Print

[GamestationOH]

Well, I searched the forum using the lame search engine, and google search turned up nothing...

So here it is...

Has anyone used this or know of anyone that has used this???

http://www.martin-sm...x_manncorpr.pdf

It is a professional re-flow system designed to fix GPU and CPU. It is also a good source of info, if true about the causes. Of course we have heard most of it before.

Can't wait to here from the Dr. Frankenstein's out there!

[xCAUSALITYx]

Hi,

I've heard of this pro system, its quite a new system though and has a big price tag approx $30,000.

I could see it being a good investment if it works for the 360 and if you can afford it would be a worthwhile service to offer to 360 owners suffering from GPU and CPU issues giving them a permanent fix.

It might be worthwhile contactng local PCB assembly companies in your area to see if they have one and if they would be prepared to carry out a pilot manual reflow on a 360 mainboard, if it works they could contact MS to get certified as a MS service center to carry out 360 mainboard repairs specifically targeting RROD issues and bring about the end these for good.

I will do the same here in the UK and post and update when I get one....!

Good Luck..!

[G0t M4xx 21]

I saw this paper not too long ago, a lot of good information.

Needless to say, I've tried to recreate their repair methods the best I can, with pretty good results.

Tools:

Electric stove
Heat gun or hot air reflow station
Infrared thermometer (you can usually find them for $60 or so at hobby shops that sell nitro powered R/C cars)

I put the motherboard on metal standoffs to hold it about 1/2 inch above the heating element, with the stove on a low setting, I tweaked it with the infrared thermometer until the motherboard was about 150-170*C (in the paper they said to heat the underside of the board to 165*C)

Then, I added some liquid flux to the edges of the CPU and GPU, and while keeping the stove on, proceeded to heat the GPU and then the CPU to 220-240*C with a Hakko reflow station (measuring at different points on the package, the key here is to get it over 218*C, the melting point of lead-free solder.) Don't hold these high temps for too long though (max 20 seconds of so) or you risk damaging the board. Then remove the heatgun, turn off the stove, and let the board cool off. Leave the board on top of the stove though, the residual heat from the stove will allow the board to cool down slowly.

I havent been able to do any long term testing yet, but the 0020 board I've had laying around forever fired right up (with the stock x-clamps), IMO it is the best possible way to reflow the board without spending thousands, again the key here is to be able to accurately measure the motherboard and die temp

[xboxreaper]

Hey, I have one of those...love it!!! Done 6000+ repairs using it since August '08

[under420dog]

there's different ones all over do a search for BGA IRDA Infrared IC Rework Reflow
less xray machine...Xray/or micro is great for seeing the problem but it ain't going to cure the ongoing heat issue... when the unit is powered on and breaks down when playing.....it's all about the board flexing
and the flawed GPU heatsink design  because billys boys... wanted the sleek slim style ...so the dvd drive had to be adjust to preform there great final design......good job m$ pfft....just think a little bit taller and it would make the flaw run at a more of a normal range...(hint the new GPU CPU combo)<and that still messes up...
normal wear for a 360 is is like a car now it needs maintenance ...I'v been fixing these flaws since they came out...no biggie though i just fasten  the board down to the bottom metal casing(after i find the sweet spots) to stop the flex and then create
a better air flow.....so basically for a avg hands on user grab a paint striping gun and some foil and find the sweet spot ......now days i have a full station and a xray is only good to find the problem the xray ain't going to help you unsolder(heatup and pull the faulty chip) now is it....my hole setup cost me through the years about 800 bucks....and that even includes me trying out lead/no lead solder to see where the sweet spot is
plus a reballing(pro style) heating the chip up removing it applying clean flux and reballing the mobo and what ever chip is bad that's the cool part all them little 0.06mm balls redone in the GPU or CPU...or the 0.45 balls in the memory...its a long process but having time and skilled patients does wonders.....try that on a freakin cell phone...man i need to find some small midgets to help me...

bottom line it's not all about a 30.000 dollar unit...you can do the same thing with just a regular
reballing kit and a rework station that alone = about 550 dollars.....
peace out!


P.S IRDA Infrared can pinpoint heat better then a hotair or brushless motor heatgun...remember that....i do cell phones RC equipment......till next time...


Divanus that's 93 units in a week...I will call your bluff put up a pic of you (blocking your face for security reasons) with your machine and current date...and don't try to trick me as i do know how to rip a photo apart electronically to see patches/and inserts......lmfao na jk if that's the case good job mang....

[under420dog]

sounds like a good deal there...I know a lot of places are dropping prices and naming there machines for specific 360 use......but that's good to know on the pricing....
and yes I do use a heat gun on the 360's and  Infrared ovens in the early 90's??. i don't use a oven never did and never will...as you know there's units out for smaller items cell phones and RC stuff +

[xboxreaper]

Sounds like good stuff! I'll keep my eyes peeled.

Hope it's easier to figure out than the 04.6x.


Good tidings and great joy!

[gamestationohio]

The guy is right about IR being bogus. Anyone can do a quick google and see that all commercial reflow ovens use  hot gas technology.

A cell phone mobo is small and easy to to reflow without warping. 40mm and larger BGA's are not so easy.

Manncorp NEVER made the 4.6X machine. Martin did and Manncorp put their name on it. martin still makes it. it is too expensive for the guy that want to start business fixing xboxes.

the new machine is not made by martin... probably made by the cheap Dragon Group China! Cashin' in on the penny wise dollar foolish.