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[lazzeri]

So i guess MS is using an interesting (yet *stupid*) approach for their problem: If you open your xbox for a 12v mod you might get tempted to do "something else", as modding your F/W. So they simply ban anyone (anyone?) who did it. And if you complain that you haven´t modded anything, it simply doesn´t matter: You had violated your TOS anyway.

Let me tell you this - those guys have balls. :-D

On a wild guess, i´d say that they wouldn´t ban *everyone* with a 12v. They might be adding things together: A 12v PLUS a weird drive response EQUALS ban (actually it doesn´t MATTER if it was caused by the F/W or bad laser, you´d already violated your TOS when performed the 12v)

[Garyfez]

When you get banned is it just gold members or a complete ban?

[Xitherun]

Are you kidding? MS is getting that hell-bent over modding that they'll even ban you for swapping your fans?

This is just being abusive to the customers. I never thought I'd see MS go on such a power trip.  

[Johnny HugeButt]

QUOTE(Tranman @ Dec 22 2007, 10:05 AM)

It does make sense that M$ should be able to read internal fan speed values...especially since almost all modern computers bios do report that.  Download a CPU fan utility and you can easily retrieve fan voltage and speed values.

All cool n all but CPU fans have a feedback line (total 3 wires: +, - and feedback) that reports speed while the xbox 360 fans only have power lines  (+ and -). There is no speed feedback in the fan system so they cannot read speed.

They could read power drainage but as the fan is not running at constant speeds this wont be easy. And what if one of the fans breaks down? That will affect the total power drainage too.

I added a Talismoon plus an extra fan on the GPU (I made the DVD 'power' cable longer and use a PC SATA cable which allowes me to place the dvd drive outside the box). This means i am surely out of range and possible candidate for banning  (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

JH

This post has been edited by Johnny HugeButt: Dec 22 2007, 12:07 PM

[Chancer]

Sorry no way can I go along with the fan theory. What happens in areas with fluctuating mains supply voltages etc. I know the whole why MS bans is just theory but the 12v fan bit is a step too far. I would stake money on the fact that this is not a reason for one single ban.
The unbanning is still not confirmed as to why the unbanned machines were banned in the first place.
We may never know.
Maybe Ms is just trying to piss off everyone by varying the attacks.

[zegita]

To everybody talking about that fan mod. Can't you just give it another power source. Like having an extra cord to the fan instead of using the xbox's power supply.

[elocin671]

QUOTE(zegita @ Dec 22 2007, 09:40 PM)

To everybody talking about that fan mod. Can't you just give it another power source. Like having an extra cord to the fan instead of using the xbox's power supply.

that would look ugly. i did it to a intercooler and it sucked having to lug around a 12v adapter and the huge power brick for lan partys. and if you did that what would you connect to the fan connector? microsoft could read no fan speed or voltage. i think banning for a 12v fan mod is a bit extreme. how do they know the stock fans arent running at 12v because the cpu is getting so damn hot? they designed it to run at 5v - 12v but it doesnt help for shit. if they were reading fan speed and voltage how would they not know that their faulty console is just reporting bogus speeds/voltage.

This post has been edited by elocin671: Dec 22 2007, 01:06 PM

[the_nerdy]

Dont be dumb people

Microsoft is not banning over a fan modd.

The guy said he called Microsoft and they told him he had a fan mod.   BUt he wasn't banned.

So whala.


Also, there is a new security leak.  If we can figure out the procedure of how the laser reads and make it purposly act this way.    The timing attack and etc, will no longer be any good and we have a full proof method of not getting banned, or being banned and getting unbanned.

More then likely, Microsoft will fix this error somehow and we can take full advantage of it.

You all need to look at the big picture here of what was just discovered.

And yes, you can still use the Kreon checker with this method too of course.

[-PK-]

QUOTE(the_nerdy @ Dec 22 2007, 01:48 PM)

If we can figure out the procedure of how the laser reads and make it purposly act this way.    The timing attack and etc, will no longer be any good and we have a full proof method of not getting banned, or being banned and getting unbanned.

More then likely, Microsoft will fix this error somehow and we can take full advantage of it.

You all need to look at the big picture here of what was just discovered.

And yes, you can still use the Kreon checker with this method too of course.

You could easily make the fw report back random or bad data.  You go ahead and make your console stick out from the crowd and deal with their poor customer support when you get banned and try explaining that your laser is dying...I'll choose to blend my console in with the 100% perfect console crowd instead.

As far as I'm concerned the ixtreme fw responds to every conditional situation exactly as it should.

[arash89]

Something really weird happend to my brothers brand new xbox... I bought it in Sweden flashed it to 1.4, then i read about the ban-waves so i flashed it to its original fw just to be sure. Last night we we decided to play Call Of Duty 4 so i put the disc in... I get an error ".... To play this disk, put it in a Xbox 360 console", thats the same error i get when i tried a copied game with a 360 with original fw... I tried it a couple of times and i got the same error. Then i tried it 20 minutes later and it worked... I have no idea if it has to anything with this but it might help..

Personally what i think is that microsoft saw a little change on my console and decided to see if it can read backups... So they made it look like a backup and wanted to see if the console plays it or not... Because the game was original and it was almost brand new.... I dunno more than this, i hope this is good info...

[bonsc2]

What about the 12v mod where you get the powere from the dvd drive lead is that ok

[GomerPyle]

QUOTE(Garyfez @ Dec 22 2007, 12:02 PM)

When you get banned is it just gold members or a complete ban?

When you get banned your xbox cannot connect to the internet period, all you can do is play backups offline. Thats it no Silver no Gold no nothing when you are banned. Your xbox will cease to log in anymore and cease to get online period for anything, No Updates Natta!

This post has been edited by GomerPyle: Dec 22 2007, 03:45 PM

[gust]

QUOTE(bonsc2 @ Dec 22 2007, 04:01 PM)

What about the 12v mod where you get the powere from the dvd drive lead is that ok

I wonder about that too!

[the_nerdy]

Also, if you have a fan modd, that does show you may have hacked firmware or etc.
  If you don't know how to mod, you prob wouldn't have the fan mod either then now would you?

and they are not saying if you have a fan mod, you have firmware mod or something else.

It just shows wich console to raise a yellow flag and watch for.

That is it.

[notrain]

QUOTE(Chancer @ Dec 22 2007, 12:35 PM)  

Sorry no way can I go along with the fan theory. What happens in areas with fluctuating mains supply voltages etc. I know the whole why MS bans is just theory but the 12v fan bit is a step too far. I would stake money on the fact that this is not a reason for one single ban.
The unbanning is still not confirmed as to why the unbanned machines were banned in the first place.
We may never know.
Maybe Ms is just trying to piss off everyone by varying the attacks.

I am not saying that I believe in that new theory, but your point does not disprove it. Fluctuating voltages from your wall outlet do not get "past" the powersupply, i.e. you could probably use that black brick anywhere from 95-125V (for US). As far as the Xbox360 Mainboard is concerned, the Voltages it receives shouldn't differ much, depending on the quality of the PSU. A High quality ATX PC Powersupply can be plugged into any wallsocket in the world, you don't even need 2 models for 110V (US) and 230V (Europe etc.), the Powersupply will supply the same voltages through the ATX Power Connector.

So, while I am not fully convinced by the merit of 12V Fanmod bannings, you are still wrong .