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[ksteiner]

So if i want to do this i need to get a new dvd drive?

[kenop]

rofl the beige GDR-8163B already SOLD OUT on newegg...
FYI the black one still available for a few bucks more: $25.99 + $4.70 UPS 3day.

Item #: N82E16827136050

get to it, gents

[TwigFigure]

QUOTE(MacDennis @ Jan 31 2006, 11:08 PM)

Each game: yes. Each disc: partially
PS2 games use a system called DNAS. This site mentions some ID's: DNAS.

I assume ps2 games are pressed in (identical) batches. Or each manufacturing plant could be using an unique master of a particular game.

I don't see how you can say 'partially' considering if two games go online using the same key, one won't authenticate.

[dbldown768]

As this does come as good news and hope for the 360, I am also a bit reserved in wanting this information released.  Sure it would be nice for people to play backups on XBL, but i hate nothing more than playing with cheaters.  It this means i cant play online, i think i'd rather take the good with the bad.

[flat235]

You know, as impressive as this is technically, I'm inclined to agree with the guy a few posts up - this should never see the light of day.

It doesnt enable / facilitate homebrew code execution - the only possible uses for it are piracy and cheating on Live!. Now I'm not gonna sit here and lecture you on the evils of copying games - what you do in your own home is your business - but this research could cause big problem on Live! - and that's a bad thing imo.

Perhaps more importantly, is how MS would respond to any mainstream implementation of this. There wouldn't be too much they could do - aside from making each game's XBE hash the *whole DVD filesystem* to verify the integrity of the supporting files (ini, etc). What worries me though, is what MS is gonna do about it legally - this could give them sufficient ammunition to start taking sites like XS and XBH *down* simply for discussing it. Until now, modchips and softmods have been difficult legally, because they facilitate homebrew execution - and the "fair use" stuff makes that pretty much legal. This attack on the DVD drive *can only* facilitate piracy and cheating..

So yeah - I know it makes little or no difference - but if I were in TheSpecialists position I would be giving a lot of thought to the consequences of this stuff - and if I were a site admin on a site like XS I'd be giving serious thought to how much of it I want on my site.

A


You know, as impressive as this is technically, I'm inclined to agree with the guy a few posts up - this should never see the light of day.

It doesnt enable / facilitate homebrew code execution - the only possible uses for it are piracy and cheating on Live!. Now I'm not gonna sit here and lecture you on the evils of copying games - what you do in your own home is your business - but this research could cause big problem on Live! - and that's a bad thing imo.

Perhaps more importantly, is how MS would respond to any mainstream implementation of this. There wouldn't be too much they could do - aside from making each game's XBE hash the *whole DVD filesystem* to verify the integrity of the supporting files (ini, etc). What worries me though, is what MS is gonna do about it legally - this could give them sufficient ammunition to start taking sites like XS and XBH *down* simply for discussing it. Until now, modchips and softmods have been difficult legally, because they facilitate homebrew execution - and the "fair use" stuff makes that pretty much legal. This attack on the DVD drive *can only* facilitate piracy and cheating..

So yeah - I know it makes little or no difference - but if I were in TheSpecialists position I would be giving a lot of thought to the consequences of this stuff - and if I were a site admin on a site like XS I'd be giving serious thought to how much of it I want on my site.

A

[TSOPrano]

Maybe it has been said but do you not all remember what ConfigMagic looks like? When you load it up it tells you information about your DVD-ROM, do you not think MS some sort of similar check on Live that does a more thourough scan of the DVD firmware, and if they don't it will be implemented as soon as this hack goes public.

Interesting news though, too bad it didn't come out 3 years ago

Then again this whole looking into the firmware was spawned out of curiosity of the 360 drive.

Maybe it has been said but do you not all remember what ConfigMagic looks like? When you load it up it tells you information about your DVD-ROM, do you not think MS some sort of similar check on Live that does a more thourough scan of the DVD firmware, and if they don't it will be implemented as soon as this hack goes public.

Interesting news though, too bad it didn't come out 3 years ago

Then again this whole looking into the firmware was spawned out of curiosity of the 360 drive.

[crustyteacup]

i wouldn't exactly say this is a massive thing. MS control Live, its their playground, and their rules and they can change those rule anytime they want. i'm sure they could impliment checks for firmware if this becomes widespread. i'm going to have a little rant now....

this is more of a development for the 360, nobody needs a firmware hack for the xbox, everyone who wants it just hides behind the excuse of "i don't want to use my original in case it gets damaged"; well i have to ask why the hell did you buy an original game if your so worried it might get damaged? why do so many people talk about how they like using "backups" to play instead of originals in case it gets damaged. heres a thought, you bought it, so use it and stop making excuses for the fact that no doubt most people who claim to use backups have a pirated copy of the game. so long as you keep the game in its case while your not playing it, how is your game ever going to possibly get damaged? i also particularly like the phrase "i'm protecting my investment"; yeah sure you could quite easily "protect your investment" by looking after the stuff you bought without having to "backup" your "investment". if your game gets damaged you buy a new one, thats the nature of life.

people with young kids who don't want them to damage there "originals" should maybe just kick there kids outside to play on the swings instead of videogames, cause there obviously too young to play games if there going to damage them.

commence the firing squad......

[derived]

QUOTE(scsscs @ Jan 31 2006, 08:35 AM)

I bet this is the kind of 360 hack Team Xecuter was talking about would be released in the coming weeks/months. Back in the beginning of January they said that for the 360 "unsigned code is looking unlikely atm but booting of raw dumps maybe quite possible.." A similar hack for the 360 would explain this quote.

It was nothing to do with Team Xecuter you can follow the thread on Xboxhacker and learn exactly how it works, what led up to it and where it is ultimately going.

Just like Xbox 1, the modchip teams don't contribute towards initial hacks, they prefer to wait for others to hack it as opposed to taking any risk themselves.

[deltop]

Why all the panicking from people who should know better?

If this was released into the wild it would be relatively easy for ms to introduce a check to verify the integrity of the dvd firmware, just as they already check for a number of other possible problems. Sure you could make it more difficult for them but what's the point? A couple of updates and it would be rendered useless. So stop worrying about the implications for Live, there aren't any.

[derived]

Stop spreading your uninformed ideas that this somehow will ruin Xbox Live.

The only way hackers could use this hack to cheat is by modifying game files ie. textures and lighting. Everything else is stored in the XBE, which can't be changed. The only hacks that might be achievable by modifying game files are half-arsed wall hacks... difficult to make but trivial to prevent with an update.

edit: beaten, stupid laggy forums

[adamscybot]

Ok, so it doesnt allow you to boot homebrew.

BUT, my xbox is already modded with XBIT and 80gb HD.

You can then mod the firmware and play backups on live with modchip off and with modchip on play your homebrew - perfectly feasible.

Whether M$ pick up on it and check for DVD firmware is a different story. But I imagine editing the hacked firmware could close M$'s oppurtunity to check for this - or make it harder at least.

Cheating is an obvious issue. But you wont see it on Halo 2. You boot the modded map on disc - play live - gets put in cache - MS checks cache - banned.

I must agree though, it can't really be used for much more than piracy.

Adam

[mkjones]

Forgive me if I am being foolish, but if this allows backups to work on Live! Then surely they would have to be simple 1-1 backups of origional games, with no hacked additions that would allow cheating??

If anything sinister was added to the game wouldnt the Live! system find it and ban the user?

What I mean is, 1-1 copies should work, but not with a shit load of cheats modded into the file?

Anyone see what I mean  

[psychoace]

Would't live be able to check the firmware of the drive to see if it's a match to any of firmwares that are legit?

[jfoster]

The trick is - once on XBL, this will be detected.  I am certain that once an exploit is well known, MS will run diags to determine which machines have it, then disable those machines.

This is very similar to what "some people" went through when hacking DSS, exept they didn't have direct access to the machine, but MS does.

If the 360 does ever get hacked, its going to be just like the SAT days.  You will have to check the web each day before you turn on your box to see if MS is blacklisting the particular hack/code you are running.

[BlueCop]

jfoster: I don't think it will be much like that because if anyone is detected using it. They will ban them all. So that would solve the problem of a cat and mouse game pretty quickly. If you're perm baned then you won't be updating your drive to the new code.

DirecTV/Dish Network/Bell vu sat services all are sending all their information all the time. there is no back and forth. It is a much more vulnerable model then we are dealing with. All you have to do with them is break their key distorbution model and you have unencrypted tv.