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[XanTium]

Apple to object to the Xbox-iPod interoperability? -- Posted by XanTium on November 5 00:04
From news.com:

Because of the iPod's digital-rights-management software, the Xbox 360 cannot stream songs purchased from Apple's iTunes Music Store, Xbox digital-entertainment executive producer Jeff Henshaw said. Those songs, he said, will appear grayed out in menus on the Xbox.
There's a reason for that: Microsoft built its iPod connection without the support of the folks at Apple.
Henshaw said Microsoft tried to "engage" Apple in a partnership that would have officially made the iPod interoperable with Xbox, but Apple rejected the overture.

Apple has been pitching a very different approach for those who want to connect to its popular music player. Through its so-called "Made for iPod" program, the Cupertino, Calif., company is attempting to collect royalties from the maker of any accessory device that interfaces with an iPod through its "dock connector."

But because Microsoft is not working within the "Made for iPod" program, David Cole, president of DFC Intelligence (an entertainment industry analysis firm), thinks Apple may object to the Xbox-iPod interoperability.
"I think it depends on whether (Apple sees) it stealing any of their thunder," said Cole. "The fact of the matter is, Microsoft has been a big software and services competitor (of Apple's). And that might cause (Apple) more worry than if it was Dell or somebody else."

Richard Doherty, president of analyst firm Envisioneering, went so far as to predict that Apple will fight back once the new Xbox launches.
"We expect Apple will have some retaliation ready within days or hours of the Xbox 360 shipping," Doherty said, referring to potential new iPod firmware or a new version of iTunes that could disable interoperability. "If you have iTunes prior to last May, it may work with the Xbox 360 forever, but if you accept (Apple's) updates, it may work differently."

Read More: news.com

[Master3xBOx]

Just one more reason for me to hate apple. They can't get past themselves to actually work with MS to allow it to connect to the 360. Even though having it work with virtually anything will allow them to make more money by selling more of them.

[ebrunn]

one of the coolest things on the 360 is its ability to connect to things like the iPod and other shit. If apple pulls that bullshit, I guess I will have to just stream it over my network

[Bogus8]

Why doesn't anyone read this as MS not playing ball???   Apple would allow it but MS won't do what EVERYONE else that hooks into the iPod does, pay the royalties...  They pay royalties for the cdrom logo, the dvd logo and it's use, and I'm sure they get a kick back for wma enabled devices.  Apple is just saying you have to do what everyone else does and just because you are the great big MS doesn't mean you are gonna get special care.

Frankly I don't like Apple either (why can't the just cave on the two mouse button on laptops and their default mouse) BUT I respect their right to demand the same respect from MS as they and MS does from others.

[JohnnyVegas]

I'm with you on that. MS should play ball if thats the rules Apple set.

My issue is more with Apple and rights management all together. When I got an MP3 player I thought of the IPOD but after reading how you can't do this and that I went with iRiver. WAY better and I can put whatever MP3, WMA or data, for that matter. I like.

I find it funny how Apple finally gets a worth while product then limits the users on every level. eeerrr the Mac... "Here's a nice product... but you can only use it the way we tell you to with a ton of retarded limits. Have fun!"

Why do people buy this thing. Never understand it. With this just another reason to buy another MP3 player. Incompatability with my new 360.

But maybe a LIVE patch that MS can charge $20 for will give you the IPOD rights again.

Go APPLE!!

This post has been edited by JohnnyVegas: Nov 5 2005, 11:02 AM

[Bogus8]

I've been forced to use a mac lately (my business partner in my production company and our main video editing computer is a mac) and it's not THAT bad but I agree there are some things where I'm like "LET ME CHANGE THAT!!" and it wouldn't take much code to allow the changes.... so fustrating.

The iPod isn't so bad... I have an older 10 gig from that same guy and I refused to load iTunes and so I found a couple of sweet free small apps that allow you to use it close to like a regular mp3 player and they can be run OFF the iPod which is nice.  Yamipod (to load files) and Sharepod (allows you to offload files from the iPod).

It's a nice player but I still think it's WAY overpriced and hyped... you are buying the name and the "cool" factor of owning an "iPod".  People don't even call regular mp3 players "mp3 players" anymore... it's "my iPod" when they have an iRiver  VERY clever marketing by Apple and that gives them the right to charge those royalties to others (marketing isn't cheap).

[incognegro]

hmmmmmm if you ask me though, i think this is a bitch move on Apple's part. I plan on getting an iRiver so it really doesnt matter to me whether it works or not. I undertsand what theyre trying to do but u have to admit its not "humblest" way of doing things. So basically MS has to pay to promote Apples product for them? Yes its cross marketing in the sense that both products (360, Ipod) are being promoted simultaneously but its quite obvious is not working against apple but working with them to get their product to a larger crowd. Its a win-win. Its in bad taste that apple wouldnt want to work with them on this.

On the flipside i agree that MS wasnt playing by apple's rules but me personally, i would have bend the rules after seeing what is MS is trying accomplish.

Anyways, i know for sure if MS adheres to Apples rules they wont have to pay any royalties; WE ARE! They probably will charge us to get it to work and I wont be wasting my money on that shit!.........Long live iRiver!!!!

[SniperKilla]

exactly why you dont buy apple.... the ipods are trash anyway

glad my creative zen sleek will work for years to come

[Australian Rat]

This is pretty funny, post this exact same thing at an ipod site and you'd get everyone saying how MS are the bastards for not simply paying a small royalty to apple.  I think it's a little bit of both Apple and MS, but that's to be expected anyway.

Personally, I really couldn't care who makes what.  I like my xbox, but I also like my iPod.  I use Windows but I like iTunes.

Also to do with the main complaint with the iPod where it doesn't play wma files, unless you encoded your entire CD collection already into this format then it's going to make little difference.  Plus you can re-encode wma's using iTunes into iPod readable ones.  I do think the lack of compatibility on the new video ipod though is a joke however.  Bad move on apple's part.

On the other hand if you like your Zen or iRiver, go for it.  If your going to shell out a load of money for an mp3 player, you should get the one you want.  For a lot of people, all they want is something thats simple to use and plays music.

Just my 2 cents

[rasmithuk]

I'd ignore that 'expert' thinking that Apple will update the iPods to stop this because it's pointless. The only way of doing this would be for Apple to change the format of the HD from FAT to something else, probably HFS+, and by doing that no-one could use the iPod as portable storage anymore (something that iPods are used a lot for).
Letting people use and iPod on the 360 isn't going to hurt Apple in any-way.

The funny thing is the iPod actaully has no restirctions on it as a Mass storage device. The restriction is that the music playing part only reads from the iTunes DB on the HDD.
Remember that both Creative and iRiver have signed up for and produce 'Plays for sure' devices. You might want to read what's required to get this:
http://go.MS.com/fwlink/?LinkId=40517
http://go.MS.com/fwlink/?LinkId=40518
Basically it's everything from secure partitions, write only partitions, secure clocks, content use monitoring and auto expiration of content. WMP10 DRM can be much more restrictive then anything Apple have implemented it's just that they haven't started using it yet, but it's all there waiting to be turned on.

[twistedsymphony]

Right now no one is to blame for anything...

The Ipod works as a simple mass storage device in most respects. This is a feature of the ipod that should require no royalties or otherwise to function properly. MS wants to have the 360 connect to any and all mass storage devices.

If apple updates their firmware they're going out of their way to disable a feature to should be freely available without royalties.

Sure MS didn't want to pay royalties, which is why we don't get access to iTunes files. Say it'd add a $1 or 2 per console to add that... OK now how many other companies are you going to pay royalties to just for connectivity? 3, 5, 10, 100? how far do you go with it. MS offers NO EXCLUSIVE CONNECTIVITY outside of their own products, why would they make an exception for Apple?

I wonder if Sony is actually paying royalties to Apple considering they DO have iTunes connectivity.

IMO Apple isn't a bastard until they update their firmware to block 360 connectivity. and MS isn't a bastard in this case at all (can you blame them for trying to maximize connectivity while getting cost out? I'm sure there are lots more people who would be pissed off by a higher price, then people pleased with iPod connectivity).

The best situation is if MS offered a special piece of software (downloaded from XBL or installed from a disc) to allow for iPod connectivity for those who want it. The royalties could be included in the price of that update.
This would have the effect of Apple getting their precious royalties. MS not having to pay any royalties. And no one who doesn't want/need iPod/iTunes connectivity doesn't need to pay for it.

[balupton]

i think its time that apple gets their share of monopoly and antitrust law suits.

[Bogus8]

QUOTE(balupton @ Nov 5 2005, 12:33 PM)

i think its time that apple gets their share of monopoly and antitrust law suits.

LOL, that's funny .... very rediculous they aren't breaking any laws and as I have stated, I don't like Apple.

I agree with you twisted I don't blame MS, just pointing out how it was funny that everyone jumped on Apple vs seeing the flip side of the coin which is equally valid.  I don't think Apple is gonna stop  the 360 from connecting to the iPod as a mass storage device, it's pulling off (streaming) music that was put on there for the iPod to play and must be done with iTunes or some other DB driven product (again this sucks but I see how it makes the iPod faster in listing songs.)

[JMan8108]

QUOTE(JohnnyVegas @ Nov 5 2005, 03:32 AM)

I'm with you on that. MS should play ball if thats the rules Apple set.

My issue is more with Apple and rights management all together. When I got an MP3 player I thought of the IPOD but after reading how you can't do this and that I went with iRiver. WAY better and I can put whatever MP3, WMA or data, for that matter. I like.

I find it funny how Apple finally gets a worth while product then limits the users on every level. eeerrr the Mac... "Here's a nice product... but you can only use it the way we tell you to with a ton of retarded limits. Have fun!"

Why do people buy this thing. Never understand it. With this just another reason to buy another MP3 player. Incompatability with my new 360.

But maybe a LIVE patch that MS can charge $20 for will give you the IPOD rights again.

Go APPLE!!

Wow, Ive had an iRiver for about a year now and I absolutely hate the thing. Mine was cheaply made and the screen starts to go out. The controls on it suck and it looks way out of proportion. I just got an iPod photo and I will never look back to iRiv-shit-er again. The click wheel on the iPod is lightyears ahead of anything out right now. I havent had any problem putting any type of file on my iPod. Granted I hate wma's for their usually sucky quality. Although other than iPod i hate apple but they got it right on one product atleast.

[Jason9875]

QUOTE(Bogus8 @ Nov 5 2005, 02:09 AM)

I've been forced to use a mac lately (my business partner in my production company and our main video editing computer is a mac) and it's not THAT bad but I agree there are some things where I'm like "LET ME CHANGE THAT!!" and it wouldn't take much code to allow the changes.... so fustrating.

The iPod isn't so bad... I have an older 10 gig from that same guy and I refused to load iTunes and so I found a couple of sweet free small apps that allow you to use it close to like a regular mp3 player and they can be run OFF the iPod which is nice.  Yamipod (to load files) and Sharepod (allows you to offload files from the iPod).

MS doesn't exactly give you a lot of options to change with Windows, and its looks/interface.
(excluding 3rd party software)

And as for the iPod, I have no problem with it, exspecially the new iPod Nano. I wouldn't mind having one of those, that is if they didn't cost $250.

QUOTE

   i think its time that apple gets their share of monopoly and antitrust law suits.

 :lol: What exactly have Apple monopolized?
What kind of competition is Apple preventing if they keep the xbox 360 from connecting to the iPod?