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[burns863]

Hey everyone (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)  This is my first post on Xbox Scene, go easy on me  (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) haha!

OK.  So my 360 is showing secondary error code 0102.  I have replaced both Xclamps with M5 bolts and washers.  Unfortunately my unit is still red lighting!  So my next port of call is Wilhelm's heat gun method, this is where I need advice!  Just on that note... thanks to Wilhelm for his massive input to all posts on this topic (or so I have noticed) and for the tutorial itself..... legendary!

An extra note on my console is that when I plug it in I get no video output at all.  Is this normal with 3RLOD?  Or should I see anything at all on the screen?

As I've noticed in the thread, most people are unsure where to get the 'plastic foil' used.  I bet I could find it if I went out and looked but I am wondering if there are any more 'household' items that could be used as a layer between the motherboard and aluminum foil?  All opinions are welcome (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

What about clothing?  I'm thinking old t-shirts or even socks?  But then I wonder if this is a fire hazard?

If I was to find the plastic foil, how easy is it to get off the board after its melted (after heating)?

My other question is regarding the tape to hold all of this down.  Is there much chance of damage when removing it after the heating is done?  

Sorry for all the questions!  I've gathered so much information from this forum through countless searches but these are just a few questions I have before I go ahead with the fix!

Oh, one more question regarding the original thermal paste applied at manufacture.  Obviously I have cleared off the cores to a mirror finish with Isopropyl wipes but the surrounding area still has quite a bit of excess gunk which has been there since I originally removed the heat sinks.  I don't feel this is causing any issues even though it covers a few of the circuits completely as I guess it has pretty much zero electrical conductivity.  Again however, I thought I would gather opinions (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Thanks!

Daniel

[humboldt111502]

Yes it is normal for there to be no video with the 3rod.  If you had an e74 or something similar, there would be an error on the screen.


the foil used is just some thing bubble wrap-like stuff used in packaging.  I have used drop cloth plastic material used for covering things when painting.  I just used multiple layers.  Also oven bags used to cook turkeys should work. someone has also insulated he caps with blue putty used to hold up posters.  always cover the plastic with mulitple layers of aluminum foil too.  

you should be okay pulling the tape off when done, just be really carefull so u dont bump or break any small parts.  might be a lil residue which is ok, or can be cleaned with alcohol

as far as the excess gunk around the chips...i always clean it all off, but suppose it would be okay left alone if u are scared of damaging something.

[bobasp1]

QUOTE(burns863 @ Nov 23 2008, 10:27 AM)

As I've noticed in the thread, most people are unsure where to get the 'plastic foil' used.  I bet I could find it if I went out and looked but I am wondering if there are any more 'household' items that could be used as a layer between the motherboard and aluminum foil?  All opinions are welcome (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I did this method twice and just used bubble wrap instead of the plastic foil *not the big kind the small ones for shippn small electronics. Double layer it if ur gona get close to the tape.

 So its 1-2 layers bubble wrap and aluminum foil.  Ohh and the fed ex envelopes with  bubbles in it works quite well.

Had no problems

This post has been edited by bobasp1: Nov 24 2008, 03:22 AM

[burns863]

QUOTE(humboldt111502 @ Nov 23 2008, 09:01 PM)

Yes it is normal for there to be no video with the 3rod.  If you had an e74 or something similar, there would be an error on the screen.
the foil used is just some thing bubble wrap-like stuff used in packaging.  I have used drop cloth plastic material used for covering things when painting.  I just used multiple layers.  Also oven bags used to cook turkeys should work. someone has also insulated he caps with blue putty used to hold up posters.  always cover the plastic with mulitple layers of aluminum foil too.  

you should be okay pulling the tape off when done, just be really carefull so u dont bump or break any small parts.  might be a lil residue which is ok, or can be cleaned with alcohol

as far as the excess gunk around the chips...i always clean it all off, but suppose it would be okay left alone if u are scared of damaging something.

Its weird you should mention another error as the first time my Xbox broke it had E79.  I know my hard drive is fine as I have tested it on other consoles.  Few days later I decided to give it the old "Lets turn it on and see if its fixed itself" sort of wishful thinking   So I went ahead and my unit then had 3 Red Lights.  Anyways.....

So it sounds like its ok to use some isopropyl to clean the whole chip free of excess thermal paste?  Only thing I am worried about is pressure as the original stuff is quite literally baked on (unlike Arctic Silver 5 which doesn't as easily solidify   )

QUOTE(bobasp1 @ Nov 24 2008, 02:19 AM)

I did this method twice and just used bubble wrap instead of the plastic foil *not the big kind the small ones for shippn small electronics. Double layer it if ur gona get close to the tape.

 So its 1-2 layers bubble wrap and aluminum foil.  Ohh and the fed ex envelopes with  bubbles in it works quite well.

Had no problems

Hmm... Thanks for that, I think I have some bubble wrap  Hopefully I will have enough time to prepare the board and heat gun it this morning before I leave for work!  Wish me luck  

Any more advice would be very much appreciated guys     Thanks!

[burns863]

OK, so I spent about 1 hour 15 minutes wrapping the board.  Thick plastic packaging (2 layers) followed by 2 layers of foil.  The heat gun I was using had 2 settings of 350 and 580 degrees C. I couldn't use the higher setting as it instantly started shrinking the tape holding down the wrapping and I was a little unsure whether this would cause more damage, so I stuck to the 350 Deg C setting.  Whether or not this was a good idea, only time will tell!

Toward the end of the heating the board was starting to smoke so I cut it short by about 50 seconds.  Again, bad move?  I'll have to wait and see!

Currently awaiting cooling!

So... if this hasn't worked, is there anything else at all I could proceed with?  Or is it time to take it that its dead?  How akward is it to get things working again if I was to purchase a replacement mother board?  I guess I would need to flash the drive?  Little unsure!

Thanks

Daniel

[burns863]

OK, so now I stil get 3RLOD but with a different secondary error code.  I am now at 0020 (listed as unknown in the error code sticky).  Any ideas anyone?

Shall I take it the machine is completely dead?  Or is it a good thing that I have cleared the original 0102?

[Wilhelm_I]

QUOTE(burns863 @ Nov 24 2008, 03:31 PM)

OK, so now I stil get 3RLOD but with a different secondary error code.  I am now at 0020 (listed as unknown in the error code sticky).  Any ideas anyone?

Shall I take it the machine is completely dead?  Or is it a good thing that I have cleared the original 0102?

0102 overrides 0020 so it might be a good thing however if the solder balls short out this will also result in 0020 so it might also be a really bad sign.
Did you move the mainboard when it started smoking?
I am just asking because you cannot touch it in the whole process if you do so though this can fuck the solder balls up when they have melted...
Look under the chips and check if you can see any visible damage, like solder balls that have turned into a big blob or a lifted up chip...

[burns863]

QUOTE(Wilhelm_I @ Nov 24 2008, 08:07 PM)

0102 overrides 0020 so it might be a good thing however if the solder balls short out this will also result in 0020 so it might also be a really bad sign.
Did you move the mainboard when it started smoking?
I am just asking because you cannot touch it in the whole process if you do so though this can fuck the solder balls up when they have melted...
Look under the chips and check if you can see any visible damage, like solder balls that have turned into a big blob or a lifted up chip...

The board was left still as a bone.  Only thing I did do was I took the foil/platic wrapping off about 5/10 minutes after I had stopped heating.  Reason for this is I thought it would aid cooling but then I checked your tutorial and you did say to leave everything on until it had completely cooled!  Bad move?

If one of them has shorted, will this have blown the chip or do you think there us chance of repair?  That is of course as long as I can see any visual bridge!

Thanks for your help!

Yet more questions... any advice on the whole "buying a new mobo" scenario?

[Lugnut]

if you heat gunned the board and it now shows an 0020 error, then most likely its trashed,  did you happen to hear a pop noise, or like a single crackle noise while heating the gpu? If you did then the board goes to the bin. Im not sure exactly what that popping noise or crackling noise is. But whenever i heatgun a board and hear it i know its tossed.  As far as i can assume is the chip gets overheated. Last time it happened to me i pryed the chip off the board, of course it caused severe damage to everything but i wanted to see what state all the solder balls were in.  Found a bridged connection. However what was left of the bottom of the gpu showed no signs of "bulging" from over heating. So now im wondering if the solder itself gets too hot if it can actually cause some kind of disturbance where it pops.

[burns863]

OK, so after being off sick for nearly a week I am finally feeling a little better.  I decided to pick up my 360 and start fiddling again!  Since I last posted with the 0020 error code I have done nothing.

So... I noticed that without being screwed in place the board does not fit perfectly sturdy in the casing.  So I decided to screw everything down, with the case partially reassembled.  I still have 3RL, but I am back at secondary error code 0102.  Hmm...

I never heat gunned the bottom of the board, and now I'm tempted.  Only problem I have is that I have ran out of isopropyl to clean the chips and reapply AS5.

Bit of a sticking point...  

Any other ideas anyone?  

[brandogg]

You know after "really" heatgunning my old system last night (and by heatunning I mean destroying the GPU and throwing away the system because I've been fucking with it for 2 years now), I've pretty much determined that even a heat gun won't reflow the solder under the GPU, and if it does actually get hot enough, it will warp the ever-loving shit out of the board and pretty much destroy the GPU, even if you're moving in circles. The hot air from a GAB rework station comes in from the sides under the chip as well as directly on top, and provides much more even heating. Blasting hot air on the top pretty much makes the GPU act as a shield against the solder below. It will certainly warp the board, and there's a very good chance it will bridge the broken or cold solder joints, but I don't think it will ever actually fix them the way that they're supposed to be fixed.

[Dolbuck]

I bought a cheap Zephyr board a couple of months ago, 0102 error, and last weekend I gave it its third heatgun treatment, yesterday played GOW2 for 20 min. and freezed, then RRoD. Besides this, I have done everything else, x clamp replacement, AS5, fan shorud mod, small heatsinks for upper RAM, southbridge and HANA, and finally a 70 mm front fan. Didn´t do 12 volt mod, but I guess it won´t do much of a difference since with the front fan, air coming from the back was warm, not hot............I´ve almost given up on this.

As for the heatgunning process, well, first time I followed the tut, but cam short on timmings since the foil was melting badly on high, and only did the top. However, the console lasted the longest time, like 10+ hours or so. Second time, was top and bottom but only GPU, 1 min low(250c), and like 2 min high(500c), lasted 3 hours of play. Third time I followed everything to the letter, but only did the GPU again. After heatgunning it always starts right up, but I´m wondering there could also be a cold solder joint under the CPU or RAM (0102 error), its unlikely since doing the GPU only has revived the box everytime so far, but I´m gonna try reflowing the whole thing next time.
Read about the oven method, but it´s scarier than the heatgun, will try if everything else falis though.......
Cheers.

[killamayne]

QUOTE(Lugnut @ Nov 24 2008, 03:20 PM)

if you heat gunned the board and it now shows an 0020 error, then most likely its trashed,  did you happen to hear a pop noise, or like a single crackle noise while heating the gpu? If you did then the board goes to the bin. Im not sure exactly what that popping noise or crackling noise is. But whenever i heatgun a board and hear it i know its tossed.  As far as i can assume is the chip gets overheated. Last time it happened to me i pryed the chip off the board, of course it caused severe damage to everything but i wanted to see what state all the solder balls were in.  Found a bridged connection. However what was left of the bottom of the gpu showed no signs of "bulging" from over heating. So now im wondering if the solder itself gets too hot if it can actually cause some kind of disturbance where it pops.

i have put boards in the oven, yes oven for 5-10 mins at 375. they have worked and I aint throwing away customer's 360s away. LOL

[bakelo]

QUOTE(Dolbuck @ Dec 12 2008, 04:21 PM)

I bought a cheap Zephyr board a couple of months ago, 0102 error, and last weekend I gave it its third heatgun treatment, yesterday played GOW2 for 20 min. and freezed, then RRoD. Besides this, I have done everything else, x clamp replacement, AS5, fan shorud mod, small heatsinks for upper RAM, southbridge and HANA, and finally a 70 mm front fan. Didn´t do 12 volt mod, but I guess it won´t do much of a difference since with the front fan, air coming from the back was warm, not hot............I´ve almost given up on this.

As for the heatgunning process, well, first time I followed the tut, but cam short on timmings since the foil was melting badly on high, and only did the top. However, the console lasted the longest time, like 10+ hours or so. Second time, was top and bottom but only GPU, 1 min low(250c), and like 2 min high(500c), lasted 3 hours of play. Third time I followed everything to the letter, but only did the GPU again. After heatgunning it always starts right up, but I´m wondering there could also be a cold solder joint under the CPU or RAM (0102 error), its unlikely since doing the GPU only has revived the box everytime so far, but I´m gonna try reflowing the whole thing next time.
Read about the oven method, but it´s scarier than the heatgun, will try if everything else falis though.......
Cheers.

yo Dolbuck.. guess we're on the same board...
i also heatgun my 0102 xbox and it least only for 4 dayz...
i turn on the console without heatsink and i directly got the overheat warning, i restart and it starts to run normal again.. been playin winning eleven 2009 for 2 hours now.. only to wait for the next FREZE....
im so desperated....!!

[Vauxfan]

QUOTE(killamayne @ Dec 13 2008, 12:45 PM)

i have put boards in the oven, yes oven for 5-10 mins at 375. they have worked and I aint throwing away

customer's 360s away. LOL

 

I have just done this yesterday, worked like a charm for error 0020.