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Author Topic: x2 4979  (Read 514 times)

Ubergeek

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« Reply #60 on: November 17, 2003, 10:04:00 AM »

CODE

   db   'Copyright (c) 2003 - Released under GNU Public License',13,10


So I guess that should have been spotted but it wasn't. If I'd known it was GPL in the first place i'd have taken care to say that none of the code was used directly as I know how "nintendo" the GPL crowd can be.

The above sentance did not mean we would have lied - it meant we would have ben more specific in what we actually did - tbh we didnt think anyone gives a shit about that they juist wanted it working - oh how wrong we were  rolleyes.gif
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krawhitham

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« Reply #61 on: November 17, 2003, 01:54:00 PM »

QUOTE (Ubergeek @ Nov 17 2003, 08:04 PM)
edit

after finding the old sources i did find a GNU statement on line 82 of patch.asm

CODE

   db   'Copyright (c) 2003 - Released under GNU Public License',13,10


So I guess that should have been spotted but it wasn't. If I'd known it was GPL in the first place i'd have taken care to say that none of the code was used directly as I know how "nintendo" the GPL crowd can be.


Now fuck this topic - i have some other posts to answer from ppl who need help.

l8r

so what you are saying is, if you would had noticed it was GPL, you would have lied from that  start.

That sure is how you just made it sound.

QUOTE
If I'd known it was GPL in the first place i'd have taken care to say that none of the code was used directly as I know how "nintendo" the GPL crowd can be.


converted, used a reference, whatever just come out and say fuck the GPL rules.

I do not completly agrees with all the GPL crap, that is not a big deal, what chaps my ass is the fact the story keeps getting changed
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oneeye258

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x2 4979
« Reply #62 on: November 17, 2003, 07:08:00 PM »

jester.gif


Keep up the good work team xecuter  beerchug.gif
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heinrich

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« Reply #63 on: November 17, 2003, 09:16:00 PM »

QUOTE (heinrich @ Nov 17 2003, 09:33 AM)
QUOTE (heinrich @ Nov 17 2003, 02:39 AM)
QUOTE
After many weeks of hardcore low level hacking we have successfully developed the Focus source code from scratch and are pleased to announce a fully working X2 bios with Focus support embedded for your enjoyment.

Any chance that some of your findings/code will be shared with xbox-linux?  Seems kind of silly to do all the work twice.

I take it that this is out of the question, correct?

Ok, it seems clear that code will not be shared where it will be made public...
what about working with undead and team assembly in making the tatx bios compatible on version 1.4/1.5 xbox's ?

QUOTE (Ubergeek @ Nov 17 2003, 09:15 AM)
QUOTE (tblake @ Nov 17 2003, 03:09 PM)
the xecuter team created derivitive code from an open source code.  That open source code is distributed under the GPL.  By not releasing it, they are violating the GPL.  Regardless of how they phrase it, they derived their code from GPL'd code, and put it out there.  They are not taking credit, but that's not the point in question.  The GPL states you MUST RELEASE THE CODE.  Plain and simple if you ask me.

its all wrapped up in none GPL stuff i.e. MS code

i could easily rls the bios with no lba48 - you patch it with xbtool and youll get the same result so this conversation really is pointless

As NghtShd said above, since this isnt the same work as what paul's patch did, is there any chance that you will release the bios without any lba48 code so that it can be patched with pauls work, and remain standard for all kernels?
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heinrich

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« Reply #64 on: November 17, 2003, 11:42:00 PM »

For some reason, I cant edit my post again....

Also, about the TATX bios, what about getting it working with lba48?  I know its not a main project for team xecuter, and I dont know how busy undead has been, but it would be nice a sign to show that you are sharing what you know with others for the benefit of others.  Of course, its all upto you, no one is forcing you, so feel free to give a big F U.
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Ubergeek

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« Reply #65 on: November 18, 2003, 12:50:00 AM »

wink.gif

If anyone wants to talk about GPL - why not make threads about the clear GPL violations going on with the many cromwell releases available ?

Now im gonna search for the thread entitled "X2 BIOS - Using MS Code ????"
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NghtShd

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« Reply #66 on: November 18, 2003, 09:32:00 AM »

QUOTE
X3 bios will work on all mods - there is just one cool feature that is X3 hardware only as its nothing to do with a flash rom. Its backwards compatible. The other teams make mods but they dont code shit. X2 mod could easily just use the evox bios - but we actually enjoy doing this believe it or not.


That's good. I was wrongly under the impression that X3 BIOS's would require X3 hardware. Also, I agree that many other mod makers do little or nothing but make money from hardware which would be useless if someone wasn't hacking kernels. Of course, just about everyone making money has used work given freely by others in their commercial enterprises, be it by using a BIOS, wmilk, cromwell, etc.

And then there's work not given freely by others, such as MS code.

None of you big mod makers (the ones raking in the lions share of the money) can complain about be being leeched from. That's like a thief crying foul when his stolen property gets stolen.

QUOTE
Nghtshd: This patch is available to our bios's whether or not we include it bro - by using your tool. We simply made the original kernel source work correctly without doing anything low level - this is the optimum and correct way to code as you know. You talk about us being better off with this - what about the fact we cracked the LPC bus first and showed everyone how to do it - has that not benefitted EVERYONE in this scene ? I could also say your tool has benefitted from out bios's too. I will say we've benefitted from your tool - easy as shit to use and useful as hell


The only disappointment I have about your inclusion of the LBA48 code is the fact that you don't support a partition table on the hard drive. I fully expected it to become integrated into future kernels, as it should be. Like I said, the partition table issue moot for now and may always be. If a partioner becomes available, maybe you can release an update. Frankly, I'd rather see LBA48 built-in, as finding all those kernel routines to patch into is tedious.

I don't know if XBtool has benefited, but I have. I generally use your BIOS's in my homebrew. I don't mean to imply that they aren't appreciated. It's a two way street. You guys get a lot of exposure, but users of all mod types benefit. I know it wasn't done out of altruism. Nonetheless, you have my gratitude.

I try not to push when I'm looking for info. I may post on a forum that I would like to do something, but I need more info (as I did many times about your packing method for the embedded xbe, because people kept asking for 4978.03 options), or I'll ask once and not press the issue if I don't get an answer. I can't recall anyone on behalf of team x-ecuter ever offering anything, but to be honest, I can't always keep up with who's working with who. If I'm mistaken, I apologize.

For example, when I mentioned to someone that you guys had cracked the focus encoder he asked me to see if you might share some code. I told him I'd ask, but that I would be shocked if you gave up anything. I was right. Your answer was that it was C code and so not of any use to anyone. That's a pretty condescending attitude, to say the least--why not just share the code and let people decide for themselves if it is useful. You weren't really trying to be condescending, you just didn't want to give anyone your code. I didn't push the issue, though, because there was no point. I knew you wouldn't share it before I asked. I knew because that's the the general vibe I've gotten from you for some time now. I started out with a very positive feeling, but as time went on I saw that I was being naive.

I'm not pointing the finger only at you guys, by the way. I see entirely too much secrecy and anti-cooperation on other fronts. I'd like to see better cooperation among all hardware and software hackers, but now I'm being naive again.
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Ubergeek

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« Reply #67 on: November 18, 2003, 12:52:00 PM »

you make it sound like we never offer to help anyone else

we fix problems and offer sources ALL the time to other groups - we're just not going to give out our kernel sources.

the reason we didnt give you any nfo on the embedded xbe was becuase it was alpha. a proof of concept really.

be assured you will be involved with X3.
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oz_paulb

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« Reply #68 on: November 18, 2003, 07:56:00 PM »

QUOTE (oneeye258 @ Nov 18 2003, 05:08 AM)
who cares.... everything we do here is illegal anyway jester.gif

For the record: I believe everything I've contributed (LBA48/etc) is 'legal' (I'm not a lawyer, but my code is 100% written by me, and doesn't contain any copyright/security circumvention mechanisms).

I believe that it is possible to make legal contributions to the scene...


- Paulb
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Ubergeek

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« Reply #69 on: November 19, 2003, 04:38:00 AM »

tongue.gif
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Ubergeek

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« Reply #70 on: November 19, 2003, 04:40:00 AM »

i forgot to add.....

the hook is already implemented, partitioning is already implemented.. partition is just not read from hdd since we dont have any configuration option yet therefore we always use standard partitioning plus F and G. It's there just not used.

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the joker

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« Reply #71 on: November 24, 2003, 02:17:00 AM »

really bothers me that people keep nagging for opening of sources every single time they think someone might have used GPL code.  I've lost count on how many demands I've had on avalaunch going opensource.

That means, we had to remove SMB support, which I loved - it was just awesome in the filehandler. I had to remove MOD/XM support since SDL is GPL. We removed every line og GPL code, making it quite boring.    

I respect GPL, and I take out GPL'ed code if someone makes me aware of it.  But do people know where that puts developement of free software ?

Doesn't people see that crying over things like this is strangling the scene and it's potentials ?  Just imagine where we could be if we used the tools that was given, and wasn't demanded for anything. After all, developers work really hard to make free programs.   Funny how that makes some people belive that the devs owe them anything.


my 2 cent, I get ticked off every time I see this kind of stuff
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heinrich

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« Reply #72 on: November 24, 2003, 02:25:00 AM »

the joker, i see where you are coming from, and the way I took the question, it was just asked that changes/conversations of the code be made public and/or shared with the original developer.  IE: if ava used SMB code from xbmp, and made any improvement (optimizations), they would share their findings with the community, which makes it better all around.
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Large Dopant white

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« Reply #73 on: November 24, 2003, 04:25:00 AM »

I find it extreamly displeasing that the most promenent groups in the scene (that people look up to, no less) skirt around sharing code (even under pressure of a licence) by simply saying, "It's all illegal, fuck it". You know, guys, this is why the scene stagnates and "freezes" for such long periods of time between the "major" shit. Yeah, I know, alot of stuff has been pioneered on the XBox by either Team EvoX or Xecuter (the latter more recently). However, if you look at, say, the DC scene, almost *every* major hack, developmental milestone, and whatnot was made very, very early, documented well, and sources released. Within less than a year, the homebrew devkit almost surpassed the commercial one, for Christ's sake. Why? Because everyone had the maturity to share their work.
Now, to this scene. Sharing code is taboo here; it's considered perfectly mature to not share code and, approched on the subject, to call all reproachers "fucking faggots". While not sharing code is acceptable (at least, if it's not under licence), saying, in effect, "fuck you" every time someone asks is just a touch adolescent.
I thank the lucky stars that guys like BenJeremy, Xport, and the XBMP/C team had such maturity (when Xport wasn't sharing the source, at least he didn't respond with an insult every time someone made a topic about it) to share the code. Hell, without derived sourcecode from XBMP, alot of coders would be banging their heads against a wall trying to implement features that were otherwise easily thrown in.
Not to sound ungrateful, Ubergeek, but your team isn't a monolith. There's still plenty of time for another group to come along and throw you off the top of the heap. Remember how you threw EvoX off the top of that same heap? You had an edge (you updated your shit more). Another group may come along and have an edge of your own group (maybe they'll release source, maybe they'll actually assist other groups instead of prattle on about it, whatever). As I've said before, no group or individual is truely indespensible, except for maybe Andrew "Bunny" Huang (sorry if I spelled his name wrong). I still remember when your team used to start flamewars daily. If it wasn't for your skilled hacking (you want to prove you know the BIOS? Code one from scratch. That, or quit dogging on Cromwell), there would be no respect for you. This thread has made me lose a little more respect for your group. As I suggested in the past, you shouldn't be the voice of Xecuter if you're going to be so damn hostile towards mostly innocent questions.
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trotos

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« Reply #74 on: November 24, 2003, 06:29:00 AM »

dear forum

if i may say anything about this thread, i could say that bottom line, i've been reading all the msges, what people whant is to get the best bios - dashboard for their xbox-modchip-exploit, right?
So, if the original author of the code has no problem with anything that a group does to provide the best think can be done for their property, what's the fuss for?
I also comprehend the point of an open source bios. These will be super only if there was a new bios M$ free and created from users for users, with the ability to be customised.

And what realy, i belive lucks from this scene is a little bit of organisation and contribution to each other, i think.

sorry for my english
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