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[dvsone]

A user from the AVS Forum is claiming that sony wouldn't replace his busted PS3 because he wasn't using official sony components.

QUOTE

Just got off the phone with Sony Support. Because I have a generic brand of component cables, instead of officially licensed Sony components, Sony has voided the warranty on my PS3 and will only replace it for $150 dollars!

http://www.avsforum....ad.php?t=789061

Is this listed on the PS3 warranty?

[VerbalVenom]

http://www.us.playst.../PS3/Warranties

QUOTE

LIMITED HARDWARE WARRANTY AND LIABILITY FOR THE PLAYSTATION®3 COMPUTER ENTERTAINMENT SYSTEM

Sony Computer Entertainment America ("SCEA") warrants to the original purchaser that the PS3TM hardware shall be free from material defects in material and workmanship for a period of one (1) year from the original date of purchase (the "Warranty Period"). If the product is determined to be materially defective during the Warranty Period, your sole remedy and SCEA's sole and exclusive liability shall be limited to the repair or replacement of this product with a new or refurbished product at SCEA's option. For purpose of this Limited Hardware Warranty and Liability, "refurbished" means a product that has been returned to its original specifications. Visit www.us.playstation.com or call 1-800-345-7669 for instructions on how to deliver the product, freight prepaid, to an authorized service facility.

THIS WARRANTY SHALL NOT APPLY IF THIS PRODUCT (A) IS USED WITH PRODUCTS THAT ARE NOT COMPATIBLE WITH THIS PRODUCT; ( IS USED FOR COMMERCIAL PURPOSES (INCLUDING RENTAL); © IS MODIFIED, OR TAMPERED WITH; (D) IS DAMAGED BY ACTS OF GOD, MISUSE, ABUSE, NEGLIGENCE, ACCIDENT, WEAR AND TEAR, UNREASONABLE USE, OR BY OTHER CAUSES UNRELATED TO DEFECTIVE MATERIALS OR WORKMANSHIP; (E) HAS HAD THE SERIAL NUMBER ALTERED, DEFACED OR REMOVED; OR (F) HAS HAD THE WARRANTY SEAL ON THE PS3TM SYSTEM ALTERED, DEFACED, OR REMOVED. THIS WARRANTY DOES NOT COVER CONSUMABLES (SUCH AS BATTERIES) OR PRODUCTS SOLD "AS IS" OR WITH ALL FAULTS. THIS WARRANTY SHALL ALSO BE VOIDABLE BY SCEA IF (1) SCEA REASONABLY BELIEVES THAT THE PS3TM SYSTEM HAS BEEN USED IN A MANNER THAT WOULD VIOLATE THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS OF A SEPARATE END USER LICENSE AGREEMENT FOR SYSTEM SOFTWARE; OR (2) THE PRODUCT IS USED WITH PRODUCTS NOT SOLD OR LICENSED BY SCEA (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, NON-LICENSED GAME ENHANCEMENT DEVICES, CONTROLLERS, ADAPTORS AND POWER SUPPLY DEVICES). YOU ASSUME ALL RISKS AND LIABILITIES ASSOCIATED WITH USE OF THIRD PARTY PRODUCTS. A VALID PROOF OF PURCHASE IN THE FORM OF A BILL OF SALE OR RECEIPT FROM AN AUTHORIZED RETAILER WITH THE DATE OF THE ORIGINAL PURCHASE MUST BE PRESENTED TO OBTAIN WARRANTY SERVICE.

THIS WARRANTY IS PROVIDED TO YOU IN LIEU OF ALL OTHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTIES INCLUDING WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE FOR THE PS3TM HARDWARE, WHICH ARE DISCLAIMED HEREUNDER. HOWEVER, IF SUCH WARRANTIES ARE REQUIRED AS A MATTER OF LAW, THEN THEY ARE LIMITED IN DURATION TO THE WARRANTY PERIOD.

OUR SOLE AND EXCLUSIVE RECOURSE IN THE EVENT OF ANY DISSATISFACTION WITH OR DAMAGE ARISING FROM THE USE OF THE PS3TM HARDWARE AND SCEA'S MAXIMUM LIABILITY SHALL BE LIMITED TO REPAIR OR REPLACEMENT OF THE PS3TM SYSTEM. EXCEPT AS EXPRESSLY STATED ABOVE, SCEA EXCLUDES ALL LIABILITY FOR ANY LOSS OF DATA, LOSS OF PROFIT, OR ANY OTHER LOSS OR DAMAGE SUFFERED BY YOU OR ANY THIRD PARTY, WHETHER SUCH DAMAGES ARE DIRECT, INDIRECT, CONSEQUENTIAL, SPECIAL, OR INCIDENTAL AND HOWEVER ARISING UNDER ANY THEORY OF LAW, AS A RESULT OF USING YOUR PS3TM HARDWARE. SOME STATES OR PROVINCES DO NOT ALLOW LIMITATION ON HOW LONG AN IMPLIED WARRANTY LASTS AND SOME STATES DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OR LIMITATIONS OF CONSEQUENTIAL OR INCIDENTAL DAMAGES, SO THE LIMITATIONS OR EXCLUSIONS MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU.

This warranty gives you specific legal rights, and you may also have other rights which vary from state to state or province to province. This warranty is valid only in the United States and Canada. The warranty offered by Sony Computer Entertainment America on your PS3TM hardware is the same whether or not you register your product.

This warranty does not apply to any system software that is pre-installed in the PS3TM hardware, or is subsequently provided via update or upgrade releases. Such system software is licensed to you under the terms and conditions of a separate end user license agreement at http://www.scei.co.jp/ps3-eula/ and such software is provided pursuant to its own warranty.
Service policy

You understand and acknowledge that any time SCEA services your PS3TM system (either within the Warranty Period or under a separate service arrangement), it may become necessary for SCEA to provide certain services to your PS3TM system to ensure it is functioning properly in accordance with SCEA guidelines. Such services may include the installation of the latest software or firmware updates, or service or replacement of the PS3TM hard disk or the PS3TM system with a new or refurbished product. You acknowledge and agree that some services may change your current settings, cause a removal of cosmetic stickers or system skins, cause a loss of data or content, or cause some loss of functionality. You should back up your hard disk regularly to prevent loss or alteration of data, although some content cannot be backed up and must be reinstalled by the user. You should also remove any peripherals, non-PS3TM system components, and any content that you consider proprietary, private, or confidential before you send in your PS3TM system for service. SCEA shall not be liable for damages resulting from your failure to comply with the foregoing, or any instructions provided to you by SCEA. SCEA reserves the right to refuse service or void the warranty of any PS3TM system that has been modified or tampered with.

Except as otherwise stated in the Limited Hardware Warranty and Liability above, you agree that (i) the services are provided "AS IS" without any express or implied warranties; and (ii) SCEA shall not be liable for any direct and indirect, consequential, or special damages, including any damages that may arise from loss of data or functionality. The foregoing limitation shall apply to the extent permitted by applicable law.
LIMITED WARRANTY FOR SCE MANUFACTURED PERIPHERALS

Sony Computer Entertainment America (SCEA) warrants to the original purchaser that this product is free from defects in material and workmanship for a period of ninety (90) days from the date of purchase. Upon a showing of proof of purchase, SCEA agrees for a period of ninety (90) days to either repair or replace, at its option, the SCEA product. See our How to Obtain Service information or call 1-800-345-SONY to receive instructions to obtain repair/replacement services.

This warranty shall not be applicable and shall be void if the defect in the SCEA product has arisen through abuse, unreasonable use, mistreatment, neglect, or means other than from a defect in materials or workmanship. THIS WARRANTY IS IN LIEU OF ALL OTHER WARRANTIES AND NO OTHER REPRESENTATIONS OR CLAIMS OF ANY NATURE SHALL BE BINDING ON OR OBLIGATE SCEA. ANY IMPLIED WARRANTIES APPLICABLE TO THIS PRODUCT, INCLUDING WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, ARE LIMITED TO THE NINETY (90) DAY PERIOD DESCRIBED ABOVE. IN NO EVENT WILL SCEA BE LIABLE FOR INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES RESULTING FROM POSSESSION, USE OR MALFUNCTION OF THE SCEA PRODUCT.

SOME STATES OR PROVINCES DO NOT ALLOW LIMITATION ON HOW LONG AN IMPLIED WARRANTY LASTS AND SOME STATES DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OR LIMITATIONS OF CONSEQUENTIAL OR INCIDENTAL DAMAGES, SO THE ABOVE LIMITATIONS OR EXCLUSION MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU.

This warranty gives you specific legal rights, and you may also have other rights which vary from state to state or from province to province. This warranty is valid only in the United States and Canada.
LIMITED WARRANTY FOR SCE PUBLISHED SOFTWARE

Sony Computer Entertainment America (SCEA) warrants to the original purchaser of this SCEA product that this software is free from defects in material and workmanship for a period of ninety (90) days from the date of purchase. SCEA agrees for a period of ninety (90) days to either repair or replace, at its option, the SCEA product. See our How to Obtain Service information or call 1-800-345-SONY to receive instructions to obtain repair/replacement services.

This warranty shall not be applicable and shall be void if the defect in the SCEA product has arisen through abuse, unreasonable use, mistreatment or neglect. THIS WARRANTY IS IN LIEU OF ALL OTHER WARRANTIES, AND NO OTHER REPRESENTATIONS OR CLAIMS OF ANY NATURE SHALL BE BINDING ON OR OBLIGATE SCEA. ANY IMPLIED WARRANTIES APPLICABLE TO THIS SOFTWARE PRODUCT, INCLUDING WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, ARE LIMITED TO THE NINETY (90) DAY PERIOD DESCRIBED ABOVE. IN NO EVENT WILL SCEA BE LIABLE FOR INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES RESULTING FROM POSSESSION, USE OR MALFUNCTION OF THE SCEA SOFTWARE PRODUCT.

Some states do not allow limitations as to how long an implied warranty lasts and/or exclusions or limitations of consequential damages, so the above limitations and/or exclusions of liability may not apply to you. This warranty gives you specific legal rights, and you may also have other rights which vary from state to state.

[VariableElite]

I'm speechless.

Expect them to reverse this decision very soon, or face some very pissed off people. "We voided your warranty because you didn't use a Sony TV."

Simon Travaglia's BoFH comes to mind:

QUOTE

"Well," I reply, "to use an analogy, you've ridden the lift of the Tower of Turd to its lowest floor and are still pressing the down arrow."

P.S. From the avsforum link:

QUOTE

I'll tell them I have Microsoft cables and see what happens  

[VariableElite]

QUOTE(mike96sc2 @ Jan 18 2007, 10:41 AM)

This is an issue of people making a mountain out of a molehill. Actually this warranty is very standard. It's basically saying if your console breaks because you used a third-party device that we haven't tested and licensed then we're not paying for your console repairs.

They don't mean you need a Sony TV, that's just a huge moronic leap of assumptions there.

Some might remember some Mad Catz memory cards for the PS2 actually ended up shorting out some consoles early in the system's life. This is nothing more than Sony protecting themselves saying if you buy unlicensed 3rd party equipment that breaks your shit we're not paying for it.

Think of it like your car, you can buy genuine parts from the manufacturer but if you go try and fabricate your own and it causes the whole car to fail that's not the fault of the manufacturer but the part itself.

Taken from AVS forum

If you follow the story. His system shows a blank screen (video issue) and was using generic video cables. Perhaps there was a pin crossed in the plug in, perhaps it bent a pin in his console, lots of things could have happened to cause a short or bend or break a pin, perhaps the dimensions of the plug didn't fit just right and in forcing it to fit something came loose.

This guy sounds like a crybaby to me. I like where he encourages people to lie. Perhaps he isn't aware that he can be sued for such an act. That's like if I go out and tell people to kill and maim, I incited it, I'm responsible on some level. Kinda the same logic there.

My TV line was obviously a joke, not the next step in Sony's idiotic customer service policies (hopefully).

And you're wrong. This is nothing more than Sony saying that if you use unlicensed third party equipment, whether or not it breaks your console, your warranty is voided. There is no proof that the Psyclone cables the avsforum poster used caused any damage to the console, yet Sony voided the warranty anyway.

How about a Microsoft USB keyboard on the PS3? If my PS3 stops outputting audio, Sony can and will void my warranty if they find out that I used a MS product -- regardless of the fact that there's no fucking way a USB keyboard could blow the audio chips on the motherboard.

Oh, and here's the proper car analogy, from wolrahnaes on the avsforum:

QUOTE

Ford can not void the warranty on my Crown Victoria just because I don't use Motorcraft parts when performing scheduled maintainance. Nor can they choose to not cover an electrical problem simply because I have modified the intake and exhaust systems. However, if my use of non-standard parts and/or modifications was the cause of a failure, they are under no obligation to repair or replace anything which has been damaged by what I have done.

What Sony should have done is said, "OK, send the console back and we'll inspect it. If we find out that the damage was caused by non-licensed component cables, then we bill you $150+shipping to repair the console. Otherwise, we replace it under the warranty. Expect a shipping box in 2-3 days and a phone call 3-5 days after we receive your system."

BTW, the cables evidently were working find on the OP's PS2 and his PS3 for a while. In my experience, cables are either good or bad. It takes a lot of abuse for them to stop working, and even more for them to stop working to the point where other hardware is damaged.

Perhaps you aren't aware that in the US, anyone can be sued for any reason at any time. Him being sued for encouraging other people to lie to Sony to bypass their ILLEGAL warranty is hardly likely, though. Sure it's possible. It's also possible for Sony to release a console that doesn't completely suck. Will it happen? Never.

Oh, and before anyone says something about how every consumer electronics company has a similar clause in their warranties, remember that not every company in the world chooses to enforce this clause. From what I understand, MS has only implemented this policy in regards to the 360 when people were using the Nyko Intercooler, which has actually been shown to cause damage to the console.

[supergrafx]

I don't believe the ps3 system can detect which component cables you are using, third part or not, so this is completely stupid. If it were a thumb drive, bluetooth device, ect..., this could be possible due to the driver showing up if the internal memory or hd saved the history of the input after the failure happened. The user should of stated the system stopped working, and they had no idea what the cause was. Sony would have replaced it. I think this is BS and nintendo/360 fanboy or corporate blacklisting Sony with lies, on forums no less. Even the 360 fans on here, can be rational when topics are thoroughly discussed. Those who just keep bashing, you got to wonder. I do know that Sony, is less nice when it comes to returns due to past experiences (non-gaming matters such as cd-players, walkmens, ect... But the system just came out, and you would think they would not be antagonizing the customer, at least at this point, when system failures are are likely to occur due to the system's newity. Complete rubbish.

[mike96sc2]

QUOTE(VariableElite @ Jan 18 2007, 10:59 AM)

Perhaps you aren't aware that in the US, anyone can be sued for any reason at any time. Him being sued for encouraging other people to lie to Sony to bypass their ILLEGAL warranty is hardly likely, though. Sure it's possible. It's also possible for Sony to release a console that doesn't completely suck. Will it happen? Never.

Lol Sony's policy isn't illegal.

It says you assume all risk that may come from use of 3rd party unlicensed devices. You have a video problem, you used 3rd party cables for your video, I wouldn't be surprised if Sony was saying if the problem ends up being a result of the cables they will charge the fee for repair. However we're hearing a one-sided story here.

Furthermore people are taking leaps of faith in their assumption of what is causing a voided warranty. If my video quits working and I used non-Sony video cables and appears to be a result of trying to save $3 then why should Sony pay for your f-up?

[VariableElite]

QUOTE(mike96sc2 @ Jan 18 2007, 05:44 PM)

Lol Sony's policy isn't illegal.

It says you assume all risk that may come from use of 3rd party unlicensed devices. You have a video problem, you used 3rd party cables for your video, I wouldn't be surprised if Sony was saying if the problem ends up being a result of the cables they will charge the fee for repair. However we're hearing a one-sided story here.

Furthermore people are taking leaps of faith in their assumption of what is causing a voided warranty. If my video quits working and I used non-Sony video cables and appears to be a result of trying to save $3 then why should Sony pay for your f-up?

Read VerbalVenom's post with the PS3 warranty, especially the part in bold. Sony is stating there that if you use non-licensed cables, they can void your warranty.

A reasonable person would expect Sony to say that "if the problem ends up being a result of the cables they will charge the fee for repair." However, Sony has proven time and time again that they are not reasonable by any rational standards.

Regardless, without proof that the OP is lying we have to assume that he is telling the truth, especially in light of the wording of Sony's warranty and corroborating anecdotes by other posters on avsforum.

BTW, I believe that the OP stated he was using Psyclone cables. Those can hardly be called less expensive than the official Sony PS3 component cables, and their ready availability in retail consumer electronics and video game stores lends a certain "authenticity," regardless of their licensing status. I actually have Psyclone cables on my 360 right now, and were it to stop working, I'd have no qualms about trying the cables on another 360 to ensure that the cables were not defective. Why? Because there is virtually no way, unless the cables had been plugged and unplugged hundreds of times, that a cable would go bad, and go bad in such a manner that the system fails as a result.

For a company so focused on public relations, they sure can botch their image up.

[dvsone]

Upgrading your Hard Drive voids your warranty, might want to keep that old one in case you have to send it back.

[VariableElite]

QUOTE(mike96sc2 @ Jan 18 2007, 09:58 PM)

1 - Can, not will. Furthermore, any rational person would construe that to mean if it breaks as a result of a non-licensed 3rd party device that Sony will not pay for those repairs. US law is based on what a rational reasonable person would think / assume. Pretty clear the rational reasonable person is going to read that and say "okay if I use non-supported stuff and it breaks this is my warning". If you fill your car with grain alcohol just because it will run on it then blow it up can you expect the manufacturer to pay for that? Check a new car warranty agreement. I bet most any product in the world has a similar statement in regards to their product.

2 - Assuming Sony is unreasonable when it comes to customer service is crap. Where's your examples besides PR crap. We don't know what took place during the call between the guy and the rep. We have one side of a story, and for all we know the story isn't even true. I can assume lots of things, that doesn't make me an authority to make statements I cannot back up.
Incorrect - if your console breaks as a result of an upgraded hard drive then your warranty is void.  Not just because you swapped the hard drive.

Sigh...

GO BACK AND READ THE WARRANTY. Sony doesn't say "if you use unapproved shit on our system and it (the shit) messes it (our system) up, we'll void the warranty."

They're saying "if you use unapproved shit on our system, we can void your warranty, regardless of whether or not the system works and whether or not a nonworking system was made to be nonworking by the unapproved shit."

It's plain as day in their warranty. The only debate here is whether or not they actually enforce that clause. The avsforum OP, along with others that have posted there, states that they do. Until the OP refutes that statement, or Sony makes an official statement of their own, one has to assume that the OP is in fact telling the truth, ESPECIALLY IN LIGHT OF WHAT SONY'S OWN WARRANTY SAYS ON THE MATTER.

BTW, how exactly is Sony supposed to say that they don't actually enforce that clause? That's like MS saying that just because Media Player can send a list of all the media files on your PC to MS headquarters, doesn't mean it actually will.

[mlmadmax]

Man that sucks, i agree that they should have at least inspected it to determine that the cables indeed caused the problem before just voiding the warrenty. I agree with the car analogy, it is spot on. What this means to me is if you use any third party acsesory at all sony can void you warrenty. Aftermarket controller, hdmi cable, usb cable, anything they want.

All this will accomplish is making liars out of people, did you use any aftermarket products sir, HELL NO send me my coffin!!

[ausmods]

Hmmmm thats interesting. I hate it how different reps tell you different things

[Mr Invader]

QUOTE(mike96sc2 @ Jan 21 2007, 03:13 PM)

I can read what the OP says all day, as well as others, but neither of us were on the phone during the call.

Second, I'll play dumb-ass advocate here for a second, and agree that it's plain as day in their warranty. Okay, now assuming this is true and Sony is taking that stance. It's in the warranty. It's in your paperwork, it's in the terms of service I'm sure. Ever gotten a ticket because you were speeding? Go tell the judge you didn't know the speed limit, see how that works out. One's own personal ignorance is not a valid excuse. What's next? I didn't know I couldn't use my PS3 in the shower?

Just for kicks I called Sony's customer support hotline. Told them my Sixaxis wasn't working and syncing up with my PS3 as it should. I talked to the guy for a bit, then I threw in there. I'm using a non-Sony memory card and I said it worked fine until I hooked up the HDMI cable that came with my LG TV and I asked if that could be a problem. Both times I was told no probably not, they even agreed to send me a box to return it in. I wasn't told one my warranty was flat out void or I would have to pay a dime. Sounds to me like this guy was told IF it pertains to the cables then he would be paying, not as he puts it.

But look at the second post on this topic, the bold part. Thats pretty clear, except that it could mean literally everything.

I think the same thing happens if the 360 crashes when having the intercooler.