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[Donny]

its kind of like Jesus...u cant see him, but he's there.......

hehe, keep up the awsome work KornKob!!!

PS:  im always willing to help out the scene...

[PolarPyro]

Just so the people know what we really think about at #halo and #halo2
these are parts of a conversation we had a day ago.



7:22pm kornkob:    it prolly wont be publicly released...
7:22pm kornkob:    however i would like to get some tools out for mod makers to start  stuff on the box

7:22pm Aztec:    well, In order to get all of halo's map info mapped, and everything (or almost everything) understood, the public needs some motivation

7:22pm kornkob:    the "public" pretty much consists of morons that dont know anything more than how to use a ppf patcher

7:22pm kornkob:    or byte swapping
7:23pm Iron_Forge:     The public is acctually quite knowledgeable...Not 'everyone' is a moron...

7:23pm Aztec:    that is true
7:23pm Aztec:    very true
7:23pm kornkob:    i have no drive to educate noobs that cant motivate themselves to look stuff up and learn on their own

7:24pm kornkob:    granted
7:24pm Iron_Forge:    But, all the 'secrecy' around the extractor has created hype that everyone thinks its much more important than it is...

7:24pm kornkob:    there arent too many of these noobs here
7:24pm @Ma_Say_Gac:    ;0
7:24pm kornkob:    it has almost no importance
7:25pm Iron_Forge:    Its important to those of us who don't really care about the game play, but are interested in file structures...And even then, no one cares anymore...

7:25pm kornkob:    im doing this cuz i love halo and i wanna push people past the byte swapping that killed the game

7:25pm Iron_Forge:    With the exception of importing new textures...The only useful thing to come out of hme to the general public is offset swapping...

7:26pm kornkob:    people have no respect for "halo" anymore, just what they can make guns fire and such

7:26pm Iron_Forge:    Well, I think some good things have come out of it since the novelty wore off...

7:26pm Aztec:    I think it's kind of sad there arent more people here to talk and really focus on testing out halo's offsets. There are so many on the forums that could be a great help here, but dont want to take the time. Think of all the n00bs that could (If not lazy) come by and help look at filestructures

7:26pm Iron_Forge:    I think Boll has an amazing talent, and deserves the respect he's earned...Offset swapper or not...

7:27pm Aztec:    definitely
7:29pm Iron_Forge:    The 'community' is what really needs to drive any project...And there is none...I think miketang's the only one who's still putting forth a genuine effort into hme...(Though I haven't been in halo-dev in a week, so I dunno)..And everyone who thinks they've done anything thinks they're vastly superior to everyone else, and it ends with n00b flaming...

7:30pm Iron_Forge:    No one seems to recall that two weeks ago, they were offset swapping, or didn't know how to...

7:30pm Iron_Forge:    Its rather depressing that people will take the time to call you an idiot for 5 minutes, rather than spending 2 minutes to help you along...

7:30pm @Ma_Say_Gac:    yes
7:31pm Iron_Forge:    Which just angers you, so you leave, and don't contribute to what could be a fine community...

7:31pm Aztec:    I picked up all of the halo editing Exactly 1 week ago. I feel that I should contribute as much as I can, and I'll probably get the same in return

7:32pm Aztec:    so far this has been true
7:32pm Iron_Forge:    Aztec>>Exactly...And if a week ago everyone just mocked you, you would've gotten frustraited, and left...Leaving us with what?..

7:35pm Iron_Forge:    The extractor/injector will be a novelty for about 2 days...Then no one will really care...

7:35pm kornkob:    i still have yet to have it compile right lol, but i did get to port it and learn from it and now have an extractor and semi functional injector

7:35pm kornkob:    i dunno forge
7:35pm kornkob:    im hoping hard soemone will start making serious mods with an injector
7:36pm kornkob:    phase 3 is wrapping up my injector, fixing all the bugs and stuff, then open source releasing it

7:37pm Iron_Forge:    You can't OS it unless Slayer gives the OK....
7:37pm kornkob:    yeah
7:37pm kornkob:    ill either have to get the ok or rip out the injector which is my code
7:37pm kornkob:    i dont care either way
7:38pm kornkob:    i jsut want progress
7:38pm kornkob:    i want to make news on most the big xbox sites to get more people into editing...

7:38pm kornkob:    its all in the name of progress and keeping halo alive, getting it over this hump its at


I agree COMPLETELY and stand behind every one of these statements 100%.
Whats this "I want to see a screenshot" crap!
The bottom line is, the entire halo modding community is compromised of a VERY small group of hard working, dedicated people. Now what do a lot of people I've seen on the forums do, they whine their heads off.
HEX editing is NOT that hard at all! If you people would just take some -time- to learn and use your new knowledge to grow and contribute, think of the possibilites! We may have had halo near done to being finished filestructure mapping-wise. Is it too hard now to go on mirc and ask for some honest help, or maybe even try to figure stuff out for yourselves. Kornkob and the others at the freenode channels work AMAZINGLY hard and still get no new people to help. Give some support! now, I dont want any posts after this saying "but I do support them!" SHOW that by giving some really honest and forward effort. please, the only way for things to get better is if people do THEIR part.

[Large Dopant white]

Well, as stated before, the authors are (IMO, rightfully) wary of releasing programs of this nature because people on the XBox scene are a bit impatient and non-exploritory. I mean, if people are having troubles doing stuff like applying PPF patches and typing in bytes at an offset (with a tutorial, mind you), can you even imagine what sort of trouble they'll be having with a texture injector? I can just see the reams of emails going to the author's mailbox right now, as well as the four dozen threads on these forums about how the program sucks because it doesn't have a bright-and-cheery-even-your-retarded-monkey-can-use-this-program GUI.
When it comes down to it, there's about two dozen people who like modding the maps for fun, and enjoy finding new hacks and offsets to screw with (Dmauro, for example). Then there's (at best) half that number who make the program to assist in the 'hacking', which is done purely as an intellectual pursuit (most of the time). Most of the rest of the people don't give a fuck about 'dumb shit' like that, and are content with ARs that shoot Scorpion Shells and posting a thread at least four times a day that's titled, "NEED BANSHEE IN BG!!!! TELL ME NOW!!!!"

[N++]

Anyway, kornkob, I missed your PM on IRC. I've been moving to a new place, been busy. I'll get you in touch tomorrow (you won't see a reply til Monday or Tuesday though), just wait for a bit, I'll be on.

As for if you should release it or not, I think you should first see if Bungie's "okay" with it and not just ask if it is "legal" or not. Seems you're already planning on that but just thought I'd throw it in. As you've heard me say way too many times, it's all about respect for the creators

Secondly, consider who's going to use it, or try to use it and fail. There are some great people out there but the majority of the population is "give me now with a shiny metal iGUI and make it 150% bug free." I think you should only give out your app by request (if they're going to be doing any texture injecting that's worth it, they can use IRC) only. Sure someone will probably put it in xbins or on some website but atleast you can feel better knowing you weren't the one to release it upon the morons, errr, masses. Just giving it to everyone seems like a waste, unless you hide your email address and change your name.

Well, off to bed I go, I'll talk to you tomorrow in the chan. To all of those who doubt the existence (even though it's been said a few times already) it does exist and it works. Think about how probable something is before you doubt it's existence.

N- goes back to low gravity

Oh, and can the morons stop PMing me telling me I'm not "N-" and I'm just here to piss people off? Thanks.

[gil27]

that would be me '

[kornkob69]

lets get some more people replying with thoughts mmm k?

[VisualAid]

lol Kornkob got people going *oh my word* now i talked  to you int eh chat and fully believed you this stuff is amazing and can be used to create great things.

[RebZie]

). Do I understand how/what hes doing? No, but will I sometime if I get to learning how? Probably... I just lack motivation and energy.. oh and if someone suggests to just ask him to teach me how, he would be an asshole about it... so I don't/wont/wouldn't ask him lol

[DuDeR MaN]

I completely agree with what is being said here.  I was in the modding scene since about 3 weeks ago.. I knew jack about hex editing and yet I taught myself.. I also knew that to keep this alive you need to help out... I haven't done much that others haven't already but I'm trying.. I know I'm credited in a couple places for finding out the map names (c30, b40, etc.) for single player but that was awhile back and a very small task.. so what am I doing now?  I've been messing with the hex to get new things working... I'm currently working on a better working 3rd person view, increasing mc speed, and attempting creating models w/ loaded AI.  

Now that you know I'm not a freaking n00b let me get to my point.  Halo Hacking is a HUGE thing... it's like opening a whole new game for those of use who beat it on every level.. on every difficulty 50x over.  Now I know you would like more appreciation for your app but you may not get it.. and thats fine because alot of people will realize what it can do and contribute their own artistic designs.  So I don't see how not releasing it will do any good rather than just being able to say "I got it and you don't, na na na na na na".  I'm not trying to be rude so sorry if I come of as it.  

Also you say how it is illegal to release an extractor and I understand why you wouldn't want to release it but my concern is that once we figure out how to basically create our own maps... who will be the one to release that to the public.  I'm not saying that you should go ahead and break the law but I just would like to know what happens then.

Anyway... I'm rambling now so I'll end it here.  I hope you decide to release this to the public and that we can make our progress move along faster.

[NoobieModder]

[dmauro]

QUOTE (NoobieModder @ Aug 31 2003, 07:47 PM)

Well then u didn't get very far on it. You r only at the noobie level of hex editing. Know before u speak

Exactly.  If all you are doing with hex hacking in Halo is making AR shoot rockets, you dont know it well enough and could be learning a lot about it.  Pretty much anything is possible, so start hammering away at that metadata and do some cool stuff.  Texture injection is cool, but not nearly as cool as flying vehicles and turrets mounted on BG bases.

[kornkob69]

Giantnewb: the more we understand about everything the better porting halo pc stuffs to xbox = fun stuff if we can learn enuff about how the game works....

as for the texture injector, its being put into final stages and private beta testing.

[dmauro]

QUOTE (kornkob69 @ Sep 1 2003, 01:28 AM)

dmauro: heh u make me laugh, i like ur references to ur own mods being cooler Giantnewb: the more we understand about everything the better porting halo pc stuffs to xbox = fun stuff if we can learn enuff about how the game works.... as for the texture injector, its being put into final stages and private beta testing.

Well no one else really makes cool hacks based on manipulating metadata.  Or if they do they don't release them.

[VisualAid]

everything's poissible my child!