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Author Topic: Can Muslims Be Good Americans?  (Read 295 times)

Arvarden

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Can Muslims Be Good Americans?
« Reply #30 on: June 20, 2006, 05:14:00 AM »

One of my old flames was a kick boxer, we went out on the town and I got friendly with some old school girl friends.  After leaving the club pork chop decided to threaten me by stating that if I chat to women that she did not know she would break my nose.

Needless to say that night was the last time she saw me.

Man she was one hardcore chic.


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damam

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« Reply #31 on: June 20, 2006, 10:04:00 AM »

QUOTE(puckSR @ Jun 19 2006, 03:26 PM) View Post

Do you believe that women are "as a rule" physically inferior to men?

in relationships yes.  Women are attracted to men that are bigger and stronger than they are as a general rule.  About 1% of women will date someone that is smaller and weaker than they are physically.  That is a fact that scientist believe is related to evolution because it is seen world wide amongst all cultures.  So as a general rule in relationships that is certainly true.
(that fact was taken from M.R. Cunningham's research google for info)

I am also willing to make an exception for those rare 1%er's whome have a 240lb steriod enhanced cage fightin women married/dating a 110lb accountant.  Those situations do exist, but they are in the minority.  And of course in those cases the situation is reversed.

when taken outside the realm of relationships it can vary a bit.  especially given the trend of women working out, and taking more responsibility on defending themselves.  however, given equael training, men are going to pack on more muscle and see faster results than women ever will.  We simply dont have as much testosterone, its a simple fact of nature.  No number of equality laws is going to change that simple fact.  More testosterone means men can workout harder and longer as well as put on more muscle.  Its no different than comparing a normal guy at the gym and benchmarking his results to someone taking massive amounts of creatine and testosterone.  Not only that, but pound for pound, men are going to be stronger anyways due to the hormones we each have.  So even if you took a man and women that had the same muscle mass, the man is still going to be stronger.  This is not anti-feminism, this is the nature of whome we are.  We each have our strengths, and they are wonderfully different.

QUOTE(puckSR @ Jun 19 2006, 03:26 PM) View Post

Women are not strong enough to normally defend themselves?

in the realm of relationships given the facts listed above, I would say that women can defend themselves but lack the same number of options that men have:
I took kenpo and tae kwon do for about 8 to 10 years while growing up, and while I no longer take the classes I do practice daily.  You would think that i could beat just about anyone up who has not had the same level of training.  And there are certianly a range of men that I could easily beat up.  However, I know that should my husband (who has had little training and doesnt work out but is still considerably stronger than i am) ever fliped out on me, I will have one chance to knock him out or otherwise incapacitate him.  And after that he would wipe the ceiling, cabinets, desks and floor with my booty.  I essentially have only one option of defense against him and that is to use the full force that is at my disposal.

if, however, the situation is reversed, and I am the one that has flipped out, he would have multiple options to contain me.  Many of which would not harm me in any way.  It is his responsibility to escalate the level of force to the necessary amount and to not go beyond that.  So there is no need for him to ever physically harm me.

given that normally women marry/date men that are bigger than them, this statement is generally true for most relationships.  That men simply have more options in there use of force than women do.  So in a situation where a violent act may be required by a women, a man may not necessarily need to commit a violent act or as violent an act.

As Uncle Ben said to peter parker, "with great strength comes a greater responsibility."

side personal note:  my daughter is so cute, she is 17 months old and does her kicks and punches with me

QUOTE(puckSR @ Jun 19 2006, 03:26 PM) View Post

That physically women are comparable to a physically handicapped man?

of course not - but i dont think that was within the spirit of throwkings statement either.

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throwingks

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« Reply #32 on: June 20, 2006, 11:39:00 AM »

Puck, my bad for criticizing you, and not only your ideas. I was wrong for that. You are a smart guy and I enjoy your input.
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jha'dhur

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« Reply #33 on: June 20, 2006, 01:04:00 PM »

QUOTE(throwingks @ Jun 20 2006, 01:46 PM) View Post

Puck, my bad for criticizing you, and not only your ideas. I was wrong for that. You are a smart guy and I enjoy your input.


SIKE!!!!

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damam

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« Reply #34 on: June 21, 2006, 11:00:00 AM »

QUOTE(puckSR @ Jun 21 2006, 04:12 AM) View Post

If women are obviously physically inferior to men, then where does this concept of "Total Equality" come from?

total equality primarily comes in the form of opportunity.  women should get equael opportunity.  Opportunity has many forms as well.  One is the opportunity to persue life, liberty, and happiness (which was not always afforded to women in America).  Another form comes in employment based on the merrit of the applicants skill set in jobs where gender should not matter (ie. not a position in Thunder Down Under).  

QUOTE(puckSR @ Jun 21 2006, 04:12 AM) View Post

And men should continue to make more money...because they have more employement oppurtunities because they can always do manual labor(in a greater capacity than women).

that would be true if all labour was physically demanding or had the potential to be physically demanding,  but its not true.  Pay should be performanced based.  Plain and simple.  However, office positions such as managers, Network engineers, etc should not be a problem.  I have worked in enough offices to know that slackers come in both sexes.
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puckSR

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« Reply #35 on: June 21, 2006, 12:11:00 PM »

QUOTE
that would be true if all labour was physically demanding or had the potential to be physically demanding, but its not true. Pay should be performanced based. Plain and simple. However, office positions such as managers, Network engineers, etc should not be a problem. I have worked in enough offices to know that slackers come in both sexes.


Not exactly....the more "Desirable" I am to the free market, the more money I make.
Many professionals make money based on their total skill set, and not on their actual performance.
If accountants started making less money than construction workers, I imagine you would see people with accounting degrees building houses(provided they had skill in construction).  

Men, because of their previously stated physical superiorty to women, have a greater number of employement oppurtunities, and therefore a higher "skill set".  They are payed more because of their increased options, and not due to their actual performance.  It is perfectly fair that men make more money than women...?

QUOTE
total equality primarily comes in the form of opportunity. women should get equael opportunity. Opportunity has many forms as well. One is the opportunity to persue life, liberty, and happiness (which was not always afforded to women in America). Another form comes in employment based on the merrit of the applicants skill set in jobs where gender should not matter (ie. not a position in Thunder Down Under).

Ahh...equal oppurtunity....but what exactly does that mean?
If your simply saying that we shouldnt automatically prohibit someone from having a certain career field, then I completely agree.
However, how far do we take equal oppurtunity?
Should we give out more scholarships to women pursuing "engineering or math" degrees?
Despite a number of studies that have shown that men are superior in these fields?
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damam

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« Reply #36 on: June 21, 2006, 10:09:00 PM »

QUOTE(puckSR @ Jun 21 2006, 07:18 AM) View Post

Not exactly....the more "Desirable" I am to the free market, the more money I make.
Many professionals make money based on their total skill set, and not on their actual performance.
If accountants started making less money than construction workers, I imagine you would see people with accounting degrees building houses(provided they had skill in construction).  Men, because of their previously stated physical superiorty to women, have a greater number of employement oppurtunities, and therefore a higher "skill set".  They are payed more because of their increased options, and not due to their actual performance.  It is perfectly fair that men make more money than women...?

the market does not place a value on your total skill set.  Its more of a targeted skill set.  For example you could be the best arm pit shaver in the world, and that is a skill, and most of the world wont give a damn either.  Its up to you to figure out where you are most needed to maximize your profit.  Men might have more flexibility when it comes to moving towards grunt labour jobs, but that does not imply that they have equael flexibility in all areas.  Furthermore, you seem to be focusing on one aspect where men have an edge on women.  There are marketable aspects where women do have the edge on men.

QUOTE(puckSR @ Jun 21 2006, 07:18 AM) View Post

Ahh...equal oppurtunity....but what exactly does that mean?
If your simply saying that we shouldnt automatically prohibit someone from having a certain career field, then I completely agree.
However, how far do we take equal oppurtunity?

First i am in no way saying the special exceptions ought to be made for women.  affirmative action is wrong.  Only that we ought to be able to compete freely without being denied soley because of gender.  Nore should we have potential limited because of gender as well.

in a perfect world, i would submit my resume or scholarship app and it would have no gender notification of any kind.  and i would be hired/granted or denied soley based on the merit of my skill set and demonstrated potential as it pertains to the job/degree at hand.

QUOTE(puckSR @ Jun 21 2006, 07:18 AM) View Post

Should we give out more scholarships to women pursuing "engineering or math" degrees?
Despite a number of studies that have shown that men are superior in these fields?

first i question the number of studies part or what exactly they showed.  There have been a number of studies that demonstrate that the top 1% of any given classical field is dominated by men performance wise.  Then 60%-99% ( i may be a little off on numbers but the general principle is still correct - its been a while since i took human evolution) are dominated by women.  And the less than 60% are then dominated by men again. So on average in classical fields like math, art, literature, science etc the average women does do better than the average man, but will never dominate the top 1% of any field.  So if your taking crap shoot, your better off hiring a women or giving them the scholarship.  but of course i dont believe you should do that either, i believe you should hire the most talented peson that best fits the position.

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jha'dhur

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« Reply #37 on: June 27, 2006, 08:57:00 AM »

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1 ) Great American
2 ) Patriot
3 ) Christian

Pillar of the W.A.S.P. communities world wide.
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throwingks

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« Reply #38 on: June 27, 2006, 09:41:00 AM »

^^^
What are you talking about?
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