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[powercntrl]

[OrkanMan]

It's also important to note that as of late, democrats continue to carry New York and California.  These are the two most populated states in the country and most democratic.  It will probably be the only reason why democrats ever win future elections, which is a shame becuase CA and NY certainly do not reflect the way the rest of the country feels.

[feflicker]

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which is a shame becuase CA and NY certainly do not reflect the way the rest of the country feels

That is the main difference between us (Liberal vs Conservative)!

We feel that middle America needs to *progress* and catch up to us, not that we need to digress into the past and join them  

Whether you like it or not, the trend is that people are becoming more liberal and more progressive. We just have to wait for the next retired generation to die and the vast majority of Americans who vote will no longer be conservative... It can't be stopped, it is just a matter of time.

Remember, the exit poll information that supports your claim only takes into account PEOPLE WHO VOTED. If you poll all Americans, the majority *does* feel the way CA and NY feel... It is just a shame that these people didn't vote. That is the true letdown of this election, the majority once again was not heard because they were once again turned off by politics  

[OrkanMan]

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Whether you like it or not, the trend is that people are becoming more liberal and more progressive. We just have to wait for the next retired generation to die and the vast majority of Americans who vote will no longer be conservative... It can't be stopped, it is just a matter of time.

I agree.

[pepsik]

Not the most democratic states, if anything they are the most liberal. We have our fair share of conservatives here in california, but we also have alot of resources of information that are probably not available to the rest of the country. If your ever visiting Los Angeles or San Francisco or any other major city you should pick up a copy of the free weekly newspapers that are published here, alot of the national media doesn't report what is really going on to try and not offend anyone.  

We passed a controversial stem cell research law here, that will make our state the leader in medical research worldwide, all you pro-lifers need to STFU because I work at the top facility for research here in cali and I'm sure when you or a family member gets terminaly ill, you'll be on a plane looking for a cure and embracing the efforts we make to better our society instead of repressing the advancement of our progress. Unwanted children are usually adopted by gay and lesbian couples, causing further breakdown of the "values" america is trying so hard to try and achieve. Statistically divorce rates are higher than ever and so is teenage pregnancy, leaving many more single parents to try and raise children causing an even further breakdown of the "values", the statistics show that a child with divorced parents will eventually be divorced later in life. It's a downward spiral of social, economic and moral values. I don't think strengthening morality will solve the current trend in america, but atleast I look at the big picture.

[Heet]

Feflicker you have to be kidding.  Your making excuses for people that are too stupid and lazy to go out and vote?  And blaming the fact that they are "turned off to politics" to be a valid excuse?  Ya you would get that poll just like you said.  Most would complain about what they dont like and then not do anything about it.  I dont want their vote.  They have proven not to have the intelligence to vote so why do I want a lack of intelligence voting? Why do i want their opinions if THEY dont even think that they are worthy of voting?

[feflicker]

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And blaming the fact that they are "turned off to politics" to be a valid excuse?

I wasn't really making excuses... There is no excuse for all these people who complain about the way the country is run and they never vote, or get involved. It seems like every time I get into an argument with anyone about the direction of this country (especially in my age group) all I have to do is ask when the last time they voted was. Sadly, it is usually never.

The point I was making is that the so-called "majority" of people who are for Bush are only the majority of people who voted on Nov 2nd. Heck, they aren't event he majority of registered voters, yet alone the majority of America. I just wish the majority voice would be heard, that these slackers would get involved and vote!

I disagree with one thing you said though. I don't think you need to know everything about every issue, and I don't think you have to be actively involved in politics to be able to make a good decision in the voting booth. Furthermore, I don't think *wanting to vote* is a pre-requisite for an "intelligent" vote  

[pug_ster]

Bush made a promise to the Evangelical Christians to ban gay marriages, abortion, etc...  That is why he won.  Yet, for the past week, Bush is pushing more of his economic agenda's that the Christians care doesn't really care as much.  

Nixon got elected also twice because he got support from the Evangelicals because he basically campagained with them.   There's no way for those roe v wade will be overturned and a amendment banning gay marriage will happen.  Like Nixon, Bush is another president who took advantage of Christians.

[powercntrl]

Maybe Bush should draft the gays.  That way he'd take care of that pesky gay marriage thing and have plenty of people to send over to Iraq all in one fell swoop.  It's the patriotic thing to do.  After that, he'll have more time to spend on figuring out how to increase the price of crude oil.

[Wong Hung Lo]

QUOTE (powercntrl @ Nov 9 2004, 05:22 PM)

Maybe Bush should draft the gays.  That way he'd take care of that pesky gay marriage thing and have plenty of people to send over to Iraq all in one fell swoop.  It's the patriotic thing to do.  After that, he'll have more time to spend on figuring out how to increase the price of crude oil.

[gainpresence]

[Heet]

Your picture also represents the percentage of people who wanted to unseat Hitler in the beginnings of THAT war.  Sounds like there are more ignorant people in the world than not.  Ok, I agree with that.  Good point.

Furthermore, I don't think *wanting to vote* is a pre-requisite for an "intelligent" vote"  

Thats a good thought.  An even better thought is "staying home and not voting is intelligent".  Man am I the one that is screwed up here?  

Bloto-AI the U.S. is better off than any of the blue regions.  There is a reason for that.  The U.S. also sends funds to every one of those regions.  There is a reason for that too.  Thinking like the masses just for the sake of "belonging" to the masses stays in highschool.  When those countries start sending us money to help us out of problems then I will say that we should listen to them.  I guess we should have voted like the spineless spanish.

[feflicker]

I don't think the 300+ Million people who didn't vote are displaying a lack of intelligence. I can't find the connection between intelligence and voting, just like I couldn't find the connection between Iraq and 9/11  

If that makes me screwed up, then so be it  

[Heet]

[feflicker]

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Right, you are saying it is intelligent not to vote. Ok, I guess we disagree

That is not what I am saying! I am saying that there are intelligent people who do not vote, LOTS OF THEM. And because they did not vote, that does not make them un-intelligent! There is no direct relationship between people who vote and people who are intelligent!  

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I would actually argue that the majority of unintelligent/uneducated people dont vote

That is true as well. Of course it is, just by shear numbers. Only 60% of registered voters even voted. That is still only 15% of the US population.

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I guess we just outlined why the country is split

The country is split because the younger generations (and people who live in modern cities) are enthralled with science/technology/logic/reason/progress/, and the older generations are laying it all on the line for morals/values/tradition/.

In terms of how I want to be governed, I choose option "A" every time.  


Another big problem is that there are too many people who cannot seperate Church from State in their politics. I hear on the news EVERYNIGHT, some conservative hack say something like "God gives us the rule of law, without God their is no law", or "Everything I do in life, every decision I make, is with God in mind". When you say things like that I HEAR: I don't work for the government for the good of the people, I work for God to do his will. The scary part is that these people believe it is the SAME THING  

That is a BIG problem. I believe there is a Right and a Wrong, and that it can be legislated without bringing everyones God(s) into it. I don't believe there is a direct relationship between the Rule of Law and God.