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[Kira Yamoto]

QUOTE(nickthegreat @ Sep 25 2006, 09:33 AM)

i only pointed out that after m_hael expressed that he would not be buying a PS3 because he saw nothing he liked that he should expect you to join in the thread with passion.

I then provided you with what you said you wanted as evidence:
but no, far from backing off you claim that m_hael is just biased. obviously noone is credible unless they share your opinion. Do you not see that this is why you piss people off? You have this unshakable belief that you are right regardless of everything and one.

As I, and others, originally stated in the prior thread (to which you argued against ceaselessly) the Ps3 will undoubtedly have great games and will be a good piece of hardware. BUT it is relatively more difficult to program games for. how you think that equates to not being a fan of games i don't know.

DO YOU EVEN KNOW WHAT THE FUCK BIAS MEANS? It's pretty damn obvious that everyone's biased, some more than others.  I never said directly that m_hael was biased, I meant in general.  But it would be pretty damn ignorant to believe that he is not, regardless of his position at Neversoft.  Now I didn't put a negative spin, as what's so favored around here.  I accept his viewpoint, and so I try to understand it as an employee of a company, rather than a consumer.

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As I, and others, originally stated in the prior thread (to which you argued against ceaselessly) the Ps3 will undoubtedly have great games

Strange, I don't ever remember reading such in a thread and I have read every thread here.  Everytime it comes down to the games, there's always some sort of negativity, and then it gets compared to a 360 game, that 360 game would be made to sound better than it's PS3 game in the same genre.

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and will be a good piece of hardware. BUT it is relatively more difficult to program games for. how you think that equates to not being a fan of games i don't know.

And what's NOT relatively difficult to program for.  X360 is touted by developers as 'less' difficult, but that doesn't make it a walk in the park does it? I never said it wasn't difficult to program for, I just wanted a credible source, written at a credible news source, or their own website and none of you have produced that.  You can't blame me for wanting the real thing, especially after all of you claim that you can't just use any source, and all that propaganda bullshit.

So really blame it on yourselves that I want concrete info.

[nickthegreat]

QUOTE(Kira Yamoto @ Sep 25 2006, 08:57 AM)

let me just add that how would it feel, to walk into a thread that you wanted to discuss, only to find someone or a group of people littering the thread with a bunch of crap about you?

that is a fair point, and im sure you won't get a warning for this thread. I had no intention of sparking a flamewar (but perhaps i should have known better for bringing you up - sorry; but you did ask for a dev on a ps3 project to state that it was hard to develop games):

QUOTE(nickthegreat @ Sep 24 2006, 01:36 PM)

I hear the foot steps of Kira......... enjoy  

you know you would have disputed m_hael's claims as a universal truth regardless of that comment........

QUOTE(nickthegreat @ Sep 24 2006, 05:36 PM)

oh I love a good arguement too, but I back down once in a while.  
lets just put it this way: we weren't devs, so we couldn't possibly have been right..........

and this comment was hardly a personal attack either, it just shows you have an unshiftable belief in what you think - not necessarily a bad point, but you have to admit this has probably caused people to be pissed off with you, as I stated.

But im sure the mods will understand how you reacted (and probably close this thread)

[Kira Yamoto]

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Yes we've been through this, and as I stated its all about analysing sources before you trust them. You obviously don't trust m_hael, and yet he is by far the best source on the subject so far.

Obviously? I never even said anything on the subject.

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apparently not you, your common sense, or your sources that YOU agree with:

I even said I was biased and gave a reason.  But you didn't catch the keyword, *enough* I'm unbiased *enough* that I would get them all just to play specific games on each.  I'm a little behind on this new generation, but I will eventually get them all like last generation (that took time too)

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you change your story SO much: all you banged on about in the said thread was our lack of sources from developers on PS3 projects - now theres one posting on this board and you revert to the generalisation that everyones biased? Let me give you examples of how much emphasis you put on devs on ps3 projects......

You twisted my words f***tard.  Just because he works at Neversoft doesn't mean that he's automatically unbiased.  I explained that even further and you used those specifc bolded words to say that I changed my story.  I never changed any story.

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he has access to one

and?  He's under NDA he can't say much.  He said that it's been giving him headaches, as well as his colleagues.  Do you see me disputing that? My comments about bias isn't an answer or response to anything he said, other then me generalizing the fact that everyone's biased somehow.  If he doesn't want a PS3 b/c he works w/ one everyday then that's his peroggative.  He just admitted (although not directly) that he's biased against the PS3, but that could be a variety of factors that only he can answer.  It does not automatically mean that I'm discrediting him, or anything like that.  Wake the **** up man its common sense.

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they do now. regardless, why would someone working with the ps3 not praise the hardware hes working on?

because maybe he's not happy with it ***wipe? I still never claimed that the PS3 was not difficult to work with.  I still have not offered an opinion on it, and I recognize that m_hael has stated its been difficult, and I accept his shared experience, and thats the 2nd time I even said that.

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and now we have (added to the 3 articles I posted previously inc. the carmack one.)

m_hael is not an official source.  The company didn't ask him to come down to Xbox-Scene and prove some random guy wrong, in which I wasn't wrong in the 1st place, because I never made a claim in either case.

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you don't remember me stating that no one was denying the ps3 will have great games?? Let me refresh your memory:

Had no franchises, no 1st party or 3rd party talk.  You only talked about it's ability to produce great games.

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yes you have:

Yeah, good luck taking me for a fool.  I can read just perfectly and you are trying to twist my words, in words that cannot be twisted for your own benefit in the 1st place.  NOWHERE in those quotes show that I ever uttered the words "The cell is not difficult to program for".  Now you're going to say, well you dont have to say it directly its what you mean.  Well that's not what I meant and that's not what I wrote.  You either read it wrong, or twisted it to your benefit.  ALL of that down there, was basically a request to see some credible sources, in which I was given none.  Which obviously does not mean that I said the Cell wasn't hard to dev for.  I never said anything close to it.  Are you having fun in wonderland?  Maybe you should come back and take 8th grade Reading.  You're not ready for the HS remedial yet.

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And this is my point: you bang on about wanting the info from a dev on a ps3 project and then once it is given to you you backtrack again. seriously I don't think you'd be happy even if kenny ken ken came out and said devs were finding it difficult.

What the hell are you talking about? I read his personal opinion and accept it.  It's not official, and what I've been wanting all along was an interview, or an article that could not be deemed propaganda, from a reliable reporter and a source thats posted to some sort of media outlet or a reputable website, such as the main website of the company.  That still has not been provided, and yes I don't think I'd be happy b/c Ken is not a developer.  Anything he says would be propaganda, or the truth, but since he's pushing the PS3 we wouldn't know and automatically assume propaganda.

[m_hael]

it should probably be noted that my comments here have been taken way out of context. What I said was.

1. I won't be getting one unless something truly fantastic comes out exclusively
2. 360 is easier to program for due to its symetrical design.

both are facts, irrefutable.

I actually like programming for ps3, its fun, its a challenge beyond normal programming.

Any and all extrapolations based on my comments or interpretations of them assume more latitude than I would allow.

Foe hammer - I think you deserve some punishment for your comments
Kira - you need to learn to rise above it, Forums are public... expect some flak.

[Kira Yamoto]

QUOTE(m_hael @ Sep 25 2006, 02:13 PM)

Kira - for some reason I'm reading you as if you have a REALLY high pitched voice, talk at twice the normal rate, hardly ever breath and at the end of each paragraph struggle with passing out before continuing...

Yeah thats right, goad me like foe-hammer did because that's all you can say.  Your post was unwarranted and that's something that you should have kept to yourself.  Your first post to me basically falls in line with what other people are doing, and for that I don't respect you and I don't think any respectable posters (that read and don't join the convo) should either.  Why do you think the OP said what he said, and even put a little subtitle under the topic?

[m_hael]

QUOTE(Kira Yamoto @ Sep 25 2006, 06:19 AM)

Yeah thats right, goad me like foe-hammer did because that's all you can say.  Your post was unwarranted and that's something that you should have kept to yourself.  Your first post to me basically falls in line with what other people are doing, and I see that as irreprehensible.  Go ahead, try and dispute against my post.

you took my innocent and entirely honest post and deem it a personal attack. It wasn't, its simply your writing style and the general pattern of posting that makes me think like that.

if I offended, apologies... it wasn't intended.

further - look back at that post... I edited it before you replied.

[incognegro]

lol

This dude is so funny...

The problem with ppl on forums is that alot of them do alot of talking but very few listens. Kira is one of those dudes that don't listen. The problem with him is that he dones't have the capacity to objectively judge ppl which causes him to not listen. If you present facts to him that goes AGAINST what he believes, he doesn't have it in him to accept being wrong (stubborn, pigheaded).

I cant speak for anyone but myself but all I'm saying is ain't nothing wrong with wanting a ps3 or a wii or a 360. I'm getting all three cause I'm a fan of gaming but I like to be informed about where my money is going. Even though sony is not on my good side right now, I still want to play Devil may cry and resistance. The problem is that if the system is difficult to program for and devs aren't happy then that will affect the quality of the games ill be playing. If games are on Blu ray only, then that affects the price I gotta pay for half-assed games. As a consumer this influences my decisions on when or if im gonna buy a system. So when I see ppl defending a system with no real grounds for argument then im gonna step in.

Everything I know about the systems have proved itself over and over again. So I'm very confident in my points. There are many times that I have to be "taught" on these forums about whats going on, so if someone proves me wrong I back down. The reason you (kira) are targeted is because even when you are wrong YOU DON'T BACK DOWN!

I just can't believe that after being educated by a man that already has alot of experience with all three consoles u still want to argue with him...

[cr4ck3rj4ck]

m_hael let me pick your brain if I may and ask you:

If you were going to develope your own game under your own company, which console would you choose for this game between the 360 and PS3? (if you could only choose 1)

[Kira Yamoto]

QUOTE(m_hael @ Sep 25 2006, 02:23 PM)

you took my innocent and entirely honest post and deem it a personal attack. It wasn't, its simply your writing style and the general pattern of posting that makes me think like that.

if I offended, apologies... it wasn't intended.

further - look back at that post... I edited it before you replied.

You have to take it from my point of view.  I WALKED INTO A THREAD I WANTED TO DISCUSS ONLY FOR PEOPLE TO HARP ON ME AND FLAMEBAIT THE SHIT OUT OF ME.  So when I look at your post, its NOT innocent.  I took that as a judgement on my character, reread what you wrote, and then tell me that, that wasnt a negative judgement on my character.  Its not innocent as much as you like to believe, if I were to show this to a bunch of people who had no clue what was going on, I'm sure they'd say the same thing.

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The problem with ppl on forums is that alot of them do alot of talking but very few listens. Kira is one of those dudes that don't listen. The problem with him is that he dones't have the capacity to objectively judge ppl which causes him to not listen. If you present facts to him that goes AGAINST what he believes, he doesn't have it in him to accept being wrong (stubborn, pigheaded).

I listen plenty.  I break people's posts down, point out what theyre saying, ask for clarification if needed and all that other junk.  Its not I thats not listening, its ****ers like you that want to speak in place of the real Kira, and claim Kira is this, Kira is that.

Just because you feel like shit for me debunking or ignoring your and a few other people's sources, does not mean I'm unwilling to listen or accept that I was wrong.  In fact, someone mentioned that Xbox games were all on DVD9, I wanted proof, someone gave it, and I wholeheartedly accepted it.  How is that being stubborn or pigheaded? It's as if I SHOULD be stubborn or pigheaded because you will believe and read it however you want anyways.

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Everything I know about the systems have proved itself over and over again. So I'm very confident in my points.

Ok, then watch.

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The problem is that if the system is difficult to program for and devs aren't happy then that will affect the quality of the games ill be playing.

Dev's dont need to be happy its their job.  I don't think that anyone really loves their job, and the few that do are really lucky.  That's real life.  Shitty games are commonplace, that doesnt mean its because they are unhappy with the hardware, its because they arent as experienced, or have faulty staff somewhere that gave bad direction, or even have strict guidelines from corporate of what they want seen in the game, with a strict deadline.

The quality of games you play, are directly chosen by you.  It's no one's fault but your own, if you decide to purchase a game whether it would be bad or not.

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If games are on Blu ray only, then that affects the price I gotta pay for half-assed games.

As history has proven, price has not stopped gamers from enjoying a game.  I've seen many people pay upwards of 100 bucks for street fighter II.  Blu-Ray and the price, isnt as much of a factor as you think it is.  You choose to allow your dislike for Bluray and for Sony, to get in the way of an experience that you want.  It's no one's fault but your own.  You blame these companies for this and that, yet, they aren't doing anything that's not needed to be done.

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So when I see ppl defending a system with no real grounds for argument then im gonna step in.

No real grounds for argument? How about this.  I like to play Gran Turismo, Tekken, Soul Calibur, Suikoden, Metal Gear Solid, Virtua Fighter, God of War, Devil May Cry and Final Fanatsy.  Franchises that have stuck to the Sony brand for years.  That's grounds enough, they are the games I enjoy.

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The reason you (kira) are targeted is because even when you are wrong YOU DON'T BACK DOWN!

How can I be wrong, on something that I don't have an official stance on?  I am merely disregarding your opinion, how does that make me "wrong"?  Ok, so I didn't take regular posts and sources that could've been compromised.  When did I ever have a stance on something, and when was that ever proven wrong.  All I ask for are links to prove what you're saying, its ok if I disregard it, I gave a pretty damn good reason to do so.

[Deftech]

oh my shit

when will the madness end  

[cr4ck3rj4ck]

This is really getting out of hand. I think we all know what Kira will buy, as well as what everyone else will buy. Isn't that really what this thread is about in the first place?

I think comments, flames,  and opinions not relative to this topic should be kept in PMs.

[m_hael]

QUOTE(cr4ck3rj4ck @ Sep 25 2006, 06:36 AM)

If you were going to develope your own game under your own company, which console would you choose for this game between the 360 and PS3? (if you could only choose 1)

if it were my money on the line I'd pick 360, if it were someone elses I'd pick ps3.

[cr4ck3rj4ck]

QUOTE

if it were my money on the line I'd pick 360

Thanks m_hael, I think that speaks volumes.

[nickthegreat]

QUOTE(Kira Yamoto @ Sep 25 2006, 01:30 PM)

f***tard.  
 ***wipe?

My posts were not aggressive towards you, in fact when i saw the backlash you got from others after i jokingly mentioned your name I apologised to you...... therefore you are a cock, pure and simple.
I don't think anyone has ever agreed with you and there is a reason for this, over and above any 'fanboyism' that you might like to claim.

QUOTE(Kira Yamoto @ Sep 25 2006, 02:19 PM)

Your post was unwarranted and that's something that you should have kept to yourself.  

the height of hypocrisy ^

QUOTE(Kira Yamoto @ Sep 25 2006, 01:30 PM)

NOWHERE in those quotes show that I ever uttered the words "The cell is not difficult to program for".  Now you're going to say, well you dont have to say it directly its what you mean.  Well that's not what I meant and that's not what I wrote.  You either read it wrong, or twisted it to your benefit.  

well done, i wrote that incorrectly - you stated that the ps3 is NOT more difficult THAN the 360. What else do you think that ENTIRE other thread was about? Why else do you think I quoted m_hael stating that the '360 is easier than the PS3.' Why else did you write hardER:

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The whole "harder-to-develop" thing is only a ploy by MS "AMERICAN" dev's that are totally biased against Sony.

and yet you still can't admit that you were wrong.

[grim_d]

people stop giving KY ammo, or infact do...maybe heel get banned quicker and these flame wars will stop

*awaits flame*

ach im just having a laugh