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[Q3A-TaNK]

What about these emulators?

Atari Jaguar (Virtual Jaguar)
NEC PC-FX (Mednafen)
ZiNC or psxMAME (PSX Based Arcade Board)
A better PSX Emulator if possible (PCSXbox is pretty frustating to setup and crashes quite abit and cant handle CDs nor Redbook Audio games too well)


Saturn to me would be possible but might not be worth it. Look at the Yabuse port for the Wii. SSF is the best Saturn emu to date IMO but still needs a hefty CPU/GPU combo to run efficiently. Also i dont think SSF is open source also. 3DO would be another system i like to see but once again FreeDO is the only emu and its not open source. FreeDO seems to be dead since 2004 with the updates.

[Xboxer64]

Any emulation work on the xbox would be great but.........

I would be happier if any energy that might be put towards the saturn be put towards improving n64 and ps1 emulation instead  

[guybird]

Oh jeez, only 3 games on Saturn worth playing?  Not hardly, although there's a huge chunk that's covered by working psx ports, or arcade games that were far superior on Saturn playing even better in FBA.  So lets look at the games left that AREN'T available elsewhere:

Fighters Megamix/Fighting Vipers/Virtual Fighters - Probably the main reason to have the emu ported
Nights
Daytona Usa's - Eh nowadays, but still the Mario for the Saturn
Panzer Dragoon's
Sonic Jam - Yes this has seemingly been ported a 1000 times across different consoles, but apparently it has some features that aren't present in many of the current sonic collections
Sonic R
Virtua Cops
Virtua Racing
And last but not least, Space Hulk Vengeance Of The Blood Angels (Psx versions works, but all in game speech is garbeled   the superior 3do version obviously has no emu to play it on, and although its rumored to exist, I can't find a Dos version to work with DosXbox)

So there you go, sure not 20+ games after you take out all the psx and FBA compatibile games that made the Saturn awesome, but still some good games.  I'm sure there's some good/obscure RPG's that purists could probably point out too.  While we're at it, lets look at some of the other non ported systems based on the # of good games they have:

Atari Jaguar

Aliens Vs Predator - That's it folks!  Good Night!  Seriously though that's pretty much it, and thanks to SirLemonHead, we have the vastly superior PC version to play now.

Dreamcast

Jeez, lets see here:
Soul Calibur
NFL/NBA 2K's
Sonic Adventures
Godzilla Generations (Jap only release, yes I loved it as it was one of the few games I had on my imported Jap only DC so sue me)
Fighting Vipers 2
Power Stones
Resident Evil Code Veronica
Typing Of The Dead
Virtua Cop
Virtua Fighter
A lot of CPS3 games (Jojo, SF3, CVS, etc) although we have emu for those
Lots of SNK Games
Once again, Psx/FBA compatible games really eat into its main attraction list

3DO

Captain Quazar
Jurassic Park Interactive
Plumber's Don't Wear Ties - Eh? Eh?  No takers?  Ok fine
Return Fire - Available for Psx but come on, made the 3do an awesome system
Star Wars Rebel Assualt - Probably looks much better than the Sega CD version
And finally Space Hulk!

So yeah, when it comes down to it, it would be great for completeness to have these systems running great, but really in order of total number of good games, it looks like Dreamcast, Saturn, 3do then Jaguar.  And the Dreamcast will never run on the xbox's specs, Saturn maybe, 3do Maybe, and Jaguar IS ported although it was a proof of concept and ran like shit according to Xport/Lantus/Whoever ported it (its been awhile).

[dballs442]

QUOTE(guybird @ Oct 1 2010, 10:31 AM)

Dreamcast

Jeez, lets see here:
Soul Calibur
NFL/NBA 2K's
Sonic Adventures
Godzilla Generations (Jap only release, yes I loved it as it was one of the few games I had on my imported Jap only DC so sue me)
Fighting Vipers 2
Power Stones
Resident Evil Code Veronica
Typing Of The Dead
Virtua Cop
Virtua Fighter
A lot of CPS3 games (Jojo, SF3, CVS, etc) although we have emu for those
Lots of SNK Games
Once again, Psx/FBA compatible games really eat into its main attraction list

dont forget virtual tennis. best tennis game ever! one of my all time favs too. and worms armogendon.

also Panzer Dragoon's is ported as a homebrew.

[guybird]

Yes I realize that the newer AVP port (which is older than AVP2 and the latest & greatest PS3/360 version) isn't the same, but it was an attempt to gloss over the lack of a good # of games worth playing on the Jag.  Obviously AVP was THE reason to own a Jag, hands down, I still wish I had the cart to play on mine (one of these days I'll grab one from ebay).  Yes these old abandoned and for the most part universally ignored (not by anyone who actually owned one of them of course) have some great and rare games, but for the most part, it isn't a huge library that we're missing out on.  I'd of course be more than welcome to have ports for all of these systems, but once again, unfortunately its probably not gonna happen on the xbox.  On the other hand though, look at something like MS Dos, where we've had a decent port forever now, and very little attention is paid to it although it has a HUGE number of unique games available.  I mean me an Madmab have gotten to the point where we have 150+ games setup, and probably 90% are unique and available on no other console, and 10% are games where the dos version is vastly superior to the console ports.  I don't think that emulating any of these systems is gonna yield us a large game selection, and really is only going to cater to the handful of people that played that one game.  Really what kills it is the uniformity of the ports between the 3do/Psx/Saturn.  MOST of the time, there wasn't a huge difference between the systems, except mainly with Capcom Fighting games where the Saturn had the edge.  Otherwise we're probably better off trying other ways to "port" these games via DOS, or Psx versions, or even Linux versions of the emu's.

[IronOx81]

The problem with DOS is that gaming on the PC only became really popular with Windows 95... many console players of today have little to no experience with DOS-games.

I´m still waiting for my Xbox to arrive, as I bought it specifically for the awesome emulators. I am a bit concerned about DOS though, seeing that I never used DOS and I expect configuration and loading games might require more than the selection of a ROM file console emulators do. And I guess the fear of having to meddle with DOS commands is keeping other people from even trying.

What are some of the games you think are much superior to their console ports btw? I don´t know that many DOS-games beside the adventures that can be played via Scumm VM also and fps like Doom or Duke Nukem, but those got equal or improved console-ports in later years.


Overall, I am really thankful for the emulator-development for the Xbox. I love the Lynx for example, and as little regarded as the system is having a Lynx-emu is actually a main reason for my interest in the Xbox. It is great that even systems of little popularity did get emulation treatment on the Xbox so far.

In the same vain is my wish for a Jaguar emulator. I know that many people don´t care, but there is also the little hope that having a decent emulator available somewhere actually might attract a few people to try it out instead of just repeating the common phrases about how much it sucks. I believe many of these people never really played on the system, and one reason is the lack of any decent emulator even on PC. Eventhough the Jaguar´s software overall is below average, there are some gems to be played and I think it would be nice to have them more readily available.
And damn, I sold my Jaguar CD... but I´d love to play the beta of Black Ice/White Noise for example, a cyberpunk adventure that was really extremely promising.

But I do understand that it is probably just too much work for the few people who will actually use it. But that´s the destiny of the Xbox I guess; it is long out of stores now, and the difficulty to obtain both infos on homebrew (it´s just too much^^) and the problem of most stuff only being available via FTP won´t help attract many new users I´m afraid.

[guybird]

The biggest problem for me was that I never could find any Jaguar games.  I bought both my 3do and my Jaguar at a pawn shop some time after '97 (after the systems were officially dead) and bought what games I could find there.  3do you could find games everywhere for, and sometimes get lucky and find a bin of 3do games for $5 apiece at EB games.  Jaguar games though, hell, I don't think I've every actually seen one in a box before, let alone finding a used copy somewhere.  In any case, buying one used got me AVP, and it was quite obvious it was THE game to own.  If you can even find one near your town, find an old school video game trading store, one that has retro consoles.  Look around and see what systems you can find games for.  Sure you'll see tons of Dreamcast, a handful of Saturn, tons and tons of old Atari 2600 and NES carts, but I bet no Jaguar games.  Maybe 1 or 2 3do games, probably not in a box but in a generic clear cd case.  Until there is a good port of a Jaguar emu, this mindset of Jaguar is crap will probably remain, because most people haven't played or even seen one, let alone played more than 1 or 2 games on it.

Back to Dos though.  For those not in the know, DOS was the old Microsoft OS before Windows, and was nothing but command line.  Being a PC and not a console, there were TONS and tons of games ported to it.  At the time, most popular games were ported to it alongside consoles, minus the obvious Mario & Sonic games (At first anyhow).  In wasn't until the later half of the 90's when Windows 95 came out that fewer games were being ported to it until it was discontinued around '98 I think.  So the games you have on DOS are very varied, there's a lot of very early games that were never ported to a console (Corridor 7, ComQmander Keen, original Duke Nukems), then you get into games that were on every system (Aladdin, Street Fighters, etc in the Genesis, SNES days), then you get into cd based games that were only available on 3do at first, but eventually made their way to the Playstation and Saturn once they were released (Gex, Return Fire, Battle Chess, the original Need For Speed), and then finally the final days when Windows had taken over there were a handful of awesome games (Blood, System Shock, C&C).  So there are literally 1,000's of games, and we've been using it to fill in the gaps of games never ported elsewhere, and in some cases where the pc version was much much better (Lemmings, Aladdin, XCOM, etc).  Here's a handful of games that are the "cream of the crop" so to speak:

Corridor 7 - Ran on the Wolf3d engine, very good doom/wolf game
Battle Chess series - I knew this from the 3do, but there's 4 games/styles in the series
Old MECC games - Most of the games we knew and loved from the Apple II days in school were ported to dos, so Oregon Trail, Word Munchers, and other similar educational games like Carmen Sandiego are all here
Blood - One of the best shooters of its time, still plays very well today
Elder Scrolls 1 & 2 - Pretty good games, but obviously not Morrowind/Oblivion level
Kings Quest series - Old RPG's
Leisure Suit Larry series
Might & Magic/AD&D series - Tons and tons of old RPG's here
Raptor Call of the Shadows - Great 1942/Strikers style shooter
Sim City's - Yes these have appeared on consoles here and there, but the DOS versions are much much better
Space Hulk - The original (not the 3do/Saturn/Psx version which was #2) wasn't ported to any console
Star Wars series - Tie Fighter, Dark Forces, etc
Ultima series
Wing Commander series
Warcraft 1 & 2
X-Com
System Shock - Bioshock predecessor
Command & Conquer

And yes the current DosXbox is a pain to configure, and unreliable, but Madmab has added so many new features to it, it won't even look the same anymore.  Once we finish tidying up what we have, we'll release our pack of preconfigured gamesmedia as an xtras pack, and hopefully, adding new games from that point on will be easier for people.  Phew!  Lots of typing!

[Xboxer!]

A port of Yabause emulator for  the xbox would not be bad but I think it would work sloooww... The PSX emulator does not work normal, idem Nintendo 64 emulator. But there is something I love to see, that's an Xbox port of ePSXe!!

[hcf]

Well, Sega Saturn had many other good games in every genre, that were not ported to other systems (at least, not ported to other systems that are emulated in Xbox). For example:

* Sega Rally Championship: a great racing game, only ported to Windows

* Sega Worldwide Soccer: a great soccer game, only ported to Windows and with a later version in Dreamcast

* Saturn Bomberman: probably the best multi-player bomberman ever made, but only available in Saturn

* Dragon Force: what a game of strategy!! Ported to Playstation 2

* Bust-a-move 3: this was ported to PSX, but it does not work properly in the PSX emulator (the music crashes)

And so on... So having a Saturn emulator would be very nice indeed (if possible)  

[jojones88]

Yabause Wii is only running around 5-15 fps.

Check out Castlevania SOTN running...

[cheema201]

QUOTE(IronOx81 @ Oct 3 2010, 10:59 AM)

Aladdin? How was the DOS-version much better? The MD-version was quite excellent, hard to imagine how anything save a higher resolution could be better...especially controls.

Aladdin is one of my all time favourite games. Had it on genisis and always loved it... the feeling of playing it in DOS is amazing. The viewpoint is nice and close, the music is of amazing quality. The apple throw is different (I think it makes it a little harder, seems to be loopier, not so straight). And I think that most enemies take one more sword slash to defeat (I could be way off on that one, I am going from memory)

Basically DOS and amiga versions usually used better music files and stuff than their console counter parts (until psx and such came into the picture)

You will definately love the DOS.. Lets not forget Jazz Jackrabbit. A platform game, which incorporates speed with shooting.

DOS all the way.

[Clockface]

Some other brilliant DOS games that never appeared anywhere else are:

Blood,
Shadow Warriors,
Carmageddon.

Well, Carmageddon did appear on other machines, but the ports were rubbish, and only the PC version is worth playing (but it's extremely good, though too easy) - I really wish we could play it on the XBox. Shadow Warrior's source code was released by 3D Realms, and thanks to a500 we have a great homebrew port for the XBox (the same with the fantastic Duke Nukem 3D) that even plays user mods, any first person shooter fan on the XBox should have the DN3D and SW ports permanently installed on their hard drives!

Also, Ive not played Alien vs, Predator on the Jaguar, but I have AvP 1 and 2 (PC) and the latest one (XBox 360), and of the three, the original one is by far the best, and the XBox port is great, though still needs some work. I'm still really hoping that SirLemonhead releases an update soon.

And yes, I do wish System Shock 2 was playable on the XBox. I loved the second one (PC), but don't like playing games on a PC.

I wish that FreeDOS had been ported to the XBox. It's open source, so probably could have been, so then maybe we'd be able to play DOS games at full speed, I don't know, instead of having to emulate DOS in DOSBox.

Some other brilliant DOS games that never appeared anywhere else are:

Blood,
Shadow Warriors,
Carmageddon.

Well, Carmageddon did appear on other machines, but the ports were rubbish, and only the PC version is worth playing (but it's extremely good, though too easy) - I really wish we could play it on the XBox. Shadow Warrior's source code was released by 3D Realms, and thanks to a500 we have a great homebrew port for the XBox (the same with the fantastic Duke Nukem 3D) that even plays user mods, any first person shooter fan on the XBox should have the DN3D and SW ports permanently installed on their hard drives!

Also, Ive not played Alien vs, Predator on the Jaguar, but I have AvP 1 and 2 (PC) and the latest one (XBox 360), and of the three, the original one is by far the best, and the XBox port is great, though still needs some work. I'm still really hoping that SirLemonhead releases an update soon.

And yes, I do wish System Shock 2 was playable on the XBox. I loved the second one (PC), but don't like playing games on a PC.

I wish that FreeDOS had been ported to the XBox. It's open source, so probably could have been, so then maybe we'd be able to play DOS games at full speed, I don't know, instead of having to emulate DOS in DOSBox.

Some other brilliant DOS games that never appeared anywhere else are:

Blood,
Shadow Warriors,
Carmageddon.

Well, Carmageddon did appear on other machines, but the ports were rubbish, and only the PC version is worth playing (but it's extremely good, though too easy) - I really wish we could play it on the XBox. Shadow Warrior's source code was released by 3D Realms, and thanks to a500 we have a great homebrew port for the XBox (the same with the fantastic Duke Nukem 3D) that even plays user mods, any first person shooter fan on the XBox should have the DN3D and SW ports permanently installed on their hard drives!

Also, Ive not played Alien vs, Predator on the Jaguar, but I have AvP 1 and 2 (PC) and the latest one (XBox 360), and of the three, the original one is by far the best, and the XBox port is great, though still needs some work. I'm still really hoping that SirLemonhead releases an update soon.

And yes, I do wish System Shock 2 was playable on the XBox. I loved the second one (PC), but don't like playing games on a PC.

I wish that FreeDOS had been ported to the XBox. It's open source, so probably could have been, so then maybe we'd be able to play DOS games at full speed, I don't know, instead of having to emulate DOS in DOSBox.

[BlueSlingShot]

I believe Nes6502 responded to a Saturn emulator request in the past and he said it totally would not be worth it, due to hardware limitations it would only run at max like 15fps.

Unless you have a Trusty xbox with a cpu upgrade, I don't think this is worth the time and effort IMO.

We should try to improve on the current emus that need some tweaking like pcsxbox and some of the new madmab emus before jumping the gun and try to port over an entirely new system.

[robot3]

with all of this possible emu talk, let us not forget that a newer vextrex emu that supports sound would be great as well as someone creating a or adding it so Sega 32x cd games could be played

[waal]

I second that. A proper vectrex emu with overlay support would be fine.