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[BCfosheezy]

QUOTE(Paintballpsyco2369 @ May 30 2006, 11:18 AM)

I recently bought a Xbox Debug console that was broken. At the time of purchase, and the thread I found the seller in, everyone thought all it needed was a new Hard Drive and to have the Recovery disk run on it. I have since found out that is not the case. It is in PAL however I can still see most of it, but it will start up normally, then at the after flubber screen it will go Christmas lights on me, and go to the error screen (in NTSC I think), but with no error code. I have tried August 2001, and 5849 recovery disks, with no luck. I have tried a phillips DVD drive, and Thompson, both with no luck. I have tried several different hard drives, and had no luck whatsoever. The guy I bought it from is positive it is a Real Debug, and not a Beta Live Debug. I think there is a slight chance it is a Beta Live, but as I can't get it working, I am not sure. One guy I was talking to thinks it could be a bad IDE controller chip. I think it could have a bad, or corrupt eeprom. I was thinking about buying a chip like an X3CE and using it to reflash the eeprom (with the debug eeprom of course) and then using the chip to run the recovery disk to get it working. I know the motherboard has the MCPX X2 chip, and the sticker has 4039 all over it. Does anyone know if it is popssible to chip a Debug and get it working, or if it is repairable? Can you please help me? I would greatly appreciate it. Thank you so much.

Like I have been telling you, modchips are made for retail consoles. The os the newer ones come with as well as the retail "hacked" bios that you will be trying to put on there will not be decrypted or unpacked and thus the xbox will not boot if you try to "chip" it with anything other than a modchip with a debug bios on it, which you are already using a debug bios. Furthermore, xbox debug kits do not look at the eeprom upon boot which has been proven. This is not the case. The xbox physically boots, it shows the flubber animation and give you an error screen which proves that this debug kit is running a debug bios and it booting it up fine. You have tried different drives with OFFICIAL MS recovery discs and different hds. The official pressed discs definitely work. You booted them on your retail xbox in the SAME drive you then moved over to your debug kit and it did not work. This would leave only the hard drive as the culprit as you have even tried different ide cables. You then tried different hard drives and the symptoms did not change. I have come to the conclusion that the ide portion of the debug kit is not functioning properly by process of elimination.

[Pikkon]

Yes it is possible to chip a debug kit and get it working,I know that Ace installed a 29 wire modchip in a DVT3 and brought it back to life.Have you tried using a different IDE cable.And if you take out the hdd and boot up the debug kit does it act the same.Well this is what I would do,install a working IDE cable,throw in a hdd that you know works for sure,throw in the recovery disc,if it does not boot that change to hdd to cable select or slave or anything else untill it boots.Thats all I can think of for now,also your eeprom is fine on there,if your eeprom was corrupt you would have no audio or no video.

[BCfosheezy]

QUOTE(Pikkon @ May 30 2006, 09:26 PM)

Yes it is possible to chip a debug kit and get it working,I know that Ace installed a 29 wire modchip in a DVT3 and brought it back to life.Have you tried using a different IDE cable.And if you take out the hdd and boot up the debug kit does it act the same.Well this is what I would do,install a working IDE cable,throw in a hdd that you know works for sure,throw in the recovery disc,if it does not boot that change to hdd to cable select or slave or anything else untill it boots.Thats all I can think of for now,also your eeprom is fine on there,if your eeprom was corrupt you would have no audio or no video.

Nobody debated the fact that a debug unit would boot from a chip. Of course the 29 wire mod worked to fix that bad flash. This kid doesn't have a bad flash. His bios works fine. It's that the dashboard never loads and even when he tries a known good recovery disc in a known good dvd drive with a known good cable and known good hd it still doesn't boot. He's tried everything you've suggested. Don't get his hopes up with a chip when it isn't going to work.

[BCfosheezy]

QUOTE(Paintballpsyco2369 @ Jun 7 2006, 05:13 PM)

Here is what bigsexyolli replied to me about my inquery on the history of the Debug (there will be more info on it soon):
 

So I finally got word from that guy, here is the story:

He sold the devstuff for a buddy, which was supposed to be a dev guy back when I bought it, not he isn't (as far as I remeber from all the emails back and forth) Thats rahter uninteresting anyway, here comesthe sotry of the debugger:

His buddy wanted to use the Recovory CD with it (to upgade it and play normal games with it, ...lame...), but the proccess didn't work out, there was an error and after that it didn't work anymore. After that the buddy gave it to another buddy and they tried to fit in a 1.0 Chip (whatever that is, that how he described it, sorry. I'd say a Modchip for a 1.0 Motherboard) in it to get it running, but that didn't work out.

Bottom line is (as far as I can tell):

While using the recovory CD, an error occered and since that it doesn't work anymore.


I don't know how helpful that info is and how you can repair it, if its even possible, which I do hope. But I guess thats what it has come down to, a mistake in wanting to use the recovory disc and play normal games with it.





 


I hope this is able to help someone help me out. ALso as a note, the wire in the picture, it is only connected to the point on the mobo that is visable in the picture there. The other end isn't connected to anything. Thanks again for all the help.

#1: You can't use the recovery disc to play retail games.
#2 The flubber animation displays and you hear the sounds. The xbox boots and initializes its hardware which proves that A: it is booting a debug bios and it's working properly. B: the xbox booting and showing the flubber proves the major components (with the exception of in my experience the mcpx: one time long ago I plugged an 80 pin ide cable in backwards and the xbox that worked right before that DID NOT read any ide devices after that)on the xbox motherboard are functioning properly.

(In our discussion earlier you stated that plugging the ide cable in backwards did not have enough "voltage" to damage anything in the mcpx. Anyone with any electronics knowledge knows that IC's have a certain tolerance. The majority of the pins are rated for 3.3 volts at a few milliamps. Since on the 80 pin cable you would be connecting many of these to ground they would have much more current passing through them than their tolerance and would definitely blow. It's definitely a possibility.)

The next thing the xbox does is look for the devices on the ide chain to boot to either dvd or the dash. This is where the xbox is hanging. No matter what he does (no dvd, no hdd, or either) the behavior of the xbox does not change. This is odd for even a debug kit as you get different reactions for certain scenarios. (if ANY results were present I have some debugs I'd test with and see which error means what) (since you get no error indicators I won't)

Also, the whole "chipping" thing... here's the breakdown. The debug kit behaves like a retail when d0 is held low. It looks to the lpc for the bios. The difference is, retail bios' don't boot on the debug and no hacked retail works on a debug. You MUST use a real debug bios on your console for it to boot. The fact that the flubber displays proves that the debug unpacked and decrypted the bios on the tsop. So running a debug bios off of a modchip will not change anything.

Good luck fixing the problem.

[BCfosheezy]

QUOTE(hargle @ Jun 9 2006, 11:22 AM)

The differences between an 80pin cable and 40pin is that the additional wires are grounds, yes, but the pins are grounded to each other to help absorb signal crosstalk at higher speeds. (think of it as a standard 40pin cable with a mesh of ground wires surrounding it.)

You aren't connecting any more IDE header pins to ground than you are with a standard 40pin cable-that's why 80pin cables are backwards compatible to 40pin cables. The motherboard doesn't know the difference.*

There is no more chance of something blowing out with an 80 pin cable backwards or forwards than with a 40pin.



*The only difference between 80 and 40pins is pin #34, which is used to detect if an 80pin cable is present, so the IDE drive can be set by software into a higher speed mode. (ATA-66, 100, 133)
Pin 34 is grounded (inside the cable) on the BLUE end of the cable, and the 2 drive connectors have this pin tied to each other (much like it would be on a 40 pin cable). On a 40pin cable, that pin is used for drive diagnostics, meaning the pin would transition from low to high as drives are initialized. Connecting it backwards would give you a connection on pin34 from the motherboard to the middle connector (just like on a 40pin) and no connection between the end drive connector to the motherboard.

All of that information is great and I'm sure you're right, unfortunately I connect one backwards to a WORKING xbox motherboard. Beforehand I had avalaunch loaded up and was playing games. I plugged it in backwards and the xbox booted, the flubber displayed but the dash didn't come up. Ok so I notice that the cable is backwards. I swap it around and the xbox still shows the flubber but will never boot from ide devices anymore. I tried 2 different dvd drives. I tried a different hdd. I tried a different cable all after that and nothing works. This is how I know I'm correct here. Had this not happened I would not believe it either. It DID happen so believe it. I only mentioned a 80 pin cable because that's what I was using when I did it. Regardless there will still be some lines grounded that are connected to an ic. (in this case the mcpx since it directly controls the ide devices) and it may lose it's ide functionality. Again, I wouldn't believe this if I hadn't made this stupid mistake myself and found out the hard way.

[BCfosheezy]

QUOTE(hargle @ Jun 9 2006, 02:12 PM)

ok, I'm not going to argue what killed your xbox's IDE controller.
You could have had a junk cable, it could have been a coincidence, could have been a power surge or a static shock.

I currently have an 80pin cable on my box, and yes, it's connected backwards at the moment, as that's the only way the connectors will reach. It's been this way approximately 1 year so far and no damage done. This, plus the fact that there aren't warning labels on 80 pin cables leads me to suspect that you had some sort of freaky experience that you're blaming on a cable. I'm just saying that it's unqualified.

I really don't want to fight, and apologies to Paintballpsyco2369 for the thread hijacking.
This is the point I was trying to explain.
No, there are no more grounds connected that are connected to an IC.

The extra ground pins in the cable are tied somewhere (probably pin 40), but unless MS designed the board REALLY strangely, the ground pins on the IDE header connect to the ground plane in the motherboard itself, which dump back to the power supply, not routed back through any IC. (path of least resistance, remember?) Only data and control signals are connected between the IDE headers and the southbridge.

I have schematics for one of the PC motherboards that my company produced right here in front of me, and none of the grounds on IDE have ever been wired directly back to the IDE controller. That would cause a signaling nightmare.


Anyway, this is getting rather petty and I'm really not typically like this; just trying to defend a poor helpless 80pin cable from getting too much of the blame for your woes.

I'm not blaming the 80-pin cable. In my last post I'd hoped that would clear that up.
At no point did I say there would be MORE grounds touching the IC. If the cable is plugged in how it was not meant to be, it can short a chip possibly due to a difference in potential. That's not even debatable. Why are you insisting that I'm saying the more grounds the 80 pin has are the culprit? I'm not.

This did happen to me regardless what you think. If you have your cable turned backwards that's fine... plug it into your hdd and dvd drive the other way but leave it backwards to your mobo. That's how I had it. I mean if you're going to test to try to prove my theory (not a theory... it's proven) wrong then do it exactly as I did it. I'm glad you have a schematic in front of you showing that. Don't tell me you know that what I say is untrue because frankly... you're wrong if you do. have no reason to make such a claim and I would not. This happened right before my eyes pal. Sorry to disappoint you but it did. Couldn't have been a power surge due to I only work on devices at my bench which I have the outlets hooked up to a ups (it's not plugged in when I work on it... but still) I also use a rubber static free mat to stand on at my bench and grounding straps. Those possibilies are good thoughts but even though I made this stupid mistake of plugging it in backwards I'm no rookie. I'm just not perfect is all and that's why I happen to know that this is possible.

I don't want to fight either but I know exactly what happened with mine and no amount of your inapplicable commentary will prove that otherwise. I wish your meaningless comments COULD revive that xbox. I still have that mobo. It is the only xbox I've ever destroyed. Regardless, try to help paintballpsycho instead of trying to prove me wrong because at the end of the day I'm just trying to help the kid as well.

[hargle]

QUOTE(BCfosheezy @ Jun 9 2006, 08:42 PM)

If you have your cable turned backwards that's fine... plug it into your hdd and dvd drive the other way but leave it backwards to your mobo. That's how I had it.

Aha!  I'm on your trolley now.

You connected the cable backwards on 1 end, bypassing the connector+cable key.  

I was referring to connecting a cable backwards as in connecting the drive end to the motherboard and the motherboard end to drive, not even considering that someone would hook up a cable backwards in regard to the connector key, as that would be more work than hooking it up the right way!  (did you not have a keyed cable?  Do they even make those anymore?)

You are correct; attaching a cable like the way you did could certainly damage things.

I am also correct in saying that attaching a cable backward (both ends swapped, still keyed properly) would NOT do any damage.

Isn't the engligh language great with such ambiguities?  We were arguing over completely unrelated, yet incredibly similar things.


I do apologize for bringing down the wrath (however light that may be) upon you.  I wanted to help remove any misconceptions that 80pin cables are somehow different than 40pin cables, which is something I have heard occasionally.  This goes hand in hand with the misconception that 80pin cables will increase your transfer speeds on an xbox, but that's a whole new topic.  

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Now onto stuff actually pertaining to the topic:

Paintballpsyco2369 has essentially a paper-weight on his hands at the moment.

Since you've swapped DVDs, HDDs, and cables, the only thing left is either BIOS or the motherboard.
I think it's a worthwhile investment to buy a modchip for it.  It may only prove that you've got a motherboard problem, but at least you can put a known good BIOS into it and give you one last hope of resurrecting it.

If nothing else, you can always re-sell or reuse the modchip if it turns out not to help.

[Agent ME]

If something was wrong with the BIOS it wouldn't even show the flubber animation would it? So a chip would be next to pointless...

At least you got a DVD drive, a hard drive, PSU, case, controller, game beta, and maybe more that you can still sell even if the xbox is screwed up.

[BCfosheezy]

QUOTE(hargle @ Jun 13 2006, 12:30 PM)

Aha! I'm on your trolley now.

You connected the cable backwards on 1 end, bypassing the connector+cable key.

I was referring to connecting a cable backwards as in connecting the drive end to the motherboard and the motherboard end to drive, not even considering that someone would hook up a cable backwards in regard to the connector key, as that would be more work than hooking it up the right way! (did you not have a keyed cable? Do they even make those anymore?)

You are correct; attaching a cable like the way you did could certainly damage things.

I am also correct in saying that attaching a cable backward (both ends swapped, still keyed properly) would NOT do any damage.

Isn't the engligh language great with such ambiguities? We were arguing over completely unrelated, yet incredibly similar things.


I do apologize for bringing down the wrath (however light that may be) upon you. I wanted to help remove any misconceptions that 80pin cables are somehow different than 40pin cables, which is something I have heard occasionally. This goes hand in hand with the misconception that 80pin cables will increase your transfer speeds on an xbox, but that's a whole new topic.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Now onto stuff actually pertaining to the topic:

Paintballpsyco2369 has essentially a paper-weight on his hands at the moment.

Since you've swapped DVDs, HDDs, and cables, the only thing left is either BIOS or the motherboard.
I think it's a worthwhile investment to buy a modchip for it. It may only prove that you've got a motherboard problem, but at least you can put a known good BIOS into it and give you one last hope of resurrecting it.

If nothing else, you can always re-sell or reuse the modchip if it turns out not to help.

I thought something was screwy because from what you were saying I knew you knew what you were talking about but yet I witnessed what happened first hand. lol. Also, no the key didn't stop anything or provide any physical resistance. Also, the pin was not filled in on the cable. It just fit in there smooth as silk and I didn't even notice. I felt so stupid afterwards... but hey live and learn and paintballpsycho's debug is giving the exact same symptoms and since the guy he got it from said people were jacking around with the mobo... it's definitely a possibility.

QUOTE(Agent ME @ Jun 13 2006, 04:33 PM)

If something was wrong with the BIOS it wouldn't even show the flubber animation would it? So a chip would be next to pointless...

At least you got a DVD drive, a hard drive, PSU, case, controller, game beta, and maybe more that you can still sell even if the xbox is screwed up.

That's exactly what I've been trying to tell him. He's convinced that the x3 os will boot on this debug and allow him to manipulate or repair a bad eeprom. If the eeprom were indeed bad he could not fix it this way because the x3 will not unpack or decrypt on the debug console. It would have to be running ONLY a debug bios and then it would perform exactly as the tsop debug bios does right now.

[au_geoff]

QUOTE(BCfosheezy @ Jun 14 2006, 09:49 AM)

That's exactly what I've been trying to tell him. He's convinced that the x3 os will boot on this debug and allow him to manipulate or repair a bad eeprom. If the eeprom were indeed bad he could not fix it this way because the x3 will not unpack or decrypt on the debug console. It would have to be running ONLY a debug bios and then it would perform exactly as the tsop debug bios does right now.

You are indeed CORRECT.
Speaking from experience!!!

The Debug Kit has a different version of the MCPX and EEPROM Data.
Thats why the debug bios had to be 'hacked' to work on normal xboxes.
And why Normal bioses don't work on debug.
Different Security signature.(something like that)

Anyway....

Ive just installed a X3 ce on my Green Debug Kit.
The only thing that works are the Lan led, Hd Led, Front X Led, Leds on chip.
The actual Chip refuses to boot, just frags.
Boots normaly pressing power button >1second.

The install Is correct.(doh!! its a debug kit..Pinheader Factory Installed)
Man,I only had to solder 3 wires.
D0,Lan and HD so I couldnt have stuffed that up.
Had to Bend Pin 16 90 degrees though to allow the chip to go on as hole 16 is filled.

Explains the trouble I had trying to install a SmartX V3.(Great chip)
Didnt even appear to get any power . No lights No Go.
At least the X3 has some functionality.

Probably need to flash on another box with a debug flashbios(If there is such a thing???)
to allow further flashing with chip enabled.
Or the hacked debug bios (for debug) on the chip.

Im using the BFM debug bios which effectively lets me run anything anyway.
With 128 meg of ram,memory is not a problem.

Still, would have been nice to have the X3 working in all its glory.

Team Executor may want to consider changing the claim of "Works on ALL XBoxs".
Cause it dont. Period

They have two versions of Config-Live at the moment.(V1-1.5/v1.6)
I think they should release a debug version of Flashbios and X3 Config-Live
to satisfy the rest of the community.(probably a very minority group)
Would not require much effort on there part.
At least then the claim would be true.

Sorry for babbling and getting of track,probably should start another thread.

Thats all folks.
Thanks
au_geoff

PS hello  paint.

[Pikkon]

QUOTE(programmingace @ Jun 14 2006, 02:25 PM)

Second, if you still want to do it for some crazy reason, you will need an ACTUAL debug bios dumpted straight off of a real debugger.

Damn Ace,thats what I was going to say,you beat me to it.haha

[BCfosheezy]

QUOTE(Paintballpsyco2369 @ Jun 14 2006, 05:29 PM)

I will be using a debug bios on the chip. And I don't think the X3 os will boot, in fact I highly doubt it will. I think it is at least worth a try to try the chip. AS the other guy said, it will at least confirm that the mobo is DOA if it will not work. I just hope to God it isn't dead. Thanks for the help guys.

Well the fact remains that it will not prove whether the mobo was DOA or not. The OS isn't going to boot as the previous poster said. It CAN'T. The debug xbox simply cannot unpack or decrypt retail packages. The x3os requires a retail xbox to unpack it. Someone in this thread has confirmed it. I have told you all along and I'm even telling you why. Your debug is not magically going to overcome these differences. We already know that the debug bios on your xbox is working and that it is in fact a debug bios so flashing the debug bios on your chip will accomplish nothing. We already know the outcome. So far you have dropped over $200.00 on a doorstop.

[Paintballpsyco2369]

WEll, the chip didn't work. (found out later the chip still had a bad bios on it anywyas) but I ghave up on it,and put the x3 in my Aladdin box. nicwe to have a real chip. I tried flashing the debug bios to my aladdin (From other talks with users [you know who you are] I found out that didn;t work either) It would begin to load, and nothing happend, it shut off, and rebooted as it normally does. I tried a few other things, holding the power button down for a long time, and several times I got it to do a very weird kind of boot thing. Nothing on the screen during this "thing" and the lights were either a solid red and orange, or flashing red and orange. IT would vary from time time, and from length of button hold to button hold. It really is the weirdest thing. Anyways, if anyone has any ideas how it can be fixed, if it even can, please let me know. Otherwise the first person who will take it at $150 paypal, gets it shipped (to the US). Thanka gain for all the help, and again I would much rather fix it, then sell it so if you have any ideas whatsoever, please let me know. THanks.

Paintball