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[ssj4android]

Live was broken for a few days, you missed it?
Anyway, Iriez, are you the one who was banned and told directly by a MS rep that the fan was the cause without mentioning it before? I find it hard to believe that Microsoft would ban someone because they modded their fan.

[Devedander]

QUOTE(rave-m2s @ Dec 27 2007, 06:39 PM)

BUYER BEWARE ?  Not when our entire society has a culture of buying and selling pre owned goods, it would be pretty silly for microsoft to impose a punishment on a second party owner who had no ill intent.  Its like throwing the VICTIM in prison when you can't catch the offender.  

Or you could look at like the police will confiscate your stuff if it turns out it was stolen even if you didn't realize it was stolen when you bought it...

And in the same veing, sure it's lame that an unwitting user gets banned but what recourse would it leave MS to protect themselves if everyone could just say "I bought it off ebay, unban me!"?

Gotta look at it from both angles... If you look around carefully you would be surprised how often buying second hand leaves you wide open for some really nasty surprises.

QUOTE

Has Microsoft ever even made a formal statement on the PURPOSE of banning a console?

I believe their official stance is that modified consoles are not allowed to connec to live to protect their online gaming experienced (ie prevent cheaters).   It's been a pretty blatent case of saying what sounds good and is plausible as an excuse to do what you want.  Kind of like the whole backup scene which we all know is heavily made up of pirates who say "backup" so they can keep pirating...

[hughjasol]

QUOTE(rave-m2s @ Dec 27 2007, 09:36 AM)

too many questions I know but just throwing some New perspective out there that may not have been explored previously.

Pardon my ignorance (and possible lack of posting etiquette) - this is my first post to this forum. But after reading the entire thread, there was one earlier post in particular that lead me to another possible theory that I'd like to throw out there . . . specifically, the post regarding the timing of the bans (i.e. Christmas time?). I noticed from the www.360drives.com DVD database, that there is a proliferation of the Benq drives in the more recently manufactured XBox Elite systems.

Earlier "mod" documents stated that while there is no iXtreme firmware available for these drives, the Benq drives are "very rare" (Hmm . .  any coincidence that MS started using these drives?). Based on the fact that there now IS Benq firmware, with a new "generic" version 1.4 supporting all XB360 drives, I have several possible conspiracy theories (BTW - the "returned data"  I refer to below is where my ignorance may come into play - I don't know exactly what information they poll, and which of that information MS does - or potentially could - save for future reference or comparison):

1. Could this latest ban sweep have been the result of some sort of "signature" in the returned data that is common to the new firmware; and which in previous drive-specific firmware releases would not have been  identical across all drive types?
   
2. Or could it have been some sort of "baseline" check in order to capture this information before everybody upgrades to the new firmware, with their intention being to perform Item #1 in the near future, in hopes of doing a comparison and finding out the answer to that question themselves?
   
3. Assuming #1 and/or #2, could that just have been a "beta test" for the real sweep - like 1-2 days after Christmas - when their new user-base will be drastically increasing due to the flood of new XBs touting the new until-just-recently-unmod'able Benq drives? (When did MS starting having the "server issues" with XBL? - not being sarcastic - I really don't know exactly. Even if it was ~ 12/26 or 12/28, it could be just a coincidence, but that would be around the time I would expect them start doing something). I assume this could have already been done without anyone knowing - as long as they left out the banning phase of the procedure this time. The idea being MS saying "let's see what we're reading now". Then in 2-4 months, running a check again to see if there are any flags they can spot.

Whether their intentiion at that point is to use their data against each individual account, and immediately do another ban sweep because they think they definitely have something to go on; or to just get whatever they think they need in order to find some sort of discrepancy; or worst case (in MS's mind), if not tracked individually, to at least be able to perform some extrapolation then comparison on the data as a whole in order derive some kind of estimate as to how many XBs out there may have mod'ed firmware - I don't know. But I believe any of these scenarios - or some combination thereof - would be a logical and fairly simple strategy regardless of whether they've already found a discrepancy, or are just doing whatever they can in order to find one.

P.S. - No - I'm generally not that paranoid!  

[milamber]

The iXtreme 1.4 firmware releases are all still drive-specific - they just happen to share the same revision number at the moment (apparently there is a 1.41 in testing for BenQ drives right now). There is no such thing as 'generic' firmware - so you can remove that from your list of possibilities.

[Charco]

Only ever had 1.2 - rev c iXtreme and not been banned, just checked there now. left it a while because to be honest was worried i was a gone'er  

[ShaX5]

QUOTE(milamber @ Dec 30 2007, 05:08 PM)

(apparently there is a 1.41 in testing for BenQ drives right now)

Where did you get this information from?
Please post a link of this information being confirmed for proof.

[Commex]

Im on iXtreme 1.3 and didnt get banned. Should i risk upgrading to iXtreme 1,4?

[milamber]

QUOTE(Commex @ Dec 31 2007, 09:53 AM)

Im on iXtreme 1.3 and didnt get banned. Should i risk upgrading to iXtreme 1,4?

Yes, upgrade - 1.4 is the only 'safe' firmware at the moment.

QUOTE(ShaX5 @ Dec 31 2007, 08:10 AM)

Where did you get this information from?
Please post a link of this information being confirmed for proof.

Damn, I knew this would happen!

It's the current topic in the #fw channel on EFNet. To quote: "BenQ iXtreme v1.41 in testing : Read sector fix & 8x fw dashboard speed fix : (bug fixes, not security-related)"

OK?

p.s. I'm not involved in the testing or anything so don't ask me when it will be available.

[nathanknight]

QUOTE(Iriez @ Dec 23 2007, 07:31 PM)

There is no need for a new firmware. A proper backup will work just fine on ixtreme 1.4. As far as i can tell, it is about as safe as it is having a unmodified 360 at this point.

Please describe a "proper backup" in detail.

And...once your proper backup is done, will the stealth checking tools (Xbox Backup Creator, Kreon Checker & Mulleter) provide accurate or proper results for double checking?

I've read thousands of post this week and I remember one post on the Team Xecuter forum (I believe) that said they just recently tested thousands of copied games, and the Kreon backups did not come out as the best copies with the correct CRC, etc, but that a Samsung method (can't remember the term) came out as a safer way to copy/backup the games.

[lenarass]

ALL ARE WRONG.... say my 360 how looks like... i have 12v mod fan for 5 months..i use 1.2ixtreme live playing cod4 and notinhg happends..

[JAG ReDDoG]

Hello,im adding my 2 cents worth.Ive been thinking of adding the Talismoon Whisper Fans.After reading these type threads and others i emailed them about this issue.Heres their response.

Neil H. wrote:
Im reading alot on the fact that MS could ban you for live if you mod your fan12v.Im sure theres an official statement in there somewhere.
 
Can you plug this in the usb port?
Can you switch it to 5v for online play?
Your fans look great and should be better than the stock ones.I just dont want to get banned from live because of a fan.
Thanks Neil

Thank you for contacting Talismoon support.


About people being banned from Live because of mods made to their case, we are aware of that rumor.  

From what we understand, the person who was banned offered this information to the XBL agent who agreed that this was the reason. Furthermore, other members of the community have suggested that it is plausible.  However, this is an extremely tenuous line of reasoning.

On the other hand, it could be that the XBL agent was just trying to get rid of the guy, and would have told him anything.  Many things in life are plausible but this does not mean that they are true.
Our sources indicate that it is extremely unlikely that MS has done this or will do this in the future.  Therefore, we will continue to manufacture this product line.
 
=====>Also, members of our staff use the whisper personally, and we haven't been banned.<========

Thats really the best answer I can give you.


The whisper fan must be plugged into the fan plug.  For the 12v nitro switch, it goes into the dvd power, using the included Y split cable.  This switch pokes out the back of the xbox, in one of the vent hole.  You can change between 5v and 12v by reaching in the back and pushing the switch.


The fan is indeed better than the stock one.  Here's the specifications for the whisper with comparison to the orignal fan, at 5v:

Specifications
(behind are the standard Xbox 360 fan specifications)

DC Power: 12V (at 5v)- Original Fan: 12V (at 5v)
Current: 160mA - Original Fan: 250mA
Speed: 4100RPM - Original Fan: 4600RPM
Air flow: 46CFM - Original Fan: 29CFM
Loudness: 38d(a - Original Fan: 41d(a

If you require further assistance, please do not hesitate to contact me.

Regards,

Sam
Talismoon Support

Sorry for the large post but i felt it was needed.As far as their email take it for what its worth.Im really thinking about adding those fans.Atleast you can switchthe volts speed.Thanks and add any help/advice/thoughts.Peace

[Haygar]

OK, I've got a question that's been going around in my head and I haven't found any good explanation on the forums. Please stick with me.
How can MS detect a console with a 12v fan mod under these circumstances?

Both fans are connected to the raw regulated 12v that enters the console before any other circuits. (Which is the exact same source/track that feeds the original drive transistors that fed the fans in the first place.)
Note: Even if they could detect current/power consumption, that's altering all the time depending on what the console is doing anyway. Voltage is one thing, current is another.

The fans are disconnected from the socket that they are normally plugged into.
Note: If you monitor the voltage on the socket it will remain at the normal voltage (5.4v when cool) as if the fans were still connected and will rise if the CPU feels the need to cool down. (If you experiment by driving the fans externally with a variable power supply you can check this quite easily.)

So, allowing for the possibility that MS can monitor the voltage on the socket for the fans, the only thing that I can see that they could tie together is the fact that the CPU would be running at an abnormally low temperature whilst the fan voltage (to MS's knowledge) would be too low to achieve this.

Hope this makes some sense to somebody. or

[Haygar]

Oh, yeah I forgot to mention for anyone who might be wondering, MS can't detect the RPM of the fans either coz there wasn't any feedback from the fans in the first place, unlike PC CPU fans, etc.

[GeorgeCloney]

QUOTE(chinozzz @ Dec 22 2007, 05:59 PM)

Is there ANYONE who is reading all of this, that has been banned with a STOCK 360 with a Fan Mod and never had their console modded...

chinozzz

yes

[GeorgeCloney]

I know this is an old topic but I am looking for evidence of microsoft getting it wrong when they identify a console as moddified. I would like to know if anyone has seen an official statement anywere I can try to quote when I attempt to take  microsoft to court for damaging my 360 at there service centre.