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[ghettoc401]

QUOTE(jimwross @ Apr 14 2008, 04:01 AM)

Use the same process outlined above.

Thanks bro  

[rickr7772]

Great info jimwross. I am glad you decided to share this with us. Nice picutres and tut.

[Wilhelm_I]

QUOTE(xolejh @ Apr 15 2008, 02:15 AM)

Hello everybody.  A few days ago I was playing and everything looked...not fuzzy, but choppy...not sure how to describe it.  A day after that I got the E74 error, and my next few tries turning it on kept turning up the E74 error.  Then, something else happened, it would start up like normal, but with a blank screen.  After about 30 seconds, the fan would get louder, and louder, and louder, until the xbox over heated and the fan shut off(which doesn't make sense really...that should be when the fan gets louder) and then the only thing to do was turn it off and google the problem.  Would this possibly fix that? or should I get a new AV cable or something?  SHould I try the RROD fix?(already done it once before a few months ago actually)

The chips dont have good contact with the chip dies, this can be cause by too many/few washers and too much/not enough thermal compound(size of a rice grain is perfect)
as the fans get louder it will for sure be the cpu heatsink as the cpu regulated the fanspeed.
If this doesnt fix the overheating issue you will have to do the same procedure for the GPU heatsink.
The E74 is a pretty weird error it might happen that you keep turning your 360 on and off and after like ten tries it boots up but the screen is covered by artifacts and the colors change until the screen is nearly black...
It can be caused by a faulty av-cable according to the faq but if you can see the E74 error message on the screen your av-cable will be fine.
So it will either be a pin of the scaler chip that has lost contact or a broken trace between the gpu and the ana-chip.
Just follow this tutorial it will fix it but make sure that you remove the gpu heatsink and the termal compound before doing that and that you isolate the capacitors in the area as they will blow at this high temperature.

[Boobers]

I still can't seem to get this right..

Basically I am looking at two choices now...

Take a totally fracked up MB and use the Heat Gun on it until it melts or catches fire or whatever.  This will show me exactly how much heat the MB can take.  I know that paper burns at 451f (thanx to Ray Bradbury.. )

Another, less destructive option, is to pick up a Infrared Thermometer and get the chips/MB up to the required temp..  If I go this option, what would the desired temp be??  I also see reasonably priced Infrared Thermometers that measure up to 1000f.  Would that be sufficient??

Thanx

B

[jimwross]

QUOTE(xolejh @ Apr 14 2008, 07:15 PM)

Hello everybody.  A few days ago I was playing and everything looked...not fuzzy, but choppy...not sure how to describe it.  A day after that I got the E74 error, and my next few tries turning it on kept turning up the E74 error.  Then, something else happened, it would start up like normal, but with a blank screen.  After about 30 seconds, the fan would get louder, and louder, and louder, until the xbox over heated and the fan shut off(which doesn't make sense really...that should be when the fan gets louder) and then the only thing to do was turn it off and google the problem.  Would this possibly fix that? or should I get a new AV cable or something?  SHould I try the RROD fix?(already done it once before a few months ago actually)

If you have replaced the X-Clamps try loosening the screws.  The way I always trouble shoot this problem is the following:

1) Take the motherboard out of the metal case
2) Hook up the DVD drive and the RF / Power button board
3) Turn it on

If it doesnt give you the 2 Red Lights / Fans speeding up and turning off, then you know has something to do with loosening / tightening / mis-allignment of your x-clamp fix.

SO when you re-assemble the box, try putting the board back in to the metal case and leaving out the two middle LONG screws that attach the top plastic piece.  For whatever reason this seems to help if you get a stubborn 360 that keeps doing the 2 red light thing.

Hope this helps.

QUOTE(Boobers @ Apr 15 2008, 08:45 AM)

I still can't seem to get this right..

Basically I am looking at two choices now...

Take a totally fracked up MB and use the Heat Gun on it until it melts or catches fire or whatever.  This will show me exactly how much heat the MB can take.  I know that paper burns at 451f (thanx to Ray Bradbury.. )

Another, less destructive option, is to pick up a Infrared Thermometer and get the chips/MB up to the required temp..  If I go this option, what would the desired temp be??  I also see reasonably priced Infrared Thermometers that measure up to 1000f.  Would that be sufficient??

Thanx

B

Hey.

You will start to notice slight colorization on the solder points (goldish color), thats how I tell when its good to go.  The board can take quite a bit as long as you don't get it close to the stuff that can melt / be destoryed (capacitors and plastic pieces), you really don't have to be over-cautious with it.

QUOTE(Wilhelm_I @ Apr 15 2008, 01:26 AM)

The chips dont have good contact with the chip dies, this can be cause by too many/few washers and too much/not enough thermal compound(size of a rice grain is perfect)
as the fans get louder it will for sure be the cpu heatsink as the cpu regulated the fanspeed.
If this doesnt fix the overheating issue you will have to do the same procedure for the GPU heatsink.
The E74 is a pretty weird error it might happen that you keep turning your 360 on and off and after like ten tries it boots up but the screen is covered by artifacts and the colors change until the screen is nearly black...
It can be caused by a faulty av-cable according to the faq but if you can see the E74 error message on the screen your av-cable will be fine.
So it will either be a pin of the scaler chip that has lost contact or a broken trace between the gpu and the ana-chip.
Just follow this tutorial it will fix it but make sure that you remove the gpu heatsink and the termal compound before doing that and that you isolate the capacitors in the area as they will blow at this high temperature.

Agreed.  I wish i could edit my original post and change the heatsink thing around.

Oh well

[Wilhelm_I]

QUOTE(Boobers @ Apr 15 2008, 03:45 PM)

I still can't seem to get this right..

Basically I am looking at two choices now...

Take a totally fracked up MB and use the Heat Gun on it until it melts or catches fire or whatever.  This will show me exactly how much heat the MB can take.  I know that paper burns at 451f (thanx to Ray Bradbury.. )

Another, less destructive option, is to pick up a Infrared Thermometer and get the chips/MB up to the required temp..  If I go this option, what would the desired temp be??  I also see reasonably priced Infrared Thermometers that measure up to 1000f.  Would that be sufficient??

Thanx

B

The desired temp is a little bit higher than the melting point of the leadfree solder that they used which is 217-218°C(422.6-424.4°F)
Some more info can be found here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solder

[Boobers]

Thanx to both of ya..


B

[fragabyte]

I have had the E74 error for a few weeks now. I didn't know there were user fixes for it before now.

I started to notice problems while playing a game rental, fairly scratch tbh and was getting Unplayable Disc errors, I would have to open and close the tray a coupel of times, on each gaming session for it to boot. The following day when I was playing I had weird squares and couloured stuff pop in on my screen, it locked up I reset it and have had the E74 message displayed ever since.

It is highly unlikely to be the AV cable, I have both a VGA and Component cable and have tried them both with the same result.

I've been recommended to checkout the X-Clamp and airgun fix (will a larger hairdryer do the trick btw?), but just wanted to outline the issues before the problem appeared, just in case there is something else worth considering...

I mentioned this problem on a nother, though not so technical forum and was recommended to replace the DVD drive as it was believed to be casuing the E74 message. Someone else promptly jumped in and claimed that was not possible and recommended me to here.

If I can get it back up and running before the release of Grand Theft Auto IV, I'll be well chuffed. I have no experience with this sort of thing though.

[wllazer17]

QUOTE(fragabyte @ Apr 15 2008, 08:29 PM)

I had weird squares and couloured stuff pop in on my screen, it locked up I reset it and have had the E74 message displayed ever since.

I had those weird squares and lines then e74 after reset... and heating the ana chip with a hairdryer only fixed my xbox for 1 day.  Hairdryers have a safety cut off switch at 140F (60C).  This only expands the solder to allow play for a day or so until it cools back where it was.  You need to reflow the solder using this guide (remove the gpu heatsink) using a heat gun.  As has been stated before, the lead free solder melts at 423F (217C).  I only had to heat gun the bottom side.  Please follow the first post by jimwross but remove the gpu heatsink before heat gun.

[fragabyte]

QUOTE(wllazer17 @ Apr 16 2008, 04:04 AM)

I had those weird squares and lines then e74 after reset... and heating the ana chip with a hairdryer only fixed my xbox for 1 day.  Hairdryers have a safety cut off switch at 140F (60C).  This only expands the solder to allow play for a day or so until it cools back where it was.  You need to reflow the solder using this guide (remove the gpu heatsink) using a heat gun.  As has been stated before, the lead free solder melts at 423F (217C).  I only had to heat gun the bottom side.  Please follow the first post by jimwross but remove the gpu heatsink before heat gun.

Yeah, that all sounds rather too much for me. I'll read it over and try and familiarise myself with the process though.

If it is the scaler chip, which can be determind by applying pressure to the chip then booting, and if it works at that point, then this confirms it is the scaler chip. Is it not just possible to somehow keep that pressure on the chip at all times once the case has been put back together, or is it really necessary to gut out everything and get a heatgun going?

I am thinking of putting the 360 back in its original white casing, and sending it off to MS and hopefully they just replace it without question for me. I suppose worst case scenario is that they send the console back to me not fixed if they notice the warranty seal has been broken.  (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

The whole reliability fiasco has really gotten me on a downer though, this is my 4th console, and I always wanted a black one to match my gear. I hanged on for ages and after 12 months of owning it I decided to replace the case, some 5 months later I get this problem.

[brandogg]

Don't mention fraudulent warranty repairs, and don't attempt them either. You made the choices and threw your warranty out the window.

Please only attempt the heat gun fix, if you've A. got nothing to lose, and B. watch some videos and take your time. It can work if it's done right, but if done wrong it can absolutely destroy your board.

[fragabyte]

QUOTE(brandogg @ Apr 16 2008, 06:07 AM)

Don't mention fraudulent warranty repairs, and don't attempt them either. You made the choices and threw your warranty out the window.

Please only attempt the heat gun fix, if you've A. got nothing to lose, and B. watch some videos and take your time. It can work if it's done right, but if done wrong it can absolutely destroy your board.

Yes, I'm going to have to try it out by the looks of it. I'll have a look and see if I can find a heat gun to order online now, hopefully they're not too expensive.

In regards to your warranty statement, I can understand such things should not be discussed on the forums. My point or more frustration is waiting for well over a year to try and make sure the console would not fail, after that I then persued the case replacement. So I'm sure at the very least you can understand my frustration. I should have just gone with the tacky black faceplate, shouldn't I lol

I'll post back soon, first of all I'll try adding pressure to that scaler chip mentioned and see if it boots, then post back here once I've had chance to try it out.

[brandogg]

I more than understand your frustration, trust me on this. I just know from experience that it's one of those things that shouldn't be talked about here.

[ishtar]

Hum thats odd because i read where it flows at 161 degrees instead of 130 sum i had 3 rrod and did the whole deal with x clamp it would work a day or so , so last weekend i figured what the heck so i took everything of and set my oven to 200 degrees set the m/b on foil set it in a cookie sheet covered it with the other half of foil and left it in the oven for thirty minuites or so i figured the foil enclosure would give even heating took it out let it cool down replaced the screw washer combo only using a lock washer for the cpu gpu side only used the screws to secure thr top cover left the m/b chassis screws off  and its been working ever since thats been a week already thats the longest i ever got it to work

[Rustmonkey]

Hmmm... well my black screen and no sound returned... I guess, time to hit it with a heat gun again...