Post by: PS3Scene on January 04, 2008, 03:41:00 PM
Warner Goes Blu-ray Exclusive Posted by XanTium | 4-1-2008 17:05 EST |
| From the press release: Quote
|
Post by: mduga on January 04, 2008, 04:16:00 PM
Post by: Quest on January 04, 2008, 04:20:00 PM
Post by: Ranger72 on January 04, 2008, 04:23:00 PM
Post by: majik655 on January 04, 2008, 04:26:00 PM
What a bunch of B*LL SH*t
Consumers have CLEARLY chosen I don't think so..
Guess I will be one of the FEW left over not buying warner bros.
since it is clear consumers have chosen blue ray.
Post by: Dav5049915 on January 04, 2008, 03:52:00 PM
i will NEVER buy a bluray dvd or dvd player.
lol i joined exactly a year ago. and today is my first post
This post has been edited by Dav5049915: Jan 4 2008, 11:53 PM
Post by: warmaster_670 on January 04, 2008, 03:55:00 PM
QUOTE(majik655 @ Jan 4 2008, 06:26 PM) 
"Consumers have clearly chosen Blu-ray, and we believe that recognizing this preference is the right step in making this great home entertainment experience accessible to the widest possible audience.
What a bunch of B*LL SH*t
Consumers have CLEARLY chosen I don't think so..
Guess I will be one of the FEW left over not buying warner bros.
since it is clear consumers have chosen blue ray.
ya bull indeed, BRs only been outselling hddvd since pretty much when it came out
Post by: Andronicus on January 04, 2008, 04:32:00 PM
Even though PS3 sales have sucked, I think that including the blueray player in the PS3 is what tipped the scales. Just look at market penetration. How many people have acctualy bought a stand alone Hi Def player? I don't know anyone.
Post by: zequal on January 04, 2008, 03:56:00 PM
QUOTE(majik655 @ Jan 5 2008, 01:26 AM)
"Consumers have clearly chosen Blu-ray, and we believe that recognizing this preference is the right step in making this great home entertainment experience accessible to the widest possible audience.
What a bunch of B*LL SH*t
why is that BS? warner may have seen that their hd-dvd's aint selling as good as their blu-ray's
Post by: Andronicus on January 04, 2008, 04:38:00 PM
The cheepest Blue-ray stand-alone player: $450
The cheepest HD-DVD stand-alone player: $350
I had always thougth that the HD-DVD players were WAY cheeper, but turns out they are only slightly cheeper.
If, like the recent artical posted on XBS suggested, sony drops the price of their players to below $200, even at a loss, then the war will be officialy over.
Post by: fhsasbvp on January 04, 2008, 04:39:00 PM
Post by: warmaster_670 on January 04, 2008, 04:14:00 PM
QUOTE(fhsasbvp @ Jan 4 2008, 06:39 PM)
All that really matters is that microsoft is now going to have to put a dual format player in their super xbox 360 II Turbo Ultimate Collectors Edition or whatever it'll be called.
best name ever
Post by: Ninja Sniper X on January 04, 2008, 04:54:00 PM
Post by: DeMoN_DARREN on January 04, 2008, 04:54:00 PM
Post by: twistedsymphony on January 04, 2008, 04:19:00 PM
QUOTE(Andronicus @ Jan 4 2008, 06:38 PM)
I just checked out BestBuy.ca.
The cheepest Blue-ray stand-alone player: $450
The cheepest HD-DVD stand-alone player: $350
I had always thougth that the HD-DVD players were WAY cheeper, but turns out they are only slightly cheeper.
If, like the recent artical posted on XBS suggested, sony drops the price of their players to below $200, even at a loss, then the war will be officialy over.
The HD-A2 was selling for $99 before christmas in the US
The HD-A3 was selling for $199 before christmas in the US
each came with 10 HD-DVDs for free with purchase
300, the Bourne Supremacy, 5 more from a select list and 3 more from pretty much anything in the store (save box sets).
HD-DVDs are cheaper... if the cheapest you could find is $350 then they either jack up the price in Canada or they're simply out of stock of the cheap ones.
The cheapest Stand Alone Blu-Ray player I've seen is also $450 though.
Post by: lc204 on January 04, 2008, 04:56:00 PM
Post by: sillyboydarryl on January 04, 2008, 04:57:00 PM
but...
I'll admit that there was a lot against it.. (and still is)
1. No HD DVD on the 360 (without addon).. but a Bluray on a PS3 (that really didn't have decent games so people bought movies.)
2. The porn industry changed from HD DVD exclusive to Bluray. Now originally they wanted to put stuff on Bluray but Sony said NO. All of the sudden the Porn Industry realizes how many PS3s are used for movies and their users demand porn (no joke lol) so the Porn Industry finally gets a green flag from Sony to make porn. Porn lead the way for VHS and DVD... The porn Industry loved the WEB enabled content from HD DVD but then realized no one really uses it.
3. The departure of Warner Bros was rumored.. but them leaving has a lot to do with all the other companies that back Bluray exclusively.
4. Target + Walmart + Bestbuy. Go to their stores and see how big the Bluray section is compared to HD DVD. Retailers had much more impact on the choice of Media (as it hurts their bottom line when the people dont know what media to side with).
Post by: snart on January 04, 2008, 04:22:00 PM
QUOTE(DeMoN_DARREN @ Jan 4 2008, 11:54 PM)
Shame that, HD-DVD is just better... Well, fuck, market cornered again
Why do you say that? I own a bunch of movies in both formats. To me, they're identical, except that Blu-ray discs are much more durable.
Post by: warmaster_670 on January 04, 2008, 04:26:00 PM
QUOTE(twistedsymphony @ Jan 4 2008, 06:55 PM)
The HD-A2 was selling for $99 before christmas in the US
The HD-A3 was selling for $199 before christmas in the US
each came with 10 HD-DVDs for free with purchase
300, the Bourne Supremacy, 5 more from a select list and 3 more from pretty much anything in the store (save box sets).
HD-DVDs are cheaper... if the cheapest you could find is $350 then they either jack up the price in Canada or they're simply out of stock of the cheap ones.
The cheapest Stand Alone Blu-Ray player I've seen is also $450 though.
amazon.com has one right now for $316 USD
Post by: rocarmy4life on January 04, 2008, 05:02:00 PM
i really wish they had...this woulda been over a looong time ago.
Post by: emailer33 on January 04, 2008, 04:26:00 PM
QUOTE(snart @ Jan 4 2008, 06:58 PM)
Why do you say that? I own a bunch of movies in both formats. To me, they're identical, except that Blu-ray discs are much more durable.
HD-DVD require more features on the players, thus if the studio's take advantage of it, more features on the movies. That and the fact that Blu-ray standard was changing as movies were coming out, while HD-DVD is pretty much set in stone.
Odd you mention Blu-ray being more durable, from my experience they scratch insanely easy.
Post by: sillyboydarryl on January 04, 2008, 05:03:00 PM
Blu Ray burners for the PC are now dipping in the 399 range. Make no mistake.. thats huge.
I've yet to see a HD DVD burner.. but there are tonz of 10 dollar HD DVDrs around...
Post by: warmaster_670 on January 04, 2008, 04:34:00 PM
QUOTE(sillyboydarryl @ Jan 4 2008, 06:57 PM)
I own and support HD DVD titles...
but...
I'll admit that there was a lot against it.. (and still is)
1. No HD DVD on the 360 (without addon).. but a Bluray on a PS3 (that really didn't have decent games so people bought movies.)
2. The porn industry changed from HD DVD exclusive to Bluray. Now originally they wanted to put stuff on Bluray but Sony said NO. All of the sudden the Porn Industry realizes how many PS3s are used for movies and their users demand porn (no joke lol) so the Porn Industry finally gets a green flag from Sony to make porn. Porn lead the way for VHS and DVD... The porn Industry loved the WEB enabled content from HD DVD but then realized no one really uses it.
3. The departure of Warner Bros was rumored.. but them leaving has a lot to do with all the other companies that back Bluray exclusively.
4. Target + Walmart + Bestbuy. Go to their stores and see how big the Bluray section is compared to HD DVD. Retailers had much more impact on the choice of Media (as it hurts their bottom line when the people dont know what media to side with).
QUOTE(emailer33 @ Jan 4 2008, 07:02 PM)
HD-DVD require more features on the players, thus if the studio's take advantage of it, more features on the movies. That and the fact that Blu-ray standard was changing as movies were coming out, while HD-DVD is pretty much set in stone.
Odd you mention Blu-ray being more durable, from my experience they scratch insanely easy.
then your experiences were bad, theve got scrath resistent coating on them, not sure who made it, toshiba, starts with a t i think
Post by: prplehz on January 04, 2008, 05:10:00 PM
Edited: After thinking about it some more...
This post has been edited by prplehz: Jan 5 2008, 01:26 AM
Post by: Quest on January 04, 2008, 05:10:00 PM
all porn on blueray is not pressed by sony owned companys.
Post by: bucko on January 04, 2008, 05:14:00 PM
Post by: warmaster_670 on January 04, 2008, 05:18:00 PM
QUOTE(bucko @ Jan 4 2008, 07:14 PM) 
I'm just dam glad I got a PS3 now hehe though I will still be buying HD-DVD's since I don't want to sit on the fence but Warner Bros is still producing HD-DVD's right just means movies will come out first on Blu-Ray? So I doubt it's that bad, oh and I still think HD-DVD's have an edge over movie price, play.com has awesome titles for really cheap. I'm tempted to buy the Matrix collection my self.
i would guess that after the current movies coming out on hddvd are out, the rest will be blu ray only.
of course i didnt bother tor ead about it
Post by: bubbafett4hire on January 04, 2008, 05:24:00 PM
Post by: Ranger72 on January 04, 2008, 05:24:00 PM
But truth be told some of you are so blind loyal to HDDVD that nothing really matters anyway. You guys will be the next beta max guys 5 years from now. Sitting alone in your dark basement with pictures of little red HD-DVD disk boxes bouncing in your head wondering why they cant find their favorite movie at their local WalMart.
Who cares people. I have 2 HDDVD stand alone players and my PS3. I would like HDDVD to be doing better but in the end I just want one format to win and it looks like that will be Blu-Ray.
But this war was over before it began. Disney won this war long time ago.
This post has been edited by Ranger72: Jan 5 2008, 01:25 AM
Post by: IDidMyTime on January 04, 2008, 04:48:00 PM
QUOTE(rocarmy4life @ Jan 5 2008, 02:02 AM)
maaaaaan...MS really messed up by not putting the HD-DVD player in their consoles as standard. With how many millions of consoles sold...pshhh
i really wish they had...this woulda been over a looong time ago.
I dont, that would of rocketed the price of the 360 and i doubt they would of sold as many units as they had. MS did the better option because atleast their console is selling well.
Lets be honest here, Blu Ray is the better choice and im glad its won, I look forward to getting Blu Ray in the next Xbox
Post by: iwannadie on January 04, 2008, 05:28:00 PM
Post by: PerfectGun on January 04, 2008, 05:29:00 PM
This post has been edited by PerfectGun: Jan 5 2008, 01:31 AM
Post by: BoNeZ on January 04, 2008, 04:56:00 PM
QUOTE(rocarmy4life @ Jan 5 2008, 12:02 AM)
maaaaaan...MS really messed up by not putting the HD-DVD player in their consoles as standard. With how many millions of consoles sold...pshhh
i really wish they had...this woulda been over a looong time ago.
Actually when I heard about MS bringing out the HD-DVD player for the 360 as a bolt on, I thought it was a brilliant move from a business and marketing standpoint.
1. It allowed them to get the 360 out to many consumers who don't (or didn't at that time) give a rip about HD at all. They just want to play games. They had the cheaper console, much cheaper. And hey, if you want to watch HD movies, they'd hook you up.
2. People can say what they will about either of the formats, but I personally don't think one was technically superiour over the other. Each had some pros and cons (fanboys go away :-) ). However, from a productization standpoint, if you're not 100% certain that your format will win, why embed the hardware. Sell it as a bolt on and if the format you're backing doesn't win out, guess what, you can simply sell a different bolt on later.
This is somewhat akin to being an arms dealer, no matter which side wins, you come out smelling like roses.
--BoNeZ
Post by: sillyboydarryl on January 04, 2008, 05:07:00 PM
QUOTE(Ranger72 @ Jan 5 2008, 01:24 AM)
Why on earth do you people insist on bringing up the porn issue. It means nothing today since most of it is spread through digital means.
But truth be told some of you are so blind loyal to HDDVD that nothing really matters anyway. You guys will be the next beta max guys 5 years from now. Sitting alone in your dark basement with pictures of little red HD-DVD disk boxes bouncing in your head wondering why they cant find their favorite movie at their local WalMart.
Who cares people. I have 2 HDDVD stand alone players and my PS3. I would like HDDVD to be doing better but in the end I just want one format to win and it looks like that will be Blu-Ray.
But this war was over before it began. Disney won this war long time ago.
I'll agree with you on the Disney part..
And I'll agree that porn for the most part is based on digital streaming as their means of distribution. But that doesn't change the fact that there is a demand for their product on HD discs. That doesn't change the fact that the demand was strong enough to get the HD DVD exclusive porn industry to move to Bluray..
porn was responsible for both VHS and DVD popularity (technology wise.. )
do a history check up on what moved the technology forward..
The good ol army.. and the sex industry...
I couldn't agree with you more on Disney though... specially with them acquiring Pixar...
Post by: bulge2 on January 04, 2008, 05:43:00 PM
personally ive been hoping that HDDVD would have more support, just because im anti-sony, but i dont think the 'war' is won yet.
its not just Betamax V VHS again - there are other ways to view HD movies at the moment - legal or not.
Digital delivery media is going to be the winner (eventually!) - look at itunes and how they effectively cornered the market with mp3's that were freely downloadable (and still are). the same will happen with video content.
everyone can see how the 'war' will pan out, but they wont get any of my cash until there is a digital delivery system in place that i can play on my PC, xbox360, PS3 or whatever.
but then im not who they sell current media too so.......
Post by: sillyboydarryl on January 04, 2008, 05:46:00 PM
For those of you trying to judge the quality of video..
dont bother at this stage...
for those that jumped on DVD early ... we all noticed horrible grain and horrible blacks on dvds .... now .. they've mastered encoding for that format..
the same is true for both HD DVD and Bluray..
I've watched both formats and noticed some movies look amazing at some parts.. and then awful encoded in other parts...
from what I remember ... the Fifth Element was a perfect example as to how they encoded it wrong the first time and a recall was made right away.....
the studios are still learning ....
Post by: Heet on January 04, 2008, 05:48:00 PM
Post by: xcalixxryderx on January 04, 2008, 05:56:00 PM
QUOTE(bulge2 @ Jan 4 2008, 04:43 PM)
Digital delivery media is going to be the winner (eventually!) - look at itunes and how they effectively cornered the market with mp3's that were freely downloadable (and still are). the same will happen with video content.
Well theres still loads of people around the world who want to hold an item their buying. I love the idea of purchusing\downloading media so long as its DRM free and I can burn\transfer it wherever I want.
As far as blu-ray goes dont you have to have an internet connection for that? maybe I'm wrong but if thats the case I cant see my 70+ yr old grandparents paying for broadband just to view a movies
Post by: Sc0rpion on January 04, 2008, 05:56:00 PM
Fact is when one format win's what will you buy? same thing happened with betamax and vhs - one winner and the other faded away.
The truth is a winner will be pushed through and we'll all be force fed the scrap's that are left.
If after a while you can't buy the losing format what else can you buy (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
This post has been edited by BoNg420: Jan 6 2008, 03:03 AM
Post by: iwannadie on January 04, 2008, 05:26:00 PM
QUOTE(sillyboydarryl @ Jan 4 2008, 05:43 PM)
I'll agree with you on the Disney part..
And I'll agree that porn for the most part is based on digital streaming as their means of distribution. But that doesn't change the fact that there is a demand for their product on HD discs. That doesn't change the fact that the demand was strong enough to get the HD DVD exclusive porn industry to move to Bluray..
porn was responsible for both VHS and DVD popularity (technology wise.. )
do a history check up on what moved the technology forward..
The good ol army.. and the sex industry...
I couldn't agree with you more on Disney though... specially with them acquiring Pixar...
Disney didnt mean as much as you think. I guess you dont remember an old dvd subformat called divx(no thing to do with the codec). Disney jumped on the divx bandwagon to compete with normal dvds. The divx kicker was you buy the disc for a few bucks, then after 24 hours your disc becomes a pay per view disk. The player had to be online(dialup) and hooked to a credit card.
Circuit city pushed that format heavy with disney being exclusive, it failed.
Post by: moddingswede on January 04, 2008, 06:06:00 PM
Post by: iwannadie on January 04, 2008, 06:07:00 PM
QUOTE(Sc0rpion @ Jan 4 2008, 05:56 PM)
What make me laugh is the people stating they will never buy blu-ray or hd-dvd because they prefer one format to the other,
Fact is when one format win's what will you buy? same thing happened with betamax and vhs - one winner and the other faded away.
There was no digital content alternative back then was there? Its not like my HD dvd player suddenly stops working either, I can watch movies on it just fine lol. I paid 150$ for the player(black friday), so I didnt break the bank on it. I refuse to buy a ps3 and wont pay More for a stand alone blu player instead of a ps3. I Might end up with one at some point but it will be bought at cost through(a friend at) denon.
Also if you think beta faded away your delirious. Beta was the Standard for all tv production and video editing because it was a superior format. Maybe you should research beta before claiming it faded away, or revise to say it faded from consumers?
Post by: Andronicus on January 04, 2008, 05:32:00 PM
QUOTE(twistedsymphony @ Jan 5 2008, 12:55 AM)
The HD-A2 was selling for $99 before christmas in the US
The HD-A3 was selling for $199 before christmas in the US
each came with 10 HD-DVDs for free with purchase
300, the Bourne Supremacy, 5 more from a select list and 3 more from pretty much anything in the store (save box sets).
HD-DVDs are cheaper... if the cheapest you could find is $350 then they either jack up the price in Canada or they're simply out of stock of the cheap ones.
The cheapest Stand Alone Blu-Ray player I've seen is also $450 though.
Those prices you are quoting are not stand-alone, they are the Xbox add-on (right?)
I checked bestbuy.com as well.
Blue ray: $400
HD-DVD: $300
Same story. Although cheeper, HD-DVD is still in the same "over-priced" ball park.
(pisses me off that they are cheeper in the USA, even though the Canadian dollar is worth more!)
Post by: iceman72 on January 04, 2008, 06:09:00 PM
Post by: sillyboydarryl on January 04, 2008, 06:11:00 PM
no 1080p output....
and yes.. sony said no to porn and the companies that pressed them followed suit.. but that has changed now..
Post by: SupaDawg on January 04, 2008, 06:17:00 PM
QUOTE(Andronicus @ Jan 5 2008, 02:08 AM) 
Those prices you are quoting are not stand-alone, they are the Xbox add-on (right?)
I checked bestbuy.com as well.
Blue ray: $400
HD-DVD: $300
Same story. Although cheeper, HD-DVD is still in the same "over-priced" ball park.
(pisses me off that they are cheeper in the USA, even though the Canadian dollar is worth more!)
no, both the HD-A2 and HD-A3 are standalone players. Also, he was correct in stating his pricing.
Toshiba HD-A2
Toshiba HD-A3
Post by: Ranger72 on January 04, 2008, 05:44:00 PM
QUOTE(iceman72 @ Jan 5 2008, 02:09 AM)
Well I guess I will be selling my HD addon and all my movies and buy a cheap 20g PS3. It does suck. But all I want is movies. It's bad enough now that not many movies drop on HD. Now this. This now sucks. Plus HD movies are just expensive as hell. I really hate buying them. Oh well, nice try HD and M$. We still win the video game war and thats all that matters.
That war wont be over for at least another 4 years. In that time MANY things will have changed.
Post by: bulge2 on January 04, 2008, 05:49:00 PM
QUOTE(Heet @ Jan 5 2008, 02:48 AM)
Buy hard drives instead. Thats what im doing. And at 1TB at a time too.
yep that a good plan bud. many will follow.
QUOTE(xcalixxryderx @ Jan 5 2008, 02:56 AM)
As far as blu-ray goes dont you have to have an internet connection for that? maybe I'm wrong but if thats the case I cant see my 70+ yr old grandparents paying for broadband just to view a movies
i see your point, my 75 year old gran doesnt even know what the internet is, but your point is really aimed at those who prefer to have a tangible product with nice box and inlay. Imagine a 20 year old in 40 years, i think they will know what to do? The xbox360 is already providing a HD movie download service - its just the start of a very big thing.
QUOTE(Sc0rpion @ Jan 5 2008, 02:56 AM)
What make me laugh is the people stating they will never buy blu-ray or hd-dvd because they prefer one format to the other,
Fact is when one format win's what will you buy? same thing happened with betamax and vhs - one winner and the other faded away.
The truth is a winner will be pushed through and we'll all be force fed the scrap's that are left.
If after a while you can't buy the losing format what else can you buy
yep your right here really, commercially speaking the product is there in the shop to be bought by people - at christmas i bought my other brother die hard 4 on bluray - he loved it
Post by: Sc0rpion on January 04, 2008, 06:31:00 PM
But and it's a big but... what diffrence does it make when the big I am's decide they are not going to produce the format for us mere mortal's.
One way or the other we are shafted into taking what they spoon feed us. so what! your nice new hd-dvd or blu-ray player upscales your old dvd's, I'm in the same boat and whatever happens, I'll upgrade and move on.
Post by: Foe-hammer on January 04, 2008, 05:58:00 PM
Kidding aside, this is a rather surprising turn of evens, i wonder what really forced warners hand?
Post by: iwannadie on January 04, 2008, 06:41:00 PM
QUOTE(Sc0rpion @ Jan 4 2008, 06:31 PM)
iwannadie: yep beta may have lived on for a while in a pro enviroment but to the common consumer it died a death, yes I know the history and my homework and always new it was the better format.
But and it's a big but... what diffrence does it make when the big I am's decide they are not going to produce the format for us mere mortal's.
One way or the other we are shafted into taking what they spoon feed us. so what your nice hd-dvd player upscales your old dvd's, I'm in the same boat and whatever happens I'll upgrade and move on.
My nice new HDdvd player also plays my stack of hd dvds, guess what they will still play years from now. So what if blu wins and hd is forgotten, my disks still work. People act like suddenly tomorrow HDdvds will suddenly be coasters.
Some time in 2008 when HD new release start to dry up(if they do), a dual format player will be out for those who want to keep up to date. Selling all your HDdvds right now to me just makes no sense at all, they still work and will continue too lol.
QUOTE(Foe-hammer @ Jan 4 2008, 06:34 PM)
suns of beatches! Now i'll be forced to get a PS3!
Kidding aside, this is a rather surprising turn of evens, i wonder what really forced warners hand?
I wonder too, because the press release made no sense.
"A two-format landscape has led to consumer confusion and indifference toward high definition, which has kept the technology from reaching mass adoption and becoming the important revenue stream that it can be for the industry," said Tsujihara. "Consumers have clearly chosen Blu-ray, ..."
So on one side the consumer is confused yet, the consumers have Clearly chosen?
Post by: BoNg420 on January 04, 2008, 06:15:00 PM
bluray is going down in price. you can get a player for $300 now, I listed some for that price on ebay.
Post by: sinister slipknot on January 04, 2008, 06:16:00 PM
QUOTE(bubbafett4hire @ Jan 5 2008, 01:24 AM)
I have to say hurray for blu-ray only cause i have to look at the fact that all discs i don't care how well you take care of them get some kind of little surface scratch that with most disks means a skip or a loss of data and i know blu ray you can damm near (not all the way) slide it across the floor and it will sill play like a champ not only that with the format war going and a majority of people only caring about there HD movies people i think forget that storage wise on a BR you can't beat i know there burners still carry the 600 - 1000 price tag but who can say no to 50 gigs on one disc
Ever heard of HD-DVDs triple 17GB layered disc? Oh yeah, you get the extra GB
Post by: Barnolde on January 04, 2008, 06:17:00 PM
Blu-ray has outsold HD DVD every single week this entire year, it has more company support (even before WB), it has better specs and it was always going to win.
Post by: warmaster_670 on January 04, 2008, 06:57:00 PM
QUOTE(sinister slipknot @ Jan 4 2008, 08:52 PM)
Ever heard of HD-DVDs triple 17GB layered disc? Oh yeah, you get the extra GB
meh, quad BR have been made, 100 gig disc there, not that ittll be needed for years to come.
Post by: Yamthief on January 04, 2008, 06:22:00 PM
I'm glad i didn't get a HD addon drive for my box now
Post by: iwannadie on January 04, 2008, 06:22:00 PM
QUOTE(Barnolde @ Jan 4 2008, 06:53 PM)
Cry bitter tears fanboys.
Blu-ray has outsold HD DVD every single week this entire year, it has more company support (even before WB), it has better specs and it was always going to win.
Lol, I just refuse to become locked into a sony proprietary format. Lets look at some other sony formats and you can tell me how great they are?
mini disc, memory sticks, atrac, umd, hi-md ,etc.
Post by: warmaster_670 on January 04, 2008, 06:24:00 PM
QUOTE(iwannadie @ Jan 4 2008, 08:58 PM)
Lol, I just refuse to become locked into a sony proprietary format. Lets look at some other sony formats and you can tell me how great they are?
mini disc, memory sticks, atrac, umd, hi-md ,etc.
and? none of them won, not that umd had anything to win, blu ray is winning here, they have nothing in common.
Post by: Yamthief on January 04, 2008, 06:28:00 PM
QUOTE(Barnolde @ Jan 5 2008, 01:53 AM)
Cry bitter tears fanboys.
Blu-ray has outsold HD DVD every single week this entire year, it has more company support (even before WB), it has better specs and it was always going to win.
Just because 1 format is better than an other doesn't guarantee it'll win. Do you remember betamax??
QUOTE(warmaster_670 @ Jan 5 2008, 01:57 AM)
meh, quad BR have been made, 100 gig disc there, not that it'll be needed for years to come.
years? with the rate that memory and storage are moving at the moment i'll have a few 100GB discs laying around my desk by the end of the year.
Just because they won't be used for movies or games doesn't mean they won't be used.
I just want Sony to hurry up and make a BD-Ram and a Memory stick that's actually useful
Post by: amak1131 on January 04, 2008, 06:29:00 PM
QUOTE(prplehz @ Jan 4 2008, 04:10 PM)
And to the guy that said MS putting a HDDVD player in the 360 would have made a huge difference. I could not agree more. That would have been a huuge market base of people that would have bought HDDVDs just because they could play them in the 360 as is.
Edited: After thinking about it some more...
it likely would have helped, but if the HD-DVD format went to hell, the 360 may have gone with it.
sticking to hd-dvd when/if i ever get a hd player. Sony's ignorance must not be rewarded.
Post by: iwannadie on January 04, 2008, 07:06:00 PM
QUOTE(warmaster_670 @ Jan 4 2008, 07:00 PM)
and? none of them won, not that umd had anything to win, blu ray is winning here, they have nothing in common.
Winning, meaning what? Winning meaning the consumer gets a better format? Looking at sonys history I dont see what they have to offer the consumer as far as a Better format.
I dont want to be locked into a single format from a company with the type of record sony has.
Post by: ILLusions0fGrander on January 04, 2008, 06:36:00 PM
I always knew id end up with a PS3, its just a matter of another price break or two, accompanied by hopefully at least a 10% off coupon from somewhere.
soon enough.
Post by: HackMy360 on January 04, 2008, 06:38:00 PM
Post by: Sc0rpion on January 04, 2008, 07:15:00 PM
also a good article on the format war here:
http://www.tech.co.uk/digital-home/general/blogs/2007/12/17/how-to-lose-friends-and-influence-people
Post by: ezhack on January 04, 2008, 06:40:00 PM
Post by: boyla001 on January 04, 2008, 06:42:00 PM
Post by: joemm210 on January 04, 2008, 07:30:00 PM
Since Toshiba said they would continue to fight, I am guessing they have something for CES and Im going to guess that it will be either xbox 360 with hd built in, if not then maybe regular price sub 100 hd dvd player. If they dont counter with anything then hd dvd is going to die. The only reason why I think Toshiba already had a plan for CES is because this anouncement is a few days before the show.
Post by: Flagg3 on January 04, 2008, 07:00:00 PM
QUOTE(boyla001 @ Jan 4 2008, 09:18 PM)
I'm calling BS on this story. Where is the source of this story? I don't see ths announcement on Warner Bros website anywhere? And the consumer didn't decide anything. We haven't had a say in this "format war" since it started. Until I see this on Warner Bros. website I say its fake.
It is official, Warner announced it in a press release:
http://ap.google.com...maSU3QD8TVCROG3
And for the record, Warner has flatly denied that they received any compensation for making the switch, unlike Paramount and Dreamworks, which were offered an amount of money that they couldn't poissibly refuse for such a short exclusivity window.
And I hate to say I told you so, but for those that doubted my assurances that this would happen, I will reiterate that the best that HD-DVD can hope for is a tie. They need to remain viable until their exclusive window with Paramount and Dreamworks runs out. If they can continue to retain a significant market share for the remainder of 2008, they may be able to force manufacturers to make dual format players the standard.
Say what you will, but the inclusion of Blu-ray in the PS3 was genius for Sony. It is the single reason that they will ultimately win the format war, and it will become more and more significant for gaming in the next couple of years, despite Microsoft's protests otherwise.
QUOTE(joemm210 @ Jan 4 2008, 09:30 PM)
I think things are just going to start to get interesting, why would Warner announce this before CES, this seems to be something they would announce at CES, unless Microsoft and Toshiba have a bigger announcement at CES and Sony and Warner wanted to get their announcement out first.
Since Toshiba said they would continue to fight, I am guessing they have something for CES and Im going to guess that it will be either xbox 360 with hd built in, if not then maybe regular price sub 100 hd dvd player. If they dont counter with anything then hd dvd is going to die. The only reason why I think Toshiba already had a plan for CES is because this anouncement is a few days before the show.
Agreed. The only counter for Toshiba now is to release a sub $100 player as soon as possible. The only problem is that unless Microsoft subsidizes a large portion of it (Which is very doubtful) then realistically Toshiba can't afford to absorb the hardware losses for the amount of players that they would be required to sell at a loss to make much of a difference.
Post by: trey85stang on January 04, 2008, 07:34:00 PM
Post by: dmitri on January 04, 2008, 07:40:00 PM
QUOTE(Flagg3 @ Jan 5 2008, 02:36 AM)
And for the record, Warner has flatly denied that they received any compensation for making the switch, unlike Paramount and Dreamworks, which were offered an amount of money that they couldn't poissibly refuse for such a short exclusivity window.
Are marketing incentives the same as bribes? Make no mistake, you don't want to be the last studio off of the sinking boat. Now Sony, Fox and Warner are exclusive to Blu-Ray, Universal to HD-DVD. I can guess which gets the worse distribution deal if (I guess WHEN) the world goes Blu-Ray.
There's no longer the need for either to slit their wrists on prices.. Content will begin drying up for HD-DVD once Warner goes away and it will happen. And prepare to repay all the fantastic deals and prices with $40 BluRay movies. You have to subsidize the R&D somehow..
I'm waiting for digital distribution. That will change the world.
Post by: running_wild on January 04, 2008, 09:06:00 PM
I dunno, but if you ask me, I'm putting my money on these guys.
The future is soon gentlemen! I'd like to see both HD-DVD and Blu-Ray make back their research costs if these fellas get their product out on the timeline they expect to. While enterprise markets are going to be the biggest initial market, consumer markets should be very soon after.
Post by: The_Flash on January 04, 2008, 09:19:00 PM
QUOTE(iwannadie @ Jan 4 2008, 09:41 PM)
So what if blu wins and hd is forgotten, my disks still work. People act like suddenly tomorrow HDdvds will suddenly be coasters.
Well said. I own standalones for both formats (Tosh A30 & Philips BDP9000) and could really care less if I have to keep both hooked up for some time. In fact, I hope this announcement does make people unload their HD-DVDs cheaply. I'll gladly play them when not viewing Blu-Ray.
Post by: FCTE on January 04, 2008, 09:29:00 PM
QUOTE(bucko @ Jan 4 2008, 06:14 PM)
I'm just dam glad I got a PS3 now hehe though I will still be buying HD-DVD's since I don't want to sit on the fence but Warner Bros is still producing HD-DVD's right just means movies will come out first on Blu-Ray? So I doubt it's that bad, oh and I still think HD-DVD's have an edge over movie price, play.com has awesome titles for really cheap. I'm tempted to buy the Matrix collection my self.
In May Warner will drop the HD DVD format completely. That means that HD DVD will only have 2 studios supporting them, everyone else is on Bluray.
And I agree about having a PS3.
QUOTE(dmitri @ Jan 4 2008, 09:16 PM)
I'm waiting for digital distribution. That will change the world.
I would imagine broadband has to get better and more widespread before that can become a standard and it's still loss quality as of right now. I'd be more worried about the state of the internet by then.
If you order an HD movie off of your cable box or Xbox and play an HD DVD or Bluray disc, the discs look much better.
Post by: NoMention on January 04, 2008, 10:18:00 PM
The Walk Man - success
The Disc Man - success
Beta - failed on the mainstream vs VHS
BetaCam - success in media outlets
Multimedia compact disc (MMCD) - failed, the opponent called Super Density disc eventually became DVD
Minidisc - failed on the mainstream
ATRAC and ATRAC3 - ever heard of MP3? Yep, failure
SDDS - Sorry but again you lose to DTS
Memory Stick and Memory Stick Duo - Anyone without Sony products never uses them, CF and SD rule here
SACD and DVD-Audio - both failed (as I imagine Blu-Ray and HD-DVD will)
UMD on the PSP - yep, what happened to that? It was supposed to take the world by storm...
Now, I'm not saying Blu-Ray is bad. It isn't and I certainly see a major benefit to the recordable format for data storage in large corporations. I could take advantage of the extra disc space when I do physical media backups of my large SQL databases. But for media, the extra space that is being touted isn't even needed. The encoding mechanism is far more important than the disc space. DVD currently goes up to 8.5GB but the average 2 hour movie is rarely any more than 6.5GB in size with the rest of the space on the disc as extras, behind the scenes etc.
Assuming that studios maximized the bitrate (anyone remember the DVD Superbit discs) then Blu-Ray would have the advantage with the extra space but numerous people have made the following statement "I don't see a quality difference between HD-DVD and Blu-Ray" which is funny because they will then turn around and immediate state that "Blu-Ray holds X GB but HD-DVD holds Y GB". Basically what is being admitted is that HD-DVD can produce the same quality but use less space.
I have the XBox HD-DVD player and nothing else. It works fine for me and I bought it when I could get a total of 10 movies for free with it which pretty much means that the player was free (10 x $20 a disc = $200 which is more than the package was).
I think that the standard DVD format has made such an impact that people are not ready for HD movies. The majority of people don't have 1080p sets so making that claim is ludicris. Even with the FCC ruling of all broadcasts to be HD, they are going to make converter boxes to dumb down the signal. I think that there will be a whole lot of those being sold. Not everyone can afford their $1500 1080p set. It would be nice if they could. I think that the HD media was released slightly before its time.
I (and I think others like me) have a 1080p set and still watch standard DVDs on it because I just have more and they are a whole lot cheaper. 1080p in HD is nice but a standard DVD on a good 1080p set looks pretty good too. I think many people are going to either buy both or buy neither. My gut tells me that more people will sit on the sidelines and do nothing. In 5 years we'll have another format anyway with a silly name like "Super Purple MultiMedia 4x Definition Disc".
Post by: slipstream on January 04, 2008, 10:01:00 PM
QUOTE(NoMention @ Jan 5 2008, 06:18 AM)
I think that the standard DVD format has made such an impact that people are not ready for HD movies. The majority of people don't have 1080p sets so making that claim is ludicris. Even with the FCC ruling of all broadcasts to be HD, they are going to make converter boxes to dumb down the signal. I think that there will be a whole lot of those being sold. Not everyone can afford their $1500 1080p set. It would be nice if they could. I think that the HD media was released slightly before its time.
your right, most people are NOT ready for a new format, and everyone cant afford a 1080p set right now. But HD-media being released early was a smart move, especially since there was going to be a format war. Figure now, by the time all the dust settles from the war, HDTV's will become much, much more common, and then the average consumer can buy the only format left and not have to research for months before making a risky choice (which i did - used PS3~$350).
Post by: 0794 on January 04, 2008, 10:14:00 PM
QUOTE(Heet @ Jan 4 2008, 06:48 PM)
Buy hard drives instead. Thats what im doing. And at 1TB at a time too.
absolutely great point...
QUOTE(Ranger72 @ Jan 4 2008, 07:20 PM)
That war wont be over for at least another 4 years. In that time MANY things will have changed.
many many things will have changed when the dust settles...
QUOTE(slipstream @ Jan 4 2008, 11:37 PM)
your right, most people are NOT ready for a new format, and everyone cant afford a 1080p set right now. But HD-media being released early was a smart move, especially since there was going to be a format war. Figure now, by the time all the dust settles from the war, HDTV's will become much, much more common, and then the average consumer can buy the only format left and not have to research for months before making a risky choice (which i did - used PS3~$350).
exactly, HD discs (both formats) have overall a very poor consumer adoption rate and the two biggest factors are (1) overall improvement in current DVD technology and (2) total cost of adoption. as the cost drops over the next few years, then more consumers will consider HD media content. but by that time, other formats and distribution methods will exist and so it will be interesting to see what the future holds...
for now, the bottom line is if you can afford the new technology and enjoy the benefits obtained - regardless of the format - then that is all that really matters..."to each his own" so to speak...
Post by: scottmuller28 on January 04, 2008, 11:37:00 PM
Post by: mc_365 on January 04, 2008, 11:07:00 PM
I wouldn't have bought my system if it was $100 bucks more expensive.
And the fact is HD-DVDs read spead is to slow for gaming so the games would not perform optimaly on HD-Disc, so the system would have been more expense without adding anything to the gaming experience.
Movie companies are acting in culusion to force the consumer into Blu-Ray.
Sony can afford to pay everyone off becuase they are the main licensor of Blu-Ray.
They may not even be paying companies off, just waving royalty fees for say 3yrs.
Then the movie studios ramp up Blu-Ray distribution and decrease DVDs.
My question is what is happening in Europe?
Is'nt HD-DVD much more popular in Europe than Blu-Ray.
I Would think China and India and South America would prefer HD-DVD as well, being they could easily re-tool dvd manufacturing facilities to produce HD-DVDs.
Given HD-DVD is region free one could import movies from any contry with english sound track.
I doubt the war is realy over yet.
I hope we're not stuck with Blu-Ray as I see no feature I would pay extra for over HD-DVD which should be inhieritly less expensive (DVD Lineage) for the next few years.
Post by: Foe-hammer on January 04, 2008, 11:13:00 PM
QUOTE(Flagg3 @ Jan 4 2008, 07:36 PM)
Say what you will, but the inclusion of Blu-ray in the PS3 was genius for Sony. It is the single reason that they will ultimately win the format war, and it will become more and more significant for gaming in the next couple of years, despite Microsoft's protests otherwise.
Genius? Oh come now. The BR is the main reason it has sold so poorly, due to the added cost they have to pass on to the consumer. The ps3 would be doing A LOT better if it had just a DVD drive. BR or HDDVD is not a necessity to the masses like DVD is. They are perfectly fine with DVD.
Post by: fluffhead on January 05, 2008, 12:03:00 AM
Post by: Mr Invader on January 04, 2008, 11:42:00 PM
Out of the 11 movies that I have, 6 are Warner Bros.
Out of those 6, 2 are classics, and 3 are a trilogy.
I have 5 very diverse movies, along with Season 1 of Heroes, that are either Universal or Paramount; Warner Bros. going to Blu-ray doesn't have much effect on me so far. The next movie that I plan on buying, Beowulf, is Paramount; so I'm good there too.
That being said, Warner Bros. going Blu-ray exclusive is probably the Achilles heel in the BR vs. HD-DVD struggle. Unless something is done quick by Toshiba and Microsoft, I think that the format war will be all but over by the end of the year.
And I've never liked the digital distribution thing, I like bringing my 360 and HD-DVD add-on, along with some discs, to my friend's house to watch movies on his 46" Plasma 1080p television. I WILL NEVER be one of those who brings my computer over to his house to watch a movie. And an external drive wouldn't be the best thing because #1 big HDD usually need software installed and #2 his computer isn't powerful enough and doesn't have the right software to play HD movies. Video marketplace isn't a bad idea, but I've never seen the quality of the downloaded movies and I don't like only being able to watch them once.
Post by: mlmadmax on January 04, 2008, 11:58:00 PM
The whoel thing just sucks, someone in this thread mentioned it coming down to a dual format player down the road settling the score and I agree.
The whole thing just sucks and the funniest thing to me is that sales of both formats are totally in the shitter when compared to dvd so who cares in the long run.
I like toys so I own both but I am very much in the minority.
Anyway cudos to warner for trying to force some kind of ending but i am betting it won;t make a difference in the lone run.
Post by: Chan163 on January 05, 2008, 01:08:00 AM
Look at early BR releases... the whole BR is filled by only the movie, because it is encoded in MPEG2 (yes, MPEG2, just like a regular DVD) which takes up lots of space. Sony claimed that H.264 didn't cut it, but why are the SAME movies on HDDVD (in H.264) better looking AND with extras?
As for 'safety' of your precious disks: Look at the specs! Look where the data sits on both disks and think about it. BR is just scary. If something gets thru this 'scratchproof' surface, the disk is history. A HDDVD can indeed, just like a DVD, be repaired.
So f#%k Sony and f#%k Warner too!
Post by: FCTE on January 05, 2008, 12:47:00 AM
QUOTE(mc_365 @ Jan 5 2008, 12:43 AM)
Why do people keep saying If MS put the dam HD-DVD drive HD-DVD would be on top?
I wouldn't have bought my system if it was $100 bucks more expensive.
Yes you would have and so would everyone else that currently has a 360.
By putting the HD DVD drive in the 360 you trojan horse the media player into thousands of homes. Sony was smart to trojan horse Bluray players by putting them in the PS3. For one it makes your sales look huge to the industry and studios, and two, people who would have probably otherwise wouldn't have bothered with an HD format now have the urge to buy Bluray movies because they got a player in their console.
Post by: Takieda on January 05, 2008, 12:59:00 AM
In the US market there is now a large incentive for blu-ray, but the global market says otherwise. Europe is very pro HD-DVD and other countries will be enjoying the benefits of it as well, especially considering its low cost of production, and the ease at which companies can switch production methods.
Overall the quality between the two is a moot point, as it's entirely dependent upon the encoder to do the right job to make the movie look good. We've already seen that both formats can produce excellent quality movies, which makes the next point also moot - capacity. Even without the addition of the three layer HD-DVD discs, both formats can produce the same quality within their alotted spaces, with all added bonuses, etc. No more space is truly needed.
I've always backed HD-DVD as there are fewer restrictions, it's not Sony (sorry, but their track record, for me, is not something I enjoy), and is generally a more robust system. It's also, in general, a cheaper system to purchase and implement. The problems, esp. early on, with Blu-Ray, and the fact that the public has, as yet, not been compensated for suffering early adoption, has prompted me to further back away from Blu-Ray.
I like the idea of digital distribution myself, but I always always prefer a tangible product. I still buy CDs, then rip them and have all the music on my media center computer. I also purchase DVDs and do the same. I have a few HD DVDs and have done the same with them. It's very nice not have to change discs when you wish to switch movies, shows, etc... I also like having the wall of boxes that house my discs, which will not receive scratches due to this. And before you flame, yes, I'm VERY aware that very few people, esp. those less technically inclined, are likely to go to this extreme. The point is, all of this is made VERY difficult for the consumer, and thusly, only tech savvy individuals such as myself are going to go through with this.
And therein lies my biggest complaint. I like HD-DVD as it is the lesser of two evils, but it is still an evil no less. I really would like to see both formats fail, and for the CONSUMER to actually have a say in this matter - allowing us to purchase discs that don't have so much copy protection crap on them as to make them sometimes unplayable on some players (blu-ray thank you), or just to require just an incredible amount of hardware because of their copy protection as to drive the cost of the players so high as to make it prohibitive.
What we need is a physical product that allows us to copy to our home PC (or player for those not wanting to have to mess with full PCs), the movie, allow for smaller, more portable versions to be copied to additional players, etc. allowing the consumer to have the collectable product, and do with it what they want, and even making it easier for the consumer to do those things.
I wouldn't mind seeing HVD's with a dozen copies of the same movie on them, all in different formats each with the ability to copy to whatever player we want. Perhaps a better, solution could arise beyond that, but that, to me, seems to be the fastest, as copying at 120MBps is much faster than reencoding the video from one media type to another.
Post by: ConteZero76 on January 05, 2008, 01:51:00 AM
QUOTE(Takieda @ Jan 5 2008, 10:35 AM)
Some things I've gleaned from this conversation, and one thing missing -
In the US market there is now a large incentive for blu-ray, but the global market says otherwise. Europe is very pro HD-DVD and other countries will be enjoying the benefits of it as well, especially considering its low cost of production, and the ease at which companies can switch production methods.
Overall the quality between the two is a moot point, as it's entirely dependent upon the encoder to do the right job to make the movie look good. We've already seen that both formats can produce excellent quality movies, which makes the next point also moot - capacity. Even without the addition of the three layer HD-DVD discs, both formats can produce the same quality within their alotted spaces, with all added bonuses, etc. No more space is truly needed.
I've always backed HD-DVD as there are fewer restrictions, it's not Sony (sorry, but their track record, for me, is not something I enjoy), and is generally a more robust system. It's also, in general, a cheaper system to purchase and implement. The problems, esp. early on, with Blu-Ray, and the fact that the public has, as yet, not been compensated for suffering early adoption, has prompted me to further back away from Blu-Ray.
I like the idea of digital distribution myself, but I always always prefer a tangible product. I still buy CDs, then rip them and have all the music on my media center computer. I also purchase DVDs and do the same. I have a few HD DVDs and have done the same with them. It's very nice not have to change discs when you wish to switch movies, shows, etc... I also like having the wall of boxes that house my discs, which will not receive scratches due to this. And before you flame, yes, I'm VERY aware that very few people, esp. those less technically inclined, are likely to go to this extreme. The point is, all of this is made VERY difficult for the consumer, and thusly, only tech savvy individuals such as myself are going to go through with this.
And therein lies my biggest complaint. I like HD-DVD as it is the lesser of two evils, but it is still an evil no less. I really would like to see both formats fail, and for the CONSUMER to actually have a say in this matter - allowing us to purchase discs that don't have so much copy protection crap on them as to make them sometimes unplayable on some players (blu-ray thank you), or just to require just an incredible amount of hardware because of their copy protection as to drive the cost of the players so high as to make it prohibitive.
What we need is a physical product that allows us to copy to our home PC (or player for those not wanting to have to mess with full PCs), the movie, allow for smaller, more portable versions to be copied to additional players, etc. allowing the consumer to have the collectable product, and do with it what they want, and even making it easier for the consumer to do those things.
I wouldn't mind seeing HVD's with a dozen copies of the same movie on them, all in different formats each with the ability to copy to whatever player we want. Perhaps a better, solution could arise beyond that, but that, to me, seems to be the fastest, as copying at 120MBps is much faster than reencoding the video from one media type to another.
False, BD is winning here in Europe.
HVD is a hoax, it was pointed as "future" since CD came, and yet nobody was able to see something working to date (just google "Constellation").
Post by: Takieda on January 05, 2008, 01:42:00 AM
QUOTE(ConteZero76 @ Jan 5 2008, 02:51 AM)
False, BD is winning here in Europe.
HVD is a hoax, it was pointed as "future" since CD came, and yet nobody was able to see something working to date (just google "Constellation").
I was merely pointing out what others had said that weren't generally argued against. I wouldn't mind seeing some official figures either way on that, as there don't seem to be many stated anywhere, beyond what the Sony and Toshiba camps want to state about market penetration with products sold and/or shipped, etc. Not much of a good reference without knowing how many movies are being sold, general public awareness and acceptance, etc.
Beyond that, I brought up HVD more as a lark than anything else. It wouldn't have to be HVD, as any format that could bring that kind of storage to the forefront for any remotely resembling affordable for the mass market would be acceptable by me, esp. in the method I suggested. I'd like to think others would agree on that point.
Obviously, what I want, and what will happen are two completely different things, but I still want both formats to fall horribly flat, and for a new, all inclusive, non DRM ridden, consumer conscious format to come onto the scene and reign supreme. I'm still pissed at HDTV manufacturers (or whoever's responsible, as I'm not going to look up which) for adopting the rather.... shoddy, HDMI and even DVI formats. They're so finicky that they can't run more than 35 feet each (compared to analog Component broadcasts running at over 300), which is completely unworkable in a LOT of home theater systems employing front-projection TVs.
Post by: the_nerdy on January 05, 2008, 02:41:00 AM
There are ways to win and it has been done.
Post by: Foe-hammer on January 05, 2008, 03:49:00 AM
QUOTE(the_nerdy @ Jan 5 2008, 02:41 AM)
There are ways to win and it has been done.
Ya, i just wonder how much of an "incentive" warner received.
Post by: mike420dude on January 05, 2008, 04:17:00 AM
Warner brothers was only going to do it if fox switched but they made a deal with the BDA so warner brothers also decided to also make a deal with the BDA
Post by: mr_spoon on January 05, 2008, 05:17:00 AM
spoon
Post by: Chancer on January 05, 2008, 06:03:00 AM
A lot of people here are making a stand and are against Sony. Nothing to do with merits or support of either format.
You might wish to check a few facts before claiming it's a Sony format. You will see the backbone of companies that support this standard. It is not a Sony monopoly.
People are complaining about bribes to drop down on the BR side. Not proven unlike the bribes paid to go HD-DVD that were admitted.
Too many people read Wikis about the real reason Beta lost to VHS.
People who were bashing the PS3 for having a BR player built in are now claiming that MS should have had HD-DVD built in. What in a "Games Machine"?
The cheapo HD-DVD players were only ever an end of line limited sale at the prices they were at.
Funai have a sub £100 BR player due out.
Many on here singing the praises of HD-DVd or BR will not even own either.
Post by: biga55 on January 05, 2008, 09:42:00 AM
As for Warner's payoff, it's important to know that both sides were offering up tons of incentives for Warner to support them. It wasn't a one sided payoff where the HD-DVD side wasn't willing to make a similar offer. It made sense for Warner to take the side which would end the format war sooner for everyone's good. With BR titles outselling HDDVD at least 2 to 1, it made sense.
Why are some of you guys so supportive of one format or the other anyway? I guess it's like PS3 vs. 360 fanboyism. Don't you understand that it's better for all of us if this format war ends and we get one HD format?
You guys also keep bashing Sony but do you think Toshiba are saints when it comes to corporate behavior? Have you seen how many business scandals Toshiba has been involved in? I dislike Sony too since I've gotten bad service from them but I dislike MS and Toshiba as well lol.
HD-DVD also screwed up by not getting more manufacturers into the mix. Where were all of the cheap chinese made HD-DVD players promised for the holidays (it was too late anyway by late 2007)? All we had was a firesale of the discontinued A2. Instead, we'll get a cheap non-Sony Blu-Ray player first.
Post by: Andrew_Roy on January 05, 2008, 09:16:00 AM
QUOTE(lc204 @ Jan 4 2008, 08:56 PM)
I wonder how much Sony paid to Warner Bros for exclusivity.
QUOTE(Foe-hammer @ Jan 5 2008, 08:25 AM)
Ya, i just wonder how much of an "incentive" warner received.
Sorry if I'm getting the wrong vibe but are you guys implying this would be something malicious? There's nothing about this story that isn't pure business, why wouldn't there be some business involved?
Post by: warmaster_670 on January 05, 2008, 09:39:00 AM
Post by: kowrip on January 05, 2008, 10:07:00 AM
QUOTE(zequal @ Jan 5 2008, 12:32 AM)
why is that BS? warner may have seen that their hd-dvd's aint selling as good as their blu-ray's
It's BS because 99% of people don't even know about the HD-DVD vs. BR battle and the other 1% are only slightly in BR's favor. Consumers have not "clearly chosen" BR. There is no real basis for that statement.
Post by: muskamike on January 05, 2008, 10:21:00 AM
That is my goal, dual player, but for now, I could care less who wins what. My eye can't tell a difference on my 42' between HD and Blu, but compare the amount of disc space available, and you should know who will be more popular longterm.
Post by: perfectdark on January 05, 2008, 10:45:00 AM
I had HD-DVD addon and just got rid of it, no one can say either format is better (i'm talking about movie and video/sound, i doubt anyone would buy a format based on extra features, when majority just want to watch the movie)
that being said, here in canada HD-DVD players were $99 for boxing day sales but are over $300 and bluray plays are also $340 for the cheapest, PS3 nest being $399, so if bluray players dont start coming down in price, DVD will continue for a long time
I know microsoft wants to do download service, but lets face it most poeple $35 anhd older still are newbies on internet and wont want to download movies nor care to learn how, and they wont spend $400+ on bluray player when they can get a dvd player for $40 at walmart and $10 movies
Post by: mlmadmax on January 05, 2008, 11:07:00 AM
When the PS3 came out in the states they where still having problems with there codecs hence talledega nights being one of the softest and least pleasing blu ray's of all time.
When the PS3 was released in the europe they finally got there shit together and are now releasing movies that look wonderfull, casino royal looks excelent.
That is a long time to be charging more for there players and not having them perform. Now they are on par with hd-dvd in terms of PQ and there players are around the same price but it still was a shitty way to go about everything. Then there is the whole 1.1 fiasco it just pisses me off the whole way they went about it.
If the hadn't put a blue ray player in the PS3 they would be losing so it was a good business strategy in that perspective. I just hope this pushes movie houses to jump over to blu ray so this can be over as soon as possible but as I said before it is going to rage on for way to long.
Post by: spinr34 on January 05, 2008, 12:43:00 PM
Post by: luther349 on January 05, 2008, 01:52:00 PM
Post by: thor99 on January 05, 2008, 01:34:00 PM
Contact Info:
Jim Noonan
Warner Bros. Home Ent. Group
(818) 977-5489
Susan Fleishman
Warner Bros. Entertainment
(818) 954-1919
Scott Rowe
Warner Bros. Entertainment
(818) 954-5806
You Never Know, "The Gears That Make The Noise, Will Be The Ones That Gets The Oil..."
Post by: Takieda on January 05, 2008, 01:59:00 PM
QUOTE(thor99 @ Jan 5 2008, 03:10 PM)
Well for those who support HD-DVD, They posted their info on the press release page.. Call Them And Complain And Let Them Know How You Feel..
Contact Info:
Jim Noonan
Warner Bros. Home Ent. Group
(818) 977-5489
Susan Fleishman
Warner Bros. Entertainment
(818) 954-1919
Scott Rowe
Warner Bros. Entertainment
(818) 954-5806
You Never Know, "The Gears That Make The Noise, Will Be The Ones That Gets The Oil..."
Thank you very much for this info. I had not even considered doing something like this (didn't even think of where to start), but now it gives me the impetus to have my voice heard, and that is what consumers need, their voices, not their pocketbooks (I say that because their pocketbooks follow the marketting and the marketing is leading them straight to DRM ridden, Region locked crap - at least HDDVD has no region lock).
I don't think my calling them and telling them to drop both formats and start their own without DRMs or other hassles will ever be taken seriously, BUT, at the least I can voice for the lesser of two evils.
And another little thing - to all you who want the war to be over with ASAP. Personally I hope it wages on for years. I want to see both sides digging their claws into the studios so deep to get them to switch sides that by the end of it, the studios will be so absolutely furious with the current model, that they actually LISTEN to what the consumers have to say.
down with BOTH HD formats... I want a consumer driven product, NOT Sony, Toshiba, or Microsoft driven. Hell, I'd even go for apple at this point with Steve Jobs admitting to hating DRMs and finally allowing the purchase of DRM free music on iTunes (though I'm not a big fan of the Mac OS).
Post by: Mr Invader on January 05, 2008, 02:15:00 PM
And now I'm waiting for an external dual-format HD drive for the 360.
Post by: Foe-hammer on January 05, 2008, 03:26:00 PM
QUOTE(Chancer @ Jan 5 2008, 06:39 AM)
People are complaining about bribes to drop down on the BR side. Not proven unlike the bribes paid to go HD-DVD that were admitted.
What other reasons would there be? Warners love for all things blu? While no facts yet on money incentives from br camp (news just barely broke), i'm sure there will be sooner then later. Money is always involved in deals like these.
QUOTE(Andrew_Roy @ Jan 5 2008, 09:52 AM)
Sorry if I'm getting the wrong vibe but are you guys implying this would be something malicious? There's nothing about this story that isn't pure business, why wouldn't there be some business involved?That was not implied. The reasons that warner gave for going exclusive were just unsound, but expected.
Post by: iwannadie on January 05, 2008, 04:08:00 PM
QUOTE(luther349 @ Jan 5 2008, 01:52 PM)
well M$ said they didn't know what format was going to win. and if it was blueray they would make a blueray player for the 360. kinda fell sad for anyone who bought the hddvd add on thow. this is why i whont go to any format and the fact any good standerd dvd player can come close to the qualty of the hd formats anyways.
Wow, you must need glasses or a new tv if normal dvds look the same as high def to you. For me its night and day difference.
Post by: Andrew_Roy on January 05, 2008, 04:22:00 PM
QUOTE(Foe-hammer @ Jan 5 2008, 08:02 PM)
That was not implied. The reasons that warner gave for going exclusive were just unsound, but expected.
Fair enough.
Post by: Quest on January 05, 2008, 05:04:00 PM
http://www.petitiono...D/petition.html
best regards
Quest
Post by: warmaster_670 on January 05, 2008, 06:47:00 PM
Post by: medievil on January 06, 2008, 06:15:00 PM
QUOTE(Yamthief @ Jan 5 2008, 03:04 AM)
Just because 1 format is better than an other doesn't guarantee it'll win. Do you remember betamax??
years? with the rate that memory and storage are moving at the moment i'll have a few 100GB discs laying around my desk by the end of the year.
Just because they won't be used for movies or games doesn't mean they won't be used.
I just want Sony to hurry up and make a BD-Ram and a Memory stick that's actually useful
you DO realize Betamax was a SONY invention right??..lol
SONY Betamax
Post by: beige on January 07, 2008, 12:42:00 AM
Post by: Foe-hammer on January 07, 2008, 07:23:00 AM
HD-DVD... funny how they worded that.