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[Rylinkus]

QUOTE (Lorre @ Jul 22 2004, 08:58 PM)

Not really, but if the Honda-people can get 240HP out of a 2litre block, imagine what they could do with a big 5litre V8 or anything like that...

I agree to some degree, but....
1 They haven't ventured into V8s for normal production vehichles.
And
2. (Same as before), Will a 5 liter V8 making 450hp be impressive if Chevy manages on with higher HP numbers, more cylinders, bigger displacement, and yet still gets the same gas numbers? I know you can argue Chevy hasn't made a 10 liter V12, but they could I suppose. Just as Honda COULD make a V8.

Trust me, as an engineer I'm amazed at how well Honda utilizes the small displacement they have. I think over 100hp per liter is awesome. But at the same time they need to get their gas consumption down. Because even if it utilizes more technology I have a hard time saying it's more advanced then Chevy's archaic pushrods when it can't trump Chevy's numbers. To me advanced means better, and I'm not sure it is.

[Rylinkus]

QUOTE (PeteHam @ Jul 23 2004, 01:32 AM)

Nice to see Ford does the same thing globally...   Not necessarily with the 'big' aspect, but 3 models which are basically the same. But that's what makes it fun when parts-hunting, right?  "Yeah, those spindles will work on models 1 and 3, but not model 2."

But there are SOO many crossplatform cars now that utlize similar parts and frames. My Ford Probe and a Mazda MX6 and 626 are mechincally identical minus suspension and gear ratios. (Though you can interchange them no problem.) The MX3 shares a lot of common parts with all 3.

Any car company needs to offer a variety of choices to hit every possible part of the market. I wouldn't ever have bought a 626, but I'm sure a lot of moms wouldn't own Probes. So once you determine that you need a variety of wagons, coupes, SUVs, and sedans, make it as simple as possible. Reuse parts to help in production and design costs. It benefits the company and the consumer since if your car shares parts with others, junkyard parts are more plentiful and the aftermarket will be bigger to support more cars so new parts will be cheaper.

[jesterrace777]

[Lorre]

QUOTE (Rylinkus @ Jul 23 2004, 05:52 AM)

I agree to some degree, but.... 1 They haven't ventured into V8s for normal production vehichles. And 2. (Same as before), Will a 5 liter V8 making 450hp be impressive if Chevy manages on with higher HP numbers, more cylinders, bigger displacement, and yet still gets the same gas numbers? I know you can argue Chevy hasn't made a 10 liter V12, but they could I suppose. Just as Honda COULD make a V8.

...and at that point you reach the maximum size an enginecan be if you want to fit it under a hood  

So,  let them make 10 litre engines, any bigger is pretty impossible, at that point they'll HAVE to fin other ways to make engines more powerfull.

Btw I found the ultimate example of how advanced European engines can be: Diesels!

BMW makes a 2.0 litre diesel engine that produces 150HP

They also just released there new 3.0litre straight 6 with biturbo : 272HP and 560NM

..and those things need verrrry few diesel to run...trust me (I don't know how to convert l/100km to miles per gallon, otherwise I'd give you the numbers)

[Rylinkus]

I don't know if diesel engines are an advnacement. There are plenty of 4 bangers that can pull off 150 hp numbers. But it certainly has it's place.

[moistness]

QUOTE (Asmodeus @ Jul 21 2004, 04:01 AM)

The first part of the answer you are looking for is simple: BECAUSE WE CAN! A little more seriously, because we do not have to pay the exorbitant prices that europeans do. Gas is nearly half the cost here. If you could get gas for half the price you might even consider buying a car with more than 90 HP. Kind of sad that Germany has the autobahn and no one can afford the gas for a car worthy of driving on it. Insurance for a V8 in Germany was very expensive while I was stationed there. My friend had a 6 cylinder Mustang....and it could eat almost every German car we saw on the road for lunch (and Euro cars didn't have emissions....screw the environment...LOL!). The worst part is gas is so expensive in Europe that they do not bother to put decent bumpers on the cars (weighs to much....and weight means less gas mileage) so they have 300 car pileups because everyone is driving a lunchbox (and cannot stop or move out of the way). I always thought it was very odd that (in Germany) they did not allow a vehicle with ANY rust on it drive on the road (it failed inspection) but allowed cars to be sold without any REAL safety rating. While I was stationed in Germany (Mannheim) I was unlucky enough to drive in a snowstorm (basically about 30-50 snowflakes). While we were driving home we saw cars off the road and upside down everywhere. The odd part (and I am NOT making this up) is that Germany did not require safety glass....so people (and parts of people) were scattered everywhere, with glass EVERYWHERE. Body parts were being swept off the road (Literally!) and blood was being soaked up with some kind of grit that they were pouring on it. It was a very sobering moment for all of us in the car. We drove through a lot of blood that day. I found out later that the reason that so much glass was everywhere is because they used PLATE GLASS....like a window on a house. If you hit it....it shatters. Makes a HUGE difference in an accident. A friend of mine got drunk while we were out at a bar.....he got mad at a German dude, the German dude ran and jumped in a taxi. My friend decided to hit the window with his fist. I was just leaving the bar when I saw his hand shatter the glass all over the German. It was funny.....but it left the Taxi driver and German VERY angry and bloody! My point.....when Europe has it's head out of it's arse about taxation (funny this is why America is here after all!) of gas.....let me know. Seems extremely odd that gas is twice as expensive there when the shipping distance is so much less. I am sure your governments are doing productive things with all the money that all of you drivers are throwing away! Also....in Europe, the roads are so narrow that they invented breakaway mirrors (the ones that can "bend" forward so that people can squeeze there cars down those little alleys. If an SUV was brought over there it would be riding on both sides of the street. So there is a little more reason for having them here.....we have room for them! Ironically, I hate SUVs.....but I hate pink, purple, and green cars too! The reason they make so many different types of vehicles is because so many different types of people drive them. Drive what you like, laugh at what you do not like.....but don't harp about it on a thread in some silly attempt to make Americans look like idiots! We can do that on our own! And we are pretty damn good at doing it! Thank you very much! Stupid picture.....you should have shown pictures of all the hairy armpitted wenches on your nude beaches! First time I went to the beach there I almost lost my lunch. Funny.....I also remember seeing a handfull of large women in Europe (Even saw large women with hairy armpits and legs!).....not much better in my humble opinion! Any country that sells room temperature beer and makes you pay for water (because the water has human feces in it from farmers....YES I SAID HUMAN FECES) needs to think twice about tossing stones at anyone else. Lastly, and I will FINALLY stop, European water (poop and all) has no flouride in it.....so that skinny tart wearing a thong turns and smiles at you all three of her green teeth invite you to stay and chat for a while. Seriously though.....turn your anger to something you need to have fixed in your own country!

When did you go to europe? 1926? Name me one car from germany that uses PLATE GLASS? Are you telling me that laminate glass is used for sidewindows in america and not toughned glass? What have bumpers got to do with how many cars are in a pileup?

[Lorre]

QUOTE (Rylinkus @ Jul 24 2004, 06:25 AM)

I don't know if diesel engines are an advnacement. There are plenty of 4 bangers that can pull off 150 hp numbers. But it certainly has it's place.

Nono, I didn't mean it like that.

I just mean that European car builders have been developping diesel engines so long and so far, they can now build diesel engines with the same (sometimes higher) number of horsepowers as a petrol engine, but with 40% lower fuel consumption.

[jesterrace777]

[Hercules Q Einstein]

QUOTE (Lorre @ Jul 23 2004, 12:07 PM)

...and at that point you reach the maximum size an enginecan be if you want to fit it under a hood   So,  let them make 10 litre engines, any bigger is pretty impossible, at that point they'll HAVE to fin other ways to make engines more powerfull. Btw I found the ultimate example of how advanced European engines can be: Diesels! BMW makes a 2.0 litre diesel engine that produces 150HP They also just released there new 3.0litre straight 6 with biturbo : 272HP and 560NM ..and those things need verrrry few diesel to run...trust me (I don't know how to convert l/100km to miles per gallon, otherwise I'd give you the numbers)

Caddillac has a V-16 (Caddillac Sixteen), i dont know what kind of litters it has but my guess it it must be huge. And makes me think cars still have plenty of growing room.

[UndercoverPunker]

too bad the whole car wasn't made as well

[Rylinkus]

The Veyron is fast as hell, but come on, a reliable VW ..... lol.

Seriously, it's nice. Just VERY pricey and perhaps not reliable. But how reliable are any supercars really?

[UndercoverPunker]

I said that cause it was supposed to be released in 2003, but here we are mid 04' and it's still not out (I believe) due to suspension issues...