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[SniperKilla]

and the xecuter team have been helping our guys with neXgen so whoever said they dident put out a dash, should go back and crawl under the dalnet channel he/she/it came from.

oh by the way, the x2 final IGR is rocksolid now, and team X gave us the kernels for free, they dident have to, just because evox rips the feature out and has their dashboard patch it to the bios thats cached in ram dosent make them anymore special.

im not arguing anymore over this as you guys are completly ignorant to the truth, and if i continue to argue its going to lead me to saying something i dont want to just to shut you up.

[SniperKilla]

yea, team evox knew damn well what releasing that bios would reveal, yet they choose to do it, their A+ scene representives.

[ADutch1]

hmmm, Why build a "back door" in a house but never use it?

So that MS doesn't find out??? HAHAHAHA, find out what?!?

Regardless what kind of security you'll put out there, somebody will crack it. It might not happen at the speed you want, but hey, really, how many of you care anyways. You have your 1.0 or 1.1 XBox now, why need another one...

[BenJeremy]

QUOTE

Evox is in it for the scene and X-ecutor is in it for the money.

Au contraire.

Evo-X seems to be firmly in bed with the Xodus/Matrox team now. It was evident with the 2.6 release a short while ago. The Evo-X team is definitely in it for the money.

The D.6 BIOS release was probably released to soothe the newbies installing Matrixes and give them a single non-confusing choice to flash into the 256k product. They knew they were exposing a 'trick of the trade' when they did it, and ignored the 'scene' by doing it, thumbing their noses at others who worked very hard, and trusted those working in the scene to protect its' own.

[BenJeremy]

QUOTE (ADutch1 @ Dec 11 2002, 04:20 PM)

hmmm, Why build a "back door" in a house but never use it? So that MS doesn't find out??? HAHAHAHA, find out what?!? Regardless what kind of security you'll put out there, somebody will crack it. It might not happen at the speed you want, but hey, really, how many of you care anyways. You have your 1.0 or 1.1 XBox now, why need another one...

                                    Well, golly. Is that why there are so many Gamecube modchips around?

[Pandoriaantje]

QUOTE (BenJeremy @ Dec 11 2002, 08:21 PM)

Well, golly. Is that why there are so many Gamecube modchips around?

                                    but than ask this: what is the point in hacking a lamecube? like a 6 yearold is gonna solder a chip is he's lamecube  

[SniperKilla]

you can see where evox has aligned themselves by looking at the fucking bootlogo of their new dash

As it seems evox has said fuck you to the scene.

if team x was in it for the money they wouldent have released their x2 bios's.

[gggie]

QUOTE (BenJeremy @ Dec 11 2002, 08:11 PM)

Yeah, the Xodus/Matrix team was soooooooooo mature with that incredibly lame and misleading 'chart' they posted some time ago. I can't tell you how much respect I lost for those guys that day. The scene could do without the sniping, but what are you guys doing?? LOL!

                                    I agree that the Matrix folks shouldn't have done that - but, to apply basic rules of fairness that we all learned at the schoolgrounds when we were 5, "x-ecutor started it"!  Seriously, Matrix got so fed up with x-ecutor's constant sniping that they finally cracked and stooped to x-ecutor's level.  And they proved that they were no match for team x-ecutor at viciously attacking your opposition, in that - I agree - x-ecutor is king.

But this one slip-up in judgment hardly compares to the sustained pattern of insults that come streaming from team x-ecutor's corner.

(Also, in response to "what are you guys doing??": noting that a group appears to have a rather bastardly attitude and that they should stop the constant sniping is hardly the same as the initial sniping itself - in fact, such complaints are aimed at ending the sniping, which, as you say, would be a good thing.)

[Roy2001]

QUOTE (prestige @ Dec 11 2002, 08:27 PM)

Maybe Team Xcuter just needs a hug! ............................ So I want to extend a big pat on the back to Team Xcuter.  Good job boys, you did a really, really good job. Gold stars and smiley-face stamps for all of you.......

                                    I have the same words to Xcuter team

Either MS is stupid or Xcuter team is stupid about security hole. My 2 cents.

[M@verick]

whatever this is all a buncha bullshit.  X-ecuter needs to lose the ego a little bit.  I'm sure MS would've found the backdoor regardless of whether EvoX sped up that process or not.  But knowing MS they knew about the backdoor and left it there on purpose for some evil reason.  X-ecuter should not go flaming their competitors.  You never seen MS flaming Nintendo.  These teams should act a little more professional.

[BenJeremy]

QUOTE (M@verick @ Dec 11 2002, 06:18 PM)

whatever this is all a buncha bullshit.  X-ecuter needs to lose the ego a little bit.  I'm sure MS would've found the backdoor regardless of whether EvoX sped up that process or not.  But knowing MS they knew about the backdoor and left it there on purpose for some evil reason.  X-ecuter should not go flaming their competitors.  You never seen MS flaming Nintendo.  These teams should act a little more professional.

Geez. First off, you are correct, everything in your post is bullshit  

Yeah, M$ was definitely going to find the loophole, so let's all absolve Evo-X of any wrongdoing.

You know what? People will die!!! So let's absolve the murderers because they were only performing an inevitable deed!

M$ hadn't found it yet, and they already had one "new" revision of their security that FAILED to close the loophole and even introduced another (but without the backdoor, might never have been figured out). Most people here readily bash M$ over every little security bug in IE, but leap to declare them masters of time, space and computers if it absolves Evolution-X from their gaff. What a double standard from the fanboys.

Then we come to THIS gem: "You never seen MS flaming Nintendo." HAAA!!! HAAA!!!

I guess you don't get out much, eh? M$ regularly rags on the competition, whether it's Linux, Sony's Playstation2 or anybody else.

Egads. Would everybody just CALM DOWN. Team X is allowed to express their opinions and be pissed. If you don't like it, ignore them and don't buy their product.

See, that wasn't hard, was it?

[BenJeremy]

Oops... X-S is a bit busy today!

[stratjakt]

They're *ALL* taking themselves way to damn seriously.

The 'scene' is teensy, tiny, insignificant.  A few thousand modded boxes amongst a sea of millions sold is nothing.

I can guarantee you that MS brass spends more time thinking of ways to stop employees from stealing pens than it does thinking of ways to make xbox harder to crack.

Did they send a team of lawyers do beat Bunnie down after he found a way in?  Nah.  They let him go ahead and publish his findings.  After all, modding didn't exactly hurt the PSX.

v1.1 was a simple contingency plan.  Cycle the codes.  Make the investors see you're doing something.  Is it unhackable?  Nah, just a little harder..  But they key is *IT DIDNT COST THEM SHIT*.  A complete redesign from the ground up would be stupid on their part - they'd be spending a dollar to save a nickel.

The 'secret trick' (which refers to the buffer overflow/reboot exploit, IIRC) has been well known and documented online for a while.  I remember reading it before linux became a reality, as an alternate boot method on the xbox-linux site.  I guess its gone now.  Which is lame from the very notion of what Open Source is supposed to mean.  No stupid 'secrets' like this.

Anyways, it's not a case of MS being too stupid to close the hole.  Its a case of it not being nearly cost-effective enough for them to do so.  

The only way it becomes cost-effective for them to do so is if modding becomes so easy and ubiquitous that anyone can do it, and the percentage of modded consoles starts being significant.  And ALL THE MODCHIP MAKERS are moving in that direction.  Then there are all of these websites and forums helping people see how easy it is to mod their xbox.  They ain't helping either.

You want to keep your geek secrets tight to your chest?  Give us the 30 wire mods back.  If anything wakes MS and gets 'em to lock the box down tight, it's going to be the "no-soldering install in 2 minutes works with xbox live" mods.  

Though even that's unlikely.  Wave 2 is going to be in the software, IMO.  Look forward to shitty half-working cracks like there is in the PC warez scene.  DVD-9 makes for huge crosslinked dummy files, tons of reroutes, lots of media checks... A real mess.  And much cheaper than paying a team of engineers to redesign the system and still keep it 100% compatible with the old one.

[0rbital]

OMG, Doesn't anyone realize that MS has the ability to disassemble and see what these hack BIOS' are doing?  Whatever this backdoor bug is you can bet MS knows about it already and this Evox release isn't going to matter.  Xecuter guys are just slamming the competition whenever they can.  It's all childish.

[mid_gen]

QUOTE

What do you think of MS's attempt to modify the Xbox to prevent people like you from cracking it again? Well, now that their v1.1 security has been cracked by Andy Green & co in under a week, I think MS's attempt was pathetic. First, they cost nVidia untold millions of dollars in scrapped chips, and then they go ahead and implement a hash using an algorithm that is explicitly not suitable for hashes! I'm infuriated because I *know* they know better than to do this. I like nVidia, and I hate seeing a good hardware company being ground into the dirt by careless engineers at MS. If they are going to spin the silicon, do it right. I saw with my own two eyes blank space on the MCPX die that could have been used to grow the boot overlay ROM so that it could accommodate a more complicated hash function. I mean, the new security system from MS doesn't even require the current modchip vendors to change their hardware--just a reflash of the ROM is all that's required. What a waste! On the flip side, even if MS had done the hash function right, I know Andy Green would still have found a way around it. Him and I did a little chatting and there's a good warchest of holes and exploits in the Xbox that are fairly easy to use.

Who do Team Xecuter think they are fooling exactly with all this PR nonsense? You can bet your ass MS is keeping track with the xbox hacking/homebrew scene a lot closer than most of us, they know the 1.1 was a balls up. Of course the next version will be a pain in the ass to hack.

I was quite dissapointed to see the Evox team bother replying, I've never seen a market place where the competition engages in such petty flamewars.