what the news is, there's always 2 sets of people complaining about the other people complaining. Personally, I see nothing wrong with rating a products performance of advertised features. Furthermore, I can't believe that people have the audacity to bash the review for pointing out flaws with it, considering how strongly MS has been pushing for people to use the 360 as their "media center". Are we to understand that if we want a good "media center" experience with our 360's that we must limit ourselves to marketplace content? Why would they tell me I should be playing DVDs and HD-DVDs with it, then?

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: The_Flash on December 05, 2007, 06:52:00 PM

QUOTE(Devedander @ Dec 5 2007, 10:18 PM)

...looking at my stack of devices, each of which does multiple things but only one thing well requiring me to take up a whole shelf to accomplish what really 2 or 3 of those thing should be able to cover - why some people would legitimately complain...

Amen. I'm with you on that one.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: djtonic on December 05, 2007, 07:28:00 PM

QUOTE(mlmadmax @ Dec 6 2007, 12:55 AM)

Yeah...as soon as he said he hooked it up in the "lab" A Laboratory is a place that scientific experimentations occur. I could call my living or game room a "lab" too but it doesnt give me any more credibility.
As far as the tests go...NO ONE bought the 360 as a Hi-end video playback device. Besides most video/audiophiles prefer analog like laserdisc and vinyl, this guy is obviously a poser

Don't ask me why...probably because they are washed up producers or maybe because they paid 2,000 for that panasonic LD player and still think it was worth the money.

I don't know if i am out numbered here but I really didnt care about the 360 support update for video at all..it's fine and nice but i only play games. I guess if I didnt have a pc hooked up to my tv for streaming over my network then maybe i would feel different.

~Dj~

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Exobex on December 05, 2007, 07:31:00 PM

I'd expect the PS3 to offer better DVD playback... look at the price of the f***ing thing!!!

I'm perfectly happy with my game-playing, DVD-playing, upscaling-through-VGA 360. Makes a damned good player when hooked up to the LCD at the foot of my bath, and the wireless controllers don't mind the odd splash!

What's this guy expect, anyway? It's a Microsoft games console. It's not a Denon.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: AmyGrrl on December 05, 2007, 08:28:00 PM

I'd like to see how the XBOX 1 rates with DVD playback when using each playback metheod... the Default MS Player, DVD-X v2.0 Dongle Free and XBMC... when output @ 480i/480p/720p/1018i... I'm not sure if the first 2 support the higher resolutions... but XBMC does.... it would be funny if the XBOX 1 does a better job than the XBOX 360..

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Jstraw on December 05, 2007, 08:00:00 PM

I don't care how many ppl want to protect the 360, but when it comes to DVD playback, MS has really dropped the ball! MS tries to say, this is a video game system and that is our focus. BULLOCKS! This is being sold as a family entertainment system which includes a dvd playback system. For this system to score a 0 for HD is sad. So MS, Pick up the ball

And by the way, Playback is visually terrible. I just bought a toshiba A2 and it upconverts. I have been missing a visual experience. When I compared playback from the 360 to a stand alone there is a huge difference without the upconversion. I had no idea I could get the visuals I get now because I depended on my xbox for DVD playback for years.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: gli7ch on December 05, 2007, 08:15:00 PM

Come on now, we all know we are just pirates here, who uses DVD's anyways?

Xbox 360 is playing DivX now right?

And who the hell says "crummy" anymore?

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: kero on December 05, 2007, 08:34:00 PM

QUOTE(AmyGrrl @ Dec 6 2007, 04:28 AM)

In his original report he says the original XBOX was a very good dvd player, which is why he was surprised the XBOX360 was not very good.
The main point of his article was that by putting in some more development time into the dashboard the XBOX360 could also be a very good dvd player - but obviously it is not MS priority.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Devedander on December 05, 2007, 09:20:00 PM

QUOTE(HotKnife420 @ Dec 6 2007, 03:25 AM)

Why on earth would you ever need to de-interlace a progressive (non-interlaced) signal? Am I missing something?

I think you missed the part where there was an i after the 1080 denoting it's interlaced information...

QUOTE(Exobex @ Dec 6 2007, 04:07 AM)

I'd expect the PS3 to offer better DVD playback... look at the price of the f***ing thing!!!

Ummmm.. the cheap PS3 is right on par with the expensive xbox and regardless if a $10 DVD player can do it well, $300 vs $500 is not a legit excuse for being a poor performer. There is no way that a triple core processor based system with an advanced graphics card should not be capable of doing good standard DVD playback.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: tha754boy on December 05, 2007, 08:50:00 PM

I'm still using a standard definition TV so I could care less about all the HD bullshit you guys are whining over. In my opinion, it does a damned good job as a dvd player

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Akrat on December 05, 2007, 08:50:00 PM

Forget HD DVD and DVD's... Have you tried playing CD's in it? Simply AMAZING!!!!

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: SEHF on December 05, 2007, 09:14:00 PM

I think the playback is fine on DVDs, but I'm not really as obsessed as some people. I haven't used the HD-DVD addon, yet. Hopefully, MS will improve its DVD and HD-DVD playback so people who care can't complain as much.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: BasicAir on December 05, 2007, 09:17:00 PM

Hahaha. This guy is an idiot.

My Elite 360 running HDMI to a 1080p tv with a 1080p HD-DVD provides the same superb picture that any other HD-DVD player with HDMI and the same 1080p HD-DVD will.

I'd love him to come over and watch my 56" 1080p with any of my 50+ HD-DVD titles and try to find *anything* I am missing in terms of quality. Because I'm not missing anything: HD-DVD's still look absolutely phenomenal, and loads better than any HDTV signal I receive via antenna or through satellite.

Maybe the 360's DVD player is lacking, but for him to say the HD-DVD player provides sub-par playback quality is completely false. He didn't outright say this but in saying that the 360's HD-DVD player scored a "0 out of 100" in his 'test' insinuates that the 360's HD-DVD playback is pitiful. When, in fact, it's no different than any other HD-DVD (or even Blu-ray for that matter) players' quality.

And I *am* one of those A/V nerds/geeks and enthusiasts.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: 0794 on December 05, 2007, 09:26:00 PM

guess i should be glad that my 360 will never see a DVD...

edit - i just read BasicAir's post and i believe everything he has said for years, so the HD DVD 360 add-on has to be good - he's got strict standards for his entertainment...

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: g8crapachino on December 05, 2007, 10:15:00 PM

In my opinion, if you have to run a bunch of test apps just to tell that there is a difference then it isn't even worth worrying about.

The 360 is a game console first and foremost, DVD playback is just a side benefit. Very few people buy an Xbox as a sole replacement for a stand-alone DVD player. Microsoft shouldn't even waste their time worrying about the opinion of that guy since the things he wants very few people would ever appreciate.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: PerfectGun on December 05, 2007, 09:51:00 PM

QUOTE(fiya @ Dec 5 2007, 05:36 PM)

MS is like the mother of 13 million crybabies; she just can't feed all of them at once! unfortunately, these babies have internet access...

Best quote of the day right there!!

But still MS should address it in the next update, the competition is scoring very high in DVD and HD playback.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: xboxSlayer on December 05, 2007, 10:21:00 PM

add another one to:

I bought the xbox360 to play games. I have other equipment to play movies.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: geniusjc on December 05, 2007, 11:00:00 PM

I'm not inclined to believe anything the guy is printing in his articles. He didn't even know how to turn off notifications during movies only.

Being the nice guy I am though, I took the time to look up the step by step instructions on it at xbox.com for him and emailed them to him!

Then I kindly asked him not to include any incorrect information about the Xbox 360 in his articles.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: faithlesssoul on December 06, 2007, 12:50:00 AM

I bought it for games me to

fuck it being a dvd play or even an hd dvd player i bought for the games and thats it.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: chinchillanet.co.uk on December 06, 2007, 02:27:00 AM

id just like to add something here

the guy who wrote all that inane pointless bull that we have all risen to is a complete and utter tool.

Ok, it may not be the most perfect Hd-DVD addon/player available, but tbh who is actually gonna notice?

unless you have a screen the size of a house, and 20/20 vision you really arent going to notice any differences in performance from a 360 HD-DVD addon or a PS3 playing a Blu-Ray disc.

The guy up there ^ somewhere was right when he said that a player outputting 1080p over HDMI to a HD Ready HDMI input screen is going to be exactly that. 1080p!

i mean come on, who the fuck cares? Ive spent far too much time in my life trying to keep up with home cinema, so much so its cost me over £40k to date! ive only just got myself a 1080p samsung lcd, and im still super amazed by everything i throw at it.

HD is HD and 1080p is 1080p. Even if you were to use low quality HDMI cables the picture will still be 1080p!

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: ze_olc on December 06, 2007, 05:11:00 AM

this review is flawed and pointless anyway; this is the same guy that last time critized so the x360 dvd player while he didnt even know that vga cbale could give an upconverted picture. well, at least, he did get some vga cable this time.
personally i occasionnally use my x360 to watch movies on my ae-900 projector (either dvds or dvds ripped to h.264 with handbrake); i must say they look great actually. sure, a good standalone player can beat that but the fact is playing dvd is just a plus and the x360 does that very well to my eyes.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Nive on December 06, 2007, 05:15:00 AM

IMHO:

A few weeks ago my old premium-console died, so I bought an Arcade. It's connected to a Thoshiba 37" WL58 via HDMI running on 1080i.

I watched "Elizabeth" and the quality was simply amazing.
Even finest patterns and ornamets were shown clearly without any problems. The colors were stunning and beautiful.

Ice Age II also rocked my butt. The fur of the animals looked very plastic. *thumbs up*

So I'm asking myself if it's just easy to satisfy me, or the playback with an HDMI-Cable is way superior than VGA or Component...?

Sorry for my cheesy english... i'm from austria and it looks like my (poor) school-english-skills gone even worse in the past years...

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: ze_olc on December 06, 2007, 05:15:00 AM

QUOTE

Maybe the 360's DVD player is lacking, but for him to say the HD-DVD player provides sub-par playback quality is completely false. He didn't outright say this but in saying that the 360's HD-DVD player scored a "0 out of 100" in his 'test' insinuates that the 360's HD-DVD playback is pitiful. When, in fact, it's no different than any other HD-DVD (or even Blu-ray for that matter) players' quality.

i agree and i think the guy that made this review is biased; hd-dvd playback on the x30 has been tested by many video enthousiasts and many websites, he is the only one to claim such a stupid thing. i guess he probably never actually test video gear b4.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: joeyddr on December 06, 2007, 07:55:00 AM

I stream wmv-hd content to it all the time and i find it to be superb in quality when watching it, from my elite to my bravia over hdmi looks awesome.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Elemino on December 06, 2007, 08:36:00 AM

QUOTE(HotKnife420 @ Dec 5 2007, 08:25 PM)

No, you are to understand that having the DVD player is just an extra feature. I never thought one about DVD capabilities when I bought my 360, it was all about gaming. It's like going out and spending a few hundred thousand dollars on a brand new Lamborghini with a DVD player in the dash and getting upset because it skips evertime you make a sudden turn at 90MPH. Who cares? It's about the car not the DVD player. Same deal here. DVD players start out at $40 and about $70 if you want one that upconverts. We have 1080p HD DVD players on sale at my store right now for $250 new. If I cared that much about movies, I wouldn't have spent $450 on an xbox just to turn around and spend another $180 on an attatchment. I would have just bought an HD DVD player. (and btw... I still dont have the attatchment... that's not why I have my 360).

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Mozbius on December 06, 2007, 09:35:00 AM

QUOTE(Devedander @ Dec 6 2007, 02:18 AM)

I couldn't say it better. I think that you've nailed it! It's definitely not a fanboy talking here.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: HotKnife420 on December 06, 2007, 08:59:00 AM

QUOTE(Elemino @ Dec 6 2007, 05:12 PM)

First of all, it's *not* like buying a Lambo and complaining about the DVD player. You can easily buy another DVD player for it and replace the one you don't like (although as expensive as a Labo is, it should come with a nice one; talk to the dealer about that tho), wheras with the Xbox 360, you're stuck with that one because it's coded into the kernel. There is NO WAY to use an alternate viewer, other than possibly some software based one running through ubanto or something.

Secondly, I agree that many people buy a device to "specialize" in a task, rather than rely on one to fufill all their needs. This is NOT the approach MS has been taking, however. To advertise the 360 should be the "hub for your media center experience", is to imply superb DVD/HD-DVD playback, not just a machine that will play them, but not as well as a standalone device and you should just buy our HD-WMV's or whatever. I've noticed a couple things with the HD-DVD addon at my friend's house, and seemed kinda weird. Watching HD Transformers had some red "noise" on the screen, but only in a part at the beginning. I didn't watch the whole thing, but that seemed to be the only problem, however there are many titiles that have had playback problems with the 360 addon (remember Children of Men, among others). Personally, I'd probably buy the $99 HD-DVD player before I buy the HD-addon for the 360, but it's not an issue at the moment.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Obveron on December 06, 2007, 10:05:00 AM

QUOTE(BasicAir @ Dec 6 2007, 05:53 AM)

Clearly your as big an A/V enthusuiast as you think.
Not all HD-DVD players are created equal, there are high end players with devoted chips to clearing up the picure. Some of these chips are vastly better than others. The HQV test he used isn't "his test", its a widely accepted test that is able to evaluate differences in picture quality that perhaps YOUR eyes can't pick up.
I gotta say, when I output a HD-DVD from my PC to the my 1080p TV, it DOES look better than the 360's HD-DVD playback.
The fact that you even talk about antenna or Sattelite broadcast, proves you aren't fully aware. It's commonly known that HD broadcasters use horrible compression techniques that result in a terrible picture compared to a HD-DVD player, including the 360. Why compare the two?
And the fact that you mention HDMI like its a big factor, shows you aren't fully aware. HDMI isnt a big deal, my PC outputting HD-DVD via VGA looks better than my 360(hd-dvd) via hdmi. Its becuase my PC video card uses great techniques to clean up the jaggies etc. the VGA connector is not a issue.

I understand why alot a people are harping, "its a gaming console, who cares about DVD!". Thats all well and good for you, but its a feature none the less and it deserves to be evaluated. Don't blame this guy for evaluating a feature you don't care about it. Just ignore it and move on.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: mercury187 on December 06, 2007, 09:59:00 AM

It was best said in Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, "if anything is worth doing, its worth doing right". I think they should quit spending time on releasing this useless social junk updates (parental timers, friends of friends, personal profiles... come on your kidding right? its a game console) and fix the issues with their console. MS is terrible at releasing products, their game console is just like its operating systems: full of problems and containing useless updates. I got the console because its a high definition machine, if they are going to put video playback in it they should make it right.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: DjRicochet1 on December 06, 2007, 10:48:00 AM

The guy who wrote that report wants shooting.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Chancer on December 06, 2007, 11:13:00 AM

QUOTE

No he is not the only one. a quick google or checking round would tell you that.
here is one and just one picture to show you. This shows DVD playback is sup par.
HD-DVD will not be on a par with expensive stand alone players.

http://gizmodo.com/g...-bad-233490.php
IPB Image

HD-DVD will not be on a par with expensive stand alone players.

QUOTE

The Xbox 360 HD DVD player is an inexpensive way for 360 owners to get high-def movies, but nonowners and audiophiles should stick with standalone HD players.

Source http://reviews.cnet....7-32138037.html

It seems too many people are unable to accept any sort of criticism aimed at the 360 even when it is valid.

QUOTE

The guy who wrote that report wants shooting.

Well obviously your balanced view and backup reasoning is bettter

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: imagenius on December 06, 2007, 12:19:00 PM

QUOTE(Akrat @ Dec 6 2007, 12:26 AM)

Forget HD DVD and DVD's... Have you tried playing CD's in it? Simply AMAZING!!!!

I haven't checked in a while but is it still impossible to fast forward/rewind music?

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: elitegamer360 on December 06, 2007, 11:49:00 AM

QUOTE(Chancer @ Dec 6 2007, 07:49 PM)

HD-DVD will not be on a par with expensive stand alone players.

Source http://reviews.cnet....7-32138037.html

It seems too many people are unable to accept any sort of criticism aimed at the 360 even when it is valid.

Well obviously your balanced view and backup reasoning is bettter

My GOD why are you bringing that picture on again and what!!! comparing Denon with the 360!! you got to be Kidding me right?. lol

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Chancer on December 06, 2007, 12:28:00 PM

QUOTE(elitegamer360 @ Dec 6 2007, 07:25 PM)

My GOD why are you bringing that picture on again and what!!! comparing Denon with the 360!! you got to be Kidding me right?. lol

Because too many people refuse to see any flaws in anything MS. Too many people believing no difference in a high end player vs a 360.
Personally I never would use my 360 for DVd playback. I already have better equipment, but if someone wants a one machine solution, I can see why they would be disappointed.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: the_nerdy on December 06, 2007, 01:50:00 PM

ok, dumb people...

DVD has been around how long now?
and a DVD player with no upconversion beats the xbox360.

the Xbox (not 360) has better dvd playback, and that could of been put into the X360.

You got to remember, it is another thing Microsoft didn't care about. A DVD player is a game machine if you think about it.
you just got a controller instead of a remote. And a way better graphics card, so a gaming system should be an all in one wonder. That is why I buy them. To watch DVD's. and play my games.

You got to look at it, this isn't about me, it is about the average user in general.
And upconverting DVD's has been out for years now as well.

This isn't new technology people. Marketing Scam.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: antiflag1980 on December 06, 2007, 01:19:00 PM

I don't get the people that are like "If you want a dvd player buy a stand alone player", it's an advertised feauture and you paid for it, even more so if you buy the hd-dvd addon. It's not a "bonus feature" or "free dvd player", any feature that you payed for should work correctly. M$ is a multi billion dollar corporation, they can afford to have some people fix the issue, they don't need their consumers to stick up for them, even against their own interests. Why would you want to be forced to buy a separate stand alone player for quality video, when you have already paid for a machine that's supposed to be capable of doing so?

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: 21cwSpanky on December 06, 2007, 01:35:00 PM

QUOTE(Chancer @ Dec 6 2007, 09:04 PM)

This is where the problem is though, microsoft initially was marketing the xbox 360 as a "home entertainment device" and boasted about it's "do everything" capability and it failed terribly at doing such.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Chancer on December 06, 2007, 03:13:00 PM

QUOTE(21cwSpanky @ Dec 6 2007, 09:11 PM)

I completely agree. I too was under the impression that we were moving towards complete multimedia solutions with the newer consoles and Ms did use this as marketing strategy. If I had purchased the 360 to do the lot I would not be happy at the quality.
It seems anyone who dares to say this about the DVD side of the 360 gets shot to pieces for telling the truth

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: elitegamer360 on December 06, 2007, 03:32:00 PM

QUOTE(Chancer @ Dec 6 2007, 09:04 PM)

I can agree with all what you said, and like you I dont use my 360 for DVD playback but some times I just have a preview for fun. To me the DVD, SD material, Divx and Xvid that I have tried on the 360 looks awesome through my 32" HDTV and I find it even better than all my £100 DVD players and Xvid Combo players that I have bought during the years. I just trashed all of them last month because I use my XBOX XBMC all the time now and I've converted all my media library to Digital storage so no need for DVD players any more.

Even the stuff that I play using XBMC looks better using the 360, but I would never use the 360 for now because:
1- Gets too hot.
2- Too much power consumption for DVD, SD, or HD playback.
3- I only want to use it for Gaming.
4- XBMC functionality, ease of playback and features Superseds the 360.

and ONLY when MS releases the 65nm CPU with lower power consuption then I will be using it more for DVD/HD playback "I'm gona have to buy a Second 360 thought" lol.

to summarise, I find the Xvid, Divx, DVD and HD playback using the 360 is awesome and I would not see why every one is bitching about it, as if they sit 1-inch away from the screen and they can spot every single artifact with the picture...

The guy who wrote the article is retard and every one whos bitching about the picture quality needs to get a life, go get girl friend and/or buy a Denon.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: lcprove on December 06, 2007, 04:00:00 PM

Every HD-DVD movie I've watched through the 360 HD-DVD addon looks badass, Transformers included. I like the HD-DVD addon just as much as my PS3's Blue-Ray player. I watch my movies on a 42" Toshiba Regza via component with the 360 and HDMI with the PS3. I see no differences except sometimes the Blue-Ray movies can actually look a little worse (maybe the encoding was bad) but the Spiderman trilogy on it is outstanding so I know Blue-Ray is fine.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: Elemino on December 07, 2007, 12:30:00 AM

QUOTE(HotKnife420 @ Dec 6 2007, 10:35 AM)

To advertise the 360 should be the "hub for your media center experience", is to imply superb DVD/HD-DVD playback, not just a machine that will play them, but not as well as a standalone device and you should just buy our HD-WMV's or whatever.

Since when has any all-in-one solution you can BUY (that excludes xbmc) been the best at all of the things it can do? With ANYthing in electronics, separate components are ALWAYS better than any all-in-one solution. That can include anything from 3/4 in 1 printers, to HTIB's that come with a built in DVD player and have 5.1 capability. The only problem I see is ppl taking the companies too literally. It's their job to make themselves sound good. No company is going to advertise and say, "Well we have an okay player, but you could do better. Still you should buy ours." Never forget, the number 1 purpose for ANY business is to make money. Period. They tell you the good stuff and the posibilities, and they leave the bad stuff out. I've seen vendors come into my store and down talk other brands to make themselves look good. Pitiful... but none the less it is their job to make their company look good no matter what.

Title: Fall Update07: Still a Crummy DVD Player
Post by: HotKnife420 on December 07, 2007, 10:35:00 AM

QUOTE(Elemino @ Dec 7 2007, 09:06 AM)

And that makes it ok.

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Xbox360 Forums => Xbox 360 General Forums => Xbox360's Multimedia Features => Topic started by: Xbox-Scene on December 05, 2007, 04:15:00 PM